Gas Prices -- What would it take to get you out of your SUV?

[WhipperSnapper]

As gas prices continue to rise, I wonder, how high do the prices have to get before people will be willing to give up their gas guzzling SUVs and pickup trucks in favor of smaller, more fuel efficient vehicles and/or SUV hybrids?

Does anyone else feel that it's a little bit obscene to see someone driving alone in a large SUV or pickup truck when they aren't using it for anything other than to drive around town or to and from work? Maybe it's just a sense of egalitarianism or proletariat envy on my part, but as the gas prices continue to rise and with my understanding that the amount of oil in the world is finite and will eventually run out, I find it a bit unseemly if not rude.

So, guys, what's it gonna take? $4/gallon (coming this summer or next summer)? $5/gallon? $6/gallon?

 

[imported_Shivetya]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper
Does anyone else feel that it's a little bit obscene to see someone driving alone in a large SUV or pickup truck when they aren't using it for anything other than to drive around town or to and from work? Maybe it's just a sense of egalitarianism or proletariat envy on my part, but as the gas prices continue to rise and with my understanding that the amount of oil in the world is finite and will eventually run out, I find a bit unseemly if not rude.

Got to love the all so typical ignorance you display.

Has it ever occured to you that many of the people you see in SUVs and Trucks alone cannot afford a commuter vehicle so they drive the one they need for all those other duties your not privledge to see?

Examples, at work many of the working moms come in their vans and suvs. The husband might own the small car which he uses to get to and from work. Sometimes its the husband that drives the mini van / suv and the wife drives the smaller car. Its all economics. The moobat so called environmentalist love to villify without thinking beyond their own little worlds. Its far easier for them to villify than to change their own ways.

As for gas prices, I have a Murano, its a Crossover/mini-SUV,modern day wagon, call it what you will. It gets 22 on my commute. I drive 26 miles one way, you do the math. I also have a BMW R1200RT that gets up to 52 on the same commute. Since I am an avid biker I tend to use it a lot.

One of my best friends is the perfect example of big car little car family. He drives the explorer, the wife has the civic. I am quite sure the holier-than-thou crowd which you seem to aspire would call him a wasteful sloth for driving to work in it. Sorry, but its not like they can afford TWO smaller cars and the explorer, which they use for hauling about everything including the kids on trips.

Lets go further, why do people villify SUVs and Trucks? Most modern sedans are overpowered fuel guzzlers. Nearly all 5&7 series, big lexus and infiniti sedans, barely average 20 mpg... getting lucky on the freeway to maintain 25. Sports cars, like Civic SIs average 22 around town on a good day. My old G35 did 21/27... big whoopee. My friends 7 barely gets to 20 on a good day but people won't stereotype him because its not a truck. I guess seeing a truck/van/suv is easy for dolts to see as fuel hogs.

As for what gas price to get me out of the Murano, probably over $7. I will just adjust my lifestyle to match what it costs to live. I can easily handle driving the murano to and from work even at $7, I just would'nt want to. Americans will give up their lattes, movies, and dinners out, before driving. It always happens. Then the holier than thou environmentalist wannabes can sip their lattes at starbucks alone....

 

[DealMonkey]

Americans are so short-sided sometimes. When gas prices first spiked, ginormous SUVs languished on dealer lots while smaller gas-efficient cars and hybrids had waiting lists months long. Then gas prices dropped for a while and brand new Yukons, Suburbans and Hummers starting showing up on the streets with paper plates, fresh from the dealers. And guess what? Gas prices are now up even higher on average than they were before. It's downright amusing to watch, but I don't think folks will take it seriously until gas prices hit $4/gal and then stays there for a long while.

 

[DealMonkey]

My main complaint concerning large trucks/SUVs goes beyond gas mileage however. What really irks me is that these vehicles are often chosen because the driver perceives them as "safe" (despite increased roll-over rates sans vehicle-stability control). Problem is, they're a far bigger danger to everyone else on the road. I find it incredibly selfish of people to try and protect themselves while increasing the risk to everyone around them.

 

[OrganizedChaos]

used suv prices have depreciated so far that i couldn't sell it and buy something smaller if i tried.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
My main complaint concerning large trucks/SUVs goes beyond gas mileage however. What really irks me is that these vehicles are often chosen because the driver perceives them as "safe" (despite increased roll-over rates sans vehicle-stability control). Problem is, they're a far bigger danger to everyone else on the road. I find it incredibly selfish of people to try and protect themselves while increasing the risk to everyone around them.

This is a good point--to an extent it's similar to a tragedy of the commons. A couple weeks ago, near my workplace, I saw some Smartcars (or the like) being tested. I couldn't believe how tiny they were; they were like glorified go-karts and I said to myself, "If you get hit while you're driving one of those, it's just over."

The responses to my initial post have been interesting so far. And, Yes, Shivetya, it did occur to me that some people can't afford second or third smaller vehicles, though I have heard of people getting Chevy Aveo's new for under $9000 (which really aren't as fuel efficient as you'd think).

I don't know if it's true or not, but I'm under the impression that vehicles in America are less fuel efficient than their European counterparts that are the same size and weight or at least same shape and volume. Is that true? Could it be that American safety requirements have made the vehicles less fuel efficient?

As for me, I drive a 2002 Saturn SL-2 and I seem to get about 30-31 MPGs during spring and summer driving while doing half-surface streets and half-highway. In the Winter my mileage drops down to 25 mpgs, but that might be because lots of ethanol is added in my state (aka, crappy gasoline).

 

[dahunan]

Allow me to get out and beatdown drivers who drive to close to my bumper.. they don't really bother me as much in a larger vehicle.. but in a smaller vehicle they are irritating

 

[Stunt]

Hybrid SUV's will be popular if gas prices hit those levels.
People enjoy the comfort and space SUV's give them.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: Shivetya

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper
Does anyone else feel that it's a little bit obscene to see someone driving alone in a large SUV or pickup truck when they aren't using it for anything other than to drive around town or to and from work? Maybe it's just a sense of egalitarianism or proletariat envy on my part, but as the gas prices continue to rise and with my understanding that the amount of oil in the world is finite and will eventually run out, I find a bit unseemly if not rude.

Got to love the all so typical ignorance you display.

Has it ever occured to you that many of the people you see in SUVs and Trucks alone cannot afford a commuter vehicle so they drive the one they need for all those other duties your not privledge to see?

Examples, at work many of the working moms come in their vans and suvs. The husband might own the small car which he uses to get to and from work. Sometimes its the husband that drives the mini van / suv and the wife drives the smaller car. Its all economics. The moobat so called environmentalist love to villify without thinking beyond their own little worlds. Its far easier for them to villify than to change their own ways.

As for gas prices, I have a Murano, its a Crossover/mini-SUV,modern day wagon, call it what you will. It gets 22 on my commute. I drive 26 miles one way, you do the math. I also have a BMW R1200RT that gets up to 52 on the same commute. Since I am an avid biker I tend to use it a lot.

One of my best friends is the perfect example of big car little car family. He drives the explorer, the wife has the civic. I am quite sure the holier-than-thou crowd which you seem to aspire would call him a wasteful sloth for driving to work in it. Sorry, but its not like they can afford TWO smaller cars and the explorer, which they use for hauling about everything including the kids on trips.

Lets go further, why do people villify SUVs and Trucks? Most modern sedans are overpowered fuel guzzlers. Nearly all 5&7 series, big lexus and infiniti sedans, barely average 20 mpg... getting lucky on the freeway to maintain 25. Sports cars, like Civic SIs average 22 around town on a good day. My old G35 did 21/27... big whoopee. My friends 7 barely gets to 20 on a good day but people won't stereotype him because its not a truck. I guess seeing a truck/van/suv is easy for dolts to see as fuel hogs.

As for what gas price to get me out of the Murano, probably over $7. I will just adjust my lifestyle to match what it costs to live. I can easily handle driving the murano to and from work even at $7, I just would'nt want to. Americans will give up their lattes, movies, and dinners out, before driving. It always happens. Then the holier than thou environmentalist wannabes can sip their lattes at starbucks alone....

And how often does your argument actually reflect reality? Sure, some families NEED an SUV or Truck for some reason or another and can't afford to have one dedicated to those activities. But if you look at most SUVs and Trucks on the road, how many of them are really owned for practical reasons? If that was always the case, I wouldn't expect to see quite so many Excursion size vehicles, because while you could probably justify an Explorer, NOBODY needs those huge SUVs unless they are hauling around an entire soccer team on a regular basis. And let's not forget that in a lot of cases there are better alternatives that get better gas mileage, like minivans for example.

But you're right, it's unfair to single out SUVs and trucks when there are a lot of fuel inefficient CARS out on the road too. And while a truck or SUV might be used for some practical purpose, there is NO real reason someone needs an extremely fast car. If they avoid the stereotype, it's probably because they aren't quite so obnoxious to share the freeway with. But they are just as big of a problem, and you're right, it's about time they got some heat too.

The real problem isn't what type of vehicle you drive anyways, it's the gas mileage you get. For the same sized car, you can get a HUGE variety of gas mileage stats...we don't need people buying more small cars if all they are buying is Subaru Impreza STIs rather than Honda Civics. And the same holds for SUVs, they are actually making SUVs that are perfectly serviceable for SUV needs that don't guzzle fuel like a Hummer. While you can make the size argument, it's a little harder to make the argument that you need to tow a small yacht around on a daily basis.

The other problem isn't what people are driving, it's how far they are driving it. 22 mpg isn't too bad for an SUV, but you drive it 52 miles every day for your commute. My car gets 30 mpg on my commute, which isn't TOO much better until you consider that I drive less than half the distance. So you use about 2.36 gallons of gas getting to and from work every day, and I use about 0.73, less than a third as much. Now on your particular case the bike helps average things out, but yours is hardly a unique situation. Maybe some people have to live farther from work because they changed jobs or whatever, but how many people just did it because gas is cheap and they don't care how much they use?

Obviously we all need to use gas to some extent, and I don't think the debate should be about the nitty-gritty of our particular vehicles so much as it should be about our overall lifestyle. I think EVERYONE could use less gas in some way or another, they just have to want to do it. It will become a problem eventually, and while bitching about "latte sipping environmentalists" (is that you, Mr. O'Reilly) might make you feel better, it's not actually going to solve anything.

 

[BoomerD]

Hey, quit pickin on us "Urban Assault Vehicle" owners...if you want to own a rolling sardine can, you have that right, but some of us can't comfortably fit in them.
I went out 3 weeks ago and "tried on" several imports. I LIKE the Toyota Yaris. Seems to be a good choice for running around town, but I can't get through the door in the 4 door version.
Hits me just above the shoulder, and my back is too badly fvcked up to contort myself to make me fit. The 3 door version however, I slid right into. The Toyota Matrix was also an easy fit (surprisingly) and seemed to be a pretty decent vehicle. I also have "fit issues" with the Prius. Nice car, but it's extremely difficult to get in the door.
I couldn't get into any of the smaller Mazdas, same issue..door height. The closest Subaru dealership is over 50 miles away, so they're not even on the compare list. Won't even look at the Kia's or Hyundai's...too much in that "Yugo category" to me.
Haven't been to the Honda dealership...we have personal issues with Honda's (mostly their crappy drivers...had 3 vehicle accidents caused by morons driving Honda's) although I've tried to convince my wife to look at them. I'm NOT impressed with the way they're built though. My neighbors on one side own 4 of them, and on the other side, the neighbors own 3 of them. I've been under the hood with them a couple of times, and they just look cheaply built. Having seen a few of them "up close and personal" after accidents, it appears that they get totaled pretty easily in what would otherwise be considered to be minor accidents. Maybe that's not bad, since driving a car that has been frame damaged and "fixed" doesn't appeal to me either.

 

[compman25]

My SUV is my smaller vehicle.

 

[blackangst1]

I wish my CAR got the same mileage most SUV's get.

And while we're talking about gas prices...it would have to top 8/gal to get a 2nd commuter car. As it is now I spend alot driving/racing so its already budgeted.

 

[Slew Foot]

Working in the ER, I've seen many car accidents. Whenever there was an SUV vs. car, the dudes in the car were usually completely wrecked while the people in the SUV barely had a scratch or some other minor trauma. Since I'm smart enough to not roll over my SUV on my own, the SUV is my vehicle of choice.

 

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper

As gas prices continue to rise, I wonder, how high do the prices have to get before people will be willing to give up their gas guzzling SUVs and pickup trucks in favor of smaller, more fuel efficient vehicles and/or SUV hybrids?

I'd say $5 or higher at the very least. Poor people aren't buying $40,000 SUVs. It'd have to be very expensive.

 

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: Slew Foot
Working in the ER, I've seen many car accidents. Whenever there was an SUV vs. car, the dudes in the car were usually completely wrecked while the people in the SUV barely had a scratch or some other minor trauma. Since I'm smart enough to not roll over my SUV on my own, the SUV is my vehicle of choice.

That would be my only reason for keeping with an SUV through higher gas prices. If we can have security and high gas mileage, good for us, but until we do you know which one loses out.

 

[Jhhnn]

Meh. Whatever vehicles are currently on the road will probably live out their normal lifespans being driven, while smart buyers of new vehicles will shape the market towards greater efficiency. It'll take time, and some prodding from stricter CAFE standards won't hurt...

As for the rest of it, few SUV's get any further off the road than a gravel parking lot, and the real need for AWD is seldom, even in smaller vehicles that have it... the actual "utility" of most sport utility vehicles is really pretty low...

As for me, I sold off my very old turbo/intercooled Volvo wagon a year ago, because the reliability, price of repairs and fuel costs were just getting out of hand... and moved into a Scion xB. It actually has more passenger room than the Volvo, complete reliability so far, and gets nearly twice the fuel mileage...

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: Slew Foot
Working in the ER, I've seen many car accidents. Whenever there was an SUV vs. car, the dudes in the car were usually completely wrecked while the people in the SUV barely had a scratch or some other minor trauma. Since I'm smart enough to not roll over my SUV on my own, the SUV is my vehicle of choice.

Ah, but we're all safer if we totally ban SUVs from the roads. Personally I question the legality of driving a vehicle that you intentionally purchased to cause more harm to anyone you get in an accident with just so YOU'RE safer. Cars are safer in EVERY circumstance except an accident with a much larger vehicle. The safest solution would seem to be banning SUVs, not EVERYONE having them. And it's not just rolling that makes SUVs unsafe, they are harder to control which means you're more likely to get in an accident in the first place. Not that I'm in favor of actually banning them, but your argument is silly.

Edit: Which reminds me, I was talking with a friend the other day, and he proposed what I thought was a novel solution to the SUV "safety" issue. They can be excellent protection if other people hit you, but make you more dangerous if you hit other folks. My friend's solution is that if you cause an accident while driving an SUV, you get charged with something extra, since you bought a vehicle you knew would cause more damage in that kind of situation. I kind of object to that on libertarian grounds, but it's an interesting idea, and might make the bad drivers think twice before buying a "safer" vehicle.

 

[blackangst1]

And if we eliminated guns there would be no more gun deaths :roll:

OTOH, commercial air travel is STILL safer

 

[Slew Foot]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Slew Foot
Working in the ER, I've seen many car accidents. Whenever there was an SUV vs. car, the dudes in the car were usually completely wrecked while the people in the SUV barely had a scratch or some other minor trauma. Since I'm smart enough to not roll over my SUV on my own, the SUV is my vehicle of choice.

Ah, but we're all safer if we totally ban SUVs from the roads. Personally I question the legality of driving a vehicle that you intentionally purchased to cause more harm to anyone you get in an accident with just so YOU'RE safer. Cars are safer in EVERY circumstance except an accident with a much larger vehicle. The safest solution would seem to be banning SUVs, not EVERYONE having them. And it's not just rolling that makes SUVs unsafe, they are harder to control which means you're more likely to get in an accident in the first place. Not that I'm in favor of actually banning them, but your argument is silly.

Edit: Which reminds me, I was talking with a friend the other day, and he proposed what I thought was a novel solution to the SUV "safety" issue. They can be excellent protection if other people hit you, but make you more dangerous if you hit other folks. My friend's solution is that if you cause an accident while driving an SUV, you get charged with something extra, since you bought a vehicle you knew would cause more damage in that kind of situation. I kind of object to that on libertarian grounds, but it's an interesting idea, and might make the bad drivers think twice before buying a "safer" vehicle.

We'd also all be much safer if we banned all cars from the road and only drove huge F350s with a max speed of 50 mph.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: blackangst1
And if we eliminated guns there would be no more gun deaths :roll:

OTOH, commercial air travel is STILL safer

I'm not saying it's a good reason to ban SUVs, I just get pissed off when I'm sharing the highway with some asshole in his SUV, driving like a moron while talking on his cell phone. Not that jackasses in cars don't do the same thing, but I'm a lot less likely to die if they hit me. Gun ownership isn't the same thing, because you being safer doesn't make me less safe. Considering the average driving skill in this country, I think for pure safety reasons, anyone other than a bumper car should be banned from the road.

 

[Enig101]

I always feel mild disgust when I see someone driving a vehicle I'm sure is less than 20mpg. NOBODY needs an SUV. Of course some people will need a truck/van for their work, but aside from that they are unnecessary. You can't possibly convince me that a majority of the Ford F150's and Dodge Rams I see driving around Texas are used for working.

Look at Europe. Only rich idiots have SUVs there. Everyone else just drives cars.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: Slew Foot

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Slew Foot
Working in the ER, I've seen many car accidents. Whenever there was an SUV vs. car, the dudes in the car were usually completely wrecked while the people in the SUV barely had a scratch or some other minor trauma. Since I'm smart enough to not roll over my SUV on my own, the SUV is my vehicle of choice.

Ah, but we're all safer if we totally ban SUVs from the roads. Personally I question the legality of driving a vehicle that you intentionally purchased to cause more harm to anyone you get in an accident with just so YOU'RE safer. Cars are safer in EVERY circumstance except an accident with a much larger vehicle. The safest solution would seem to be banning SUVs, not EVERYONE having them. And it's not just rolling that makes SUVs unsafe, they are harder to control which means you're more likely to get in an accident in the first place. Not that I'm in favor of actually banning them, but your argument is silly.

Edit: Which reminds me, I was talking with a friend the other day, and he proposed what I thought was a novel solution to the SUV "safety" issue. They can be excellent protection if other people hit you, but make you more dangerous if you hit other folks. My friend's solution is that if you cause an accident while driving an SUV, you get charged with something extra, since you bought a vehicle you knew would cause more damage in that kind of situation. I kind of object to that on libertarian grounds, but it's an interesting idea, and might make the bad drivers think twice before buying a "safer" vehicle.

We'd also all be much safer if we banned all cars from the road and only drove huge F350s with a max speed of 50 mph.

No we wouldn't, SVUs and trucks are MUCH less safe in all circumstances unless you're hitting someone driving a smaller vehicle. If we all had huge trucks, even that safety advantage would disappear.

You know what would make me safer on the road? Shaped charges. I could put them on all sides of my car, and as soon as anyone even starts to tap my fender, they get blasted off the road, leaving me totally safe. Sure, YOU'RE going to die, but I'LL be a lot safer, and that's all I really care about.

 

[greatfool66]

Ive gotten used to this kind of self righteous argument

I drive an SUV but its a family car I need to move my stuff to college in.

Even though I get a shocking (24/16-1) 33% worse gas mileage than an Accord or Camry, I probably use way less gas because I drive as little as possible.

I ride my bike everywhere or get rides and use less than a tank a month on average (20/30=.66 gals/day)

I know lots of people in little cars who drive them all the time... the problem today isn't the vehicles as much as the American driving culture. I hate the fact that our cities are made on a driving scale so that you can't really walk anywhere.

I realize everyone doesn't live withing a few miles of school or work and can't do what I do, but lots of people make no effort to cut back on driving.

That being said, when I buy myself a vehicle it will probably be a car.

 

[MicroChrome]

I got a CRV Kind of an SUV I guess... '07 has a 2.4L VTEC engine. Like it a lot. Usually get 30MPG. Also own a Mazda (ranger) pickup. I drive it for taking things to the dump or bringing things back from home depot. Maybe you just keep seeing me drive it empty? I gets about 22MPG V6 3L. Anyway, my point is, maybe you are seeing the glass half full?

People are going to drive what they have...

 

[Enig101]

To be honest, anything short of 30mpg is pretty bad these days. My car only just gets that because it's an older one, and American. Cars in Europe have been achieving that for some time now because they are built smaller and more economically (gas is a lot more expensive there).