Fallout 4 - it's official! Coming Nov 10, '15

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ibex333

Diamond Member
Mar 26, 2005
4,092
123
106
Apparently you aren't, since difficulty doesn't require "extra rewards" to justify it. The idea is to present more of a challenge, give the player more to do. "Extra rewards" are the opposite of increased difficulty.

Food gives you a reason to care about cooking beyond healing items, diseases similarly have you concerned about crafting or finding antibiotics. It's another variable, and more reasons to craft things. Sleep doesn't seem so pressing by comparison, but it does interact with the adrenaline bonus and also brings on hunger as you're passing time.

Limited saving - the idea's mainly to encourage ironman play rather than creepsaving. Limited saving means more of a penalty for death, which in turn makes for more cautious, tactical play. Unfortunately it's indifferently implemented, since it should really allow you to save and exit, and "only when you sleep" is too far between checkpoints.

Giving a player more to do just for the sake of doing more is just grinding. This "more to do" must end in some sort of a reward, but if all it does it take up more of your time, you are essentially wasting your life on pointless grinding.
 

DefDC

Golden Member
Aug 28, 2003
1,858
1
81
Giving a player more to do just for the sake of doing more is just grinding. This "more to do" must end in some sort of a reward, but if all it does it take up more of your time, you are essentially wasting your life on pointless grinding.

It depends on how you look at it. Someone people want to put the game in "god mode" and run through it as fast as possible and see the sights.

Survival mode gives it more of a "Stalker" feel where you never know if you live through the next firefight. Your planning makes all the difference. Back in Fallout 2, the carry weight was low, and you could very well be ridiculously swarmed with deadly enemies.

Maybe some of us are looking for that old school challenge and sense of accomplishment when things go well.
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
82,854
17,365
136
I don't use VATS, but virtually everything regarding firearms is badly designed. There is tons of .38 ammo laying around, but no factory-built .38 weapons. I can build an automatic receiver, but I can't carve a stock. A factory-built 5.56x45mm assault weapon weighs a ton, but a jury-built "pipe weapon" is light, and a laser or plasma weapon lighter still.

Still a pretty good game at over 600 hours.

many guns can be modded to use .38 instead of their native caliber.
Great way to burn up the excess.

OR get a plugin that lets you break down & craft ammo. Then use your favorite gun all the time.
 

GusSmed

Senior member
Feb 11, 2003
403
2
81
Giving a player more to do just for the sake of doing more is just grinding.
I don't think you understand what "grinding" means. Grinding is explicitly about rewards - you're doing something repetitive over and over in order to gain a reward (levels, loot, faction points, something).

Games are all about giving the player something to do. Whether or not what you're doing is interesting or not depends on whether there are meaningful decisions involved. With Survival Mode, I'd say the new decisions are mostly about inventory - how much food, water, and antibiotics you should carry instead of weapons and loot, and how much of your loot space should you devote to ingredients for the same (meat, glowing mushrooms, etc.)

There's also a little more incentive to take the Chemist perk, since you can't craft antibiotics without it. Taking or postponing that perk is another decision.

I think there's a lot to be argued about the specifics of Survival Mode, but what you're doing is a blanket rejection of increased difficulty. The reward for increased difficulty isn't game trinkets, it's enjoyment of the process of solving a harder challenge.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
many guns can be modded to use .38 instead of their native caliber.
Great way to burn up the excess.

OR get a plugin that lets you break down & craft ammo. Then use your favorite gun all the time.
I just sell the .38 since I rarely run low on anything. Though I did run completely out of .308 once. I misunderstood the never-ending rifle to mean that it used no ammo, when in fact it simply doesn't use the magazine system. I ran dry with two .308 rifles and had to fight my way out of the southwest corner with nothing but a 10mm pistol - lots of running! Now I watch it like a hawk and periodically switch between carrying .45, .308, and 5.56x45mm rifles, and sometimes a gauss rifle. Last time I played, I even carried a laser and a plasma rifle. They are so light!

Anybody playing Far Harbor yet?
 

Face2Face

Diamond Member
Jun 6, 2001
4,100
215
106
So anyone playing Far Harbor already? How is it?

I have it loaded, but haven't started the quest yet. I'm only lvl 31 though, so not sure I should jump on it yet? I'm about 77 hrs of playtime. If it's anything like the Dragonborn DLC, as far as the land mass goes, I'm sure I'll love it. The funny thing is, I've been to Bar Harbor in real life, so I'll be interested to see if I find any landmarks.


EDIT: Well I started playing and stumbled upon the start of Automatron, so it looks like I'll be doing that one first.
 
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Face2Face

Diamond Member
Jun 6, 2001
4,100
215
106
Also, has anyone experienced longer loading times? I have the game installed on my SSD, and the loading times have drastically increased from when I last played the game. I't probably been a couple months since I last played though. Took a little break.

I also sold my GTX 780 and installed my older 7970 GE...1440p performance is much worse...I had to drop pretty much everything down to medium. This game might be the main reason why I buy another NVIDIA card this go round, since it's the only game I'm playing these days.
 
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Imp

Lifer
Feb 8, 2000
18,829
184
106
New Far Harbor DLC came out yesterday, apparently... Started up Steam to get updates because I haven't touched it in weeks.
 

Oyeve

Lifer
Oct 18, 1999
21,940
838
126
Also, has anyone experienced longer loading times? I have the game installed on my SSD, and the loading times have drastically increased from when I last played the game. I't probably been a couple months since I last played though. Took a little break.

I also sold my GTX 780 and installed my older 7970 GE...1440p performance is much worse...I had to drop pretty much everything down to medium. This game might be the main reason why I buy another NVIDIA card this go round, since it's the only game I'm playing these days.

I have definitely seen longer load times. Started a few patches ago. I am all ssd and my load times used to be pretty fast but sometimes it seems like it takes 30 seconds to a minute on some loads.
 

Imp

Lifer
Feb 8, 2000
18,829
184
106
Is it me or have load times gotten better?

I went through Boston and it seemed to load pretty quickly near the stadium area.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
Played Far Harbor this afternoon. It's pretty good. I've completed four of the preliminary missions and enjoyed them. There are new monsters, pretty tough too and sometimes quite surprising. Overall the island is well done, haven't yet hit anything I consider poorly conceived or executed.

However, I would really like to shake the hands of the people who wrote the companion AI code. Having Nick spin in place every time I try to speak to him isn't all that impressive, but the path finding AI, how he unerringly blocks me no matter in which direction I wish to go, that took some mad coding skill. But the most amazing feat of his AI is how he can block every line of fire I have and yet still hit me in the back of the head with every single grenade he throws. Amazing!

We whose asses are about to explode salute you.
 

Voxata

Member
Jun 26, 2012
28
1
0
Played Far Harbor this afternoon. It's pretty good. I've completed four of the preliminary missions and enjoyed them. There are new monsters, pretty tough too and sometimes quite surprising. Overall the island is well done, haven't yet hit anything I consider poorly conceived or executed.

However, I would really like to shake the hands of the people who wrote the companion AI code. Having Nick spin in place every time I try to speak to him isn't all that impressive, but the path finding AI, how he unerringly blocks me no matter in which direction I wish to go, that took some mad coding skill. But the most amazing feat of his AI is how he can block every line of fire I have and yet still hit me in the back of the head with every single grenade he throws. Amazing!

We whose asses are about to explode salute you.


Honestly fallout/scrolls games are the most bug filled games I've ever played in my life. I'm more surprised at you being surprised about the AI issues than the AI issues actually being there.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
Honestly fallout/scrolls games are the most bug filled games I've ever played in my life. I'm more surprised at you being surprised about the AI issues than the AI issues actually being there.
Enemy AI isn't nearly as bad though. I never see them hit each other with grenades and they often hit me, whereas if I make the mistake of giving grenades to my companion, I can bank on 90% of them damaging me whether the enemy is a blood bug in my face or a mutant a hundred yards away. I also never see them getting stuck in terrain, whereas I have spent hours of my life trying to coax companions through imaginary obstacles. It's so bad that I commonly just run off far enough that the companion teleports to me, then lead him back to his power armor rather than trying to get him out of a building that settlers freely wander in and out of. And I have to lead him to the correct side, else he will happily run into his own armor's front in an otherwise wide open plaza and then declare it unreachable.
 

StinkyPinky

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2002
6,831
878
126
Played Far Harbor this afternoon. It's pretty good. I've completed four of the preliminary missions and enjoyed them. There are new monsters, pretty tough too and sometimes quite surprising. Overall the island is well done, haven't yet hit anything I consider poorly conceived or executed.

However, I would really like to shake the hands of the people who wrote the companion AI code. Having Nick spin in place every time I try to speak to him isn't all that impressive, but the path finding AI, how he unerringly blocks me no matter in which direction I wish to go, that took some mad coding skill. But the most amazing feat of his AI is how he can block every line of fire I have and yet still hit me in the back of the head with every single grenade he throws. Amazing!

We whose asses are about to explode salute you.

Companions are totally useless, I only keep Nick around in Far Harbor because of the plot. Last session I had he got stuck on a shelf and kept firing point blank at a ghoul which had no legs and arms...and missed 90% of the time.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
Companions are totally useless, I only keep Nick around in Far Harbor because of the plot. Last session I had he got stuck on a shelf and kept firing point blank at a ghoul which had no legs and arms...and missed 90% of the time.
They go through tons of ammo and manage to get their power armor destroyed most of the time. They do however sometimes say interesting things - although most times, they say the same things over and over again ad nauseum.
 

Face2Face

Diamond Member
Jun 6, 2001
4,100
215
106
I gotta say, I love ADA from Automatron. She isn't annoying and upgraded she kicks a ton of A$$.

I have definitely seen longer load times. Started a few patches ago. I am all ssd and my load times used to be pretty fast but sometimes it seems like it takes 30 seconds to a minute on some loads.

Yeah, it's been hit of miss as of late. Fast traveling doesn't take long, but going from the commonwealth into a building has terrible load times... Sometimes over a minute or two.

On another note, I've purchased a used GTX 970 to hold me over until custom GTX 1070's become plentiful. The games run like crap at 1440p on my 7970.
 
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Imp

Lifer
Feb 8, 2000
18,829
184
106
Dannnnnnng.... Finally got to Far Harbor. Didn't realize how big the place was. Only found out after opening the map half an hour after arriving.
 

Qbah

Diamond Member
Oct 18, 2005
3,754
10
81
One of the main reasons I don't use companions is that their kills don't give you experience. And a fully upgraded Ada murders stuff so fast... So that's a lot of wasted experience points. Especially since your companions share your level. So you need to level to level both yourself and your companion but anything the companion does isn't counting towards your own experience... So I just run solo
 

GusSmed

Senior member
Feb 11, 2003
403
2
81
I've been working through another run from scratch with the new Survival Mode in order to play through Far Harbor. I don't think there's much point in taking a level 70+ character (as one reviewer did) into new content, because the difficulty's going to be terribly skewed.

I looked over several mods with major balance changes for this run, but ended up giving them all a miss. Every one I looked at (or tested in one case) ended up screwing something up seriously. Like making missile launchers do 20k area effect damage, or nerfing the weapon perks to the point you might as well skip them.

The one major change I've made, then, is adding a mod that autosaves on transitions, such as entering / exiting a building. An man, does Survival Mode need that. The thing about Fallout 4, particularly when the enemy damage multiple is x2, is that you can die abruptly. Even in the T-45 power armor, a direct hit from a molotov is a one-hit kill.

The game is just fundamentally unsuited to pseudo-ironman play. (Real ironman would be permadeath, and "save once every several hours of play" isn't permadeath). Death is not something you can avoid through careful play.

In any case, I'm only up to Corvega, and not ready to journey to Far Harbor yet. Lack of fast travel hasn't been nearly as big a deal as I thought. It just means I move stuff to the nearest settlement (i.e. Starlight Drive In) to make my loot safe instead of trekking all the way back to Sanctuary. Distances are actually kind of short if you're focused on getting from point A to B and have local drop-offs.
 

GusSmed

Senior member
Feb 11, 2003
403
2
81
OK, case in point, and in line with the comments about companions: I just lost about 2 hour's play because I was throwing a Molotov at a Feral, and Garvey decided that just then would be a good time to step in front of me. Boom! Instant death, and no recent autosaves.
 

Lepton87

Platinum Member
Jul 28, 2009
2,544
9
81
I didn't have time to read the whole thread it would take hours to do that. I have a question.
As you can see I have an ultra-wide monitor that has an aspect ration of 21:9 which the game doesn't support by default. Is there any way to play it in 21:9 aspect ratio?
I've read somewhere that the game was designed for 16:9 aspect ratio so it's going to be difficult to run that thing with a wide aspect ratio I think the HUD elements may be the biggest problem but the game is highly mod-able so maybe someone already solved that problem. I'm quite angry because I bought this monitor recently and every game I want to play doesn't support 21:9. First StarCraft 2 now Fallout 4
 

Qbah

Diamond Member
Oct 18, 2005
3,754
10
81
I didn't have time to read the whole thread it would take hours to do that. I have a question.
As you can see I have an ultra-wide monitor that has an aspect ration of 21:9 which the game doesn't support by default. Is there any way to play it in 21:9 aspect ratio?
I've read somewhere that the game was designed for 16:9 aspect ratio so it's going to be difficult to run that thing with a wide aspect ratio I think the HUD elements may be the biggest problem but the game is highly mod-able so maybe someone already solved that problem. I'm quite angry because I bought this monitor recently and every game I want to play doesn't support 21:9. First StarCraft 2 now Fallout 4

Set the game to borderless windowed and use the two .ini files to manually put your 21:9 resolution. There should be a guide somewhere about it on the internet, you're not the first one asking

Btw. my PC bit the dust while I was exploring Far Harbor... there must have been a shortcircuit on the motherboard or in the PSU... cause it smelled like something got burnt and the fuse blows each time I try to power the PC :awe:

Goodbye my trusty Q9450 and GTX670 You servered well over the years... especially the CPU! Such fond memories throughout the years.... I'm now waiting for Broadwell-E next week and GTX1070 and I'll start building from scratch
 
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