Forgive me for this question

[TheStu]

Is linux ready?

I have WinXP SP2 on my desktop (SP3 does not play nice with my keyboard).
I have OS X.5.2 on my MacBook.

Every time a new version of Ubuntu comes out, I hear that it is finally ready for the desktop, that this version is the one that will bring about the day of the Linux. And everytime I then read quite a few articles about how this person or another sat their mom, or dad, or grandparents, or sister, or goldfish down with a fresh install, and in no time flat said person/fish was up and running like a pro.

And every time I read this, I think "You know self, maybe it has improved. Maybe you can run it at a res other than 1024*768. Maybe you will be able to install things easily. Maybe installing the OS will be easy without useless identifiers instead of something more familiar for the drives. Maybe the 5th time is the charm". And without fail, I delete it within 2 weeks. Twice now I have tried forcing myself into it, much like when I got my MacBook. I made Ubuntu my only OS for the entire 2 weeks. But after having to turn to the internet every time I couldn't for the life of me figure something out, I deleted it.

So, in all honesty. Is Linux Ready?

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: TheStu
So, in all honesty. Is Linux Ready?

Yes n' no, Stu...

I run a Slackware box, here at the house, for my personal sites.

And, my production sites run on a CentOS server in Atlanta.

So, yes, Linux is ready for web server work, but...

No, I still don't think Linux replaces Windows, et al, on the desktop.

Having said that, if I WAS going to run Linux on my desktop, I'd use openSUSE, not Ubuntu!

 

[Hyperblaze]

It all comes down to familarity.

You are familiar with windows, hense it's in your comfort zone.

I've been using Linux for a while now (over 10 years), and I can say it's gotten much easier to do things.

Do I ever get stuck in something? of course, Have I ever failed in solving it? Not really.

And you know what? Same thing happened to me when I used Windows.

Neither operating system is perfect. They both reach target audiences. Some of that target audience overlap.

Is Linux ready? It all depends on you. Are you ready to use a different operating system that acts somewhat different then Windows?

I can almost guarantee you that you went through a learning curve when you first went through windows.

Do I use Linux as my desktop? Yes I do. Both home and work. What do I do? I'm a PHP web developer. I don't have a need for games. Something you might enjoy.

In all reality, your question is a loaded one. Linux is ready for you only if you let it be.

Like the above poster wrote, it's not going to replace windows. It's just an alternative to Windows. Is it better? Again, loaded question. I find it is, but I find Windows too restrictive.
Some others don't.

 

[Hyperblaze]

Originally posted by: VinDSL

Originally posted by: TheStu
So, in all honesty. Is Linux Ready?

Yes n' no, Stu...

I run a Slackware box, here at the house, for my personal sites.

And, my production sites run on a CentOS server in Atlanta.

So, yes, Linux is ready for web server work, but...

No, I still don't think Linux replaces Windows, et al, on the desktop.

Having said that, if I WAS going to run Linux on my desktop, I'd use openSUSE, not Ubuntu!

Hey, no love for Fedora?

 

[TheStu]

Originally posted by: Hyperblaze
It all comes down to familarity.

You are familiar with windows, hense it's in your comfort zone.

I've been using Linux for a while now (over 10 years), and I can say it's gotten much easier to do things.

Do I ever get stuck in something? of course, Have I ever failed in solving it? Not really.

And you know what? Same thing happened to me when I used Windows.

Neither operating system is perfect. They both reach target audiences. Some of that target audience overlap.

Is Linux ready? It all depends on you. Are you ready to use a different operating system that acts somewhat different then Windows?

I can almost guarantee you that you went through a learning curve when you first went through windows.

Do I use Linux as my desktop? Yes I do. Both home and work. What do I do? I'm a PHP web developer. I don't have a need for games. Something you might enjoy.

In all reality, your question is a loaded one. Linux is ready for you only if you let it be.

Like the above poster wrote, it's not going to replace windows. It's just an alternative to Windows. Is it better? Again, loaded question. I find it is, but I find Windows too restrictive.
Some others don't.

I already live in two OSes, OS X (my preferred) and WinXP (games mostly). So, learning another one isn't an issue, it is just that anytime that I have tried to give Linux a fair shot, it seems to still exhibit the same issues. No easy way to find the right software that isn't on the software manager list (apt-get in my opinion is neither easy, nor straightforward). Driver support is sometimes lacking, and certain aspects of it just plain don't make sense.

I don't know, maybe I will try out the latest Ubuntu... or OpenSUSE, my question was mainly asking if Linux had reached the point yet where it was easy to transition to. I don't know, maybe my brain is wrong for Linux, but, I think that if I can easily transition to and from OS X and Windows, that if I have trouble with Linux, maybe the problem isn't me, maybe it is Linux.

 

[Hyperblaze]

Originally posted by: TheStu

Originally posted by: Hyperblaze
It all comes down to familarity.

You are familiar with windows, hense it's in your comfort zone.

I've been using Linux for a while now (over 10 years), and I can say it's gotten much easier to do things.

Do I ever get stuck in something? of course, Have I ever failed in solving it? Not really.

And you know what? Same thing happened to me when I used Windows.

Neither operating system is perfect. They both reach target audiences. Some of that target audience overlap.

Is Linux ready? It all depends on you. Are you ready to use a different operating system that acts somewhat different then Windows?

I can almost guarantee you that you went through a learning curve when you first went through windows.

Do I use Linux as my desktop? Yes I do. Both home and work. What do I do? I'm a PHP web developer. I don't have a need for games. Something you might enjoy.

In all reality, your question is a loaded one. Linux is ready for you only if you let it be.

Like the above poster wrote, it's not going to replace windows. It's just an alternative to Windows. Is it better? Again, loaded question. I find it is, but I find Windows too restrictive.
Some others don't.

I already live in two OSes, OS X (my preferred) and WinXP (games mostly). So, learning another one isn't an issue, it is just that anytime that I have tried to give Linux a fair shot, it seems to still exhibit the same issues. No easy way to find the right software that isn't on the software manager list (apt-get in my opinion is neither easy, nor straightforward). Driver support is sometimes lacking, and certain aspects of it just plain don't make sense.

I don't know, maybe I will try out the latest Ubuntu... or OpenSUSE, my question was mainly asking if Linux had reached the point yet where it was easy to transition to. I don't know, maybe my brain is wrong for Linux, but, I think that if I can easily transition to and from OS X and Windows, that if I have trouble with Linux, maybe the problem isn't me, maybe it is Linux.

don't blame Linux for lack of specific hardware support. It's not it's fault. Blame the hardware vendors who don't offer proper linux support.

Linux developers can only go so far without assistance from any hardware vendors (like hardware specs, etc)

I can easily transition from WIndows to Linux (I find OS X a bit more tough, again, lack of familarity).

What software you looking for exactly? Kubuntu for example has an amazing amount of packages. You wouldn't believe how many packages I've installed using "apt-get install"

Does the command line intimidate you?

 

[TheStu]

Originally posted by: Hyperblaze

Originally posted by: TheStu

Originally posted by: Hyperblaze
It all comes down to familarity.

You are familiar with windows, hense it's in your comfort zone.

I've been using Linux for a while now (over 10 years), and I can say it's gotten much easier to do things.

Do I ever get stuck in something? of course, Have I ever failed in solving it? Not really.

And you know what? Same thing happened to me when I used Windows.

Neither operating system is perfect. They both reach target audiences. Some of that target audience overlap.

Is Linux ready? It all depends on you. Are you ready to use a different operating system that acts somewhat different then Windows?

I can almost guarantee you that you went through a learning curve when you first went through windows.

Do I use Linux as my desktop? Yes I do. Both home and work. What do I do? I'm a PHP web developer. I don't have a need for games. Something you might enjoy.

In all reality, your question is a loaded one. Linux is ready for you only if you let it be.

Like the above poster wrote, it's not going to replace windows. It's just an alternative to Windows. Is it better? Again, loaded question. I find it is, but I find Windows too restrictive.
Some others don't.

I already live in two OSes, OS X (my preferred) and WinXP (games mostly). So, learning another one isn't an issue, it is just that anytime that I have tried to give Linux a fair shot, it seems to still exhibit the same issues. No easy way to find the right software that isn't on the software manager list (apt-get in my opinion is neither easy, nor straightforward). Driver support is sometimes lacking, and certain aspects of it just plain don't make sense.

I don't know, maybe I will try out the latest Ubuntu... or OpenSUSE, my question was mainly asking if Linux had reached the point yet where it was easy to transition to. I don't know, maybe my brain is wrong for Linux, but, I think that if I can easily transition to and from OS X and Windows, that if I have trouble with Linux, maybe the problem isn't me, maybe it is Linux.

don't blame Linux for lack of specific hardware support. It's not it's fault. Blame the hardware vendors who don't offer proper linux support.

Linux developers can only go so far without assistance from any hardware vendors (like hardware specs, etc)

I can easily transition from WIndows to Linux (I find OS X a bit more tough, again, lack of familarity).

What software you looking for exactly? Kubuntu for example has an amazing amount of packages. You wouldn't believe how many packages I've installed using "apt-get install"

Does the command line intimidate you?

I don't know if intimidate is the appropriate word with regards to CLI, so much as it that I am less inclined to want to turn to it to get things done. I have done plenty in Terminal in OS X in order to activate certain features that were disabled for whatever reason, and have never had a problem using it. And until I realized that my professor was using a PowerMac as his server I used Terminal to transfer project files to and fro (then I found out it was running OS X so I just logged into it and used Finder to transfer my files).

I would be using it more from the standpoint of exploration. I got a MacBook just under 2 years ago since it was the only machine on the market with the specs that i wanted, for the price that i was willing to pay, and could run all the major OSes legally. I transitioned to OS X fairly easily (though there is a learning curve to it) and still can switch between OS X Leopard, Tiger, Win 2K, XP and Vista all quite well.

As for drivers... my desktop is the one in my sig, would you anticipate any major issues with that? I am gaming less and less on my desktop, and have been simply using it more and more as a media haven for my files. Videos, Pictures, Music, Games, Installers, Documents, any and all kinds of files are hosted from that system to my PS3 and my MacBook, both of whom I prefer using (though, the PS3's media player does leave quite a bit to be desired, i suppose that comes from using a controller as one's primary input device) to Windows. I simply use Windows because I am familiar with it, I was planning on using the desktop for gaming (until the PS3 happened) and I had a legal copy of XP Pro laying around.

However, if you think that I can use Linux to easily set up file sharing between Linux and OS X, and Linux and the PS3, then I would be all for it... but I need to know that it would work without my needing to reformat my drives, and that it would work without my having to apt-get install things, my issue with that is in Windows, and OS X, one goes online, finds the app they want, gets the version appropriate to their OS version, downloads it, and then double click what downloads. It installs and you are all done. With linux it never seems to be that simple if the app is not in the repository, and frankly sudo apt-get install nvidia-forceware-92.11-tar.gz does not strike me as particularly straightforward, self explanatory or easy. But like I said earlier, maybe my brain is wired wrong.

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: Hyperblaze
Hey, no love for Fedora?

Never used it... yet...

I cut my teeth on Debian - but back inthose days the support groups were all Nordic/Teutonic types - so I experienced a language barrier, and finally gave up on it.

Then, I tried FreeBSD, which I STILL think is the best OS around... but the support groups were V clannish and stuck-up! So, I went back to Linux...

I tried this n' that (remember those six-packs) before 'discovering' Caldera - which went belly-up!

Slackware was the one that stuck - still running it...

I'm renting space on a semi-dedicated server for my production sites, so I haven't got a choice there. If I did, it would probably be Fedora or Debian.

Anyway, I know a Bosnian that's a %$#^ genius - and I don't throw comments like that around lightly! He worked in robotics at Saab before coming to the U.S. - he's doing a double-master in electrical engineering at the state university - has a 'hot-line' to buddies at Microsoft when he finds bugs in their products, yada, yada, yada... and he's always talking up SUSE, hence (ahem) my recommendation! Actually it's HIS recommendation to me...

As an aside, he loves XP and !HATES! Vista...

 

[VinDSL]

Heh!

I'm running openSUSE 10.3 on my lappy right now...

Not too shabby!

 

[The Keeper]

Originally posted by: TheStu
But after having to turn to the internet every time I couldn't for the life of me figure something out, I deleted it.

It is weird that long-time Windows users expect to know how to use entirely different operating system in a heartbeat.

If you ask long-time mac-owners if OS X is ready, they will certainly answer yes. However, when I bought my macbook, it was frustrating because I had to google even things that were no-brainers in Windows and even linux. Now, if you put a long-time mac or linux user in front of Windows they've never used. The experience will be very much same.

The bottom line is, operating systems are different. I had to learn OS X even if I already knew how to use Windows and linux.

So, in the end the question is not about whether linux is ready. The question is; are you ready? Are you ready to put aside your preconceptions on how operating system is supposed to work based on your experience with Windows?

That's the question you should be asking.

 

[nerp]

If you install it and find it's more trouble than it's worth and you already have your PC decked out doing the things you need it to do... why are you forcing yourself to try it out?

 

[TheStu]

Originally posted by: The Keeper

Originally posted by: TheStu
But after having to turn to the internet every time I couldn't for the life of me figure something out, I deleted it.

It is weird that long-time Windows users expect to know how to use entirely different operating system in a heartbeat.

If you ask long-time mac-owners if OS X is ready, they will certainly answer yes. However, when I bought my macbook, it was frustrating because I had to google even things that were no-brainers in Windows and even linux. Now, if you put a long-time mac or linux user in front of Windows they've never used. The experience will be very much same.

The bottom line is, operating systems are different. I had to learn OS X even if I already knew how to use Windows and linux.

So, in the end the question is not about whether linux is ready. The question is; are you ready? Are you ready to put aside your preconceptions on how operating system is supposed to work based on your experience with Windows?

That's the question you should be asking.

Its weird that everyone keeps thinking that I only run Windows, when I have said mulitple times that I use both Windows and OS X, and in fact, prefer OS X... and I was a longtime Windows user when I got my MacBook. But, after googling how to right click (I forgot about ctrl click) and exploring the OS, and sticking with OS X for abotu 2 weeks solid, I am not very comfortable in it. I discover new things every now and again, but not as often as i once did. So, I am a longtime Windows user, but I see myself as becoming a longtime OS X user as well. And I figured that if I have already learned and adjusted myself to 2 OSes, how hard can a third be, especially when I see all the press it is getting.

 

[Markbnj]

It is weird that long-time Windows users expect to know how to use entirely different operating system in a heartbeat.

It's wierd that long-time linux users tend to generalize so often about long-time Windows users.

Nobody has ever precisely defined "ready for the desktop" as far as I know, and I'm not sure it can be defined in simple terms. But whatever the definition is, fitness to it is not a simple matter of whether the user knows what he or she is doing.

Assume the user is fully educated to whatever level is necessary, over some reasonable period of time. At _that point_ will he or she find linux as accessible and fully-provisioned, and easy to use as any of the other choices?

I'm not sure I could answer the question even for myself, and I run both. Windows is "ready" for everything I do in a certain sphere, i.e. business and programming, and writing. Linux is "ready" for everything I do in another sphere, i.e. java development, and running servers. I would have no interest, to be honest, in trying to make either one do the job I've assigned the other. I have a gut feeling more people are feeling that way. The enterprise linux community certainly seems tired of the desktop debate lately.

 

[TheStu]

Originally posted by: nerp
If you install it and find it's more trouble than it's worth and you already have your PC decked out doing the things you need it to do... why are you forcing yourself to try it out?

My friend and I run a computer repair service, i figure it would be good for me to be familiar with Linux in addition to OS X and Windows.

 

[Nothinman]

I'm probably going to echo a lot of the statements already made here, but what the hell...

Is linux ready?

IMO it has been for a long time, my primary desktop has been Debian for at least 4 years now.

And every time I read this, I think "You know self, maybe it has improved. Maybe you can run it at a res other than 1024*768. Maybe you will be able to install things easily. Maybe installing the OS will be easy without useless identifiers instead of something more familiar for the drives.

I'm running 2560x1024 across two monitors over here. Yes I had to edit my xorg.conf file to make it work but I can't really complain since I only had add one line: " Option "TwinView" "true"" and the binary nVidia driver did the rest automagically. The next version of Xorg is supposed to have automatic display hotplug stuff so if it actually works that single step might not even be necessary, no idea if Ubuntu included it or not though.

Frankly I find the Windows method of installing software (i.e. hunt around, run setup, click next blindly, etc) more difficult than installing most things on Linux. Add onto that the need for installation keys and the amount of spyware and just plain crap software and it's way too much work to figure out what's worth it and what's not. I actually do like using aptitude and will even go out of my way to find an alternative that's been packaged by Debian if something I'm looking for isn't there. OS X wins for simplicity since a lot of things come in bundles that you just drop somewhere but I'd say that apt still wins overall because it's one central location for installation, removal and updating so I don't have to worry about watching for security updates in a dozen different places.

I don't think I've seen anyone complain about the Ubuntu installer, it's usually one of things that most people rave about. The drive naming is a little odd but in Windows "C:" means absolutely nothing to me and the whole drive letter thing causes more problems than it addresses. I believe Gnome shows filesystem labels in Nautilus whenever they exist like OS X does so that's really a non-issue there.

My friend and I run a computer repair service, i figure it would be good for me to be familiar with Linux in addition to OS X and Windows.

It's not a bad idea, but if 99% of your work is fixing, reloading, etc Windows then I wouldn't worry about it. I personally can't stand fixing Windows any more, every time I have a Windows problem I end up thinking "Man, if this was Linux I'd be done already." or I end up booting up an Ubuntu LiveCD to make sure the hardware really works, image the drive, etc because it's just so much simpler in Linux.

 

[TheStu]

Originally posted by: Nothinman
I'm probably going to echo a lot of the statements already made here, but what the hell...

Is linux ready?

IMO it has been for a long time, my primary desktop has been Debian for at least 4 years now.

And every time I read this, I think "You know self, maybe it has improved. Maybe you can run it at a res other than 1024*768. Maybe you will be able to install things easily. Maybe installing the OS will be easy without useless identifiers instead of something more familiar for the drives.

I'm running 2560x1024 across two monitors over here. Yes I had to edit my xorg.conf file to make it work but I can't really complain since I only had add one line: " Option "TwinView" "true"" and the binary nVidia driver did the rest automagically. The next version of Xorg is supposed to have automatic display hotplug stuff so if it actually works that single step might not even be necessary, no idea if Ubuntu included it or not though.

Frankly I find the Windows method of installing software (i.e. hunt around, run setup, click next blindly, etc) more difficult than installing most things on Linux. Add onto that the need for installation keys and the amount of spyware and just plain crap software and it's way too much work to figure out what's worth it and what's not. I actually do like using aptitude and will even go out of my way to find an alternative that's been packaged by Debian if something I'm looking for isn't there. OS X wins for simplicity since a lot of things come in bundles that you just drop somewhere but I'd say that apt still wins overall because it's one central location for installation, removal and updating so I don't have to worry about watching for security updates in a dozen different places.

I don't think I've seen anyone complain about the Ubuntu installer, it's usually one of things that most people rave about. The drive naming is a little odd but in Windows "C:" means absolutely nothing to me and the whole drive letter thing causes more problems than it addresses. I believe Gnome shows filesystem labels in Nautilus whenever they exist like OS X does so that's really a non-issue there.

My friend and I run a computer repair service, i figure it would be good for me to be familiar with Linux in addition to OS X and Windows.

It's not a bad idea, but if 99% of your work is fixing, reloading, etc Windows then I wouldn't worry about it. I personally can't stand fixing Windows any more, every time I have a Windows problem I end up thinking "Man, if this was Linux I'd be done already." or I end up booting up an Ubuntu LiveCD to make sure the hardware really works, image the drive, etc because it's just so much simpler in Linux.

Now, to my understanding, Nautilus is the file browser, analogous to Explorer on Windows, and Finder on OS X. My main issue with the drive naming came when I went to install the latest version of Ubuntu, which by the way, has a lot of really cool things, like reading the My Documents folder so it can import the user's pictures, music, and whatnot all automagically. (at least I had heard that it does this), and how it will (i believe) import a user's bookmarks as well. However, when it came time to partition the drive, I was having a really hard time with it. My understanding was that you could dynamically partition drives in the installer, either I was misinformed, or I simply couldn't figure it out.

And in all honesty, we have, to date, only worked on Windows systems. And I would be of the opinion that if we ever had a customer that was running Linux, they wouldn't need us for Linux troubleshooting so much as a hardware issue (fried PSU, bum RAM, that sort of thing). However, as another option would be to be able to pitch to our customers that need to have Windows reinstalled on their system, the option of installing Linux instead, because it is free, and it is (last i checked) virus and malware free, but if I, a relatively intelligent and savvy computer user, have trouble installing and running Linux, how can I effectively 'sell' the idea of it to my customers?

My partner and I already promote the use of free software when it will take the place of for pay software. We install AVG Free since it does just as well as Norton, we install free alternatives to Reader for PDFs, we usually recommend that they use Firefox (except on OS X where I recommend Safari), and the list goes on. However, I do not recommend anything unless I myself either do use it, or can use it, and since neither of those are true for Linux, i figured I would find out from some of the Pros here whether they thought the time had come for Linux.

My previous statement about the difficulties with running the correct res mostly centered around a 6800LE graphics card that I had. I tried numerous different nVidia drivers straight from their website, none of them worked. I tried editing the Xorg.conf file, to no avail.

My newer system, in my sig is mostly used now for media center work, and in all honesty spends most of its time headless since my monitor is usually set to HDMI for PS3, or VGA for my MacBook (though that may switch to DVI soon, with the desktop on VGA). It has a 7800GTX, a card that I hope will be able to run proper resolutions better, especially since my monitor now outputs at 1920*1200.

So, do you think that installing Linux (I will take distro recommendations, all I have really tried is Fedora and Ubuntu I believe) will be able to replace Windows for me? Hosting media to a PS3 and MacBook, and it has to be able to quickly and easily convert MKVs to h.264 AVIs for use on the PS3.

 

[wetcat007]

Originally posted by: TheStu
Maybe installing the OS will be easy without useless identifiers instead of something more familiar for the drives.

Useless identifiers?
If you want drive letters use windows, you mentioned using Mac OSX which also does not use drive letters. Linux distributions are not meant to be exact clones on Windows, things are done differently.

Installations on distributions such as Ubuntu are quicker simpler than in Windows, Applications > Add/Remove, and you have yourself a nice list with search functionality. Drivers have the Restricted Drivers manager(found under System > Admistration) that will install nvidia or ati drivers with a click. No endless clicking of the next button, or having to find the drivers on a site filled with flash animations.

Is Linux Ready?
Is Windows Ready?
Is Mac OSX Ready?
Is there an operating system ready for the masses? I sure haven't found one yet.

 

[TheStu]

Originally posted by: wetcat007

Originally posted by: TheStu
Maybe installing the OS will be easy without useless identifiers instead of something more familiar for the drives.

Useless identifiers?
If you want drive letters use windows, you mentioned using Mac OSX which also does not use drive letters. Linux distributions are not meant to be exact clones on Windows, things are done differently.

Installations on distributions such as Ubuntu are quicker simpler than in Windows, Applications > Add/Remove, and you have yourself a nice list with search functionality. Drivers have the Restricted Drivers manager(found under System > Admistration) that will install nvidia or ati drivers with a click. No endless clicking of the next button, or having to find the drivers on a site filled with flash animations.

Is Linux Ready?
Is Windows Ready?
Is Mac OSX Ready?
Is there an operating system ready for the masses? I sure haven't found one yet.

It isn't a drive letter thing, when I install OS X, it gives me the name of the drive, it just seems easier than with Linux where they are SDA1, (or some such) it just strikes me as difficult for some reason.

No, i do not think that they are Windows clones, or think that they should be. I didn't get my MacBook thinking that OS X would be just like Windows, so I am not sure why everyone thinks that I want that. I just want to know if anyone here thinks that I might be able to use Linux easily after my previous failed attempts.

Is Windows Ready? It seems to be easy enough to use for 90% of the population.
Is OS X ready? Everyone I have talked into getting OS X has enjoyed it quite a lot and had very few issues other than needing replacement programs, or having me explain how DMGs work.
Is Linux Ready? That is what I am asking, stop stealing my questions.

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: TheStu
Is Linux Ready? That is what I am asking, stop stealing my questions.

Atta boy, Stu Baby!

Hang in there, Dude! :thumbsup:

 

[Hyperblaze]

Originally posted by: TheStu

Originally posted by: wetcat007

Originally posted by: TheStu
Maybe installing the OS will be easy without useless identifiers instead of something more familiar for the drives.

Useless identifiers?
If you want drive letters use windows, you mentioned using Mac OSX which also does not use drive letters. Linux distributions are not meant to be exact clones on Windows, things are done differently.

Installations on distributions such as Ubuntu are quicker simpler than in Windows, Applications > Add/Remove, and you have yourself a nice list with search functionality. Drivers have the Restricted Drivers manager(found under System > Admistration) that will install nvidia or ati drivers with a click. No endless clicking of the next button, or having to find the drivers on a site filled with flash animations.

Is Linux Ready?
Is Windows Ready?
Is Mac OSX Ready?
Is there an operating system ready for the masses? I sure haven't found one yet.

It isn't a drive letter thing, when I install OS X, it gives me the name of the drive, it just seems easier than with Linux where they are SDA1, (or some such) it just strikes me as difficult for some reason.

No, i do not think that they are Windows clones, or think that they should be. I didn't get my MacBook thinking that OS X would be just like Windows, so I am not sure why everyone thinks that I want that. I just want to know if anyone here thinks that I might be ae to use Linux easily after my previous failed attempts.

Is Windows Ready? It seems to be easy enough to use for 90% of the population.
Is OS X ready? Everyone I have talked into getting OS X has enjoyed it quite a lot and had very few issues other than needing replacement programs, or having me explain how DMGs work.
Is Linux Ready? That is what I am asking, stop stealing my questions.

You are kidding me right? Are you joking? If it was really that easy, there would be no need for techs or tech support.

Also, the reason why "90%"' of the population even have windows as their desktop is simply because it was installed by default and many don't have a clue on how to use it properly, or use something different.

 

[degibson]

I sense flame in this thread, so I shall fuel the fire with my near-irrelevant opinion:

1) Is Linux Desktop Ready? Yes. There will be a learning curve. Just like there is a learning curve with Windows.
2) Is Linux as likely to 'work right the first time' as Windows? No. Sometimes Linux likes your hardware by default, sometimes not. A Linux newbie is not always going to be able to force it. Same in Windows, though less frequent.
3) Can Linux run just about the same hardware that Windows can? Yes, almost everything. The trick is finding out how, and yes, sometimes some time on google is required.
4) Is Linux consistently improving? Yes. Some will say that about windows, too.
5) Is Linux more confusing? Yes. Definately. Windows has a few flavors these days... but Linux can mean anything from Gentoo to Slackware to Ubuntu and back again. Overall, much more variety, much more confusion for new users.
6) Does Linux have the desktop apps users want? Kinda. Firefox, yes. OpenOffice is better than Word in some ways, lack of compatibility pretty much stinks. That said, a determined user can switch to a Linux desktop, provided it works (see #2 above), if they are willing to accept the learning curve of new applications as well as the desktop environment itself.

Kudos to the OP for the humorous initial post.

Edit: Clarified what I meant in bullet 3.

Edit again:
7) Am I going to encourage my 84-year-old father to switch to Linux? Not a chance in Hades.

 

[Nothinman]

Now, to my understanding, Nautilus is the file browser, analogous to Explorer on Windows, and Finder on OS X.

Correct.

My understanding was that you could dynamically partition drives in the installer, either I was misinformed, or I simply couldn't figure it out.

Pretty sure you just couldn't figure it out which is surprising since I don't think I've ever heard anyone else complain about it.

but if I, a relatively intelligent and savvy computer user, have trouble installing and running Linux, how can I effectively 'sell' the idea of it to my customers?

Obviously you don't sell something that you can't or aren't willing to support.

i figured I would find out from some of the Pros here whether they thought the time had come for Linux.

Wouldn't that be part of the problem? Us "Pros" have been using Linux desktops for a long time now so of course we think the time came a long time ago.

My previous statement about the difficulties with running the correct res mostly centered around a 6800LE graphics card that I had. I tried numerous different nVidia drivers straight from their website, none of them worked. I tried editing the Xorg.conf file, to no avail.

I can't speak to that but I've never had a problem with the nVidia drivers and the free nv driver usually does fine too although it's slower.

It isn't a drive letter thing, when I install OS X, it gives me the name of the drive, it just seems easier than with Linux where they are SDA1, (or some such) it just strikes me as difficult for some reason.

I can count the number of OS X installs I've seen on one hand and they were a while ago, so what exactly is the name of the drive? In Linux it would be /dev/sda and in Windows it would be disk0 because that's how you address that device. Maybe you mean something like "Maxtor 7L250S0-L50F3WWG" but what if you have 2 or 3 of the same model drive in the machine?

Is Windows Ready? It seems to be easy enough to use for 90% of the population.

Hardly. I did tech support and most people have absolutely no idea how to use Windows. They know the little bit that they've been trained on but that's about it. The only reason that Windows seems any easier than Linux is because people are already trained on Windows.

Is OS X ready? Everyone I have talked into getting OS X has enjoyed it quite a lot and had very few issues other than needing replacement programs, or having me explain how DMGs work.

In general yes. I've only used OS X a few times but there a number of things that I ran into that sucked like one button touchpads and the non-changeable GUI. It's all in your personal preferences and what you're willing to put up with.

 

[BD2003]

I think the OS itself is mostly ready, but the supporting apps and hardware support arent quite all the way there. Firefox is great, and that might be all most people need, but until it can support true blue microsoft office, and work with suspend/hibernate flawlessly, its going to be on the sidelines for me.

 

[VinDSL]

If we can steer away from the personal attacks for a minute...

One of the things I've always liked about Linux, et al, is you 'custom build' it to your hardware.

And, one of the things that always bugged me about Windows is, they use a shotgun approach to hardware.

That alone is worth the price of admission.

I've been using a 'Live' version of openSUSE on my lappy, the last couple of days, and the only thing it didn't detect was my sound hardware - everything else is working great!

Sooooo, I'm interested enough that I'm gonna buy another HD for my lappy tomorrow and do a full 64-bit openSUSE install, and leave my 'Vista drive' unmolested, in case it doesn't work out.

I'll let you know how it goes, Stu!

 

[RebateMonger]

To answer the question, "is an OS ready for the desktop", I'd ask the following questions and make a decision from there. These are what the "average" user is looking for in a desktop PC:

a) Can users purchase a pre-configured box at the store?
b) Can required additional applications be obtained and easily installed?
c) Can required additional hardware be obtained and easily installed?
d) Is support easily available for the OS, applications, hardware, and ISP?
e) Are backups of data easily made?
f) Are the OS and applications easy to learn and use?
g) Are the OS and applications "reasonably priced"?