Explosion at NY Port Authority

[SlowSpyder]

It's a question of where that line in the sand is, though. Progress won't necessarily take a U-turn, but that doesn't mean this is moving things forward, either. And again, there's a real chance that this could have serious consequences that Trump and crew clearly didn't factor in... like, say, terrorist attacks.

Let me be clear, I am not Israel's biggest fan, I hate that so many sheeple want to support Israel just to please their invisible buddy in the sky. But, it is hard to argue that Israel hasn't been one of our stronger allies as of late, and I imagine a lot of the intelligence work we do together in that part of the world save many lives. But overall, the Libertarian in me would really like to see us be more hands off, we create so many of our own enemies by the things we meddle in that we shouldn't.

Whether you or I am really all for this isn't the point, what is the point is that the elected government of America that represents us felt this is the direction to go. There are good legitimate reasons to question should if we do this or other things, but worrying we are going to piss off people that already hate us and would do us harm either way isn't one of them, even if this pisses them off even more. Not if we really think this is the right thing to do for one of our allies.

 

[feralkid]

. There are good legitimate reasons to question should if we do this or other things, but worrying we are going to piss off people that already hate us and would do us harm either way isn't one of them, even if this pisses them off even more. Not if we really think this is the right thing to do for one of our allies.

Wrong. It pisses off Every Single U.S. Ally except Israel. Dumb. Ass. Move.

 

[Brainonska511]

Wrong. It pisses off Every Single U.S. Ally except Israel. Dumb. Ass. Move.

We really shouldn't worry about it though, because even if we do piss a few people off and they retaliate, the bigger danger is people smoking. That kills far more people.

 

[sdifox]

We really shouldn't worry about it though, because even if we do piss a few people off and they retaliate, the bigger danger is people smoking. That kills far more people.

Get your facts straight. It's second hand smoke.

 

[Starbuck1975]

No, I'm not sympathizing with terrorists. What I'm saying is that Trump's policy is ignorant, and that previous presidents avoided formally recognizing Jerusalem as the capital for a good reason -- it provokes terrorist attacks and sets back the peace process by being needlessly antagonistic.

What you're basically arguing is that Trump must never be held responsible for the consequences of his actions. News flash: policy decisions can have repercussions beyond those you intended. Smart presidents take those into account.

Then we haven't had a smart President in decades, because every sitting President in my lifetime has set events into motion due to poor policy decisions.

I see no reason to perpetuate the false hope charade of a two-state solution and fantasy of a sovereign Palestinian state. Was never going to happen.

 

[Darwin333]

Still waiting for this to be answered. I love how the line is drawn at 9/11, because if you move the bar one day forward, the leftist house of cards in this thread falls a part.

I don't understand this statement. If you move the bar one day forward so you don't include 9/11 then the number of people killed on US soil by Muslim terrorists quite literally falls off the chart.

 

[Commodus]

Then we haven't had a smart President in decades, because every sitting President in my lifetime has set events into motion due to poor policy decisions.

I see no reason to perpetuate the false hope charade of a two-state solution and fantasy of a sovereign Palestinian state. Was never going to happen.

Well, that's true to a degree... past presidents have tried a lot of awkward compromises that didn't necessarily work well. And I'm not wholly convinced that simply forgetting the two-state solution would work, either. Yeah, Israel would be happy... but all its neighbors (not to mention extremists around the world) definitely wouldn't be. Whatever happens has to be better than a "screw it" action, and I haven't seen indications that Trump thought any further than that.

 

[urvile]

but worrying we are going to piss off people that already hate us and would do us harm either way isn't one of them

You are referring to the EU I assume? Trump is doing a fantastic job of isolating the US. Hopefully the next president will be able to reverse the damage he has done to americas reputation.

 

[fskimospy]

Then we haven't had a smart President in decades, because every sitting President in my lifetime has set events into motion due to poor policy decisions.

I see no reason to perpetuate the false hope charade of a two-state solution and fantasy of a sovereign Palestinian state. Was never going to happen.

Isn’t there a pretty simple reason not to recognize Jerusalem as the capital? It costs us nothing to not recognize it and recognizing it makes people angry. Pretty easy decision there unless you’re Trump I guess, haha.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Isn’t there a pretty simple reason not to recognize Jerusalem as the capital? It costs us nothing to not recognize it and recognizing it makes people angry. Pretty easy decision there unless you’re Trump I guess, haha.

Well Schumer seems fairly pleased with the decision.

So we should not pursue common sense so as to not provoke a violent response from irrational people.

If anything, not recognizing Jerusalem costs us more because as we continue to kick the foreign policy can down the road, we allow more people to vest in false hope and idea of something that will never happen.

 

[fskimospy]

Well Schumer seems fairly pleased with the decision.

So we should not pursue common sense so as to not provoke a violent response from irrational people.

If anything, not recognizing Jerusalem costs us more because as we continue to kick the foreign policy can down the road, we allow more people to vest in false hope and idea of something that will never happen.

Not recognizing Jerusalem costs us literally zero in perpetuity but has costs if we do. Continuing not to recognize it is just common sense.

 

[bshole]

Let me be clear, I am not Israel's biggest fan, I hate that so many sheeple want to support Israel just to please their invisible buddy in the sky.

Is sheeple a word that smart literate folks such as yourself use to denigrate the rest of us uneducated buffoons?

 

[MomentsofSanity]

Looks like he left a personal message for Trump on facebook yesterday before he set out. "You failed to protect your nation".

That won't end well for anyone...

 

[zinfamous]

Yea, we never had attacks until this.

You want a president that tries to lead from behind again. It didn't work before.

The president(s) that "lead from behind" weren't responsible for our country's reputation and influence dropping like a stone within months. If "leading from behind" actually keeps us as #1, then that seems like the right strategy, no?

Oh sorry, smoke inhalation again?

 

[SlowSpyder]

The president(s) that "lead from behind" weren't responsible for our country's reputation and influence dropping like a stone within months. If "leading from behind" actually keeps us as #1, then that seems like the right strategy, no?

Oh sorry, smoke inhalation again?

Sorry, but I just don't get this mentality of not doing something we feel is right because it could make people that already don't like us not like us more. We're telling terrorists we're afraid of them so we won't do something we want to do. And now that we have been attacked over this, we must strengthen our resolve even further. Don't send a message that terror attacks will make us change course.

 

[bshole]

Sorry, but I just don't get this mentality of not doing something we feel is right because it could make people that already don't like us not like us more. We're telling terrorists we're afraid of them so we won't do something we want to do. And now that we have been attacked over this, we must strengthen our resolve even further. Don't send a message that terror attacks will make us change course.

Well you guys think teaching fairy tales as science in publicly funded public schools "feels right". How about objectively demonstrating something is right before jumping in for once?

 

[SlowSpyder]

Well you guys think teaching fairy tales as science in publicly funded public schools "feels right". How about objectively demonstrating something is right before jumping in for once?

I'm completely against having prayer or any religious proselytizing in public schools. I don't even like god on our currency. I'm not a believer in any invisible friend in the sky in particular, and don't think government should be used to push anyone's version of a god.

I don't think we should tell terrorists they can stop us from doing what we feel is the right thing because they may attack us.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Not recognizing Jerusalem costs us literally zero in perpetuity but has costs if we do. Continuing not to recognize it is just common sense.

The notion of validating a charade into perpetuity is kicking the inevitable can down the road. North Korea and Taiwan are perfect examples of this.

 

[fskimospy]

The notion of validating a charade into perpetuity is kicking the inevitable can down the road. North Korea and Taiwan are perfect examples of this.

North Korea is definitely not an example of this.

As for Taiwan, that convenient fiction has been incredibly useful for both the US and China. It’s a very good example of a policy that costs us nothing but is very beneficial. These sorts of things are pretty common in diplomacy. So sure, tomorrow we could stop pretending there are two Chinas but then we’ve caused a huge incident that will likely have severe impacts on trade and cooperation and may even lead to war. Or... we just don’t and everything is fine.

I have yet to see a single person articulate what the US gains by recognizing Jerusalem as Israel’s capital. That should tell you something about how dumb an idea it was.