GeForce 6 series video processor OFFICIAL THREAD

[Atif]

Hey heyyoudvd, please check the post above yours, I listed the official statement from nVidia you might want to read it

Peace

 

[magomago]

hehe, looks like this will quickly boil down into a waiting to next month: either nvidia releases this magical foreceware driver and everyone is happy...or they don't and all hell breaks loose and ATI capitalizies ;0

 

[Zebo]

"The Case of the Vanishing Feature"
Ed Stroligo - 10/28/04


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


nVidia's response to the dispute over 6800 is really a test to see how functionally literate you are about the product in question.

Their official response is (bold italics nVidia, plain text, our comments):

"The GeForce 6800 models featured the 1st generation of our programmable video technology which includes support for high-definition MPEG2 video decode and standard definition MPEG2 encode, as well as advanced post processing features such as motion adaptive deinterlacing, and inverse 3:2 pulldown."

Under these circumstances, when anyone starts a lot of items that are there, one ought to look for any items that ought to be or used to be included to see if they've gone MIA. Like Sherlock Holmes, you have to look for the dog that doesn't bark. In this particular case, that dog is hardware acceleration for high-definition Windows Media Video, which was included as part of the 6800's promotional literature.

The view then gets cloudier . . . .

"The GeForce 6600 models have the same 1st generation programmable video technology support as the GeForce 6800 models. However, the GeForce 6600 models also include hardware acceleration for high-definition Windows Media Video (WMV) decode."

If you say Product B has the same things as Product A, plus something else, that means Product A doesn't have the "something else." Here, it is "hardware acceleration for high-definition Windows Media Video (WMV) decode." So the 6600 has it, but the 6800 doesn't, even though the 6800s were advertised as having it.

"In order to utilize the programmable decode and advanced post processing features of the GeForce 6800 and 6600, end users need to download an updated ForceWare driver as well as the NVIDIA DVD decoder."

In other words, to get any of this advanced stuff working at all, you'll have to get this future driver AND this DVD decoder.

"Both the ForceWare driver and NVIDIA's DVD decoder will be available for download from NVIDIA.com by the end of November. For Windows Media Video decode on the GeForce 6600 models, end users will also need to download an update to Windows Media Player from Microsoft."

Please note what isn't there when nVidia talks about Windows Media Video. There's no mention of the 6800. Only the 6600 gets mentioned.

Please also note that we're talking about hardware acceleration of WMV. It's not that a computer with a 6800 can't handle WMV, now or later, what happens is that the CPU will have to do the work in software (a sizable burden).

Conclusion

nVidia's statement says that there is only hardware acceleration for high definition WMV with the 6600, not the 6800. If you're at all interested in watching video on your computer, you probably don't want to buy a 6800 for that purpose.

If you already bought the card for this feature (a feature apparently advertised originally on video card websites and on the boxes themselves), you have a problem.

More as this story develops.

Ed


http://overclockers.com/tips00681/

 

[HardWarrior]

Nice write-up. I just wish he would have mentioned that nV wants $20 for its decoder. Sounds like they don't mind profitting from a problem they created, yes?

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: HardWarrior
Nice write-up. I just wish he would have mentioned that nV wants $20 for its decoder. Sounds like they don't mind profitting from a problem they created, yes?

Yup bastages...He does''nt mention price but

"In other words, to get any of this advanced stuff working at all, you'll have to get this future driver AND this DVD decoder. "

 

[Algere]

AS I PERSONALY was dissatisfied with how Nvidia was treating my readers, I wanted to do something about it. All Nvidia PR machine does is putting some nice out of the world "we are all happy" documents and think our readers will buy it. Well they haven't, and they haven't bought the Soundstorm story either.
Here is our original article and Nvidia's reply, here.

This is what one of reader had to say to Nvidia and I have an inbox full of similar mails.



Fudo

Sorry, but that reply from nVidia is bull***t. Please tell the PR-manager I said so.

I have a 6800 LE AGP and I have bought the nVidia DVD Decoder. Drivers do nothing at all for decoding performance. The only thing that affects playback of MPEG-2 is the DVD Decoder. Neither the decoder or drivers help WMV9 (the PR-manager practically nixes this in the reply) or XviD/DivX (MPEG-4) playback, both of which are still advertised as important features for the GeForce 6-series.

And yes, I've tried every driver since 61.xx and up to the newest, playback cpu load is identical.

I suggest they come clean before they have a IBM Deathstar-like PR-catastrophe on their hands. Oh, I had one of those too. Nasty lil' ah heck.

http://www.nvidia.com/object/feature_on-chip-video.html

"Another important factor is that the GeForce 6 Series GPUs are completely programmable and can handle formats such as WMV9 and MPEG-4. The NVIDIA motion compensation engine can provide decompression acceleration for a variety of video formats including WMV9, MPEG-4, H.264, and DiVX. As with motion compensation for MPEG-2, the NVIDIA video engine can perform most of the computation-intensive work, leaving the easiest work to the CPU. "

And yes, I do encode quite a bit and I do play HDTV-material quite often. I'm not Joe Average Gamer, whining because some minor feature he really doesn't comprehend or really never had plans of using doesn't work. I bought this card in part due to the fact that it touts a kickass VPU.

Inquirer

 

[Luck JF]

I dont know if the DVD Decoder helps or not but I think charging people for a driver that suppsedly fixes a problem cause by malfunctioning hardware that they sold and is not living up to warranty is immoral.

 

[MDE]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: HardWarrior
Nice write-up. I just wish he would have mentioned that nV wants $20 for its decoder. Sounds like they don't mind profitting from a problem they created, yes?

Yup bastages...He does''nt mention price but

"In other words, to get any of this advanced stuff working at all, you'll have to get this future driver AND this DVD decoder. "

Most companies put nvDVD on their driver discs, I know BFG did with my 5900. I haven't bothered to check my 6800's driver disc but I'm pretty sure it's there as well.

 

[HardWarrior]

Originally posted by: MDE

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: HardWarrior
Nice write-up. I just wish he would have mentioned that nV wants $20 for its decoder. Sounds like they don't mind profitting from a problem they created, yes?

Yup bastages...He does''nt mention price but

"In other words, to get any of this advanced stuff working at all, you'll have to get this future driver AND this DVD decoder. "

Most companies put nvDVD on their driver discs, I know BFG did with my 5900. I haven't bothered to check my 6800's driver disc but I'm pretty sure it's there as well.

If that were true in this case why wouldn't nV just say "Check your distribution disks and install the wonderfuly free DVD decoder we gave you in order to help fix the problem!", instead of "Come on by and BUY!"

I'll check though.

 

[gobeavs]

I've got a PNY 6800 GT, and I would like to email them stating my displeasure with this situation..maybe if they get enough of it they will pass it on to nVIDIA...but in any case, how do I find a support email address? I found none on their website, just the usual FAQ databases and such...

I paid 400 bucks for a card so I want it fully-functional.

 

[MDE]

I just checked my BFG 6800GT and the box states that nvDVD 2.0 is included on the driver disc.

 

[gururu]

Originally posted by: MDE
I just checked my BFG 6800GT and the box states that nvDVD 2.0 is included on the driver disc.

I don't think nvDVD 2.0 employs the hardware decoding necessary to enable WMV support.
nvidia
Will this product work with NVDVD and ForceWare Multimedia?
The new software will upgrade the decoders in ForceWare Multimedia 3.0 to access the new features in the NVIDIA DVD Decoder. The NVIDIA DVD Decoder will not upgrade NVDVD 2.0 as it was a separate application based upon an old architecture.

 

[rbV5]

Most companies put nvDVD on their driver discs, I know BFG did with my 5900. I haven't bothered to check my 6800's driver disc but I'm pretty sure it's there as well.

NV2.0 came with my 6800, there is no upgrade path to the now "required" NV4.0 decoders. $20 for the decoders (which comes with nStant media btw) or $70 for TT2.0 which includes the decoders. The decoders themselves are supposed to be excellent, but still...

 

[MDE]

Originally posted by: rbV5

Most companies put nvDVD on their driver discs, I know BFG did with my 5900. I haven't bothered to check my 6800's driver disc but I'm pretty sure it's there as well.

NV2.0 came with my 6800, there is no upgrade path to the now "required" NV4.0 decoders. $20 for the decoders (which comes with nStant media btw) or $70 for TT2.0 which includes the decoders. The decoders themselves are supposed to be excellent, but still...

In that case, burn Nvidia's HQ to the ground. This is truly ridiculous, they better allow it to be downloaded free for 6 Series (or at least 6800 Series) owners. If not I will have absolutely NO problem with obtaining it through alternate means.

 

[Megatomic]

My CPU Usage was between 85 and 95% the entire time that video was playing back on my system. I had no dropped frames per the stats but there was one scene where the video hitched twice and smoothed out.

 

[imported_Harbinger]

http://www.tcmagazine.info/mod...e=article&sid=8143

Check this out. It seems that nVidia is ready to confirm the video processor bug.
Its a really big deal and they should really do something to compensate for it.
I dont care if its a card replace via RMA or a voucher for future cards but I feel
cheated and I want to be compansated. And I am sure all of you feel the same
even if you dont plan to use HDWMV. You paid for it and it should be there working.
End of story.

 

[gururu]

oh man, that is not good.

 

[HardWarrior]

I can't believe that nV is claiming that this flaw "doesn't effect performance." Depending on why you bought the card it OBVIOUSLY does. nV would have been much better off if they had simply owned up and taken their lumps right when this broke. I agree with your sentiments entirely Harbinger, except for one thing. Some of the posters here have made it plain that they don't care if they, AND the rest of us, got played by nV.

 

[gururu]

Originally posted by: HardWarrior
I agree with your sentiments entirely Harbinger, except for one thing. Some of the posters here have made it plain that they don't care if they, AND the rest of us, got played by nV.

how can you say that? the majority of the posters including myself want to see this resolved so that all 6800 owners are satisfied. If you guys want to do some sort of official protest, i'll be the first in line and I don't even have a 6800 card.

 

[HardWarrior]

Originally posted by: gururu

Originally posted by: HardWarrior
I agree with your sentiments entirely Harbinger, except for one thing. Some of the posters here have made it plain that they don't care if they, AND the rest of us, got played by nV.

how can you say that? the majority of the posters including myself want to see this resolved so that all 6800 owners are satisfied. If you guys want to do some sort of official protest, i'll be the first in line and I don't even have a 6800 card.

I'm never quite sure what that question means. How can I say what I've already said? Or do you mean that you don't agree with what I said? If that's it, I would suggest that you reread this threat as well as the one I started for BFG 6800 owners. I've seen more than a few posters who've said everything from "Why are you wasting your time being mad, you're screwed either way?" to "You guys are being self-indulgent and not considering nV's bottom line! (How did that guy put it punisher?)" I wish we were all unanimous about this, logically we should be, but by your own admission we aren't. Which makes my statement correct, yes?

 

[Megatomic]

Hmm, I have 28 days to return my 6800 OC to Best Buy. Maybe I'll get an X800 Pro instead.

 

[gururu]

Originally posted by: HardWarrior
I'm never quite sure what that question means. How can I say what I've already said? Or do you mean that you don't agree with what I said? If that's it, I would suggest that you reread this threat as well as the one I started for BFG 6800 owners. I've seen more than a few posters who've said everything from "Why are you wasting your time being mad, you're screwed either way?" to "You guys are being self-indulgent and not considering nV's bottom line! (How did that guy put it punisher?)" I wish we were all unanimous about this, logically we should be, but by your own admission we aren't. Which makes my statement correct, yes?

I guess what I meant by "How can you say that?' is "how can you acknowledge those turds over those who support you?"

 

[HardWarrior]

Originally posted by: gururuI guess what I meant by "How can you say that?' is "how can you acknowledge those turds over those who support you?"

How can I acknowledge them? I find the combination of their insistence and lack of ego fascinating, g.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Harbinger
http://www.tcmagazine.info/mod...e=article&sid=8143

Check this out. It seems that nVidia is ready to confirm the video processor bug.
Its a really big deal and they should really do something to compensate for it.
I dont care if its a card replace via RMA or a voucher for future cards but I feel
cheated and I want to be compansated. And I am sure all of you feel the same
even if you dont plan to use HDWMV. You paid for it and it should be there working.
End of story.

I don't know how much stock I put in "TCMagazine" which I've never heard of. I'm skeptical of anyone who "publishes" anything that can't write at all:

Unanimous NVIDIA distributor

and

furiated

and

began

(should be "begun") and

effect

(should be "affect") etc. etc. etc..

Nonetheless, I've e-mailed a link to this to my buddy at nVidia to see what they say about these "official nVidia sources".

 

[imported_Harbinger]

I dont understand how some ppl say "its ok , i dont plan on using hdwmv so i dont care if it works or not". The point is that you PAID your hard-earned money on this.
Even if you dont use it nvidia asked you to pay more for this product because it SHOULD work this way. For example. Imagine you buy a very nice Asus A8V WiFi edition
with the nice little pci card and cute antenna even though you dont plan on using a WiFi network. Then all of a sudden people discover that there is a bug in the WiFi pci
card that simply renders it unsuable. So you think "i dont care about it, i dont plan on using WiFi. Since mobo works ok i am ok as well". WRONG! You paid MORE money for
this product because of the extra feature. So you DESERVE it even if you dont plan on using it. Getting back on subject. If we suppose NV40 gpus didnt have this "video processor"
i am sure nv40 would not count 222mil transistors. Which means better yield per waffer in production which means LOWER prices. It would also mean less power consumption and
less heat generated. You got my point. And of course every1 is sure that nVidia has enough money to compansate its customers. Because we are nvidias customers and not
gainwards or bfgs or asus's or whatever.

And for the older ones let you remind you of the Pentium 1 (60-66-90mhz series) math bug. For those not familiar with that in the first batch
of the very first pentium running on 60/66/90 mhz a little bug was discovered some months after chip hit the stores. The problem consisted of slightly inacurrate answers in math
calculations with very large numbers. Here an example taken from this site:
"x = 4195835, y = 3145727, and z = x - (x/y)*y , Computed exactly, the answer, z, should be zero. The Pentium chip gave 256 as the answer."
Intel acknowledged the existance of the bug and agreed to change all faulty chips for no extra cost.
Sure, less than 1% of those chips owners would use their processors for math calculation of that scale.
Yet most ppl did return their chips for new bug-free ones. Of course Intel didnt bankrupt of this. Sure they
did lose a lot of money but not enough to be of a problem for the wealth of the company.

Same should apply for todays situation. nVidia should offically acknowledge the absence of the super-PR hyped video processor and should change all faulty chips with new working ones. And to be honest
i never used hd wmv and neither intend to do so in the near future. I just want nVidia to give me what
I paid for.

@Rollo: I got the link from warp2search.net , a well known and respectable tech news portal.