GeForce RTX 2060/2070/2080 Super Reviews

[Guru]

The performance gains are significant and impressive, but I must say the pricing is still too high. I know you are essentially getting 1080+ 5-10% better performance for $400, but it's been over 3 years since Pascal, considering the GTX 1080 was $500 for most of its lifespan, we are essentially just now getting a proper 1080 replacement for $100 less.

With that said Nvidia is never going to improve prices and release better products unless AMD is a very strong competitor, so with that said AMD needs to reduce RX 5000 series prices. They could have gotten away with $380 RX 5700 and 7-10% faster performance before, but now they are still 5-7% slower than the super 2060 for just $20 more, AND they are releasing over a year later. AMD needs to drop the RX 5700 price to $350 if they want to be competitive and the RX 5700xt price needs to be $420.

 

[AtenRa]

So, RTX 2070S is using the TU104 which is a 545mm2 chip with 13.6B transistors , the same chip used in RTX2080.
No matter how good yields are at 12nm , this is a huge die and will hurt NVIDIAs margins.

Just for comparison , NAVI 10 that is used in the RX 5700XT is only 251mm2 with 10.3B transistors.

Bad thing for AMD is that there current 330mm2 chip is VEGA 20 and not NAVI based. They would have a way better Graphics card product with NAVI 10 competing only up to RTX2060 Super (TU106).

 

[Shivansps]

So, RTX 2070S is using the TU104 which is a 545mm2 chip with 13.6B transistors , the same chip used in RTX2080.
No matter how good yields are at 12nm , this is a huge die and will hurt NVIDIAs margins.

Just for comparison , NAVI 10 that is used in the RX 5700XT is only 251mm2 with 10.3B transistors.

Bad thing for AMD is that there current 330mm2 chip is VEGA 20 and not NAVI based. They would have a way better Graphics card product with NAVI 10 competing only up to RTX2060 Super (TU106).

This remainded me of the day Lisa Su held a Navi on his hand and and said "see how small navi is" then at E3 they slapped a $449 price tag for that "small Navi".

I think this Raytracing stuff is really taking a lot of die size and Nvidia is also charging a big premium over it, if you think about it AMD could have provided the old RTX2070 perf for what a GTX1660TI costs if they wished to do so, good thing to Nvidia that they did not.

The mayor issue for Nvidia will be once the big Navi launch, because again AMD is in a position to undercut them with prices with a smaller die that performs equally or better, but im sure they are not going to do that.

 

[Head1985]

-This is huge. One of the most frustrating knock on effects of high Turing pricing was the inflated pricing of used parts thanks to the lack of $/perf improvement.

"Patient gamer's" such as myself were used to getting the prior gen's top end performance for half the price, but that didn't happen this time around. The 2070S makes the $500 after market 1080ti obsolete overnight, and used 1080ti prices should start migrating down to the mid $300 range where they should have been a long time ago.

The folks who really got screwed here are the guys that just bought a 2080 new or a 1080ti used and it just passed the return period.

AIB 1080TI is still 10% faster than 2070super.Dont forget that those 1080TI FE editions in reviews work at 1700mhz.They are just crap.

 

[tviceman]

You sure talk with a lot of "facts" about a product that isn't released and has had literally zero testing outside AMD.

And sure, the Supers look fine if you were not one of the consumers that got raked over the coals by nVidia (again) after buying cards that nVidia knew full well they would be obsoleting inside 6 months.

Obsolete is an awfully strong adjective, wouldn't you agree? There is nothing obsolete about the vanilla RTX 2060, 2070, and 2080 cards.

 

[Thala]

I think this Raytracing stuff is really taking a lot of die size and Nvidia is also charging a big premium over it

Not sure what you consider "lot" but reality is, that the die size adder for RT cores is very small - around 3% for TU106.

 

[tviceman]

Ooooffff... poor AMD on the GPU side of things, at least their CPU division is killing it. GPU pricing is still dookie but just got a bit better. 2070 Super looks to be a decent high end option.

I'm excited to see NVIDIA on 7nm. Assuming that Samsung's process is solid, the 3000 series should be executed very well and offer a nice upgrade to everyone on 400/500 series AMD and Maxwell/Pascal NVIDIA GPUs.

Hopefully they can get power consumption back to Pascal levels.

 

[Stuka87]

Obsolete is an awfully strong adjective, wouldn't you agree? There is nothing obsolete about the vanilla RTX 2060, 2070, and 2080 cards.

Well production has ended for the 2070 and 2080, so they are EOL'ed. The 2060 is being kept, but at a lower price less than 6 months after launch. While the 2060S is the same price as the old 2060, only faster.

EDIT: I was mistaken on the pricing of the 2060/2060S. The S is just straight up more expensive.

 

[amrnuke]

The performance gains are significant and impressive, but I must say the pricing is still too high. I know you are essentially getting 1080+ 5-10% better performance for $400, but it's been over 3 years since Pascal, considering the GTX 1080 was $500 for most of its lifespan, we are essentially just now getting a proper 1080 replacement for $100 less.

With that said Nvidia is never going to improve prices and release better products unless AMD is a very strong competitor, so with that said AMD needs to reduce RX 5000 series prices. They could have gotten away with $380 RX 5700 and 7-10% faster performance before, but now they are still 5-7% slower than the super 2060 for just $20 more, AND they are releasing over a year later. AMD needs to drop the RX 5700 price to $350 if they want to be competitive and the RX 5700xt price needs to be $420.

So Nvidia is gouging the customer.

So, RTX 2070S is using the TU104 which is a 545mm2 chip with 13.6B transistors , the same chip used in RTX2080.
No matter how good yields are at 12nm , this is a huge die and will hurt NVIDIAs margins.

Just for comparison , NAVI 10 that is used in the RX 5700XT is only 251mm2 with 10.3B transistors.

Bad thing for AMD is that there current 330mm2 chip is VEGA 20 and not NAVI based. They would have a way better Graphics card product with NAVI 10 competing only up to RTX2060 Super (TU106).

So Nvidia is killing their own margins for the sake of competition.


Wait... which is it?

 

[AtenRa]

While the 2060S is the same price as the old 2060, only faster.

2060 Super is $399, 2060 was $349

xx60 cards are getting higher and higher MSRP every time,

GTX960 = $199 - 2015

GTX1060 = $249 – 2016

RTX 2060 = $349 – 2018

RTX 2060 Super = $399 – 2019

This is why NVIDIA is good at PR, they sell you a xx60 card at double the price it had 4 years ago and everyone is exited because it gives you the performance of a $500 card that should have been in the $300 price in the first place.

 

[GodisanAtheist]

AIB 1080TI is still 10% faster than 2070super.Dont forget that those 1080TI FE editions in reviews work at 1700mhz.They are just crap.

- True but if discussion on this board is to be believed the lack of RT support when you're in the performance ballpark means people will go with the RT support, even if its a bit more money. Throw in used, 3 year old tech with diminishing driver lead improvements in newer games and it should translate to a substantial discount when purchased used.

 

[railven]

This is why NVIDIA is good at PR, they sell you a xx60 card at double the price it had 4 years ago and everyone is exited because it gives you the performance of a $500 card that should have been in the $300 price in the first place.

This, is definitely it. When the alternative is buying the same AMD card performance for the same price bracket over the course of roughly 5 years.

R9 290X -> R9 390X -> RX 480 -> RX 580 -> RX 590

Throw in the mining situation and you were lucky when you got any of these products between lulls and below MSRP. Otherwise, the NV equivalents that had yet to get screwed up by mining were amazing deals. NV has been playing the smart PR this whole time.

Even now:
Turing v1.0 Announcement: Overall consensus was it was bad, with little redeeming factors.
Navi10 Announcement: Well now both sides are milking us now. Sucks to be consumers.
Turing v2.0 Announcement: Well it's better than Turing 1.0 and better than RX 5700 XT. Things are starting to get better for consumers.

And once again AMD is left looking like fools.

 

[Adawy]

The entire lineup is unimpressive and overpriced, i'm actually looking forward to Ampere now, which will make Next-gen Consoles look like a Turd (pun intended) at launch.

 

[Glo.]

The entire lineup is unimpressive and overpriced, i'm actually looking forward to Ampere now, which will make Next-gen Consoles look like a Turd (pun intended) at launch.

And be even more overpriced, at the same time.

 

[Adawy]

Embrace the milking.

 

[Head1985]

 

[piesquared]

2060 Super is $399, 2060 was $349

xx60 cards are getting higher and higher MSRP every time,

GTX960 = $199 - 2015

GTX1060 = $249 – 2016

RTX 2060 = $349 – 2018

RTX 2060 Super = $399 – 2019

This is why NVIDIA is good at PR, they sell you a xx60 card at double the price it had 4 years ago and everyone is exited because it gives you the performance of a $500 card that should have been in the $300 price in the first place.

Their PR is garbage. The only thing they have is astroturfers spreading their infection in tech message boards (a reworked 'focus group' initiative). I've yet to see anyone able to point to an example of good marketing from their marketing department. Take their "Super" branding for an example of how bad they are.

 

[mopardude87]

No 6gb wasn't proven to be a problem at all. Maybe after 3 years it would be a problem.

So many people forgot that even at 1080p BF5 with rat tracing on with Ultra textures saturated a 6gb and there was even performance issues that got resolved with the lowering of texture quality. Of course the answer for everyone was to drop textures and well the debate got pretty much out of hand with some people claiming entitlement.

I was on the side of asking why couldn't a 1070ti performance tier of card have at least the very same vram. I guess the others who agreed ended up being called entitled. I think it was kind of crazy to have to drop textures on a brand new card for a 1080p resolution.

 

[ElFenix]

Their PR is garbage. The only thing they have is astroturfers spreading their infection in tech message boards (a reworked 'focus group' initiative). I've yet to see anyone able to point to an example of good marketing from their marketing department. Take their "Super" branding for an example of how bad they are.

i don't know why you'd use super instead of Ti, since you already have Ti.

 

[Insomniator]

Why are we complaining about the word Super? Who cares...?

 

[tviceman]

Not sure what you consider "lot" but reality is, that the die size adder for RT cores is very small - around 3% for TU106.

I'm pretty sure the RT and tensor cores are around 8-10% of the total die space.

 

[Thala]

I'm pretty sure the RT and tensor cores are around 8-10% of the total die space.

Of course, i was only referring to RT-cores. RT-cores are 3% and Tensor-cores 5.5% of a TU106 - in sum 8.5%.

 

[tviceman]

Of course, i was only referring to RT-cores. RT-cores are 3% and Tensor-cores 5.5% of a TU106 - in sum 8.5%.

In my opinion, I don't think we'd have one on the die without the other. Nvidia is trying to lump sum the value of these features in consumer space so they don't have to make a different kind of die for professional products.

 

[railven]

Their PR is garbage. The only thing they have is astroturfers spreading their infection in tech message boards (a reworked 'focus group' initiative). I've yet to see anyone able to point to an example of good marketing from their marketing department. Take their "Super" branding for an example of how bad they are.

When I hear "Super" I think of Dragon Ball Super. An anime that is popular among millions of people. The "Super" arc of the series being well received by fans due the return of the original creator and re-booting the series discontinuing the most hated arc of the series.

But yes, Nvidia's marketing is terrible. I mean, I'm still seeing jokes about the dent in the 5700 XT shroud.

 

[guachi]

AMD needs to drop the RX 5700 price to $350 if they want to be competitive and the RX 5700xt price needs to be $420.

I said at the time of the E3 price reveal that Navi was $30 too high. And that'd be exactly at the prices you have here. So, clearly you are correct in your assessment.

If Navi prices are dropped $30 I think it makes the Super cards far less appealing (I would say pointless, depending on reviews). Maybe after a month and initial demand is satisfied AMD can do that.