Footage of two black men handcuffed in Starbucks prompts police investigation

[esquared]

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/foo...fed-starbucks-people-wondering-133435563.html

So when do you think the last time that Starbucks employee called the police when two white people didn't buy anything and said they were waiting for a friend?

I know it's stated the cops asked them to leave three times but refused, but why were they asked to leave?
Law against waiting for someone in a starbucks?

Come on America, wake the F up. I am getting tired of this horseshit. So you see two black people and think somethings wrong and/or you call the cops cause you're pissing your pants.

Jeebus, it was in a damn starbucks for pete's sake.
And.......there was nothing going on, as people will/would no doubt speculate.
Witnesses there said the two men were minding their own business.

 

[Kneedragger]

Are they still being boycotted for the Refugee hiring comment?!

 

[Paladin3]

Starbucks asked the two men to leave because they were not paying customers. Nobody has a right of any kind to stay on private property of a business after they are requested to leave. Cops were called by Starbucks, asked the gentlemen to leave three times, at which point they were arrested and removed. Totally legal.

In the comments someone said it's a Starbucks policy to ask non-customers to leave if they are just hanging out. When Starbucks tweeted they were disappointed this incident lead to an arrest they are full of poop. They called the cops and demanded the men be made to leave. They may be disappointed because the men didn't leave willingly, but should not be mad at the cops for making them leave when that's what they asked to have done.

Now, unless you've got proof that Starbucks only kicks out black non-customers, but allows whites to say, there is nothing to see here. If you can prove Starbucks unfairly targets blacks then let us know. But DON'T say anything silly like "we all know whites wouldn't be asked to leave" like it's a verified fact. Prove it. Otherwise we're just searching for racism where it doesn't exist.

If you want to boycott Starbucks go ahead. I don't drink coffee, and would rather patronize a mom and pop shop if I did.

 

[esquared]

Starbucks asked the two men to leave because they were not paying customers. Nobody has a right of any kind to stay on private property of a business after they are requested to leave. Cops were called by Starbucks, asked the gentlemen to leave three times, at which point they were arrested and removed. Totally legal.

In the comments someone said it's a Starbucks policy to ask non-customers to leave if they are just hanging out. When Starbucks tweeted they were disappointed this incident lead to an arrest they are full of poop. They called the cops and demanded the men be made to leave. They may be disappointed because the men didn't leave willingly, but should not be mad at the cops for making them leave when that's what they asked to have done.

Now, unless you've got proof that Starbucks only kicks out black non-customers, but allows whites to say, there is nothing to see here. If you can prove Starbucks unfairly targets blacks then let us know. But DON'T say anything silly like "we all know whites wouldn't be asked to leave" like it's a verified fact. Prove it. Otherwise we're just searching for racism where it doesn't exist.

"Now, unless you've got proof that Starbucks only kicks out black non-customers, but allows whites to say, there is nothing to see here."
I was waiting for a waterboy to come out here and defend these assholes.

"But DON'T say anything silly like "we all know whites wouldn't be asked to leave" like it's a verified fact. Prove it. Otherwise we're just searching for racism where it doesn't exist."
Who said that? Not me. I asked a hypothetical question. I said, when do you think the last time that Starbucks employee called the police when two white people didn't buy anything and said they were waiting for a friend?

Who said starbucks asked them to leave? From what was posted, it looks like the employee just called the cops.

Who said that it's starbucks policy to ask people to leave? One of those random comments that is now past 6K? Starbucks certainly didn't mention that in their tweet.
Starbucks has already admitted they fucked up.

I been at plenty of starbucks in the past and see people just using their wifi without buying anything. I have never seen anyone being asked to leave.
No one searching for racism here. Because it actually happened, I was just posting it for everyone to see another example of people behaving badly
to African Americans.

cheeto's MAWA - (trying to ) Make America White Again.One starbucks at a time.

 

[Paladin3]

"Now, unless you've got proof that Starbucks only kicks out black non-customers, but allows whites to say, there is nothing to see here."
I was waiting for a waterboy to come out here and defend these assholes.

"But DON'T say anything silly like "we all know whites wouldn't be asked to leave" like it's a verified fact. Prove it. Otherwise we're just searching for racism where it doesn't exist."
Who said that? Not me. I asked a hypothetical question. I said, when do you think the last time that Starbucks employee called the police when two white people didn't buy anything and said they were waiting for a friend?

Who said starbucks asked them to leave? From what was posted, it looks like the employee just called the cops.

Who said that it's starbucks policy to ask people to leave? One of those random comments that is now past 6K? Starbucks certainly didn't mention that in their tweet.
Starbucks has already admitted they fucked up.

I been at plenty of starbucks in the past and see people just using their wifi without buying anything. I have never seen anyone being asked to leave.
No one searching for racism here. Because it actually happened I was just posting it for everyone to see another example of people behaving badly
to African Americans.

MAWA - (trying to ) Make America White Again.

There is a cafe just down the road from me. If I go in and don't order anything they will ask me to leave. Is that racist?

Show me some proof Starbucks asked these two men to leave because they were black. Show me some proof or reason to believe those men were only arrested because they were black. Show me some proof white folks would have been treated any differently.

And stop saying you aren't accusing folks of being racist, then accuse folks of being racist. You can't dance around your accusations.

And I'm not arguing with you anymore on this.

 

[esquared]

Piss off waterboy.
I didn't say I wasn't accusing people of being racist. Of course I was, or I wouldn't have posted the damn article.
You have no argument. If you believe that this was justified, you're most likely a racist.

Even the CEO of starbucks said that this was reprehensible.

https://twitter.com/Starbucks/status/985200942030012416/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc^tfw&ref_url=https://s.yimg.com/os/yc/html/embed-iframe-min.2d7621e2.html

Read those comments. Nobody gets the cops called on them and arrested for hanging out at starbucks,

Go ahead a keep being the waterboy for these racist assholes, you'll get far.

 

[compuwiz1]

Loitering is loitering, no matter what your skin color is.

 

[esquared]

Loitering is loitering, no matter what your skin color is.

Read the comments. No gets asked to leave a Starbucks much less arrested and taken to jail to
"waiting for a friend". "waiting for a friend" is not loitering. Check the definition.

Don't be a waterboy. The CEO already called the outcome reprehensible.
His longer apology:
https://news.starbucks.com/views/st...ter&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=springfy18

 

[mindless1]

If your dumb ass is asked to leave and you don't, you need schooling ramped up to any level necessary.

Nobody gets to stay anywhere but their own property. Rich, poor, black, white, hot, ugly, does not matter. You have no option to stay.

No CEO apology based on social media pressure means anything.

GET THE FSCK OUT IF YOU AREN"T WANTED THERE. Don't come back, there is no stronger message than spending your money elsewhere.

We all know that they don't turn away any paying customers regardless of race, religion, blah blah blah etc.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I know it's stated the cops asked them to leave three times but refused, but why were they asked to leave?
Law against waiting for someone in a starbucks?

Starbucks is a private business. If there are people standing around, that ARE NOT customers, and the management ASKS THEM TO LEAVE, and THEY DON'T LEAVE, then they are TRESPASSING, and subject to ARREST.

I know this all too well. If someone who owns a private residence or business asks you to leave, you LEAVE.

I was even a customer (and I'm white), at a certain dunkin doughnuts in CT, and there were a group of people, and the mgmt (or could have been a cop, I don't remember), asked us ALL to LEAVE. I complied.

Unless you seem to think that some people are "more equal" than others, and black people don't have to "follow the rules", because "minority", and "bleeding heart liberal".

Of course, those black men, are free to no longer associate or visit that Starbucks location, and even protest on the public streets outside the Starbucks (on PUBLIC through-ways), how they were mis-treated, and how other people should choose not to patronize that establishment.

But what they are NOT free to do, is to remain (LOITER), against the wished of mgmt and the cops.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I been at plenty of starbucks in the past and see people just using their wifi without buying anything. I have never seen anyone being asked to leave.

Then you live in an area of moochers / loiterers. I would never consider using a businesses' wifi, just like their restroom, without buying something.

Funny, how you think that some people breaking the "rules" or at least the unwritten social contracts of businesses providing services to the public, justifies other people (of any color of skin or otherwise) doing the same.

And last time I checked (OK, I haven't actually checked, but I believe strongly that I'm right), there's no legal exception to the definition of loitering, just by saying that you're "waiting for a friend".

 

[VirtualLarry]

If you believe that this was justified, you're most likely a racist.

Shrug. As I posted, it largely depends on location. At a dunkin's in CT, I was asked to leave, EVEN AS I WAS A CUSTOMER. (I'm white. I wasn't being disruptive.)

The difference between those people, and myself, is I'm not stupid, and I know better than to argue with cops as to my justification to remain there on private property. I know the rules.

Again, this is basic rule-of-law stuff, no racism found.

 

[esquared]

Starbucks is a private business. If there are people standing around, that ARE NOT customers, and the management ASKS THEM TO LEAVE, and THEY DON'T LEAVE, then they are TRESPASSING, and subject to ARREST.

I know this all too well. If someone who owns a private residence or business asks you to leave, you LEAVE.

I was even a customer (and I'm white), at a certain dunkin doughnuts in CT, and there were a group of people, and the mgmt (or could have been a cop, I don't remember), asked us ALL to LEAVE. I complied.

Unless you seem to think that some people are "more equal" than others, and black people don't have to "follow the rules", because "minority", and "bleeding heart liberal".

Of course, those black men, are free to no longer associate or visit that Starbucks location, and even protest on the public streets outside the Starbucks (on PUBLIC through-ways), how they were mis-treated, and how other people should choose not to patronize that establishment.

But what they are NOT free to do, is to remain (LOITER), against the wished of mgmt and the cops.

You didn't read the article did you? You didn't read the tweets did you? You didn't read the CEO's apology did you?
Shame on you.

"Again, this is basic rule-of-law stuff, no racism found."
No racism found because you agree with the assholes who called the cops.
No racism found because you supported the cops arresting these African Americans.
No racism found because, as you said, you're white"
No racism found because you actually have to think and see these injustices. As they happen every fucking day.
No racism found because - reasons
How on earth could you miss this???

I won't rip you a new one, just because...........................

 

[ivwshane]

Shrug. As I posted, it largely depends on location. At a dunkin's in CT, I was asked to leave, EVEN AS I WAS A CUSTOMER. (I'm white. I wasn't being disruptive.)

The difference between those people, and myself, is I'm not stupid, and I know better than to argue with cops as to my justification to remain there on private property. I know the rules.

Again, this is basic rule-of-law stuff, no racism found.

Yeah, what you seem to be missing isn't that Starbucks has the right to remove people from its premise, its that they decided to remove these people from the premise. Why? What is Starbucks public policy regarding non paying customers? What was their reasoning for asking these two guys to leave? Have they applied that policy fairly in the past?

Those are all questions you didn't bother asking and its why the CEO probably came out and apologized.

Using your right to remove people from your business isn't an issue, so long as you apply that policy equally. If you don't then it becomes an issue of discrimination and if that discrimination is against a protected class, then you are going to have problems.

 

[mikeymikec]

Now, unless you've got proof that Starbucks only kicks out black non-customers, but allows whites to say, there is nothing to see here..

Straw man: esquared was not asserting that this is a failing of the entire organisation.

Employ Occam's Razor instead: Coffee shop employment is not exactly the desired calling of our best and brightest. Where there are ignorant and stupid people, events born of stupidity and ignorance are more likely to occur, like when security guards ask gay couples to leave because they're holding hands or they kissed, etc.

There are racist people around. This fact ought to be as much of a shock as the fact that water is wet.

Someone really needs to rewrite the lyrics to "there are no cats in america", because threads like this really need a theme song.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Yeah, what you seem to be missing isn't that Starbucks has the right to remove people from its premise, its that they decided to remove these people from the premise. Why? What is Starbucks public policy regarding non paying customers? What was their reasoning for asking these two guys to leave? Have they applied that policy fairly in the past?

In the absence of any sort of public, binding policy document on all Starbuck's locations, I would instead assume that the choice of whether to ask someone to leave, is down to the mgmt, which would largely be location-specific.

Those are all questions you didn't bother asking and its why the CEO probably came out and apologized.

Using your right to remove people from your business isn't an issue, so long as you apply that policy equally. If you don't then it becomes an issue of discrimination and if that discrimination is against a project class, then you are going to have problems.

I mean, you can call me racist all you want, I guess, for supporting Starbuck's right to do this, which is what I was taking offense at @esquared ' s POV, that somehow, they should get a pass, EVEN AFTER BEING ASKED TO LEAVE BY THE COPS. (Because "waiting for friends", isn't really loitering. Oh wait, yes it is, if you're not a customer.) I know I'm NOT racist, just because I don't support "social affirmative action for minorities", doesn't make me so. "Taking the knee", doesn't mean that "black people" (insert favorite minority here) don't have to follow the Rule of Law.

I mean, if I were the cops, I probably would have escorted them out, taken them down the street, and unless the mgmt explicitly asked to press charges, I would have just released them, and told them never to set foot in that location again. (Small-town police procedures. I understand, that rarely flies in metro-type locations.)

And no, I'm lazy, I haven't read the linked article, nor the CEO's apology.

I just don't think that this is somehow inherently racist. I'm not a Starbuck's customer, but my experience with semi-loitering (staying for an extended period of time - but buying drinks and food) at dunkin's, has shown me that there's no real universal policy on "hanging out", that it's very much down to location, and the predilections of the local cops.

 

[mindless1]

stuff

That's not occam's razor at all. Occam's razor is GTFO and STFU.

 

[Sunburn74]

I think I would side with the comments of the Starbucks CEO.

 

[VirtualLarry]

You didn't read the article did you? You didn't read the tweets did you? You didn't read the CEO's apology did you?
Shame on you.

Well, no, I didn't read them.

I guess my question is, is your reasoning for posting this thread, because: 1) you think that Starbuck's mgmt are assholes, for asking non-customers to leave, who happen to be black, or 2) you think that two men that the cops asked to leave, three times, were arrested, should somehow not be required to follow the law, because they're black, and "everybody knows" (roll eyes) that the law is somehow prejudiced against black people.

"Again, this is basic rule-of-law stuff, no racism found."
No racism found because you agree with the assholes who called the cops.
No racism found because you supported the cops arresting these African Americans.

Well, I agree that the people that made the decision to ask those black men to leave, were assholes. But that doesn't inherently make them racists, just because of the race of those affected by that decision.
My people of mentioning (several times) that 1) I'm white, I'm part of the "majority", and that 2) I was ALSO asked to leave a "coffee shop". Thus providing a counter-example to this particular example, that suggests that racism, may not be the factor at play here. In fact, my personal example, being that: 1) I actually purchased food and drink from said coffee shop, and was STILL asked to leave, and yet in your example, 2) the black men did NOT buy anything - at least from those two examples, I would counter, that it seems that the dunkins that asked me to leave, was MORE racist, against whites (paying customers!), than that Starbuck's was against the black men (whom were NOT customers).

 

[mikeymikec]

I think I would side with the comments of the Starbucks CEO.

Not exactly rocket science is it?

It's amazing really: Pretty much everyone present and the head of the company says "what happened here is stupid", yet lots of people who weren't there are saying the opposite.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Is there some inherent reason, or some believed inherent right, to "wait for friends" INSIDE the Starbuck's? I mean, if they're not customers, why not meet OUTSIDE somewhere nearby. Seems more logical to me, and less risk to being picked up for loitering.

Edit: Unless it was cold and snowing. Then, if you're going to take advantage of businesses' heat and hospitality, then PAY THEM and order a drink or some food. Really, it should be common sense.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Well shit, I've sat in Starbucks and not ordered something. Guess the ones around here don't care

*Note, I'm white.

 

[mindless1]

nvm

 

[VirtualLarry]

Idiots. If you are asked to leave, that's THE END.... Doesn't matter if you have a life threatening illness where moving you would kill you.

Somebody who gets it. Those black people, weren't arrested for racism, but for their own stupidity, and refusal to leave the premises. Stupid is as stupid does?

 

[ch33zw1z]

Idiots. If you are asked to leave, that's THE END. It doesn't matter if you are waiting for Hillary Clinton to delete her emails. Doesn't matter if you want trump impailed, doesn't even matter if you are waiting for Scotty to beam you up. Doesn't matter if you have a life threatening illness where moving you would kill you.

YOU CAN NOT STAY, PERIOD.

Ok, this post made me chuckle. First, because you bring up buttery males, then you spelled impaled wrong....unless you means putting Trump in an actual pail. I know my phone is always correctly me, and many times wrong, thanks for the chuckle