French officials decide that Buriki cannot be worn at a swimming pool, despite its design exclusively as swimwear

[ZeGermans]

The interesting thing about a multiparty system is that you can have parties that include racism in their founding principals and they still get seats. Here they're basically all stuck on the republican fringe.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Originally posted by: AshPhoenix
Modest female clothing is not restricted to Islam, look at how nuns are dressed. I've read about a Jewish sect whose women cover their hair and are required to dress modestly too.

The difference is that those people are on the fringe and it isn't mandated by law in majority Christian and Jewish nations.

 

[zeruty]

Originally posted by: TruePaige
Actually I can't. Because of the same kind of laws.

Other than the comment about my pity of these women being brainwashed into "modesty", I have to admit that I support their right to wear their weird suits.

Honestly though, as a whole humanity focuses far too much on silly things, like banning clothing or forcing clothing.

So we need a nudist religion? You can't force us to wear clothes, our religion forbids it except when functionally necessary!

 

[marincounty]

What's ironic is they don't allow men to wear board shorts. Speedos anyone?
Dick suits. I'm getting ill just thinking about it. Hey, it's the French, they're wacky.

But they do have all of those topless women on the beach. How about we just ban tops on the beach?

 

[Kadarin]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper

Originally posted by: AshPhoenix
Modest female clothing is not restricted to Islam, look at how nuns are dressed. I've read about a Jewish sect whose women cover their hair and are required to dress modestly too.

The difference is that those people are on the fringe and it isn't mandated by law in majority Christian and Jewish nations.

Nuns (and so forth) choose to do it. Once Islam gains a significant political foothold, Muslims try to dictate how everyone should behave.

Here in the US it isn't an issue because Islam doesn't have political power at this time.

 

[tk149]

Originally posted by: magomago

Originally posted by: tk149

:laugh:

But seriously, there are two separate issues here:
1. Public pool rules: They should apply to everyone equally. If the pool administrator truly thought the Burkini was "clothing" than he was justified in tossing her out. The article implies that his decision was based more on the government's stance on religion, but we don't know what the situation really was.

2. Government trying to restrict the rights of an individual for no reason other than that they believe in something not mainstream: That sucks. But they're French! Anything not French is inferior! Every Frenchman knows this, and who cares what non-French people think.

I'm too lazy to look it up. Does France have a Constitution or Bill of Rights similar to the U.S. in regards to guaranteeing certain rights?

go to the original Ahiida sites and you can get a close zoom up on the models in a flash drive program Talk about babe threads

1. Yes we don't know exactly. But the results are clear. We'll see what happens. Now just because a person truly believes they were right, just it justify their tossing them out? What is his argument going to be "It looked like clothing"? Its already shown not to be clothing

You're right - When I wrote my original response, I was trying to think of a way of saying what I wanted, but nothing came to mind, so I just used "justified." Yeah, lazy of me. What I meant to say was, "if he did what he believed was correct according to established rules, even if he was wrong, you can't fault him for trying to do his job. This situation has likely never popped up in his pool before, so he had to make a judgment call."

 

[kylebisme]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper
The difference is that those people are on the fringe and it isn't mandated by law in majority Christian and Jewish nations.

It isn't mandated by law in some nations with Muslim majorities either. Surely we should praise the ones who don't make such laws, encourage the others to follow that lead. Besides, it is intellectually dishonest to damn the whole for the actions of the some.

 

[tfcmasta97]

Originally posted by: OCguy
This is why I laugh when sheltered liberal morons pretend the US is the most racist xenophobic country on the planet.


The French are more nationalistic than a Mississippian at a Nascar race.

I love it when hicks think they know anything about anything and just prove how off they are, you're just a gift that keeps on giving, with a brain that is just so.... so disappointing.

I guess it's the liberal's fault for expecting more, maybe something like practice what you preach, or trying to even meet reasonable standards, from some *cough, point* people that are just incapable of thought. I guess it's easy for your head to be full of shit when it's jammed up your ass.

 

[magomago]

Originally posted by: Kadarin

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper

Originally posted by: AshPhoenix
Modest female clothing is not restricted to Islam, look at how nuns are dressed. I've read about a Jewish sect whose women cover their hair and are required to dress modestly too.

The difference is that those people are on the fringe and it isn't mandated by law in majority Christian and Jewish nations.

Nuns (and so forth) choose to do it. Once Islam gains a significant political foothold, Muslims try to dictate how everyone should behave.

Here in the US it isn't an issue because Islam doesn't have political power at this time.

Don't worry. I'll be there to fight and argue against any law mandated wearing of a Hijab. And I'll be quoting the Quran to boot.

Originally posted by: kylebisme

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper
The difference is that those people are on the fringe and it isn't mandated by law in majority Christian and Jewish nations.

It isn't mandated by law in some nations with Muslim majorities either. Surely we should praise the ones who don't make such laws, encourage the others to follow that lead. Besides, it is intellectually dishonest to damn the whole for the actions of the some.

Winnar

 

[n yusef]

I don't care for Muslim traditions or the concept of "modesty" for women, but it's the height of irony to restrict women's choices in the name of women's rights.

 

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: zeruty

Originally posted by: TruePaige
Actually I can't. Because of the same kind of laws.

Other than the comment about my pity of these women being brainwashed into "modesty", I have to admit that I support their right to wear their weird suits.

Honestly though, as a whole humanity focuses far too much on silly things, like banning clothing or forcing clothing.

So we need a nudist religion? You can't force us to wear clothes, our religion forbids it except when functionally necessary!

Worth a shot.

If people can wear any clothes they want, I don't see why people shouldn't be able to wear no clothes if they want.

 

[kylebisme]

Originally posted by: TruePaige
If people can wear any clothes they want, I don't see why people shouldn't be able to wear no clothes if they want.

Think of the CHILDREN!



Actually, I agree.

 

[AstroManLuca]

Originally posted by: n yusef
I don't care for Muslim traditions or the concept of "modesty" for women, but it's the height of irony to restrict women's choices in the name of women's rights.

Agreed. France is hypocritical for criticizing one dress code (that held by many Muslim women) while enforcing their own (the ban on loose swimwear, which doesn't make any sense either).

I think it's stupid for a woman to want to always be covered up at all times, but if she wants to that's her choice. The only thing that should be illegal is mandating certain clothing.

 

[Kadarin]

Originally posted by: magomago

Originally posted by: Kadarin

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper

Originally posted by: AshPhoenix
Modest female clothing is not restricted to Islam, look at how nuns are dressed. I've read about a Jewish sect whose women cover their hair and are required to dress modestly too.

The difference is that those people are on the fringe and it isn't mandated by law in majority Christian and Jewish nations.

Nuns (and so forth) choose to do it. Once Islam gains a significant political foothold, Muslims try to dictate how everyone should behave.

Here in the US it isn't an issue because Islam doesn't have political power at this time.

Don't worry. I'll be there to fight and argue against any law mandated wearing of a Hijab. And I'll be quoting the Quran to boot.

Originally posted by: kylebisme

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper
The difference is that those people are on the fringe and it isn't mandated by law in majority Christian and Jewish nations.

It isn't mandated by law in some nations with Muslim majorities either. Surely we should praise the ones who don't make such laws, encourage the others to follow that lead. Besides, it is intellectually dishonest to damn the whole for the actions of the some.

Winnar

The problem is not just legal. It's also when cultural/social/peer pressure forces a woman to dress in a certain way against their wishes. Sometimes it leads to fatal consequences, like this incident from 2007:

http://www.reuters.com/article.../idUSN1151774720071211

Note that it was the father who killed this woman, and the woman's brother was also arrested for obstructing the police investigation.

 

[Double Trouble]

Originally posted by: magomago

Originally posted by: Double Trouble
The whole "must cover up and dress modestly" idea is idiotic, but that has no bearing on this issue. The French have specific rules about attire at public pools for men and for women. For example, men can't wear baggy shorts into the pool, you must wear body fitting swimwear. I think those rules are dumb, but that's what the rules are for everyone. They are not rules singling out Muslims or women or any specific group. This woman wants to adhere to some backwards notion of what clothing is required, and she wants the French to change the rules that apply to everyone to suit her needs. No. You want to do something that doesn't conform to the rules of society, you are free to do it in your own pool, not a public one. If the majority of people in society think those rules are dumb, they can get rid of them, but until that happens, everyone is bound by them.

As an example, lets say my religion had a strict rule that anyone in the water must be naked or face the wrath of God, and I wanted to go swim. Public pools have rules stating that I must wear certain clothing. Does it make sense to whine and claim discrimination against my religion because I'm forced to wear something at the public pool? No, it doesn't, and neither does her whining make sense in this French case.

Disagree. Living in a free society is about having the freedom of choice in the public arena.

Based on that logic, if my religion says everyone near a body of water must be naked, does that mean everyone else in society must change their rules with regard to being naked at the public pool to allow me to be naked for my religion? Of course not. We all realize that society does, and should, have the power to regulate what attire is appropriate in a public setting. Every country has it, including the US. The limits are set according to what is general acceptable practice in society. As long as the rules are not applied to one group and not to others, I see no problem with society making rules about proper attire at a public pool. If she wants to wear her nutty outfit, she is free to do so at a private pool.

The other thing is that this rule -- like it or not -- is *not* a rule against a certain religion. The rule has always been in place and is enforced against everyone. If I show up with jeans at the pool, I'd get refused entrance just like she did.... except I wouldn't complain and call it religious discrimination.

 

[WHAMPOM]

Hey DD! I am with you, nude bathing only! How the hell did shift-o make a post? My keyboard fritzing out? Or is this another hidden feature of this forum like time warp?

 

[WHAMPOM]

Originally posted by: magomago
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8197917.stm

You guys can read the article. I'm sure everyone is a big boy and can click links.

How what actually is a "burkini"? Its, from people who advocate it, "Islamically acceptable" beach attire that maintains modesty.

Let us go to some REAL website that uses it- It was an Aussie lady that successfully pushed the Burkini and if you do any googling you'll find out that Ahiida is really the company behind this pretty damned cool idea.

http://www.ahiida.com/index.php?a=subcats&cat=20

What are these made of?

http://www.ahiida.com/index.php?a=results&subcat=59

100% Polyester - High Performance
50+ UV protected, Chlorine Resistant, Water Repellent, Low Water Absorbency and Very Quick Drying.

Here are some pictures of females modeling a Burkini:
http://www.ahiida.com/img/prod...221-110-1248312971.jpg
http://www.ahiida.com/img/prod.../225-52-1248310589.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_nfZn...s320/burkini_retro.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_nfZn...s320/burqini_polka.jpg

You can go online and read about the lady's story and why she made it - where she wanted modest, light, easy to wear clothes that would still let her swim and look appealing.

Of course, form this time article, we can see people who are not even Muslim that appreciates it

http://www.time.com/time/magaz...0,9171,1645145,00.html

Conservative Christians, cancer patients, burn victims and senior citizens, among others, have shown surprising interest. Joanne Martinez, 37, of San Clemente, Calif., bought a Hawaiian-print ensemble to stave off chills during late-night dips. Her mother Norma Suarez, 69, got a suit because her medications make her skin sun-sensitive. "We're both hooked," says Martinez. Meanwhile, Kathleen Petroff, 59, of Helendale, Calif., bought her Splashgear suit for a snorkeling trip, after weight gain from multiple-sclerosis treatment made her old suit unappealing. If not for Sabet's design, she says, "I would have missed swimming with the dolphins.

Yet we have a vague 'health concerns' (as if the people pissing in the pool, entering with god knows what kind of diseases, constantly spitting, etc. is something less of a concern than 100% polyester that is UV protecetd, water repellent, and quick drying). This is simply discrimination against Muslim women.

Thank GOD in the USA we would not have this, and I hope this type of attitude doesn't filter into our society.

Of course, the hygiene rules come from as follows:

At the pool, staff "reminded [the woman] of the rules that apply in all (public) swimming pools which forbid swimming while clothed," pool management official Daniel Guillaume was quoted by AFP as saying.

Here is a hint Daniel Guillaume, the burkini is made for swimming. It is swim wear. It is not clothing you wear while walking down the street.

French officials seem to lack lots of common sense (oh and one more time for good measure --> God bless USA.)

You guys all miss the point. Franch!! Oglee la la! Bare breasts and butts only!

 

[StageLeft]

It is discrimination and without any merit whatsoever. Like an opressive twit who uses any vague link to pedophilia to push some asinine law these people are using the irrelevant link of health effects (obviously they have zero proof that this causes any problems) to push their agenda.

The French have specific rules about attire at public pools for men and for women.

So THAT is why they all look gay when at the pool.

--

Some of the responses in this thread made me literally lol. I don't agree with the burkas but if they are not hurting others to wear them, let them do it. If I want to swim in a pool in a damn winter ski suit who gives a damn let me do it.

The other thing is that this rule -- like it or not -- is *not* a rule against a certain religion. The rule has always been in place and is enforced against everyone. If I show up with jeans at the pool, I'd get refused entrance just like she did.... except I wouldn't complain and call it religious discrimination.

The rule is, like French men in speedos, exceedingly gay. All the burkini has done is help illuminate its gayness in ways it had not before been seen. I cannot stand rules that serve no purpose and are there because of some doucheag's sensibilities.

 

[nobodyknows]

Originally posted by: Kadarin
In my opinion, one of the most fucked up things about Islam is the whole phobia it has about displaying the female form. Seriously, who the fuck thought covering up beautiful women was a good idea?

Somebody with more wives then he can keep track of??? :laugh:

 

[Kadarin]

Originally posted by: nobodyknows

Originally posted by: Kadarin
In my opinion, one of the most fucked up things about Islam is the whole phobia it has about displaying the female form. Seriously, who the fuck thought covering up beautiful women was a good idea?

Somebody with more wives then he can keep track of??? :laugh:

I just wouldn't be able to handle all the nagging and PMS.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: Perknose

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
This would be like the Saudis saying women must cover up in public, that women who don't and get beaten deserve it because there is no natural right of free expression. [...] The comedy here in my opinion, is that the French and the Saudis are mirror images of each other.

All that said, Moonie, as a women, in which society would you want to live? Is it even close?

I guess it would depend on how modest I was and how badly I wanted to swim.

 

[kylebisme]

Originally posted by: nobodyknows
Somebody with more wives then he can keep track of???

Actually, it is only in regard to Muhammad's wives that the mention is made of veiling women in the Qur'an, and at least in the translations I've read there is nothing nearly as strict in regard to dress codes for women in general. What is said I take to mean; always keep the crotch covered, don't let the the curvy bits be seen outside your family, and wear a distinctive headscarf when traveling outside Muslim territory. Of course the majority of Muslims would disagree with my understanding, but I've yet to see anyone make a sound argument to support stricter dress codes in the context of Qur'anic text.

 

[Infohawk]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
It is discrimination

Yes it is. So what? Should Muslims really be allowed to export their pathetic culture around the world as they please? France, unlike the USA, is a nation state. It doesn't take up that much space on the globe. Why not let the French dictate how they want their culture and society to develop? It's not like they're saying you can't be dark-skinned. (And on a similar and more extreme note, if the Japanese don't want other races on their island, that should be their option.)

 

[kylebisme]

I'd prefer we work on sending the bigots to live on the moon instead.

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: kylebisme
I'd prefer we work on sending the bigots to live on the moon instead.

You think the moon really wants the inner-city thugs up there?