Friend bought used 2010 laptop for $275 since new laptops are now junk ?!

[GoodEnough]

No, I am posting an email written by a friend who bought a used Dell. That is why it was quoted.

I am still considering swapping my Gateway NV44 for either a T410 or a X220. Once I figure out how they are different.

 

[hans007]

pretty sure your friend is just dumb.

 

[GoodEnough]

...and ostensibly happy!

 

[alkemyst]

No, I am posting an email written by a friend who bought a used Dell. That is why it was quoted.

I am still considering swapping my Gateway NV44 for either a T410 or a X220. Once I figure out how they are different.

A Dell Studio is not a great laptop. It was just a little better than the Inspirons and IMHO worse in many durability ways than their business Latitudes.

It shows your friend made the budget choice and really didn't know the range laptops run. I have no doubt that laptop is nice and he is happy. There is just a lot of room for him to be happier if he was in front of even better machines.

That T410 is a nice laptop. If it's in your budget go for it. If I had to choose a T61p vs T410, EDIT: I'd pick the former even though it has no webcam and a slightly inferior GPU memory (the 3100M and 570M are about equal otherwise really.

The T61p can do way better resolution in 14.1 even if that's what you want:
14.1" TFT display with 1400x1050 (SXGA+) resolution
14.1" TFT display with 1400x900 (WXGA+) resolution
15.4" TFT display with 1680x1050 (WSXGA+) resolution
15.4" TFT display with 1920x1200 (WUXGA) resolution

The 15.4 1920x1200 setup is great for email/web/internet.

 

[GoodEnough]

What's the difference between the X220 and T420 ?

 

[alkemyst]

What's the difference between the X220 and T420 ?

Are you being serious?

https://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome-psyapi2&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8&q=x220 vs t420

 

[GoodEnough]

Looks like X220 is smaller and has a better LCD screen

 

[nk215]

I did the same. I have the X1 carbon (along with ASUS zenbook, dell m6800) but like my thinkpad x201 much more. The thinkpad x201 is around $250 with the first gen I5+SSD, it works fine more most tasks. It's a good balance between weight and the ability to dock with a real docking station.

The X40 was a pure joy to use (and I still use with). I used to love the thinkpad X series up until (not included) the X carbon.

 

[GoodEnough]

nk215, what is better to get, the x201 or the x220?
Was the X40 an older generation?

 

[nk215]

nk215, what is better to get, the x201 or the x220?
Was the X40 an older generation?

The main different between the x220 and the x201 is the newer processor (second gen vs first gen) and better integrated GPU. I didn't get the x220 because I can't see enough of an improvement vs my x201.

My x201 was a major update from the x60t I also have (i5 vs dual core). I stayed with the x201 until the i7 second generation came out and got that (asus zenbook -- what a mess), then the X1 carbon to quickly replace the zenbook.

The x201 on the used market fits within the original price point. I don't think the X220 does.

The X40 was a very old laptop, bought it in 2003, it has the pentium M processor. The form/fit/function of that laptop is above all the others I've used. I still use it to this day (for golf launch monitor and RDP to my server. With an SSD, it's not that slow).

 

[TeknoBug]

Yup I've been buying laptops since the early 90's, build quality has taken a nose dive in the past few years. My Toshiba Satellite from 2010 is still kicking as an HTPC in the bedroom. In the past year I had to return a Toshiba, Acer and Asus laptop because they were faulty in different ways and I'm currently using an Acer for personal use (and I hate Acer but it works). Oddly enough as much as I dislike HP, my wife's HP is the newest laptop and it's working very well but upgrading parts for it is a rotten PITA (have to dismantle the top and keyboard to access HDD and memory). I'm considering a Dell Latitude but they're even going "plasticy" too.

I think Lenovo and high end MSI, Dell or Asus are the way to go.

 

[GoodEnough]

Ok, in my world, it means X201 and x220 are very comparable when it comes to email and web surfing.

x201 is 2010. Around $150
x220 is 2011. Around $250

I bet x201 is an even better bang for the buck.

Prices seem all over the place, actually


http://www.ebay.com/sch/Laptops-Net...op&rt=nc&_pppn=r1&_mPrRngCbx=1&_udlo=50&_udhi

 

[alkemyst]

Ok, in my world, it means X201 and x220 are very comparable when it comes to email and web surfing.

x201 is 2010. Around $150
x220 is 2011. Around $250

I bet x201 is an even better bang for the buck.

Prices seem all over the place, actually


http://www.ebay.com/sch/Laptops-Net...op&rt=nc&_pppn=r1&_mPrRngCbx=1&_udlo=50&_udhi

The X series is nice, but small. I prefer the T series over it, but you have to go to 15" to get the best screen.

When searching ebay I'd do a filter on everything but "not working / for parts only" under condition and then buy it now.

Keep in mind these can be configured very differently...screens, wireless type, keyprint scanner, HDD/CPU/GPU types, etc. There are websites out there that can help you narrow down what type of build you want.

For my T60, I had to upgrade the wireless which normally is just popping a card in the bottom, however; I needed to go to three antennas so I had to disassemble most of the laptop.

If I wasn't getting a MacBook the Lenovo/Thinkpad would be my choice. Some Dell's do ok in the higher end series as well.


Check out: http://forum.thinkpads.com/ and https://forums.lenovo.com/t5/ThinkPad/ct-p/Thinkpads


This is a good thread about buying a thinkpad off eBay: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=67846


This is one of the holy grail of thinkpad websites (link to hardware pages): http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Hardware_Specifications

Edit: also look for the 'tabook.pdf' for the year you are interested in to get CTO numbers which should be on the bottom of all thinkpads and tell you what they came with: http://www.lenovo.com/psref/pdf/tabook.pdf

 

[alkemyst]

I know a lot about IBM products, I was heavily involved in my geek days with the PS/2 lineup.

This is the final version of the PS/2 FAQ I created and maintained for about 7 years.
http://30moons.com/ps2faq.php

Quite a few colleges had it available, even University of Tokyo.

 

[GoodEnough]

Thanks for the links, alkemyst. I am in no hurry to get an X201 or X220, so I added an Ebay watch, and will see if a decent one comes down, once I get a sense of prices. I will only buy a mint condition one that ideally was owned by a tech geek who always upgrades. Max RAM and SSD. B/c those are going to be a $150 upgrade if I buy stock.

 

[alkemyst]

Thanks for the links, alkemyst. I am in no hurry to get an X201 or X220, so I added an Ebay watch, and will see if a decent one comes down, once I get a sense of prices. I will only buy a mint condition one that ideally was owned by a tech geek who always upgrades. Max RAM and SSD. B/c those are going to be a $150 upgrade if I buy stock.

Just verify the CTO number and make sure everything else matches up. For a while sellers were listing the higher end CTO's and then in the fine print denoting the lower grade options the laptop really came with.

Also keep in mind Max RAM reported in many Thinkpads can actually go higher. Their are links out there on that. 8-16GB is more than enough for what you are doing.

 

[GoodEnough]

My desktop runs 6GB of RAM, and that is more than goodenough for me.

 

[Calista]

T61p is probably a decent value at $150, but I'd rather spend a little more and get a laptop that is much newer.
I don't think the T61p is the sweet spot I'm looking for.

The sweet spot for used machines seem to be first or second generation i-processors from the high-end series. Still faster than modern budget machines, but with better build quality. Use DDR3 RAM and support 8-16 GB. Battery life may suffer, and weight may also be an issue. But when choosing between say a new $300 laptop with a crappy WXGA screen, crappy keyboard and a slow AMD CPU and say a used $300 Dell Latitude E6510 with a first generation i7 CPU, a nice backlit keyboard, 1920x1200 resolution and what not I would choose the latter. Any C2D CPU on the other hand will hit the roof with common tasks like 1080p videos.*

With a $500 budget it's a harder choice, a lot of nice laptops can be found new for that price. But a lot of really nice laptops can also be found used for that price.

With the said, I think the friend of the OP paid a tad to much considering the condition.

*Owning both a T9600 C2D system and a i5-560 system I can easily compare them both.

 

[Calista]

The X40 was a very old laptop, bought it in 2003, it has the pentium M processor. The form/fit/function of that laptop is above all the others I've used. I still use it to this day (for golf launch monitor and RDP to my server. With an SSD, it's not that slow).

The X40 was crazy sturdy. I mistreated mine constantly and it just kept on ticking. Still, it was far from perfect. It tended to get quite hot and noisy, the screen was horrible (like really really bad) and the 1.8" HDD was dirt slow.

Still - I would say the technology has matured to such an extent I would love to get a laptop with a similar build, trackpoint and all, but running a ULV Haswell, with a proper IPS display and a speedy SSD.

 

[Calista]

Looks like X220 is smaller and has a better LCD screen

Not all of them, most were sold with quite bad TN-panels. The much better IPS screen was a CTO option and quite rare. So make sure you get what you're looking for. They unfortunately also seem to fetch much higher prices as compared to their TN siblings.

 

[paulcheung]

The sweet spot for used machines seem to be first or second generation i-processors from the high-end series. Still faster than modern budget machines, but with better build quality. Use DDR3 RAM and support 8-16 GB. Battery life may suffer, and weight may also be an issue. But when choosing between say a new $300 laptop with a crappy WXGA screen, crappy keyboard and a slow AMD CPU and say a used $300 Dell Latitude E6510 with a first generation i7 CPU, a nice backlit keyboard, 1920x1200 resolution and what not I would choose the latter. Any C2D CPU on the other hand will hit the roof with common tasks like 1080p videos.*

With a $500 budget it's a harder choice, a lot of nice laptops can be found new for that price. But a lot of really nice laptops can also be found used for that price.

With the said, I think the friend of the OP paid a tad to much considering the condition.

*Owning both a T9600 C2D system and a i5-560 system I can easily compare them both.

Actually the problem that play the 1080P video on C2D notebooks is really rely on the GPU on the machine, most newer i series machine will have the Intel HD2000 or better GPU and the C2D machine has less GPU. The C2D CPU is quit adequate to play 1080p if the machine has a dedicated GPU.

 

[McWatt]

The best thing I see on the Studio 17 is a trackpad with two discrete buttons. That's pretty rare today, and if you use a laptop to do precision pointing away from an external mouse it's necessary. Even the Apple's best in class clickpads are terrible when you need to click without any chance of jumping a pixel in a random direction.

 

[GoodEnough]

Ok, in my world, it means X201 and x220 are very comparable when it comes to email and web surfing.

x201 is 2010. Around $150
x220 is 2011. Around $250

I bet x201 is an even better bang for the buck.

Prices seem all over the place, actually


http://www.ebay.com/sch/Laptops-Net...op&rt=nc&_pppn=r1&_mPrRngCbx=1&_udlo=50&_udhi

X201s seem to go for about $175-$200 on Ebay.
Not as many X220s listed.

 

[thecoolnessrune]

Actually the problem that play the 1080P video on C2D notebooks is really rely on the GPU on the machine, most newer i series machine will have the Intel HD2000 or better GPU and the C2D machine has less GPU. The C2D CPU is quit adequate to play 1080p if the machine has a dedicated GPU.

This is true, but by today's standards, there is no good dGPU that was in use in that time. Keep in mind that even if you got the most modern C2D machine, you were still using nVidia 8xxx or 9xxx mobile GPUs, or ATI Mobility HD 3xxx or 4xxx GPUs. While most of the dGPU's above can do full or nearly full h.264 work, they can't do so without adding at least another 10-15W TDP to the system. Add that to the already warm 35W TDP CPUs (or woah is you if you got a 45W model), and you are talking about a hot, extremely uncomfortable laptop. I still have an HP dv6500t (C2D + NVIDIA 8400GS GPU) and there's no doubt that the thing is always a giant pain to use.

The only point I'm really trying to make, is that a little bit (or none at all depending on the deal) of extra money goes a long way in getting a better laptop. Even the first-generation Arrandale mobile CPUs based off Nahelem are so far and away better performing, and lower power than C2D it's barely even comparable. Better yet, the integrated GPU had enough power to video decode. For anything other than a "I *really* need something to computer one right now for as cheap as possible", C2D's time has past. There's just no sense in looking at it for it's given cost given how low first-gen Arrandale Core processor-based systems are now.

 

[Ramses]

Yup I've been buying laptops since the early 90's, build quality has taken a nose dive in the past few years. My Toshiba Satellite from 2010 is still kicking as an HTPC in the bedroom. In the past year I had to return a Toshiba, Acer and Asus laptop because they were faulty in different ways and I'm currently using an Acer for personal use (and I hate Acer but it works). Oddly enough as much as I dislike HP, my wife's HP is the newest laptop and it's working very well but upgrading parts for it is a rotten PITA (have to dismantle the top and keyboard to access HDD and memory). I'm considering a Dell Latitude but they're even going "plasticy" too.

I think Lenovo and high end MSI, Dell or Asus are the way to go.

I just bought a $400 Toshiba
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/toshiba-...&skuId=8790183

I was thinking the same thing relative to my last one, Acer Extensa 4420 that's six or eight years old and was also a $400 BB cheapy. It still works, has been beat to death, and feels dramatically more nicely built than this thing. I suspect some of it is the sheer size but I needed a huge cheap screen for work more than anything, I put an SSD in it and will upgrade the RAM, but it's a flexxy plastic POS imo. There isn't even an access panel for the drive/memory, but they were nice enough to use all the same size screws on the bottom and it comes off without too much drama. Disposable crap. I should have tried harder and bought a higher end used one.