Yeah with NVMe when it comes to sharing the only option is either a PCIe switch, which enthusiast boards have seemingly all but stopped doing, or an NVMe eHBA like the Broadcom 9600-24i that can natively attach 6 NVMe 4 Lane drives back to a single x8 PCIe port. More than a couple NVMe drives is still in my opinion beyond an enthusiast class need because it sucks up available PCIe lanes so quickly.From my PoV I just want something serviced with enough PCIe lanes that I don't have to worry about whether the PCIe slot my video card is in going down from 16x to 8x because I put in too many drives. That or if there aren't enough lanes in total for all the drives I've installed, I'd want them to be shared instead of stealing speed from the video card slot.
Yeah adding $300 to the cost of the encloser/fan-out is a nonstarter. Woof.Yeah with NVMe when it comes to sharing the only option is either a PCIe switch, which enthusiast boards have seemingly all but stopped doing, or an NVMe eHBA like the Broadcom 9600-24i that can natively attach 6 NVMe 4 Lane drives back to a single x8 PCIe port. More than a couple NVMe drives is still in my opinion beyond an enthusiast class need because it sucks up available PCIe lanes so quickly.
It would be cool to see an enthusiast enclosure for say up to 8 drives back to a single PCIe attachment. The technology certainly exists. Microchip's PFX 28xG5 PCIe Fan-out is basically built for that sort of thing, but at over $300 per chip in small quantities I think it will be a long time before we ever see these built into something like Icy Docs. They're mostly relegated to server backplanes for All-NVMe Storage when the host doesn't have enough lanes in the design for direct-to-NVMe.
E31T is made on 7nm, while E26 is made on 12nm, so they have already started. I think we will see gen5 drives that doesn't require cooling by the end of 2024.E31T is not Gen 4 speeds (up to 10.8GB/s).
But the real solution is other new controllers made on more advanced manufacturing processes which Phison is too cheap to do yet.
Or perhaps to use conventional 2.5" sized SSDs that connect via U.2/U.3.
Bare drive without heatsink easily throttles.My 990 Pro 4TB rarely gets above 40c. Unless I am copying large files between nvmes.
You really have to check the documentation for the specific board on this. It's hidden in the manual somewhere. Mine has the last pcie slot shared but the main video card slot always remains at 16x.From my PoV I just want something serviced with enough PCIe lanes that I don't have to worry about whether the PCIe slot my video card is in going down from 16x to 8x because I put in too many drives. That or if there aren't enough lanes in total for all the drives I've installed, I'd want them to be shared instead of stealing speed from the video card slot.
You can't have the newest processes, because SSDs are low margin. N3 for example would break them. If they do though, you can be sure it'll be Gen 7 using even more power than 12nm ones.I think the solution is to wait for 7nm controllers instead of 12nm.
Moving to a new standard is NOT the solution, because then we'll truly have SSDs with heatsinks the size rivaling CPUs.
The real fix is stop increasing sequential speeds like it's a new fad. And that's what it is. Increasing numbers of no relevance.
Phison has literally just announced the E31T 7nm low powered controller. It's not going to be the fastest out there, but a first step.You can't have the newest processes, because SSDs are low margin. N3 for example would break them. If they do though, you can be sure it'll be Gen 7 using even more power than 12nm ones.
There's literally objective proof in the video with the FLIR camera showing the temperatures. Also multiple reviewers show the drive throttles under sustained writes.Been doing this stuff so long that I only take what I experience as truth and not someone else saying this is how it is.
What's actually happening is some people develop an emotional attachment to their hardware, so any objective criticism of said hardware is perceived as an affront to their manhood.Younger people do not like others challenging their opinion. Nature of being young.
But virtually every bare gen4 and gen3 drive still throttles even after die shrinks, so you're still going to need a heatsink of some sort on gen5. It may not be as big as before, but it still won't fit into laptops or other small form-factors.Phison has literally just announced the E31T 7nm low powered controller. It's not going to be the fastest out there, but a first step.
Is there any indication of throttling under gaming/desktop use or is it only when you throw continuous workloads on them?But virtually every bare gen4 and gen3 drive still throttles even after die shrinks, so you're still going to need a heatsink of some sort on gen5. It may not be as big as before, but it still won't fit into laptops or other small form-factors.
Actually some bare QLC drives don't throttle because their sequential writes already drop to ~130MB/sec, which is far below any modern HDD. Rather ironic actually.
The vast majority of people won't notice difference between SATA and NVMe unless performing large file copying or another kind of niche I/O.As a casual gamer/desktop user is there any reason to worry about throttling?
I know, but lets say texture streaming/RTX IO etc. become a thing, will it actually load the drive enough to throttle?The vast majority of people won't notice difference between SATA and NVMe unless performing large file copying or another kind of niche I/O.
Bring on real SATA-4. A bump to 1GB/sec would be absolutely fine. Keep bumping the sequentials to stay far below manufacturing improvements and you'll never have a problem with runaway thermals or exotic form-factors.
Only if it's a significant contribution.I know, but lets say texture streaming/RTX IO etc. become a thing, will it actually load the drive enough to throttle?
I think NVMe is faster by 10-20us than SATA. SATA SSDs get 4K Random read latency at 120-150us while NVMe can go little under 100us. Intel created the NVMe spec just so Optane on NVMe didn't look even more terrible than it did.The vast majority of people won't notice difference between SATA and NVMe unless performing large file copying or another kind of niche I/O.
Bring on real SATA-4. A bump to 1GB/sec would be absolutely fine. Keep bumping the sequentials to stay far below manufacturing improvements and you'll never have a problem with runaway thermals or exotic form-factors.
Wouldn't that be U.2/U.3 form factor?NVMe spec but with SATA physical connectors is maybe what you're looking for?
Depends on what's getting hot. The controller does not like getting hot.Generation 4 NVMe is already an overkill and 5 is just silly. Doesn't too much heat kill drives faster?
And again how hot do they get under regular desktop use, which is probably the usage case for most of us.Depends on what's getting hot. The controller does not like getting hot.
Some drives have temp sensors reading 90C or higher. Whether that's for the NAND or the controller, I don't know.And again how hot do they get under regular desktop use, which is probably the usage case for most of us.
MSI SPATIUM M580 PCIe 5.0 NVMe M.2 FROZR LIQUID SSD