Fixing my house

[AMDMaddness]

http://www.habitat.org/env/restores.aspx

 

[drwoo123]

All the work will be contracted out. Prior to purchase, I did a walkthrough with a trusted contractor. His estimate with labor and materials was around 45K. I am budgeting 60+/- as a safety net. The plan is to be in and out of the property in 90 days. Thanks for the habitat link, I will definitely check that out.

 

[iGas]

Hardwood Floors and Carpet throughout - 3 Bedrooms - Living , Dining
Gut and Redo 2.5 Baths
Gut and Redo Kitchen
New Fence, New Deck
Replace All the windows
Landscaping
Replace Heating and Air Conditioning System
New Roof of course

estimate with labor and materials was around 45K

Depends on what you really mean complete reno, but no way in hell you can get all that work done for 45K.

Gut & redo 2.5 bath you are looking at the very least 15K (more if you want better counters & tiles/marbles/bath/shower), but more likely 20-25K
Don't know how large the house is and the materials/quality that you want, but you are looking at around 8K or more to replace the flooring.
Gut & redo kitchen, depends on how large the kitchen is and how extensive of a face lift you are going to do, but complete stainless steel appliances (range hood/range,cook top, or oven/fridge) is likely be 5K or more, plus counter top & cabinets (the sky is the limit), and flooring would set you back a total of 25K at the very least for the kitchen.
Fence 2K or more.
Deck, depends on size and materials would be another 2K or more.
Depends on how many windows you have but the average house is going to cost more than 5K (8-10K is more likely).
Landscaping again going to cost at least 2K just to rip out the old sod and reseed.
In place replacement of an AC system going to cost you at the very least 5-6K.
Roof start at around 3K & up.

+10-20% for good measure you are looking at 79K to 87K

Since you are an amateur at reno it is likely that the project going to fail or will cost you north of 87K to get the job done.

<--- plumbing/gas/HVAC

 

[Greenman]

Originally posted by: drwoo123
All the work will be contracted out. Prior to purchase, I did a walkthrough with a trusted contractor. His estimate with labor and materials was around 45K. I am budgeting 60+/- as a safety net. The plan is to be in and out of the property in 90 days. Thanks for the habitat link, I will definitely check that out.

Labor rates must be stupid cheap in your area, or you're contractor isn't carrying insurance and pays his people in cash.

 

[DrPizza]

Originally posted by: MikeyIs4Dcats
cheap in cost usually IS cheap in quality.

True. However, it's difficult to determine what "cheap" is, because so many products/manufacturers are ridiculously over-priced. Example: windows, siding. One of my friends just had Sears Home Siding give him an estimate. It was nearly 10k higher than what the local contractors were asking. I had a window company come in to give me an estimate - they wanted roughly $1000 per window installed. Of course, if I bought right then, I'd get 30% off, and they had a $100 trade-in for each of my windows that they'd be replacing. Oh, and they'd finance it right then and there, on the spot. This was 10 or 15 years ago. I can't imagine how much they want now. The local contractors had much better prices for equivalent, if not better quality windows. (Note: I've only hired a contractor twice in my life: once to replace an upper roof, too steep of a pitch for me, plus it was a hip roof with 2 dormers - not the easiest of do-it-yourself projects. Got a great deal (under $3k, about 15 years ago, for a complete tear down & redecking. LOTS of roofing wound up in the attic, which I cleaned up myself, no complaints. Roof turned out great, never leaked, zero problems.

Anyway, if you're looking to do this as extra income, I think (no offense meant) you're delusional. It might work if you're doing the labor yourself. But, if you're paying a contractor, and think you're going to make a profit after paying for all that material, the contractor, etc., I don't think you've quite thought it through. Think about it - if you could hire a contractor to do all the work, and turn around in 3 months and sell it for even a $20k profit, don't you think contractors would be doing this themselves?

Also, contractors don't pay what you pay. You pay $100 for something - they can get it for $90 (or less?) (Some of the contractors on here might be willing to tell you how much of a discount they get.) Of course, they may charge you $100 for that item - it's part of the profit they build in to the jobs they do. If they're going to use your materials, they're going to have to charge you more on labor to make the job worth doing.

 

[Rubycon]

Don't buy sheetrock made in China.

 

[iGas]

If they're going to use your materials, they're going to have to charge you more on labor to make the job worth doing.

And good luck at finding a contractor to warranty the work with materials that they didn't supply.

 

[drwoo123]

yeah thanks for the warranty heads up. my experience has been that contractors rarely show up on time, and that is when their money is on the line. a lot of these contractors are licensed and insured but simply run subcontractors and do just the marketing on their own. regardless thanks for all the info.

 

[MikeyIs4Dcats]

Originally posted by: DrPizza

Originally posted by: MikeyIs4Dcats
cheap in cost usually IS cheap in quality.

True. However, it's difficult to determine what "cheap" is, because so many products/manufacturers are ridiculously over-priced. Example: windows, siding. One of my friends just had Sears Home Siding give him an estimate. It was nearly 10k higher than what the local contractors were asking. I had a window company come in to give me an estimate - they wanted roughly $1000 per window installed. Of course, if I bought right then, I'd get 30% off, and they had a $100 trade-in for each of my windows that they'd be replacing. Oh, and they'd finance it right then and there, on the spot. This was 10 or 15 years ago. I can't imagine how much they want now. The local contractors had much better prices for equivalent, if not better quality windows. (Note: I've only hired a contractor twice in my life: once to replace an upper roof, too steep of a pitch for me, plus it was a hip roof with 2 dormers - not the easiest of do-it-yourself projects. Got a great deal (under $3k, about 15 years ago, for a complete tear down & redecking. LOTS of roofing wound up in the attic, which I cleaned up myself, no complaints. Roof turned out great, never leaked, zero problems.

Anyway, if you're looking to do this as extra income, I think (no offense meant) you're delusional. It might work if you're doing the labor yourself. But, if you're paying a contractor, and think you're going to make a profit after paying for all that material, the contractor, etc., I don't think you've quite thought it through. Think about it - if you could hire a contractor to do all the work, and turn around in 3 months and sell it for even a $20k profit, don't you think contractors would be doing this themselves?

Also, contractors don't pay what you pay. You pay $100 for something - they can get it for $90 (or less?) (Some of the contractors on here might be willing to tell you how much of a discount they get.) Of course, they may charge you $100 for that item - it's part of the profit they build in to the jobs they do. If they're going to use your materials, they're going to have to charge you more on labor to make the job worth doing.

actually for most general goods, contractors don't receive a very big, if any discount. In fact Lowes doesn't discount any and HD just recently started, but only if you use their credit lines, and from my recollection it wasn't enough to warrant the hassle. Sepcilaty contractors do usually save a decent amount on things such as paint from paint stores and flooring, but for the most part lumber and such is the same. Now thats not to say that from the local lumberyard I can't get quotes on a larger project and save a little, but if we walk in off the street we likely are paying the same as you. We do get a good discount on concrete, mostly because usually a homeowner wants a partial load for his front step, and we're buying 10 truckloads.

In my experience, the general public thinks cheap means CHEAP. As in, hey, I want new windows, but I want the cheap. They think that you can get wood windows for what it would in fact cost you to get vinyl. I do commercial and it's even worse there sometimes...people think a lockset ought to cost $45 just like the one at their house, when in fact a commercial grade lockset may run you $100 and up.

 

[MotF Bane]

Save yourself lots of cash and do some of the work yourself. A lot of that is pretty simple. Fencing, hardwood flooring, window installation, landscaping... you can figure those out. You should be able to do most of the kitchen and bathrooms, barring electrical and plumbing work. Leave HVAC and roofing to professionals.

For hardwood flooring, there's a type that comes in variable lengths, pre-stained and finished, with a slot on one side and a ridge on the other. They lightly lock together, and then you use a hardwood nailer. Price isn't bad, and it's easy to do it yourself.

 

[DrPizza]

Originally posted by: MikeyIs4Dcats
actually for most general goods, contractors don't receive a very big, if any discount. In fact Lowes doesn't discount any and HD just recently started, but only if you use their credit lines, and from my recollection it wasn't enough to warrant the hassle. Sepcilaty contractors do usually save a decent amount on things such as paint from paint stores and flooring, but for the most part lumber and such is the same. Now thats not to say that from the local lumberyard I can't get quotes on a larger project and save a little, but if we walk in off the street we likely are paying the same as you. We do get a good discount on concrete, mostly because usually a homeowner wants a partial load for his front step, and we're buying 10 truckloads.

In my experience, the general public thinks cheap means CHEAP. As in, hey, I want new windows, but I want the cheap. They think that you can get wood windows for what it would in fact cost you to get vinyl. I do commercial and it's even worse there sometimes...people think a lockset ought to cost $45 just like the one at their house, when in fact a commercial grade lockset may run you $100 and up.

I didn't have much of an idea in general; I guess maybe it also depends on the source? I know the privately owned lumber yards in my area give contractors some degree of a discount, and the one I was most familiar with - the place that sold my gas furnace to me, they won't even sell to the general public & they base the price for the contractors on how often the contractors purchase from them. i.e. higher volume gets a lower price. (Not sure how much lower their price is.)

 

[drwoo123]

just an update at the end of the project.

we finished and turned and were able to sub out the work. It came out amazing, and people absolutely loved the place.

our total cost 42K.

profit after realtor fees, and closing 77K.

thanks for all the supporters.

 

[zoiks]

Originally posted by: drwoo123
just an update at the end of the project.

we finished and turned and were able to sub out the work. It came out amazing, and people absolutely loved the place.

our total cost 42K.

profit after realtor fees, and closing 77K.

thanks for all the supporters.

Wow. You did well. Congrats.

 

[oogabooga]

Originally posted by: zoiks

Originally posted by: drwoo123
just an update at the end of the project.

we finished and turned and were able to sub out the work. It came out amazing, and people absolutely loved the place.

our total cost 42K.

profit after realtor fees, and closing 77K.

thanks for all the supporters.

Wow. You did well. Congrats.

indeed. Have any before/after pictures?

 

[ShockwaveVT]

(before & after) pics or ban imo

 

[mshan]

You might try and see how active your local Angie's List is and see if a subscription is worthwhile. Local chapters can be hit or miss, primarily depending upon how large a metropolitan area your local area services (i. e. has a lot more members writing reviews).

Look for well-rated handymen, renovators, etc., get some estimates and hopefully they have good sources to get raw materials from at a fair price. You could also try and find a good interior decorator, and if you like that decorator's style and pricing, see if that person has reliable contractors with which they work.

When my sister was doing condo renovations, I got a subscription to Angie's List and found a owner operated carpet store where she got really high quality carpet remnants (I think $7 sq. ft. carpet for about $2 sq ft), and she got referral to a handyman (actually, I think my mom asked carpet installer used by that well rated carpet company and got the handyman reference that way), who has done lots of renovations for her at very fair prices. Handyman had some good granite countertop distributor friends, and she was able to pick up some really nice granite countertop remnants for bathrooms at really good prices.

Personally, I think I would stay away from Home Depot or Lowes for any installed renovations, because I think they just sub-contract out to whomever will work for least amount of money. Owner operated independent business owner can probably offer you higher quality products, better installation, and probably competitive prices with the big box stores.

With your $40,000 - $60,000 total budget, bet you could get a lot of bang for your buck if you can find someone that does quality work and has a network of other owner operated businesses that he uses often.

Given that comps in your neighborhood are $280,000 - $310,000, I personally would opt for using high quality materials, professionally installed by experienced installer, even if it costs you a little more out of pocket right now. You might get greater return once housing market and home buyer psychology changes back more towards a balanced or buyer's market (I get impression now that un-knowledgeable home buyers will say that any listed price is way too high, irrespective of what recent comps and historical price appreciation / replacement cost might indicate).

Good Luck!