F22/35/16 vs. MiG's SU's and other flying crap - Updated Plane Thread

[lizium]

Poll closed...

 

[PowerMac4Ever]

Ok, do you even know what you're talking about? Mig-29 far superior to the F-22? HA! You've got to be kidding me. Also, I'm quite positive that the Mig-29 is on the same level as the F-15. Of course American F-15s would own Russian Mig-29s because Americans have much better training and AWACS support. I'm not knocking the Russians, they just don't have the money right now.

 

[Chipster]

F35

 

[Desslok]

I have never heard of the F-35. The current F-22 which is still in testing will own the sky's. The only way a 29 could get a 22 is if they used their IR system to come up from behind and do a close in IR missle shot or gun run.

 

[adlep]

F-35?
The plane on the picture looks like the F-22 too me....?
Anyhow this IS VERY UNUSUAL to compare these two planes...... MiG-29 was developed in Soviet Union in the 70's, and although it has excellent airframe, and very good engine, its avionic, radar and weapon subsystem is no match for any moder american plane....
The most suitable comparision would be then MiG-29 versus F-16A version....These planes are very similar in their spects and role....
F-16C however is a much, much better plane overall, aviopnic wise. radar wise, and it can carry a wide array of weapons... air-to-air, air-to-groud (such us PaveWay bombs, Maveric missiles etc, etc)....

Good oponent for F-22 would be Eurofighter Typhoon for example....
MiG-29 is a good plane, but the plain basic version just can not compete (look what happened in Iraq)......

 

[Justin218]

The F-35 is just the JSF, techgeek. Lizium, it's not 500 million dollars. Why don't you read the popular mechanics article where you got the frikkin picture.

 

[lizium]

Thats why i posted this, god damn it, so people who DO know what they are talking about could discuss this. Actually, i am trying not to be biased myself here, but I LOVE the F35 shape. Maybe someone could explain all the main differences between MiG's, Fantoms 16, 22 35 etc...

 

[lizium]

Hehe, i got it mixed up with the Stealth, now that one is $500K mill.

 

[Desslok]

Ahh thanks Justin. I agree with Adlep up to a point. The only problem saying "look what happened in Iraq" is that those pilots were probably a couple notches below where the Soviets pilots would be.

If I am not mistaken the Eagle was produced to counter the Fulcrum or was it the Foxbat?

 

[308nato]

If you ignore the airframe/powerplant performance, the weapons systems are key. The teeth of the beast. The US radar, tracking, aquisition owns the Russian hardware. Not to say everything they have is junk, it just isn't what we employ capabilitywise. However, the Chinese are perfecting the Russian hardware so stay tuned.

 

[adlep]

Oh, F-35 = JSF me/ , doh I should know that....

Then JSF is the same size/ class as F-16, and it is desinged to replace the Falcons.....
Anyhow Russina technology + Chinese electronics can create some interesting combinations...
Really right now/ durring the war, the side with more data, information will prevail....
Right now the western planes have a big informational advantage....which can be deadly....New western planes have excellent data link capabilites, which allows them to passively recieve information from another fighter planes, recon satelites, and AWACS radar systems... which allows them to be practically invisible.... it is like this IR thing that AMDtechgeek was talking about taken to the next level...
F-22 is a stealth fighter.. its radar halo is very very low...It can turn off the radar and rely on the info from the other sources to make a kill. With radar turned off this plane is practically invisible for the radar, and it can aim and kill without even being noticed...

But if the dog-fight situation would happened, the ultimate killing machine these days is SU-37, a latest version of Su-27 Flanker, with a new avionics and vector thrusted engines in 3-d space, which allows it to perform Harrier like combat movements... This plane is the ultimate dog-fight plane........

 

[Desslok]

308 you bring up a great point. The Chinese are going to be a real threat in the upcoming years. The way I see it it is a race between the hardliners and the students(ie younger generation) that want to be free. If the younger generation can cause a coup or a real national election then we will be ok, but if the hardliners get enough power and then feel threaten they are going to strike out either at the Soviet who they hate or at the US.

 

[Pastfinder]

F-35 Joint Strike Fighter, according to the Air Force Alamanac it is designed to be "an affordable, highly common family of next-generation strike aircraft." It is a multi-role fighter, initial delivery is to take place in 2008, with production planned at 1,763 for the USAF, 480 for the USN, 609 for the USMC, and 150 for the UK. In terms of the future the JSF is to replace the F-16 and A-10 of the Air Force, the Harriors of the Marine Corps and Royal Navy, and some of the older F-18s in the Navy.

 

[lizium]

SU 27 and SU 37

 

[Desslok]

The last time that I know that the services tried to get one plane for several branches was the F-111 Advark. The DOD told the Navy and the AF to look at it and if I not mistaken they wanted it to be a fighter too. I can't remember the doctumentary I was watching, but one of the reviews had a great quote when asked if given bigger engines if the Vark could be a fighter "Sir all the thrust in the world couldn't make this plane into a fighter" So the fact that this plane albeit in different version is going to all the different branches is scary to me. Don't get me wrong though the Vark and the ECM version the Spark Vark were great low level intruders.

 

[fornax]

Why would you compare a 30-year old fighter (MiG-29) to a new, still in the works plane like F35?

 

[NFS4]

The F-16 and F-4 Phantom are two of the greatest fighters EVER IMHO.

 

[Electric Amish]

Originally posted by: NFS4
The F-16 and F-4 Phantom are two of the greatest fighters EVER IMHO.

Unfortunately the F-4 is friggen huge next to a MIG.

amish

 

[BreakApart]

If you look close, all the best U.S. and Russian military aircraft, they share sooo many design elements it's hard to tell who was stealing designs for whom.

Pilot training and the weapons carried is all that matters.

Doesn't matter how nice your aircraft is if the missles are substandard, or the pilot can barely stress the abilities of the plane.. Your as good as dead.

 

[Lithium381]

I don't know if it's the best, but out of your options, i like the F22 the best

 

[justint]

In the end it all comes down to the training and skills of the pilots and there supporting maintenance, logistics, and intelligence elements. You can give a country a pile of modern fighter aircraft and other equipment, but it is the infrastructure built to support these systems that makes the difference in the end. When you start looking at availability rates, flight hours, training cycles and rotations, phase results, and personnel retention between different air forces you can probably get a better estimate of thier capabilities.

 

[JellyBaby]

Multirole fighters have traditionally never been the master of any one category. Thus, I wouldn't believe the F-35A (air force version) would perform better than an F-22 in the air superiority role. From the article it sounds like the F-35As would be designated mostly strike roles anyway.

There are many ways to define "best" fighter in the world. Effectiveness, looks, cost/performance, kill record, etc. Thus, you can only truly assess the F-35 after it has been on active duty for a while and been in harm's way.

 

[Daxxax]

If I am not mistaken the Eagle was produced to counter the Fulcrum or was it the Foxbat?

I think it was the other way around....

Like alot of people said here comparing these two planes is kinda pointless, they aren't really close to being on the same page at all. Fighters of the future will rely less on acrobatics and dogfighting and more on top end speed and advanced weapons systems. Even Nowadays a fighter is measured more on top speed, the weapons system it can carry and how far it's range is. The "F-35" is still a long way off. The F-22 isn't even active yet!! and it would blow the doors off of a Mig-29

 

[BP]

The real question is how the SU-37 and the F-22 stack up against each other.

 

[silverpig]

Avro Arrow owns!