For those that despise SUV's, might I ask what you drive?

[ThisIsMatt]

<< THANK YOU. Another sound mind in this discussion. It seems that people hate SUV's for all the wrong reason. When's the last time that you saw a Civic with 5 people in it, an Accord with 5 people in it, a minivan filled to capacity, or a pickup truck with three people sitting on the bench seat?? How dare you dis SUV drivers when I rarely see cars filled to capacity.

No one rags on big BMW's and big Mercedes' for poor gas mileage. Ohh, and let's not dis pickups for their bad gas mileage and bulk. Those big ass long-wheelbase pickups weight just as much as the largest SUV's. >>

NFS4, the king of "hear only what I want to hear".

You guys have totally missed the boat. As some have stated, most SUV-haters dislike the fact that people buy SUV's AS COMMUTER CARS. Not very many people buy trucks or minivans as plain consumers. No single person, or even couples, go out and say, "hey, I think I'll buy a minivan!" Naw, they go, "Wo0t, I'm cool, I'm hip, I'm getting an sUv, bayyyyyyyyyyy-be!" And them most SUV's are junked before they get to the low-end of affordability, whereas minivans are often readily available in decent condition, cheap.

Oh, did you miss my facts about SUV's being looped out of the gas guzzler laws?

And did you miss the high profit margin? Yes, it is your money. A fool and his money are quickly parted. <nelson>ha-ha</nelson>.

 

[Ultima]

<< i personally hate suvs Tree hugger...

I drive an Expedition, so I guess I am out of this topic. >>



I wish I knew why you people think "Tree hugger" is an insult? Let me guess, it's cool to drill and consume oil, be the biggest and crush all the little economy cars on the road, and don't forget to squish that bicyclist cause he's a "Tree hugger". Dumbass.

 

[Eug]

<< It's whole front end was like an accordion up to the windshield. >>

Isn't that the point of crumple zones? Anyways, if the car is properly designed that's a good thing. I'd hate to be in a car of that size with no crumple zones, up against a 5000 lb pickup.


Anyways, some interesting stats, for everyone's digestion. Not preaching, but nonetheless I thought they were interesting.

My car:

USA ratings (US gallon):
City: 52 mpg
Highway: 45 mpg
Combined 48 mpg

Canada ratings (Imperial gallons):
City: 63 mpg (4.5 L/100 km)
Highway: 60 mpg (4.7 L/100 km)

My best mileage to date on a single tank is 825.5 km (513 miles) with 43.5 L (11.5 US gallons) combined highway (mostly) and city, with air conditioning some of the time.
That's 5.27 L/100 km or 44.6 mpg (US).

However, for the record I ususally don't get as high a mileage as listed, and I'm sure none of you get the mileage your cars are listed to have in the specs either.

My average mileage to date (including sometimes lead foot driving driving , air conditioning in summer, heater in winter, and stop-&-go city traffic in Toronto):
828.6 L/13020 km = 6.36 L/100 km (37 mpg)

Year 2000 US EPA mileage ratings of vehicles in general: 24 mpg (lowest in 20 years)
Year 2000 US EPA mileage ratings of SUVs: 20 mpg (11.7 L/100 km) (actually slightly lower than light pickups) - Real life estimated to be around 16 mpg.
Year 2000 US EPA mileage ratings of vans/minivans: 22.5 mpg (10.4 L/100 km)
Year 2000 US EPA mileage ratings of passenger cars: 28.1 mpg (8.3 L/100 km) - Real life estimated to be around 20+ mpg.

SUVs, pickups, vans, and minivans make up nearly half of all the year 2000 model US vehicle market.

 

[Ultima]

<<

<< A BMW or a Mercedes' is not as much of a threat to me. >>



(length, wheelbase, weight)
BMW 7-Series - 198, 117, 4376 lbs
Mercedes Benz S-Class - 203.1, 121.5, 4488 lbs
Ford Explorer XLT (most prevelant SUV on the market) - 189.3, 113.7, 4378 lbs
Jeep Grand Cherokee (next most popular) - 181.6, 105.9, 4072 lbs

You were saying? Back yourself up with facts!


<< A truck weighs much less than any SUV of comparable length. >>


(length, wheelbase, weight)
Ford F-150 Lariat SuperCrew Short Bed 4WD - 226.2, 138.8, 5124
Ford Expedition - 205.8, 119.1, 5345 lbs


FACTS!!!!! are your friend >>




They sure are. It isn't the weight that's the main issue, although that certainly is a factor.
http://www.suv.org/safety.html

 

[KokomoGST]

Sheesh, now this thread is degenerating...

Bad drivers are annoying and dangerous... that's nothing new. SUVs + bad drivers = BAD... any big car + bad driver = BAD
Dependence on foreign oil = bad... current licensing standards & driver education in the US = bad...

that's nothing new... I think the main contention of most "bashers" is that it's TOO MUCH of a bad situation. If there were as many SUVs as there were minivans or light trucks, I doubt most people that are peeved would be peeved. The trend will change... crossovers will fill the gap that SUVs were plugging for now... hopefully. "Just ignore it and it'll go away... like that giant squid..."

And my car get 26mpg... the family SUV gets 16... dad's commuter car gets 30. It's not the Highlanders, V6 Explorers, and CRVs that are so much a problem as the 8-10mpg guzzlers for the oil problem. But yeah, the 50% of cars made are SUVs stat is quite alarming. Lets start blaming the gov't!

 

[PlatinumGold]

Ultima

good link. i hope all suv drivers read that one.

 

[Sciolist]

I drive a Subaru Outback wagon. It's good on slippery surfaces, and I can haul a fair amount.

I don't hate SUV's or their drivers, but I prefer not to be behind ANY vehicle that limits my field of vision. That includes but is not limited to SUVs, vans, large trucks, etc. Because I prefer not to be behind them, when merging I will let small cars ahead of me but not one that I can't see around.

 

[Priit]

May I ask how exactly do you guys define "SUV"? Are all big/small (pseudo)offroaders "SUV's"? Was the original Bantam Willys "SUV"?

 

[PullMyFinger]

Holy Crap,
What's up with all of the fear mongers on this site, "oohh, those SUV's are so big and scary, they make the roads dangerous". What the hell do you people do when a tractor trailer or dump truck gets close to you, come to a complete stop until it leaves your sight? Geesus!

Every single argument I've read about how SUV's are excessive, useless, dangerous, blah, blah, can be refuted rather easily: they're heavy - well so are a lot of cars and minivans, they don't handle well - have you ever driven a Town Car, they will never go off road - how many Corvettes and Porches and riced up Asian cars will ever make it to the track, they're never full - look at nearly EVERY SINGLE car or truck or van on the road and you'll see they average 1 or 2 passengers. And to the people saying that there aren't as many pickups as SUV's, better check your stats. The number one selling vehicle for several years has been the Ford F-150 with the Chevy C-1500 right behind it.

And nearly every single SUV hater out there states "when an SUV hits a car ..... ". Well I guess it would be impossible to have a CAR hit an SUV

. Did you people ever think that maybe a person in a large car (only one person in a car than can hold 6, getting 8 mpg and poluting the atmosphere because of a clogged catalytic converter), with bad brakes and worn tires and shocks, talking on their cell phone, not using signals, and playing their music at herculean levels could make an illegal turn and hit an SUV who was driving responsibly? Nope, it's always the driver of the SUV who is at fault. According to the fear mongers here, everyone should drive the vehicle which performs the worst in crash tests just so that everyone would fare the same in an accident. Welcome to Russia, comrades.

Like several others on this thread (myself included) have said, it's the driver who makes the vehicle "dangerous". A bad driver in a Civic is more dangerous to EVERYONE around them than a good driver in a Kenworth.

 

[PlatinumGold]

pullmyfinger

did you bother to read ANYTHING before you posted.

THE SUV / 4 wheel driver Pickups IS INHERENTLY DANGEROUS. The same driver in a CIVIC or in an SUV / 4 wheel driver Pickups would be MUCH MORE DANGEROUS IN AN SUV / 4 wheel driver Pickups. READ THE FVCKING FACTS before you go off.

This is one of the FEW ARGUMENTS MOST OF THE SUV / 4 wheel driver Pickups LOVERS have CONCEDED except IDIOTS LIKE YOU.

If you also read above you will see that I PLAN ON BUYING AN SUV but that doesn't change the FACTS. SUV'S / 4 wheel driver Pickups ARE INHERENTLY MORE DANGEROUS and the Government SHOULD MAKE REGULATIONS TO REMEDY THE SITUATION.

SUV / PICKUPS are not held to the same safety standards as Sedans. SUV / Pickups are more dangerous not only to OTHER DRIVERS but to the DRIVERS of the SUV / Pickups.



DO SOME READING before you make a fool of yourself.

 

[PullMyFinger]

Well PlatinumGold,
Before you make another post (and embarrass yourself), please go to this site and brush up on your grammar. And yes I've read every single post in this thread. You, my friend, are the one who needs to read. My previous posts have always stated that the driver is to blame, not the vehicle.

Wow, you really know your stuff "THE SUV / 4 wheel driver Pickups IS INHERENTLY DANGEROUS".
Why just the other day I heard that a rouge pack of "SUV/ 4 wheel driver Pickups" ran through the city stealing old lady's purses and spray painting gang symbols on the bus stops, all without any drivers.

And you must be one busy person to have interviewed every "SUV/ 4 wheel driver Pickups" owner to get their opinion "This is one of the FEW ARGUMENTS MOST OF THE SUV / 4 wheel driver Pickups LOVERS have CONCEDED". And you dug up this information from where? Oh yeah, I forgot, from that "SUV / 4 wheel driver Pickups IS INHERENTLY DANGEROUS" web site.

Good for you for saying (repeatedly ad nauseum) that your next vehicle will be an Avalanche, maybe after you take delivery you'll get sick and tired of people saying it's a "dangerous vehicle".

You must be the leading authority on contradicting oneself. You tell me to read an article and to "READ THE FVCKING FACTS" "before making a fool of myself", yet all one has to do is look back a couple of posts to one of your fear monger "SUV/ 4 wheel driver Pickups IS INHERENTLY DANGEROUS" posts where you state "it's true i don't have the exact statistical numbers at my fingertips, but it is an undeniable fact even tho i don't have the numbers at my fingertips". And in your post above, you manage to tell me I'm wrong when I say it's the driver who makes a vehicle dangerous while at the same time agreeing with me "The same driver in a CIVIC or in an SUV / 4 wheel driver Pickups would be MUCH MORE DANGEROUS IN AN SUV / 4 wheel driver Pickups". Again, I suggest brushing up on your grammar skills prior to making another post, that way it will be easier to determine when you start and stop contradicting yourself.

What a piece of work you are. This thread WAS a rather mature, sensible discussion topic until YOU decided to chime in with READ THE FVCKING FACTS and IDIOTS LIKE YOU. Oh well, maybe when you put your money where your mouth is and make your own "ricer-friendly" bumber, then people will listen to what you have to say. Hope you have a good time impressing your (shallow) friends by converting your short bed pickup into a long bed, YAWN.

 

[docmanhattan]

flame on!

<< Well PlatinumGold,
Before you make another post (and embarrass yourself), please go to this site and brush up on your grammar. And yes I've read every single post in this thread. You, my friend, are the one who needs to read. My previous posts have always stated that the driver is to blame, not the vehicle.

<snip>...

Good for you for saying (repeatedly ad nauseum) that your next vehicle will be an Avalanche, maybe after you take delivery you'll get sick and tired of people saying it's a "dangerous vehicle".

You must be the leading authority on contradicting oneself. You tell me to read an article and to "READ THE FVCKING FACTS" "before making a fool of myself", yet all one has to do is look back a couple of posts to one of your fear monger "SUV/ 4 wheel driver Pickups IS INHERENTLY DANGEROUS" posts where you state "it's true i don't have the exact statistical numbers at my fingertips, but it is an undeniable fact even tho i don't have the numbers at my fingertips". And in your post above, you manage to tell me I'm wrong when I say it's the driver who makes a vehicle dangerous while at the same time agreeing with me "The same driver in a CIVIC or in an SUV / 4 wheel driver Pickups would be MUCH MORE DANGEROUS IN AN SUV / 4 wheel driver Pickups". Again, I suggest brushing up on your grammar skills prior to making another post, that way it will be easier to determine when you start and stop contradicting yourself.

What a piece of work you are. This thread WAS a rather mature, sensible discussion topic until YOU decided to chime in with READ THE FVCKING FACTS and IDIOTS LIKE YOU. Oh well, maybe when you put your money where your mouth is and make your own "ricer-friendly" bumber, then people will listen to what you have to say. Hope you have a good time impressing your (shallow) friends by converting your short bed pickup into a long bed, YAWN. >>

 

[krakken]

I drive a Camry

 

[PullMyFinger]

"flame on"

He, he, he. Yeah, sorry about the long winded response but I felt I had to stoop to the level of the poster.

 

[PlatinumGold]

pullmyfinger

ok you need a kinder gentler approach. let's examine what you said.

Holy Crap,
What's up with all of the fear mongers on this site, "oohh, those SUV's are so big and scary, they make the roads dangerous". What the hell do you people do when a tractor trailer or dump truck gets close to you, come to a complete stop until it leaves your sight? Geesus!


obviously intended to be FLAME BAIT.

And nearly every single SUV hater out there states "when an SUV hits a car ..... ". Well I guess it would be impossible to have a CAR hit an SUV . Did you people ever think that maybe a person in a large car (only one person in a car than can hold 6, getting 8 mpg and poluting the atmosphere because of a clogged catalytic converter), with bad brakes and worn tires and shocks, talking on their cell phone, not using signals, and playing their music at herculean levels could make an illegal turn and hit an SUV who was driving responsibly? Nope, it's always the driver of the SUV who is at fault. According to the fear mongers here, everyone should drive the vehicle which performs the worst in crash tests just so that everyone would fare the same in an accident. Welcome to Russia, comrades.



let's say your scenario does happen, even if it is the non-suv drivers fault, the non-suv driver is much more likely to end up DEAD.


Like several others on this thread (myself included) have said, it's the driver who makes the vehicle "dangerous". A bad driver in a Civic is more dangerous to EVERYONE around them than a good driver in a Kenworth.

granted bad drivers are DANGEROUS. We all know this to be true, but a BAD DRIVER in a Kenworth is MUCH more dangerous than a BAD DRIVER in a CIVIC. same is true of SUV's. A bad driver in an SUV is MORE DANGEROUS than a bad driver in a CIVIC.

Before you make another post (and embarrass yourself), please go to this site and brush up on your grammar. And yes I've read every single post in this thread. You, my friend, are the one who needs to read. My previous posts have always stated that the driver is to blame, not the vehicle.


again, pure flame bait. designed for the sole purpose of arousing anger or embarrasing someone.

Good for you for saying (repeatedly ad nauseum) that your next vehicle will be an Avalanche, maybe after you take delivery you'll get sick and tired of people saying it's a "dangerous vehicle".

ok, mb i said this too often, but the point of it is obviously to show, I don't HATE SUV's. I don't hate 4 wheel drive vehicles, but it must be admited that they do pose a danger.



He, he, he. Yeah, sorry about the long winded response but I felt I had to stoop to the level of the poster.


funny. i was stooping to your level w/ my obvious flame post.

if you ask to be flamed you will be.

 

[RSMemphis]

I drive a Scorpio hatchback. It's the biggest car I have ever had.
A lady in a minivan once asked me if "I were driving the small red car"
That just cracked me up.

I have never bashed SUVs on this board before, but here is why I would:

* Most SUVs I have ever seen: In the DC metro area, on paved roads, with one occupant (what a waste of gas)
* I cannot see in front of an SUV, which makes it harder for me to anticipate traffic problems (same with minivans, although they tend to be lower)
* No MPG restriction for trucks and SUVs - one reason why I like minivans better

I am not talking about people who need SUVs (rangers, hunters, farmers, etc...), but what I hate is people who drive in city traffic with a monster just to compensate for whatever. Because they make driving for me more difficult.

Fortunately, I am in rural OH, where everyone drives a car.

Ever notice how there are more SUVs in a municipal area than in a rural area?

 

[RSMemphis]

<< NFS4 said: For peeps that seem to dispise SUV's so much, have you even TRIED driving one before?? >>



I am not saying that they drive badly.
I am saying that they make it less secure to drive for peeps in smaller cars.
Not being able to see in front of an SUV and making little shredded pieces of my car in case of a crash. *shudder*

 

[yourharddrive]

i gotta 02 ford escape....all in all a nice car

 

[PullMyFinger]

PlatinumGold,
"ok you need a kinder gentler approach". You need to get a clue, you define the term Flame Bait.

You spout off your mouth about how you know so much regarding dangerous SUV's, you stated no less than 15 times (in all caps too) that "SUV's/ 4 wheel drives are dangerous to those who drive them and those around them". Then you make moronic personal attacks IN ALL CAPS (see, isn't that annoying), and post links to "SUV's are DANGEROUS.com". You then have the audacity to say "I don't hate SUV's or 4 wheel drives, in fact I'll be getting a ......" and "oh, I agree it's the driver who can make a vehicle dangerous". I'd call that being a hypocrite.

And tough crap if someone in a smaller vehicle pulls a bonehead maneuver and hits an SUV, even though you and other people on this thread don't believe that scenario can happen. If they get hurt it's their fault not the SUV or the driver of the SUV, regardless of how "dangerous" SUV's are. Your proposal to have the government make SUV's safer makes my blood boil. You could make all vehicles w/ 3 feet of foam padding on the inside and outside and someone would still find a way to get hurt in an accident. Like the old saying goes "If you make something idiot proof, they'll just go and build a better idiot".

If you had read any of my posts you would have seen that I agree that SUV's aren't the most fuel efficient, best handling, practical vehicles on the road, but neither are sports cars, convertibles, old clunkers, or pickups. People who deem SUV's dangerous are narrow minded, they don't realize that the person behind the wheel determines the safety of the vehicle.

 

[PlatinumGold]

Like several others on this thread (myself included) have said, it's the driver who makes the vehicle "dangerous". A bad driver in a Civic is more dangerous to EVERYONE around them than a good driver in a Kenworth.

granted bad drivers are DANGEROUS. We all know this to be true, but a BAD DRIVER in a Kenworth is MUCH more dangerous than a BAD DRIVER in a CIVIC. same is true of SUV's. A bad driver in an SUV is MORE DANGEROUS than a bad driver in a CIVIC.

 

They pay more taxes, I don't really care.

 

[deftron]

I like SUV's, just not most of the people that drive them

I have a Firebird.

 

[vi edit]

I still think that 90% of these problems would be prevented if the requirements to obtain a drivers license weren't such a freaking joke. They are practically handing those things out. People have come to accept driving as a god given right, instead of a privledge that you need to EARN.

Prevention is the key. Not band aiding a problem to make things better after the fact.

It is not, I repeat, it is NOT the truck/suv owners fault if some reckless twit crashes into the back of the Suv/truck and totals the twit's car. If people had a god damn clue how to drive responsibly MANY THOUSANDS of lives would be saved a year.

Make people earn that license. Test more often. Make a graded license system for varying sizes of vehicles. Require emergency manouvers classes. Make the driving test an ACTUAL TEST and don't give them 10 chances to repeat.

All of these things would ultimately make the roads immensly safer.

 

[stev0]

I used to have a suv, just got a 01' f150 supercab though. I of course use a pickup for what it was intended to be used for, hauling my snowmobiles, work in the summer, ect. That and I live in N. Dak. so it is pretty hard to get away with a little car in the winter.

I honestly don't have anything about suv's but all too often I see a middle aged mother driving a excursion or some other big.. thing, they are the ones that always seem to get into the accidents around here, underestimating their vechicals stopping legnth and rear ending someone else, just mindless things like that.

 

[Stifko]

There are inconsiderate SOBs that think the entire world revolves around them behind the wheels many diferent types of vehicles.

I used to have an 84 Chevy Blazer S10, till my gf crashed it. Now I got a VW Scirocco and a Rabbit GTI.