For the 20 year anniversary

[guyver01]

Rose no closer to baseball reinstatement 20 years into ban

-- It's one of the great ironies in all of sports: Pro baseball's career hitting leader is not in baseball's Hall of Fame.

On Monday, 20 years to the day Pete Rose signed an agreement with Major League Baseball banning him from the sport, he is no closer to being reinstated.

In that agreement, Rose, accused of betting on MLB games while he managed the Cincinnati Reds, was "declared permanently ineligible in accordance with Major League Rule 21."

Last month, it took one comment about baseball's hit king from baseball's former home run king to reignite the controversy.

"I would certainly like to see him in," Hank Aaron told reporters at baseball's Hall of Fame festivities. "He belongs in, really."

At first, many observers thought those remarks were a big move in favor of Rose, as Aaron is a longtime friend of MLB Commissioner Bud Selig. Hall of Fame pitcher Bob Feller later told the San Francisco Chronicle, "I heard what Hank Aaron said about it, and that's a cockamamie idea. I had dinner with the commissioner Sunday, and he didn't like it."

 

[TallBill]

Pete should be in the Hall, but I don't think he ever will be.

 

[lupi]

good thing we're only approaching it and it's not already past by several minutes, cause that would be discouraging.

 

[guyver01]

Originally posted by: TallBill
Pete should be in the Hall, but I don't think he ever will be.

Agreed...

Should he be banned? probably... he gambled on a team he was playing for.. that's bigtime nono.

but, should what he did off the field have any effect on his accomplishments ON the field as a player? NO .. i dont think it should

 

[guyver01]

Originally posted by: lupi
good thing we're only approaching it and it's not already past by several minutes, cause that would be discouraging.

there.. i fixed it.

happy?

:roll:

 

[mcmilljb]

I think the ban should be lifted, but definitely not in the hall of fame until after he passes away. These people who break the rules should not be allowed to prosper from their actions. I wish these steroid jokers would be banned for a while. They were just as bad (actually worse) as pete rose's gambling. There should be at least some integrity in this sport.

 

[BoomerD]

Originally posted by: mcmilljb
I think the ban should be lifted, but definitely not in the hall of fame until after he passes away. These people who break the rules should not be allowed to prosper from their actions. I wish these steroid jokers would be banned for a while. They were just as bad (actually worse) as pete rose's gambling. There should be at least some integrity in this sport.

Integrity ONLY in this sport? Why not push for integrity in ALL sports?

Michael Vick should be banned for life, as should ANY professional athlete who is convicted of a felony. Testing positive for illegal drugs should be a lifetime ban, illegal steroid use should result in a lifetime ban.
All too often, professional athletes seem to think the laws don't apply to them...and all too often, because of their celebrity status, they don't.
Living in northern Kahleeforneeya, I remember all the new stories about Jose Canseco while he was with the A's. He got away with stuff that would put a "normal" person behind bars for years. He's only one (relatively minor) example of the "star power" these athletes carry, and of the political power the teams wield.

As for Pete Rose...I didn't agree with the lifetime ban when it happened...I don't agree with it today. Banned from playing? Yes. He gambled on a game that his team was playing in. He COULD potentially have "thrown" a game in order to win big with his bookie...OR, in order to help pay some gambling debts. Since he bet ON his team, not against them, I consider it to be a slightly lesser "sin," but none the less, his career should have been ended. That part I agree with.

As for the Hall of Fame...he earned the right to be interred in the Hall of Fame. He was a fabulous baseball player in his day and he earned his place in the Hall of Fame. (perhaps with the infamous asterisk* )

 

[BigJ]

Originally posted by: BoomerD
Integrity ONLY in this sport? Why not push for integrity in ALL sports?

Michael Vick should be banned for life, as should ANY professional athlete who is convicted of a felony. Testing positive for illegal drugs should be a lifetime ban, illegal steroid use should result in a lifetime ban.
All too often, professional athletes seem to think the laws don't apply to them...and all too often, because of their celebrity status, they don't.
Living in northern Kahleeforneeya, I remember all the new stories about Jose Canseco while he was with the A's. He got away with stuff that would put a "normal" person behind bars for years. He's only one (relatively minor) example of the "star power" these athletes carry, and of the political power the teams wield.

As for Pete Rose...I didn't agree with the lifetime ban when it happened...I don't agree with it today. Banned from playing? Yes. He gambled on a game that his team was playing in. He COULD potentially have "thrown" a game in order to win big with his bookie...OR, in order to help pay some gambling debts. Since he bet ON his team, not against them, I consider it to be a slightly lesser "sin," but none the less, his career should have been ended. That part I agree with.

As for the Hall of Fame...he earned the right to be interred in the Hall of Fame. He was a fabulous baseball player in his day and he earned his place in the Hall of Fame. (perhaps with the infamous asterisk* )

Well said.

 

[rockyct]

Originally posted by: mcmilljb
I think the ban should be lifted, but definitely not in the hall of fame until after he passes away. These people who break the rules should not be allowed to prosper from their actions. I wish these steroid jokers would be banned for a while. They were just as bad (actually worse) as pete rose's gambling. There should be at least some integrity in this sport.

Yeah, we really shouldn't be talking about letting him into the HoF until after he passes away.

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: BigJ

Originally posted by: BoomerD
Integrity ONLY in this sport? Why not push for integrity in ALL sports?

Michael Vick should be banned for life, as should ANY professional athlete who is convicted of a felony. Testing positive for illegal drugs should be a lifetime ban, illegal steroid use should result in a lifetime ban.
All too often, professional athletes seem to think the laws don't apply to them...and all too often, because of their celebrity status, they don't.
Living in northern Kahleeforneeya, I remember all the new stories about Jose Canseco while he was with the A's. He got away with stuff that would put a "normal" person behind bars for years. He's only one (relatively minor) example of the "star power" these athletes carry, and of the political power the teams wield.

As for Pete Rose...I didn't agree with the lifetime ban when it happened...I don't agree with it today. Banned from playing? Yes. He gambled on a game that his team was playing in. He COULD potentially have "thrown" a game in order to win big with his bookie...OR, in order to help pay some gambling debts. Since he bet ON his team, not against them, I consider it to be a slightly lesser "sin," but none the less, his career should have been ended. That part I agree with.

As for the Hall of Fame...he earned the right to be interred in the Hall of Fame. He was a fabulous baseball player in his day and he earned his place in the Hall of Fame. (perhaps with the infamous asterisk* )

Well said.

:thumbsup:

 

[dabuddha]

Unban him. Bullshit that we allow these steroid pumping morons to keep playing and yet ban Pete

 

[Izzo]

edit: accidentally quoted wrong post, so i removed it.

Pete Rose was a little before my time...so he gambled that his team would win? He wasn't fixing or throwing games to win money? If that was the case and it was up to me, I would put him in the HOF.

Slight exaggeration but it would still be interesting - I would be in favor of having more players bet on their teams so it would like they actually gave a crap when they played. How fun would it be to watch Vince Carter or Randy Moss put up a game's worth of salary on the outcome of the game? Think they'd take so many plays off?

In a weird way, I appreciate Rose for having the balls and swagger to bet on his team. That presumably motivated him more each game and gave the fans a better show. Yes, betting on your own team opens a huge can of worms and my sentiment is completely reversed if you intentionally point shave or throw games. But in this case, I don't understand why Selig is being such a hardass about this. Must have some personal issues between them.

Not to digress too much, but do any of you buy into the conspiracy theory that MJ was banned for a year due to betting on his own team? If that's the case, at least Stern had the common sense to see how having one of his best players ever be forever tarnished would be a black eye on the sport.

 

[dainthomas]

Originally posted by: dabuddha
Unban him. Bullshit that we allow these steroid pumping morons to keep playing and yet ban Pete

:thumbsup:

 

[SP33Demon]

I don't think the ban should be lifted. He bet on the game as a manager and he should never be allowed back in the game ever. That being said, he should be in HOF. In addition, baseball needs stiffer penalties for roids. Manny should have gotten a full year in the least. Clowns like him who get caught now need to be made a harsh example of so baseball can restore its image. Heck, give past clowns like ARod, Pettitte, Tejada, Sheffield, and Giambi smaller suspensions for admitting it.

 

[Miramonti]

It would be crude to exploit his name in Cooperstown yet still ban him.

Ban - no. HOF - yes.

 

[Slick5150]

Originally posted by: Izzo
edit: accidentally quoted wrong post, so i removed it.

Pete Rose was a little before my time...so he gambled that his team would win? He wasn't fixing or throwing games to win money? If that was the case and it was up to me, I would put him in the HOF.

Well, what we know 100% is that he would often bet on his team to win. Did that mean he was throwing games when he DIDN'T bet on them? Who knows. But it certianly tipped off bookies to know that they should expect a win when he bet, and to expect a loss when he didn't. And many people argue that that's exactly what he was doing to repay debts to bookies was helping them out by tipping them off. You can't say he was throwing any games, but he was certainly tipping his hand to others about when to expect a win and when not to.

Edit: Besides the fact that the guy is an absolute douchebag at this point. Allowing him back into baseball wouldn't be good for anybody. I had the misfortune of meeting him in Vegas briefly last year.

 

[Taughnter]

I voted Ban - Yes, HOF - Yes

To put it simply, Rose earned his the chance to be eligible for entry in the HOF regardless of all else he has done. Much like McGuire, Bonds, etc.. its up to the HOF voters to determine whether his career is worthy. Fact of the matter is, he was a part of the game and that including his play and his gambling and the sport shouldn't just gloss over that.

As far as being banned from baseball, I'm not necessarily opposed from removing the ban, but I think that the commissioner and the league in general have an interest in the ability to ban players and coaches based on their character and whether they can obey the rules imposed on them. In reality, I think the league should just let individual teams decide whether Rose has the right character to be involved in baseball, but they do have to be able to set standards and enforce rules so I see nothing wrong with it, even if it is harsh.

 

[D1gger]

Originally posted by: Izzo
edit: accidentally quoted wrong post, so i removed it.

Pete Rose was a little before my time...so he gambled that his team would win? He wasn't fixing or throwing games to win money? If that was the case and it was up to me, I would put him in the HOF.

Slight exaggeration but it would still be interesting - I would be in favor of having more players bet on their teams so it would like they actually gave a crap when they played. How fun would it be to watch Vince Carter or Randy Moss put up a game's worth of salary on the outcome of the game? Think they'd take so many plays off?

In a weird way, I appreciate Rose for having the balls and swagger to bet on his team. That presumably motivated him more each game and gave the fans a better show. Yes, betting on your own team opens a huge can of worms and my sentiment is completely reversed if you intentionally point shave or throw games. But in this case, I don't understand why Selig is being such a hardass about this. Must have some personal issues between them.

Not to digress too much, but do any of you buy into the conspiracy theory that MJ was banned for a year due to betting on his own team? If that's the case, at least Stern had the common sense to see how having one of his best players ever be forever tarnished would be a black eye on the sport.

He claims he bet only on his team to win when he was the manager. We don't know that he was telling the truth as for years he claimed he didn't bet at all. But even if he did only bet on his team to win it could have an effect on his team's overall performance. Say he really needs to win a game that he has a lot of money riding on, so he leaves his ace pitcher in for an extra two or three innings thereby causing an injury that takes the starter out for the next month. Definitely has the potential to effect his teams overall record and is not good for his team or baseball.

 

[FoBoT]

i think they'll let him in, after he dies