Firewood theft. This an ethical way to deal with it?

[NetWareHead]

Just lock the wood up.

Like DrPizza said, it just isn't practical. People here actually rely on wood for a majority of their heating, sometimes all of their heat. A little wood shed like this would perhaps be 1-3 days worth of heat:

This is what is more common around here. People are not only storing what they will burn this winter but also seasoning the next year's fuel supply. I've seen even bigger wood piles as well.

 

[dud]

I believe that I read/saw a news report years ago related to this very subject where someone was stealing from a 2nd party. The 2nd party "booby trapped" the stuff being taken and the theif suffered the consequences. Unfortuantely, the perp was harmed and the person who set the trap life was made a living hell afterward. Whether the law states this or that ... why would you want to expose yourself to a lawsuit and the liability of harming someone (anyone can file a lawsuit against anyone for any reason in this country) over some firewood???

Common sense would indicate that if the firewood is that important perhaps a game camera should be set up to collect evidence of the theft ... and leave the "justice" to the law.

The poll option "No, the boobytrap is unethical" should be changed to read: "No, the boobytrap is highly risk and could cost the OP to lose a LOT more than just firewood".

 

[AViking]

Those two pictures are a good representation of the amount of wood you have even in Northern CA but I figure if you care so much about someone stealing your wood then you would go out and spend a couple thousand on securing it. Better yet don't buy so much wood. Those piles are definitely lasting longer than one winter.

Wood is cheap. I think the problem is more with the neighbors you have.

 

[natto fire]

These people aren't stealing firewood because they're "destitute" or because they "have to". If they were really in a bad situation and knocked on a door instead of sneaking into a back yard, their neighbors would help them. And if they're physically fit enough to haul stolen firewood, they're fit enough to cut some for themselves.

Destitute...lol. Morally destitute, maybe

This. That said, potentially murdering people after a theft has occurred is not the most level-headed way to deal with it. It sounds like something an overly passive aggressive person would think of, honestly.

There are currently 18 people on these forums I sincerely hope to never have as neighbors.

 

[NetWareHead]

Those two pictures are a good representation of the amount of wood you have even in Northern CA but I figure if you care so much about someone stealing your wood then you would go out and spend a couple thousand on securing it. Better yet don't buy so much wood. Those piles are definitely lasting longer than one winter.

Those piles are perhaps 5-10 cords by visual estimate. Everyone's heating needs are different. I know a guy that burns 25-30 cords of wood each winter heating a big house, all his hot water. workshop and garage and has the next year's supply already cut,stacked and seasoning. That means 55+ cords of wood on his property at any given time. He either cuts his own trees or has whole trees delivered. His backyard looks like this before stacking:

 

[Apple Of Sodom]

Why not post a very large sign stating thieves beware, many of these logs are booby trapped and will explode in your fireplace. I know which ones are - do you? This might even work without actually boobytrapping them.

Do we know for a fact that the explosion killed or hurtsomeone? I think it would be find to fill the log with something disgusting and noxious, something that causes a small audible noise, but not an actual explosive that will blow the people up. Although, the only good thief is a dead thief. My house has been burglarized before and I would take every opportunity to kill a thief.

 

[rudeguy]

Those two pictures are a good representation of the amount of wood you have even in Northern CA but I figure if you care so much about someone stealing your wood then you would go out and spend a couple thousand on securing it. Better yet don't buy so much wood. Those piles are definitely lasting longer than one winter.

Wood is cheap. I think the problem is more with the neighbors you have.

You really are ignorant aren't you?

People with that much wood don't buy it. They chop it. How in the fuck could you secure all of that? It needs to be exposed to the sun to dry out.

 

[AViking]

You really are ignorant aren't you?

People with that much wood don't buy it. They chop it. How in the fuck could you secure all of that? It needs to be exposed to the sun to dry out.

We bought it. In Northern CA we don't all have forests to get wood from so you just call up a guy and they dump off however many cords of wood you want. I don't think anyone is going to buy a mountain like that other picture but I'm talking about a regular person with a regular house buying around 2-5 cords of wood.

I'll grant you though that I've never had to lock up my wood (huh huh beavis) and deal with drying it out but people have woodsheds. Don't buy oak if you have thieves in your neck of the woods (huh huh).

We had electric heaters in our old house. We had no idea what it would cost but quickly learned our lesson after one month when the bill was over $500. Wood stoves, even in expensive CA, makes a lot of sense.

 

[DrPizza]

We bought it. In Northern CA we don't all have forests to get wood from so you just call up a guy and they dump off however many cords of wood you want. I don't think anyone is going to buy a mountain like that other picture but I'm talking about a regular person with a regular house buying around 2-5 cords of wood.

I'll grant you though that I've never had to lock up my wood (huh huh beavis) and deal with drying it out but people have woodsheds. Don't buy oak if you have thieves in your neck of the woods (huh huh).

We had electric heaters in our old house. We had no idea what it would cost but quickly learned our lesson after one month when the bill was over $500. Wood stoves, even in expensive CA, makes a lot of sense.

I think someone pointed out that you're clueless. You just pointed out again that you're clueless. First of all, there's no way in hell you're going to heat a house in colder areas with only 2 cord of firewood, unless the firewood is for occasional supplemental heat. Second, in this picture: http://www.ecolibrary.org/images/full_image/Firewood_pile_DP1804.jpg I only see about 6 cords of firewood; not much outside of your 2-5 cord of firewood. Derp. I think that anyone with a bit of knowledge can figure out what happened. You attempted to use Google as a substitute for your own knowledge. You didn't realize that there are two different definitions of a cord of firewood. A full cord, and a face cord. If you mix up the two definitions, then your posts and numbers make sense. If you had a clue, you wouldn't mix these two definitions up.

 

[surfsatwerk]

If more people were out with their snowblowers at 4am it would curb this heinous crime.

 

[Newell Steamer]

Place your wood pile at the bottom of an acid filled lake. Have man eating sharks in said lake as well. And, have a helicopter circling the acid shark lake with a chain gun - 24/7. Instruct the helicopter crew to gun down anything that goes near your wood pile (except the sharks of course).

Loading fire wood with explosives - just to "get" at a wood thief; bloodthirsty suburban vigilante psychos are so cute. They are impotent and failures in life, so they cook up all sorts of fantasies of people attacking them and ways to harm them.

Go back to your bloated beer gut and diabetes. Continue making $35K a year in your dead end unfulfilling life as you fantasize about making something of yourself.

In all seriousness though; gate/fence your wood. Or, place a tarp over it with some bells. So, when someone tries to take it, you can run out waving your missle launcher and firing your AK47 at those gosh durn wood thieves.

Rawr - so fierce.

 

[sourn]

This. Maker of the log bomb is probably liable for damages. If someone dies I'd guess manslaughter at a minimum.

I like the colored smoke idea. Or maybe something that stinks something awful when burned.

The colored smoke (not sure what's out there for that) would work. As long as the person that was getting stolen from kept on the lookout.


The "stink bomb" would not work unless it was a regular fireplace. If it was a wood stove you'd only piss of the neighbors or in this case if it was a neighbor taking your wood might just back fire on your depending on the way the wind blew.

So far as explosives, not good. It's freaking wood and while I hate thieves also that's going overboard.

 

[DrPizza]

Oh, and continuing, and using your own numbers against you. If I recall correctly, you claimed a $500/month heating bill for electric. A kilowatt hour of electricity is 3413 BTUs. At 10 cents per kw-hr, that's 5000 kw-hrs. Let's say that only 80% of that went to heat. (I.e., your normal electric bill is $100 per month.) 3413 BTUs/kw-hr * 4000 kw-hrs = 13.6 million BTUs to heat the house. That's equivalent to about 2 face cord of wood, or most of one of those rows of wood in the picture. http://www.superstechnicalassociation.org/pdffiles/EnergyConversionFactors.pdf And... it's not very cold in Northern California. http://www.currentresults.com/Weather/California/city-temperature-february.php That's pretty laughable for "cold" - the current temperature is almost 32 degrees - 45 degrees warmer than it's been on at least half a dozen mornings so far. The average temperature for the past 2 months in this area has been in the teens (Fahrenheit).

 

[NetWareHead]

We bought it. In Northern CA we don't all have forests to get wood from so you just call up a guy and they dump off however many cords of wood you want. I don't think anyone is going to buy a mountain like that other picture but I'm talking about a regular person with a regular house buying around 2-5 cords of wood.

In your area, if you can't chop your own wood and are forced to buy it at dealer's prices, the more the reason to stockpile it and buy it during the cheaper summer. If you are buying firewood in the winter, your fuel is going to get much more expensive. I'd rather stack a firewood delivery in the summer than the winter...

I also have a mistrust of some firewood vendors. Ive been burned by a shipment of green firewood when the vendor promised it seasoned. How the hell am I going to burn that? If that happened in the winter I would have been screwed. If you get firewood delivered during winter time, its probably poor planning and you are resigned to burning whatever the vendor brings you. I don't mind getting green wood delivered in the summertime (if I'm paying green wood prices), at least you can arrange your woodpile to burn the green stuff next year after it seasons.

 

[rudeguy]

Oh, and continuing, and using your own numbers against you. If I recall correctly, you claimed a $500/month heating bill for electric. A kilowatt hour of electricity is 3413 BTUs. At 10 cents per kw-hr, that's 5000 kw-hrs. Let's say that only 80% of that went to heat. (I.e., your normal electric bill is $100 per month.) 3413 BTUs/kw-hr * 4000 kw-hrs = 13.6 million BTUs to heat the house. That's equivalent to about 2 face cord of wood, or most of one of those rows of wood in the picture. http://www.superstechnicalassociation.org/pdffiles/EnergyConversionFactors.pdf And... it's not very cold in Northern California. http://www.currentresults.com/Weather/California/city-temperature-february.php That's pretty laughable for "cold" - the current temperature is almost 32 degrees - 45 degrees warmer than it's been on at least half a dozen mornings so far. The average temperature for the past 2 months in this area has been in the teens (Fahrenheit).

I love it when Doc gets pissed. He has a memory like an elephant and a brain like a beaver (beavers are smart, right?). I wouldn't even dream of posting again if Doc ever came at me.



Full disclosure: I have never bought wood, so I have no idea how much a cord is. I think its the bed of a truck, but I am not sure. I can however chop down a tree with or without a chainsaw and split wood like a champ. When I was getting sober, I would take out my frustrations by chopping down trees and splitting them. My bro in law loved the ever growing wood pile.

 

[AViking]

I think someone pointed out that you're clueless. You just pointed out again that you're clueless. First of all, there's no way in hell you're going to heat a house in colder areas with only 2 cord of firewood, unless the firewood is for occasional supplemental heat. Second, in this picture: http://www.ecolibrary.org/images/full_image/Firewood_pile_DP1804.jpg I only see about 6 cords of firewood; not much outside of your 2-5 cord of firewood. Derp. I think that anyone with a bit of knowledge can figure out what happened. You attempted to use Google as a substitute for your own knowledge. You didn't realize that there are two different definitions of a cord of firewood. A full cord, and a face cord. If you mix up the two definitions, then your posts and numbers make sense. If you had a clue, you wouldn't mix these two definitions up.

I think you're assuming that everyone needs to be a professional wood buyer to get some firewood. We call up a guy, buy some wood, he dumps it, we stack it, we burn it. Full cord and face cord? You're absolutely right I didn't know until 2 seconds ago. I don't remember even having to differentiate between the two. It's Northern CA and not Buffalo.

 

[NetWareHead]

Full disclosure: I have never bought wood, so I have no idea how much a cord is. I think its the bed of a truck, but I am not sure.

Cord of wood is a neatly stacked pile that is 4 feet wide x 4 feet high x 8 feet long:

A face cord is 4 feet high x 8 feet long x 16 inches wide:

 

[waggy]

I think you're assuming that everyone needs to be a professional wood buyer to get some firewood. We call up a guy, buy some wood, he dumps it, we stack it, we burn it. Full cord and face cord? You're absolutely right I didn't know until 2 seconds ago. I don't remember even having to differentiate between the two. It's Northern CA and not Buffalo.

you are wrong though. I have a smallish house (2k sq/ft) and we only use the woodburning stove to supplement the heating (ie we use it a few times a week and only once. that last roughly 6-8 hours). We still go through about 2 cords a winter.

It does not matter if you are in Ca or bumfucking Antarctica. a cord is a cord. A face cord (many also call it a truck cord) is smaller.

proffessional wood buyer? i don't even...

 

[AViking]

Oh, and continuing, and using your own numbers against you. If I recall correctly, you claimed a $500/month heating bill for electric. A kilowatt hour of electricity is 3413 BTUs. At 10 cents per kw-hr, that's 5000 kw-hrs. Let's say that only 80% of that went to heat. (I.e., your normal electric bill is $100 per month.) 3413 BTUs/kw-hr * 4000 kw-hrs = 13.6 million BTUs to heat the house. That's equivalent to about 2 face cord of wood, or most of one of those rows of wood in the picture. http://www.superstechnicalassociation.org/pdffiles/EnergyConversionFactors.pdf And... it's not very cold in Northern California. http://www.currentresults.com/Weather/California/city-temperature-february.php That's pretty laughable for "cold" - the current temperature is almost 32 degrees - 45 degrees warmer than it's been on at least half a dozen mornings so far. The average temperature for the past 2 months in this area has been in the teens (Fahrenheit).

Ok if you're going to do this analysis then please feel free to give me the proper analysis. I lived there in 1989 to 1999. I'd like color charts please. We like to keep our home at 72F and the temperature drops below freezing at night. Please don't take an average either. I would like you to be very specific with how El Nino affected my wood burning as well as drought years and any other variables that need to be considered. If I remember correctly that house was 2,000 sq feet but please calculate it for our 900 sq foot guest house as well. Minus one room that we would keep sealed off sometimes.

You're taking this too seriously.

There is no way in hell I'm going to remember my exact electricity bill, how much we paid for wood, or any of that. We bought wood, they delivered it, we burned it, it kept our home warm. It takes up space and can be put in a wood shed. We just threw a tarp over it at first and then put it under a 2 faced open roof since we didn't have roaming bands of wood thieves. Maybe in NY where you're from you need a small mountain of wood and what I said is not applicable but you are going nuts with this for no reason.

Don't forget to use pie charts.

 

[rudeguy]

Cord of wood is a neatly stacked pile that is 4 feet wide x 4 feet high x 8 feet long:

A face cord is 4 feet high x 8 feet long x 16 inches wide:

Gotcha, thanks!

But I'll never need to know that. If I ever need wood, I chop down a tree. If I ever bought wood, I would feel like I would have to turn in the last half of my man card.

 

[AViking]

And they were not face cords. That's not much wood at all.

 

[mizzou]

boobytraping is unethical and also illegal....now did the guy deserve it? yup lol

the main problem is that every now and then...innocent or unintended people get harmed

 

[rudeguy]

boobytraping is unethical and also illegal....now did the guy deserve it? yup lol

the main problem is that every now and then...innocent or unintended people get harmed

what does that have to do with this thread? This thread is about how AViking doesn't know jack about wood.

 

[waggy]

Gotcha, thanks!

But I'll never need to know that. If I ever need wood, I chop down a tree. If I ever bought wood, I would feel like I would have to turn in the last half of my man card.

yeah. but sometimes you just have to. i sometimes have to get a cord or at the least a truck cord (face cord). Most of the time though i get it free.

A friend of mine goes around after storms and gets the fallen trees. he will offer people to clean it for free if he keeps the wood. his backyard is filled with wood. He gives me a few cords a year I just gotta put gas in the truck and invite him over for BBQ and beer.

 

[rudeguy]

yeah. but sometimes you just have to. i sometimes have to get a cord or at the least a truck cord (face cord). Most of the time though i get it free.

A friend of mine goes around after storms and gets the fallen trees. he will offer people to clean it for free if he keeps the wood. his backyard is filled with wood. He gives me a few cords a year I just gotta put gas in the truck and invite him over for BBQ and beer.

:thumbsup: That's how community is supposed to be.

And I'm not knocking anyone that has to get wood (giggity gigity), I just couldn't do it. Hell when we used to camp down at MIS (the race track) I would go into the woods to find a tree for firewood. All the other people were paying top dollar for wood at the store, I'm out there with an axe, a rope and my step brother's pickup. Sure it was stinky but it was free!