Fireproof vs non-fireproof surge protectors

[drthrd]

I have seen them and heard of them, but really didn't put to much thought into them. Whenever I would see and/or hear them I would think that sounds good or that's a good selling point but I doubt that would happen. Then one day I saw show or video about a famous person house burning down because of a surge protector. I had to some looking and I think it was Trace Adkins, but don't remember exactly. His house did burn because of a surge protector. http://theboot.com/trace-adkins-house-fire-cause/. Here is 2 more interesting links I fount about surge protectors and fires. http://www.sfowler.com/investigations/Surge Protectors.htm and http://www.skyvalleychronicle.com/B...ould-have-burned-down-the-whole-house-1004184. It has got me started to think about fireproof surge protectors now. Do you think the advice them 2 links give are good and not outdated? Would like to see some updated advice from pros about it.

Would like to get your opinion on fireproof surge protectors and if being fireproof is major plus in buying a surge protector.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I'm not sure about fire-proof ones specifically, but I know that Tripp-Lite and APC make metal-casing surge protectors.

 

[Cerb]

If the UL and other stamps/stickers are legit, I'm cool. Big brands matter, for this, IMO, since they have a lot to lose, and little to gain, from acting fraudulently (and even when they don't, still get sued for design mistakes - see APC).

If it's more than ~10 years old, replace it. The safety requirements have gone up, mainly in terms of preventing them from catching fire, over the years, especially since around 2000 (I can't recall the exact year, off the top of my head). As well, the surge suppressing component (MOV) is sacrificial, and practically impossible to test (if it fails in certain ways, the strip can tell if it's gone bad, but it can't tell if it's just worn out), so it's considered a good idea to replace old ones just in case they aren't working to snuff out surges, anymore.

I'll keep using old metal-cased ones as PDUs, just not on carpet, personally, since I really don't see how a fire starting in one is going to spread, but that's as far as my cheapness goes, for old power strips . Especially old plastic-cased ones get replaced, landfill waste issues be damned.

While on the subject, don't have cables going over door thresholds, or otherwise being crushed. If they have to cross a threshold, or a walkway, get some protectors/guides from an office store. That can eventually lead to a high-resistance short, that can cause a fire, and people do it all the time.

 

[monkeydelmagico]

I'm not sure about fire-proof ones specifically, but I know that Tripp-Lite and APC make metal-casing surge protectors.

+1 on the Tripp lite and APC name brand surge protectors. Toms hardware did an extensive tear down series on cheap surge protectors. After reading it I scrapped all my cheap ones. I was foolish to hook a $10.- surge protector to a $1,xxx.- machine that I use daily and rely upon.

 

[drthrd]

+1 on the Tripp lite and APC name brand surge protectors. Toms hardware did an extensive tear down series on cheap surge protectors. After reading it I scrapped all my cheap ones. I was foolish to hook a $10.- surge protector to a $1,xxx.- machine that I use daily and rely upon.

Do have the link to the Tom's Hardware article?

 

[corkyg]

Can't imagine Any surge protector as fire PROOF. Fire resistant, yes, but not "Proof." That means it will not be damaged by any fire, and that scenario makes no sense.

 

[drthrd]

Can't imagine Any surge protector as fire PROOF. Fire resistant, yes, but not "Proof." That means it will not be damaged by any fire, and that scenario makes no sense.

They mean they won't start a fire and burn down your house.

 

[corkyg]

They mean they won't start a fire and burn down your house.

OK - but that is not what fireproof means. That would be more like fire safe.

 

[Ken g6]

It seems like any surge protector - or any electronic device at all - that can cause a fire shouldn't get UL listing and shouldn't be sold.

 

[Red Squirrel]

You could look for a metal cased one, and replace the power cord with BX wire. The conductors inside might still melt though, depends what kind of heat/fire you are expecting it to withstand. I'm guessing this is for an environment that gets lot of sparks, vs wanting to actually survive a full blown fire?

 

[master_shake_]

Can't imagine Any surge protector as fire PROOF. Fire resistant, yes, but not "Proof." That means it will not be damaged by any fire, and that scenario makes no sense.

as soon as i read the thread title this is what popped in to my head.

i was thinking "usually when your house is on fire the things that need surge protection are usually destroyed."

here is the one i use

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816129053

 

[drthrd]

It seems like any surge protector - or any electronic device at all - that can cause a fire shouldn't get UL listing and shouldn't be sold.

I agree.

 

[westom]

They mean they won't start a fire and burn down your house.

Fire has long been a problem when MOVs are grossly undersized. Two failure modes exist - degradation and catastrophic failure. MOV manufacturers are blunt about this. Catastrophic failure must never happen. MOVs must be properly sized to conduct any surge without catastrophic failure.

An undersized protector can fail catastrophically. Many have seen this such as smoke or sparks. Numerous structure fires have occurred due to undersizing.

Near zero joules protectors depend on a thermal fuse to disconnect protector parts as fast as possible. But sometimes that fuse does not disconnect fast enough. Fire can result.

Effective protectors even earth direct lightning strikes without damage. Protection is always about where hundreds of thousands of joules harmlessly dissipate. How many joules does your protector or UPS claim to absorb? Hundreds? A thousand? Then the emergency protection device - a maybe one amp thermal fuse - averts fire.

We examined one protector from APC that was particularly egregious. Its thermal fuses were not even in contact with MOVs. When Schneider Electric bought APC, it discovered maybe one million of those protectors required immediate removal - due to fire.

A properly earthed 'whole house' protector means hundreds of thousands of joules dissipate harmlessly outside in earth. Properly sizing a protector is essential to averting fire. These numbers are relevant. Lightning can be 20,000 amps. So a minimal 'whole house' protector is 50,000 amps. Because effective protectors do not fail on any surge.

A light can report protector failure. It can only report one type of failure - catastrophic (unacceptable) type. If that light reports a failure, that light is saying a protector was grossly undersized. Its thermal fuse had to trip to avert fire.

Many foolishly believe protectors are one shot protector devices only because so many plug-in protectors are grossly undersized. That light reports a failure on a first surge because that protector was grossly undersized - a potential fire. An undersized protector is also obscenely profitable.

Informed consumers know a properly earthed 'whole house' protector is essential to avert plug-in protector fire. Because and again, protection is always about where hundreds of thousands of joules are harmlessly absorbed. Only 'whole house' protectors are sized and earthed to provide effective protection.

Again, protection without catastrophic protector failure means hundreds of thousands of joules are connected low impedance (ie less than 10 feet) to single point earth ground. Never ignore the numbers.

 

[Blain]

The housing composition has been grossly neglected by surge protector customers.