Friend with no ambition

child of wonder

Diamond Member
Aug 31, 2006
8,307
175
106
I've had a close friend for over 15 years now. He had the misfortune of being born when his mother was over 40 years old and led a very sheltered life. In 10th grade I had to explain to him what a blow job was. Other kids made fun of him and, I'm ashamed to admit, I even went through my stints of putting him down to curry favor with kids I thought were more popular or cool.

However, as I matured I realized that despite his social awkwardness and sometimes odd personality that he was a truly stand up guy who would always be there for me if I needed him. When I got married nearly 5 years ago I was honored to have him as my best man.

As the years go by, I've come to realize more and more that he has absolutely zero ambition in life and is content to drift along and doing nothing but playing computer games, RPGs with other losers, and whacking off.

After we graduated from high school, he decided to go to the same local college as I did. He rarely left his dorm room and dropped out after a year. He then began working in a food freezer moving freight. After 3 years there he got a job doing online customer support. A year or so after that he got a job in the data center at the same company as a Computer Operator. Essentially he sits there over night, changes tapes, and calls someone if something breaks. While doing this job he did go back to school and got a 2 year degree in "Computer Technology" but the degree is nearly useless now since he never uses those skills at his job.

His parents offered him an interest free loan to pursue a Bachelor's degree. His GF (the first he'd ever had, mind you, and who lives 100 miles away) said he could move in with her and she would work a FT and PT job to support him while he went to school in the same town she lives in. She was a few years older than him (he's 30 next month and she was 35) and wanted him to graduate and get a good job so they could get married and start a family ASAP.

When he told me he planned to go to school (I live in the same town as his GF) I was happy he was trying to do something with himself. This was February and he planned on starting school in September. He wanted to work PT while going to school so I advised him to start applying now so he wouldn't have to compete as much with May graduates. He decided against that and didn't start looking until June.

Naturally, no jobs came and he told his GF he would not be moving down and that he would try again next year. She, again, offered to support him but he wouldn't accept. She became upset since it would be another year of being 100 miles apart and she wasn't getting any younger. In her anger she said some hurtful things and he ended the 18 month relationship.

Since that happened I volunteered to look over his resume and spruce it up for him. He agreed and it was in bad shape. Soon my boss announced we'd be hiring 3 temp-to-hire help desk people for a minimum of 6 months, however he wanted to keep the new people permanently so long as they did a good job. I gave my boss my friend's resume and informed my friend he would be getting a call for an interview.

He got the call, interviewed, and was offered the position. He declined. He told me despite the fact he'd be making $3 more per hour he didn't want to risk being without health insurance for 6 months and there was no guarantee he'd be hired on full time. I told him at least in 6 months he'd have IT experience and could look for something else. Nothing I said would sink in.

Now, I'm beginning to question if I want to remain friends with him any longer. I'm a successful IT professional. I have a great wife, 2 kids, a house, 401k, etc. My friend, on the other hand, seems content to work a dead end job, play games, and spank it. We're at completely different stages in life and it really eats me up seeing him scorn personal growth because he's too scared or comfortable to really strive for more.

If you read this whole thing, thanks. I wanted to vent.

Cliffs:

1. Had friend for over 15 years.
2. Led sheltered life, almost 30.
3. Left first and only GF because she wanted him to do something with himself.
4. I got him a job paying more money and would give him experience in IT but he turns it down because it's temp to hire.
5. I now question this friendship because it pains me so much to see him no different than he was 15 years ago and how he refuses to strive for anything more.
 

mryellow2

Golden Member
Dec 2, 2000
1,057
0
0
People are what they are. Good luck trying to change someone, even if it is for their "own good".
 

spaceman

Lifer
Dec 4, 2000
17,602
166
106
i have a couple videogame casualties as friends.
one is successful, the other isnt .
i wont foresake friendship with either one, but you just gotta realize you cant change people that do not want to change.
as far as getting a job for him, i'd be careful putting your credibility on the line for your friend.
 

waggy

No Lifer
Dec 14, 2000
68,145
10
81
we all have a friend like that and if you say you don't then you are that friend.
 

OdiN

Banned
Mar 1, 2000
16,431
3
0
Originally posted by: waggy
we all have a friend like that and if you say you don't then you are that friend.

No....no we...

Oh wait, shit yeah I do.
 

CrazyLazy

Platinum Member
Jun 21, 2008
2,124
0
0
Some incredibly rich successful person out there could argue that you have no ambition and are a total loser etc. Let your friend live out his life as he pleases.
 

spaceman

Lifer
Dec 4, 2000
17,602
166
106
i had to listen to my 30 something friend tell me how leet he was at cod4 on xbox 360. and how he just blew x on a sweet hd set.
he doesnt have a car or a job... and he just doesnt give a hoot.
 

Cheesetogo

Diamond Member
Jan 26, 2005
3,817
4
81
Originally posted by: child of wonder
He told me despite the fact he'd be making $3 more per hour he didn't want to risk being without health insurance for 6 months and there was no guarantee he'd be hired on full time.

That sounds pretty reasonable to me - health insurance could easily be worth a lot more than $3 / hour.
 

racolvin

Golden Member
Jul 26, 2004
1,257
0
0
OMG .... I have a friend almost just like this, except that we've been friends for 22 years. It took him 10 years just to finally get his bachelor degree in - Public Relations - which is funny because he hates the public

He has no clue how to manage his money (what little there is of it), he works at hourly jobs because he's always refused to do what it takes to get ahead. He won't work overtime, he won't study new things, he completely refuses to learn how a computer actually functions - he just memorizes the things he needs to do his job but he doesn't understand why he does them.

I can't begin to tell you how many times I've tried to help him better himself but he always sabotages himself somehow. The absolute best thing I ever did was finally to NOT help him anymore and let him do his own thing. I care for him like a brother but he has to live his own life no matter how miserable he is in doing it. He has to want to change it for the better, nobody can make him want it or do it.

He moved out of state to live with his sister and BIL and that's the best thing that happened to our friendship. I still chat with him online and such to keep in touch, but I'm no longer immersed in his daily angst and that has meant a world of difference.

So that's the best I can tell you. Don't kill the friendship on purpose but just let go. Live your life on your terms and just hope he comes around on his own.
 

kranky

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
21,014
137
106
Frustrating, isn't it?

Sometimes people like this are afraid of change - they may not be in love with their life as it is, but at least they know exactly what each day will bring, and they can cope with that. Sometimes they are content just as they are and don't visualize themselves going through the typical life phases - courtship, career, marriage, children, house, etc. Kind of emotionally frozen in time. And sometimes they have mental issues that they are trying to keep a lid on - they fear that doing something different will reveal to everyone what their problems are. Surely there are other reasons as well.

No matter what, you can't change someone who doesn't want to change. I have one of those friends - known him for 30 years. He used to have a decent job, an apartment and a car. Now, he doesn't work, lives in Section 8 housing in a slum, divorced. He lives on $160/month welfare + food stamps. No car. Everything he owns would fit in the back of a pickup truck easily. To me he is living in hell, but he's content with things. He wishes he had more money, but that would mean working, and he's not going to do that.

We've tried to help him get jobs, but he always rejects the idea. He insists he can't work with other people because they are all idiots. He's a very smart person but has zero ambition and will probably live in that craphole apartment until he dies.
 

JEDI

Lifer
Sep 25, 2001
30,160
3,302
126
people wont change till they hit rock bottom. your friend's content w/life. ask him what rock bottom means to him.

if it bothers you that much that he's comfortable being himself, then slowly drift away.

and yeah, i read it all.
 

OCGuy

Lifer
Jul 12, 2000
27,227
36
91
Originally posted by: Cheesetogo
Originally posted by: child of wonder
He told me despite the fact he'd be making $3 more per hour he didn't want to risk being without health insurance for 6 months and there was no guarantee he'd be hired on full time.

That sounds pretty reasonable to me - health insurance could easily be worth a lot more than $3 / hour.

Well, unless hes paying for it now, isnt he without it anyway? What a joke.

You friend has no ambition, he didnt want the job. Some people are happy being poor.

Hey, there has to be poor people so we can be well-off, right? Everyone with money doesnt work. Its called inflation.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,131
5,659
126
Don't see what the problem is. As long as he's not leeching off of anyone(and it appears he goes out of his way to avoid that), let him live his life.
 

ChaoZ

Diamond Member
Apr 5, 2000
8,909
1
0
Who cares as long as he's happy. No everyone wants to live the life where they have to get married and have kids. He may be content just caring for himself for the rest of his life.
 

Special K

Diamond Member
Jun 18, 2000
7,098
0
76
Originally posted by: CrazyLazy
Some incredibly rich successful person out there could argue that you have no ambition and are a total loser etc. Let your friend live out his life as he pleases.

Exactly. It's all relative.

Most people would probably say that you don't need billions of dollars to be happy and content, yet there are still people out there trying to become billionaires. Are we all slackers compared to them?

Perhaps your friend thinks they don't need whatever arbitrary amount of money and/or status you would consider to not be a slacker.

Who are you to tell him he is not content with his life?

Happiness is a state of mind.
 

dullard

Elite Member
May 21, 2001
25,214
3,632
126
There are people with no ambition. Blame them if you want, but you may be missing the whole picture. I recently read a new study showing an ambition gene is strongly responsible for this behavior. Basically, a subset of the population simply doesn't feel the need to change unless there is a massive problem.

Sure your friend knows he could do better, but he probably has "lack-of-ambition" genetics. He will stay the current "slacker" course for as long as he has food and shelter. There just is no drive otherwise. In my experience, these people cannot be changed by others. They can change themselves if they REALLY hit rock bottom, but that is about it.

The best you can do, if you chose to do it, is to stand by your friend. You did your best. Now, let him be.

Of course, you can introduce him to Golden Rule insurance It is very cheap short term health insurance for people in his exact situation. I bought it between my bachelor's degree and the start of my master's degree. That was a couple years ago, but it was about $2/day back then. There is no reason at all to turn down a $3/hour job to avoid a ~$2/day charge. But of course, unless he really feels the need to change, he won't.
 

OdiN

Banned
Mar 1, 2000
16,431
3
0
You know what's even more frustrating?

Having a friend like this who is extremely talented.

My one friend like this...VERY good natural artist. He should have gone to art school or done graphics design or something. He's...28 now I think and doesn't even have a drivers license.
 

TallBill

Lifer
Apr 29, 2001
46,044
62
91
Originally posted by: dullard
There are people with no ambition. Blame them if you want, but you may be missing the whole picture. I recently read a new study showing an ambition gene is strongly responsible for this behavior. Basically, a subset of the population simply doesn't feel the need to change unless there is a massive problem.

Sure your friend knows he could do better, but he probably has "lack-of-ambition" genetics. He will stay the current "slacker" course for as long as he has food and shelter. There just is no drive otherwise. In my experience, these people cannot be changed by others. They can change themselves if they REALLY hit rock bottom, but that is about it.

The best you can do, if you chose to do it, is to stand by your friend. You did your best. Now, let him be.

Of course, you can introduce him to Golden Rule insurance It is very cheap short term health insurance for people in his exact situation. I bought it between my bachelor's degree and the start of my master's degree. That was a couple years ago, but it was about $2/day back then. There is no reason at all to turn down a $3/hour job to avoid a ~$2/day charge. But of course, unless he really feels the need to change, he won't.

Do you have a link to the study? I have th ambition to read it.
 

hanoverphist

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2006
9,928
23
76
Originally posted by: racolvin

I can't begin to tell you how many times I've tried to help him better himself but he always sabotages himself somehow. The absolute best thing I ever did was finally to NOT help him anymore and let him do his own thing. I care for him like a brother but he has to live his own life no matter how miserable he is in doing it. He has to want to change it for the better, nobody can make him want it or do it.

my best friend from hs is the same way. he is content to work at auto zone, even after making twice the money here where i work. he was laid off when he pretty much refused to pursue any schooling for elec motor control. the company he worked aat after this one was decent as well, but made him drive a lot with no real reimbursement. he lives on a couple acres out in county land that he owns outright, is building a harley that he owes nothing on and has no real need for much else. it used to bug the hell out of me, but hes happy so i am too.
 

thepd7

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2005
9,429
0
0
Originally posted by: Cheesetogo
Originally posted by: child of wonder
He told me despite the fact he'd be making $3 more per hour he didn't want to risk being without health insurance for 6 months and there was no guarantee he'd be hired on full time.

That sounds pretty reasonable to me - health insurance could easily be worth a lot more than $3 / hour.

$3/hour = $480/month. That will pay for health insurance.
 

Gooberlx2

Lifer
May 4, 2001
15,381
6
91
I dunno....some people are content to stay how they are.

Honestly though, unless he's a total drag to be around, overtly full of self-pity or a bad influence on your kids (like shows them porn or has a drug habit), I don't see why it should affect your friendship.
 

dainthomas

Lifer
Dec 7, 2004
14,616
3,471
136
Originally posted by: hanoverphist
Originally posted by: racolvin

I can't begin to tell you how many times I've tried to help him better himself but he always sabotages himself somehow. The absolute best thing I ever did was finally to NOT help him anymore and let him do his own thing. I care for him like a brother but he has to live his own life no matter how miserable he is in doing it. He has to want to change it for the better, nobody can make him want it or do it.

my best friend from hs is the same way. he is content to work at auto zone, even after making twice the money here where i work. he was laid off when he pretty much refused to pursue any schooling for elec motor control. the company he worked aat after this one was decent as well, but made him drive a lot with no real reimbursement. he lives on a couple acres out in county land that he owns outright, is building a harley that he owes nothing on and has no real need for much else. it used to bug the hell out of me, but hes happy so i am too.

Yep. Not everyone derives happiness from jobs, cash, family status, whatever. As long as someone's content, ragging on them about how much better you think their life could be will only drive you apart.
 
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