General VR discussion thread

[ImpulsE69]

I don't even think it is worth debating about. They will have it eventually, and with all games, control preference is going to vary by game type. For Eve Valkrie I certainly plan on using a controller, not a waving my arms about in a spaceship.

If they try to shoehorn everything with touch controllers, then experience is going to get dull and the same. There is still only so much you can do. Touch controls are going to allow for NEW experiences, but the old experiences are still mostly going to need mouse/kb or controller. I don't plan on playing a racing game with touch controllers.

Precision is still wanted. Touch controllers SHOULD only be used when the game is designed around the idea, not shoehorned into everything under the sun. I would much rather see actual hand tracking (Leap).

 

[Sabrewings]

No one is saying motion controllers will replace a HOTAS or wheel. Dismissing room scale and motion controls as a gimmick is short sighted, though.

This is what I want, this is what I expect from this great revolutionary VR tech. Let's forget about the optical shortcomings for a moment, I get that the display tech and GPU power isn't there yet but will be sooner or later, and despite that the sense of scale and volume and the graphical presentation of the actual game is already there and it's fun and there's this world around me I want to do stuff with goddamnit!
And I know there's no excuse, I know the tech to interact with stuff is there, I've seen it and I want it. I want to break this barrier and really step into that world to its full conclusion.
Here's what I got though: I get to intensely stare at floating menus because I move this cursor with my head rotation, and then I get to press a button on this old school controller. That's it.
That is so disappointing because right now this feels like you're being dragged around this beautiful beach in a transparent sarcophagus where you can only look around with a laser pointer strapped to your head. No touchy fishy!
This interaction model bothers me so much because Oculus managed to take the old abstraction "push-buttons-on-controller" and instead of replacing it with something better, something more natural, they grafted this even weirder "my-head-is-a-laserpointer" abstraction on top of it.
A friend of mine who also got his Rift today compared it to being in a nightmarish situation, where you're in this realistic feeling place where you expect to be able to move but can't, causing an almost claustrophobic feeling.

 

[ImpulsE69]

I forgot to mention I went ahead and ordered a Vive. I will try them both out and see whats what. WTF did they charge me tax though? My state never gets charged tax unless its a chain store.

 

[Sabrewings]

I forgot to mention I went ahead and ordered a Vive. I will try them both out and see whats what. WTF did they charge me tax though? My state never gets charged tax unless its a chain store.

I'm pretty confident in which will be more useful for you, at least. That, and the god effect bars glare on the Rift is apparently a bit distracting.

As for tax, not sure. If the state has a sales tax, they charged it. I was charged the same tax rate that Amazon charges.

 

[ImpulsE69]

I'm pretty confident in which will be more useful for you, at least. That, and the god effect bars glare on the Rift is apparently a bit distracting.

As for tax, not sure. If the state has a sales tax, they charged it. I was charged the same tax rate that Amazon charges.

God rays are also on the Vive, as well as more SDE. In fact, they both suffer from all the same issues. Most people who have tried both are trying to be realistic in saying that if 'weight, screen res, god rays, etc' are an issue for you, you may as well skip this gen.

 

[IEC]

God rays are also on the Vive, as well as more SDE. In fact, they both suffer from all the same issues. Most people who have tried both are trying to be realistic in saying that if 'weight, screen res, god rays, etc' are an issue for you, you may as well skip this gen.

Which is precisely why I am skipping Gen1.

 

[gorobei]

ifixit teardown of the rift
https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Oculus+Rift+CV1+Teardown/60612

tested podcast review of the rift
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9s-gBm5OCI&feature=player_detailpage#t=4299
constellation [specifically coverage to distance from camera] looks like it will be the weak point of the rift.

 

[Sabrewings]

God rays are also on the Vive, as well as more SDE. In fact, they both suffer from all the same issues. Most people who have tried both are trying to be realistic in saying that if 'weight, screen res, god rays, etc' are an issue for you, you may as well skip this gen.

Not god rays, but it has some fresnel effect that is more like lens flare. Doc-Ok did a great comparison:

http://doc-ok.org/?p=1414

And had great thoughts on the glare effects here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/com...me_disagreement_about_rift_cv1s_field/d1lmphp

TL;DR Distracting on Rift, not noticeable on Vive during use.

 

[sxr7171]

Shoot them an email with this form.

https://store.digitalriver.com/DRHM...=htcus&Locale=en_US&ThemeID=38736100&Env=BASE

The next day I got a very helpful email telling me what batch I was in and the estimated arrival date.

That's good info.

 

[Aikouka]

I forgot to mention I went ahead and ordered a Vive. I will try them both out and see whats what. WTF did they charge me tax though? My state never gets charged tax unless its a chain store.

I noticed that the tax didn't appear to be the usual 9%. I wonder if they're charging me my use tax, which is only 4%. Also, Digital River is distributing this, so the taxes may be based upon whether Digital River has an entity in your state.

 

[Sabrewings]

Latest updates from both camps.

Oculus slow shipping is due to a component shortage:
http://m.imgur.com/jneHEwh

HTC's payment processor, Digital River, is apparently cancelling orders after payment were automatically declined by some banks. HTC is making provisions to get these folks in on April wave 2.
https://as.reddit.com/r/Vive/comments/4d0qm7/vive_has_just_been_cancelled/

I notified my bank ahead of time and have been charged. Tracking numbers started going out yesterday so I should have mine soon.

 

[Subyman]

Just got an email from Oculus saying they will be covering the shipping costs to everyone that ordered before today due to the slow roll out. Between that and them giving the kickstarter backers free CV1s, it shows they are standing behind the community.

 

[Sabrewings]

Just got an email from Oculus saying they will be covering the shipping costs to everyone that ordered before today due to the slow roll out. Between that and them giving the kickstarter backers free CV1s, it shows they are standing behind the community.

It's a great deal, especially for international customers. It's a welcome change after their silence.

 

[Sabrewings]

HTC is making good on taking care of the order confusion. Also, word on the street is that they're not doing large waves anymore.

https://as.reddit.com/r/Vive/comments/4d2a4l/full_details_from_the_htc_vive_support_team_on_cc/

 

[ImpulsE69]

There's a lot of info about Leap over there so I ordered one off Amazon. Seems the newest updates have fixed a lot of the issues. (Not that there aren't still some).

 

[Sabrewings]

There's a lot of info about Leap over there so I ordered one off Amazon. Seems the newest updates have fixed a lot of the issues. (Not that there aren't still some).

Good plan. I've got one waiting.

 

[HeXen]

I definitely plan to use my physical monitor (tv) as little as possible so been reading on the Virtual Desktop app vs Steam VR. Appears VD app will offer a few more features atm. Also, unless you want to turn on your monitor every single time you VR which must also support 90 hz?... you'll need a headless hdmi with enough resolution support and both the Rift and Vive have a funky resolution so I take it that a 4k unit would be best.

My hope is that I could set VD or SteamVR to launch up at boot to where the headless hdmi would then trigger the GPU so I can just slip on the VR and not have to turn on my TV in order to do anything.
The VD app does sound nice in that it offers a game launcher and voice commands too along with interesting landscapes so that could be a very handy thing to just boot directly into....again, assuming I'm understanding it all correctly.

 

[flexy]

Of course a 4k unit would be "best", but the h/w requirements are already steep enough for this resolution. Imagine the rig you will need to get 4K *high end* graphics constantly 90+ FPS

** What my hope in regards to VR is, that there will some day be one standard without *major* differences in tech and software respective where those differences won't matter. Not a "war" between systems.

As for having ONE API and a VR standard, someone mentioned that currently it is still too early to even think about standards when "what is optimal", say input etc. is not even established.

 

[Aikouka]

There's a lot of info about Leap over there so I ordered one off Amazon. Seems the newest updates have fixed a lot of the issues. (Not that there aren't still some).

I got a Leap Motion off eBay, but in typical eBay fashion, they're misrepresented. I got a VR-AZ model, which from what I found on Alibaba, is supposed to include the VR stuff. Yeah, it doesn't have any of that. Is there actually a new version though or is it just a firmware update?

 

[Sabrewings]

I got a Leap Motion off eBay, but in typical eBay fashion, they're misrepresented. I got a VR-AZ model, which from what I found on Alibaba, is supposed to include the VR stuff. Yeah, it doesn't have any of that. Is there actually a new version though or is it just a firmware update?

It's my understanding that the Leap itself is the same. There's new software for it called Orion that sets it up for VR integration. The only other thing included is a mount plate for mounting to a HMD, but this can be done with command strips. New versions of the plates are said to be in work and I think they said they'll offer a file so you can 3D print it if you prefer.

 

[Sabrewings]

Early thoughts on Eve Valkyrie are that it's an underwhelming cash grab:

https://as.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/4d71vh/eve_valkyrie_disappointing/

I wasn't too interested because it seemed a bit too arcade, but it's disappointing to see Oculus pushing a title like this. It's not in VR's best interests.

 

[Sabrewings]

Laura at Destructoid has had the audacity to say the Vive is better for seated experiences than the Rift.

The ability to see your keyboard and mouse via camera feed without taking my headset off, as well as the absense of Oculus weird nose gap, for me made the Vive a considerably better VR platform of choice for seated play.

http://www.destructoid.com/review-htc-vive-352103.phtml

Not sure if one day HTC would ever offer a single base station sans controllers kit, but if they did it could be quite the hit for the seated only crowd.

 

[ImpulsE69]

The only thing I got out of that article is that it's a journalist who doesn't know how to type w/o looking at their hands.

It does amaze me that most of the complaints about either are the most trivial, going out of their way to find complaints issues there could be. Like they are clueless on the tech itself. All the reviews spend 3/4 the time talking about the headsets themselves and very little time talking about actual use.

In other news, there's a youtube vid where someone has been experimenting with a way to do chaperone on Rift as an option, but room scale works pretty well with 1 camera. I do think it would behoove Oculus to figure out chaperone sooner than later.

 

[Sabrewings]

The only thing I got out of that article is that it's a journalist who doesn't know how to type w/o looking at their hands.

Since she never mentioned typing, if that's all you got from a journalist's article I'm sorry. A lot of games (like Elite) make FULL use of the keyboard. Even if you have a HOTAS, it's unlikely you could bind everything to it. Being able to quick glance the keyboard is very useful since a lot of people set it to the side while playing and bind less common functions to it.

The reality is that the two are very similar (HMD wise) and any small differences there are all that could help someone decide.

(Edit: r/Oculus gets it: https://as.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/4datx6/first_review_of_the_htc_vive/d1p91tw )

In other news, there's a youtube vid where someone has been experimenting with a way to do chaperone on Rift as an option, but room scale works pretty well with 1 camera. I do think it would behoove Oculus to figure out chaperone sooner than later.

Roomscale is certainly doable with the Constellation. The problem is that one camera will never be as good as the Vive's dual Lighthouses (it would be just like a single Lighthouse). The reason they went with two is to eliminate occlusion. With only one camera, if you move your Touch controller behind you it is now lost. Yes, Touch comes with a second camera (at what cost?) but to be useful it has to be setup behind you, which means repeaters or an active and long USB3 cable. Not all chipsets like long USB3 runs, especially Z97+ chipsets.

Constellation can't scale near as well as Lighthouse can either. Imagine a dozen various objects in one space (this is how NASA intends to use it, for one). With Lighthouse each object sees the laser sweeps and calculates its own position then forwards the data (mostly wirelessly except the HMD) to the PC for updating the game engine. Constellation requires the CPU to be used and parse all those different light emissions into location data, which means constantly processing video data from two or more cameras for a whole space. All that video data is a constant load on your peripheral buses and not all PCs will handle it as well as others.

Palmer was inspired by TrackIR style setups which were meant for rotational data and limited translational data, whereas HTC/Valve designed a system intended for easily scaled large volume tracking from scratch.

 

[Kaido]

Early thoughts on Eve Valkyrie are that it's an underwhelming cash grab:

https://as.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/4d71vh/eve_valkyrie_disappointing/

I wasn't too interested because it seemed a bit too arcade, but it's disappointing to see Oculus pushing a title like this. It's not in VR's best interests.

That's the thing, being an early adopter means we're going to have limited access to quality content. I love my Gear VR, but there's a half a dozen really excellent titles & a lot of junk. And even stuff like Gunjack, which is pretty cool, gets lame after a few minutes. We're just going to have to wait for the game libraries to build up.

I kind of suspect that the PSVR will win for most titles & most fun games simply because they're a console with a lot of developers behind them, despite having somewhat inferior hardware.