General VR discussion thread

[frowertr]

It's not as they show it, but you can watch them on your monitor while they play. I had a lot of fun watching my daughter play and talking to her about what she was doing, even though I couldn't wait to play myself.

So it can be a family experience in a way.

I admit, I haven't watched any videos about the Vive or the Rift. But doing what you said actually peaks my interest for it being a family device. I very much dislike the total isolation that VR brings. At least being able to see what they see would help to break that isolation.

 

[Sabrewings]

I admit, I haven't watched any videos about the Vive or the Rift. But doing what you said actually peaks my interest for it being a family device. I very much dislike the total isolation that VR brings. At least being able to see what they see would help to break that isolation.

Parts of this video are what you can expect in that regard. Disregard the green screen portions, but the end portion where they're at home and you can see what they see on the TV/monitor is quite easy to setup. I've done it with a DK2 lots of times.

https://youtu.be/qYfNzhLXYGc?t=3m53s

 

[Sabrewings]

http://www.techinsider.io/virtual-reality-gave-me-depth-perception-2016-4

 

[Kaido]

http://www.techinsider.io/virtual-reality-gave-me-depth-perception-2016-4

Reminds me of that one story about the dude who saw Hugo in 3D & gained depth perception:

http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20120719-awoken-from-a-2d-world

 

[Kaido]

Parts of this video are what you can expect in that regard. Disregard the green screen portions, but the end portion where they're at home and you can see what they see on the TV/monitor is quite easy to setup. I've done it with a DK2 lots of times.

https://youtu.be/qYfNzhLXYGc?t=3m53s

Just saw that video this morning. Leaning more towards keeping the Vive over the Oculus...VR controllers & Lighthouses seem awesome...

 

[Sabrewings]

Just saw that video this morning. Leaning more towards keeping the Vive over the Oculus...VR controllers & Lighthouses seem awesome...

If room scale interests you, I don't see any reason to go with the Oculus right now. The price of Touch is still undetermined (includes another camera). The viability of placement of said camera such that between it and the original the entire volume of space can be seen is also undetermined. The Vive has proven performance now, and both are suited for seated experiences.

The Touch controllers and their finger tracking seem interesting, if not a bit weird, but I'm highly doubtful of their performance at this point versus a product we have over a year of verifiable performance with.

 

[ritditditdidoo]

I am really tempted to buy the Vive but the main thing stopping me is that I can't see any games I would want to play with it. I looked up many of them and they look like they would be fun for 30 mins or an hour or something but then I would get bored. They look like casual iphone type games and I just wouldn't want to play stuff like that regularly. A lot of people call them glorified tech demos which seems about right to me, but until there are some big games like an Elder Scrolls 6 or something with really good VR integration, I will have to just wait.

Also the tech seems ok but still not 100%. It is heavy, screendoor effect still exists, lots of cables all over the place, and the light houses have to be fitted to the walls etc. If some killer VR games came along soon, I would just get a Vive and try to ignore the limitations. But without that killer VR game, it makes me think I should probably just wait for a second generation. I can see the next generation of VR being pretty awesome. I expect they will get all the cables into one cable and there will be some spring loaded whatsit which attaches to your belt or the wall or something so it holds the cable away from your feet. I imagine the weight of the headset will get a lot lower, and screendoor will vanish, and the resolution will end up 4k and the next generation of graphics cards will be able to run that at 90fps with high settings and without breaking the bank, and there will be some great games to play with it. That's when most gamers will have one

 

[Sonikku]

I desperately want to try VR but have neither the money to buy one nor the patience to wait years for them to fall in price. Guess it's going to come down to the whole ATOT escort thing because I probably need a new GPU too.

 

[ImpulsE69]

Aside from the quality of games, you are looking at 5 years at least before the majority of that happens. You are either in it because you are excited, or you are just another general consumer. That is the difference.

This iteration isn't necessarily for gamers, but rather a niche group of gamers, and other technophiles.

I guarantee you, the adult industry will drive this tech and direction just like it does many other techs. I predict a number of...um...interesting peripherals on their way.

 

[ritditditdidoo]

The other issue is that the area I could play in is about 6 foot by 7 foot which is not bad but still not perfect I think. If there was something I just HAD to experience, I could setup my PC in another room, but I really don't want to do that so it would take something epic.

With no epic VR games yet, one of the things I thought might tempt me was the movie watching experience. I read that it can make it feel like you are in a movie theatre type room and you have a massive imax type screen to look at. Not sure how good that would be in reality to actually sit and watch a 2 hour movie though, but it sounds promising.

 

[HeXen]

The other issue is that the area I could play in is about 6 foot by 7 foot which is not bad but still not perfect I think. If there was something I just HAD to experience, I could setup my PC in another room, but I really don't want to do that so it would take something epic.

With no epic VR games yet, one of the things I thought might tempt me was the movie watching experience. I read that it can make it feel like you are in a movie theatre type room and you have a massive imax type screen to look at. Not sure how good that would be in reality to actually sit and watch a 2 hour movie though, but it sounds promising.

For about the cost of another VR headset, you could get yourself a Wizdish ROVR or something like this instead. I'm sure the market for this stuff will come down in prices as well

 

[thesmokingman]

Was at Target and saw this...

http://www.target.com/p/view-master-virtual-reality-starter-pack/-/A-49168078

 

[flexy]

Was at Target and saw this...

http://www.target.com/p/view-master-virtual-reality-starter-pack/-/A-49168078

It's crap like this (A VR start-pack for €17??), google cardboard etc. which I fear will give VR a bad rep, when people *expect* any amazing VR experiences for €20, batteries not included.

On the other hand, it is predicted that VR will indeed first take-off in the mobile sector....and actual, "real" VR that would deserve this name will for a longer time still stay a niche thing, only LATER become more mainstream.

Prepare that MANY people who never had any exposure to VR previously will judge VR like this, from getting things like a €17 "VR Starter Kit" for their phones....

 

[Sabrewings]

It's crap like this (A VR start-pack for €17??), google cardboard etc. which I fear will give VR a bad rep, when people *expect* any amazing VR experiences for €20, batteries not included.

The thing is, Cardboard can be amazing for the unitiated. It's a great way for people to see the potential in the technology. Everyone I showed some Cardboard 360 videos to or a roller coaster or similar absolutely loved it. Then I would say "now imagine you could walk around with the graphics a high end PC would give you" and their mind is blown.


I saw this comparison today that I think will benefit the guys interested in seated experiences. I found this to be one of the best demonstrations of optical artifacts I've seen.

http://blog.metaclassofnil.com/?p=837

 

[Subyman]

The thing is, Cardboard can be amazing for the unitiated. It's a great way for people to see the potential in the technology. Everyone I showed some Cardboard 360 videos to or a roller coaster or similar absolutely loved it. Then I would say "now imagine you could walk around with the graphics a high end PC would give you" and their mind is blown.


I saw this comparison today that I think will benefit the guys interested in seated experiences. I found this to be one of the best demonstrations of optical artifacts I've seen.

http://blog.metaclassofnil.com/?p=837

That is a good article. After watching hours and hours of footage, I'm going to hold off on VR for a while. I have a Rift coming, but I'll likely pass it on to someone else. The main reason is that there aren't any games I'm interested in at the moment. I can see how room scale can be a compelling experience, but again I haven't seen much that I want to jump into right now.

I can be swayed by a roomscale experience in a game like The Vanishing of Ethan Carter or Fire Watch, but I think it will be awhile before someone nails it enough for me to devote a room to.

The thing that had me wanting to get one right away was backward support for big games, but I'm not seeing devs add support right now.

 

[Sabrewings]

That is a good article. After watching hours and hours of footage, I'm going to hold off on VR for a while. I have a Rift coming, but I'll likely pass it on to someone else. The main reason is that there aren't any games I'm interested in at the moment. I can see how room scale can be a compelling experience, but again I haven't seen much that I want to jump into right now.

Are you looking for sim games? Elite is supposed to be one of the premier experiences for a sit down experience, and the time I spent in it with a DK2 I'd agree. The game itself lacks any depth, but I still managed to lose around 100 hours in it just touring. Project Cars is supposed to be a good one too. DCS, then there's FlyInside if that sort of thing interests you. FlyInside even support Leap Motion Orion at the moment.

I can be swayed by a roomscale experience in a game like The Vanishing of Ethan Carter or Fire Watch, but I think it will be awhile before someone nails it enough for me to devote a room to.

The Gallery is supposed to be pretty epic, but a bit short since it's only one episode. That concerned me at first until the devs mentioned the first episode is the most expensive and the others will be quiet a bit cheaper.

The thing that had me wanting to get one right away was backward support for big games, but I'm not seeing devs add support right now.

VorpX?

http://www.vorpx.com/supported-games/

They're said to be adding Vive support soon, and when they do I will definitely be purchasing.

 

[Subyman]

Are you looking for sim games? Elite is supposed to be one of the premier experiences for a sit down experience, and the time I spent in it with a DK2 I'd agree. The game itself lacks any depth, but I still managed to lose around 100 hours in it just touring. Project Cars is supposed to be a good one too. DCS, then there's FlyInside if that sort of thing interests you. FlyInside even support Leap Motion Orion at the moment.

I've played Elite enough to not really want to play anymore of it. I couldn't get into Project Cars, but I may give it another try. I'm mainly interested in narrative games and FPS RPGs like skyrim (but something new.) I get into flight sims every now and then, but am not in the mood to play them right now. I may keep the Rift around for American Truck Simulator depending on how I feel when it arrives.

The Gallery is supposed to be pretty epic, but a bit short since it's only one episode. That concerned me at first until the devs mentioned the first episode is the most expensive and the others will be quiet a bit cheaper.

Vive only right now it seems.

VorpX?

http://www.vorpx.com/supported-games/

They're said to be adding Vive support soon, and when they do I will definitely be purchasing.

That is pretty cool. You'd hope that Oculus or HTC would add native support for older games without having to rely on third party applications especially if it is just a driver hook.

I'm really excited to see what the indie scene does with VR. I hope the games sell well enough for devs to invest their time and energy into making the experiences.

When do you get your Vive?

 

[Sabrewings]

I've played Elite enough to not really want to play anymore of it.

Oh, I understand. Mile wide inch deep and I've already got around 100 hours in it. VR is enough to make me pick it up again if nothing else than as a glorified galaxy tourer and proof of concept.

Vive only right now it seems.

Oops, I forgot. The devs are really cool guys so I would hope they'd be ready to add support for OR when touch releases.

That is pretty cool. You'd hope that Oculus or HTC would add native support for older games without having to rely on third party applications especially if it is just a driver hook.

Yeah, you'd think it'd be something first party, but everyone raves about VorpX's implementations. It's worth it to me just for a few games on the list.

I'm really excited to see what the indie scene does with VR. I hope the games sell well enough for devs to invest their time and energy into making the experiences.

"Indie" or small studio is pretty much the driving force right now. They can afford a risky experimentation of mechanics to find out what works and what doesn't. They're also flexible enough. I think in a year or so when the things that work prove themselves, we'll see some larger dev involvement. That's assuming adoption rates stay pretty strong throughout that time as well which is a big if. I really think Gen 2 is going to need to be about cost reduction and not a quantum leap of features in order to keep driving the market. Luckily, the Vive is pretty modular (right down to the HMD's components) and upgrades shouldn't be too painful. As it is, a higher performance HMD could be plug and play into the existing head harness and work with the existing Linkbox, controllers, and lighthouses. It could go even further as it appears the screen/lens modules are very easy to remove and replace.

When do you get your Vive?

Hah, if I could predict accurately when someone would get their Vive, I could make a lot of money off r/Vive. :sneaky:

I'm predicting next week, though still no tracking confirmation. I preordered at 3 mins after the open, but it appears HTC/DRI are loosely following that order, when they do at all.

 

[thesmokingman]

Was at Target and saw this...

http://www.target.com/p/view-master-virtual-reality-starter-pack/-/A-49168078

It's crap like this (A VR start-pack for €17??), google cardboard etc. which I fear will give VR a bad rep, when people *expect* any amazing VR experiences for €20, batteries not included.

On the other hand, it is predicted that VR will indeed first take-off in the mobile sector....and actual, "real" VR that would deserve this name will for a longer time still stay a niche thing, only LATER become more mainstream.

Prepare that MANY people who never had any exposure to VR previously will judge VR like this, from getting things like a €17 "VR Starter Kit" for their phones....

No duh it's crap, but that's not the point. It's cheap products like these that start the trend. Knockoff products... they don't make them for products that have no appeal. VR is starting to become more ubiquitous so it's a positive sign that knock offs are hitting the market especially at such an early adopter stage. What better way to get it to the people than to start with the kiddos? It will be a part of their vernacular early. You won't have to educate them or waste advertising creating a space for the VR product itself.

 

[Subyman]

Yeah, you'd think it'd be something first party, but everyone raves about VorpX's implementations. It's worth it to me just for a few games on the list.

I've check out some reviews.

"Indie" or small studio is pretty much the driving force right now. They can afford a risky experimentation of mechanics to find out what works and what doesn't. They're also flexible enough. I think in a year or so when the things that work prove themselves, we'll see some larger dev involvement. That's assuming adoption rates stay pretty strong throughout that time as well which is a big if. I really think Gen 2 is going to need to be about cost reduction and not a quantum leap of features in order to keep driving the market. Luckily, the Vive is pretty modular (right down to the HMD's components) and upgrades shouldn't be too painful. As it is, a higher performance HMD could be plug and play into the existing head harness and work with the existing Linkbox, controllers, and lighthouses. It could go even further as it appears the screen/lens modules are very easy to remove and replace.

My issue right now is obsolescence. I've tried VR and know it is something I will like a lot. I'm not in a huge hurry though. I've been waiting patiently since DK1 where I knew it would be an awesome way to experience games and I have no problem waiting longer for the right way to experience VR. I was disappointed to see the screen resolution specs of the consumer units. I don't want my VR headset to be something that I will need to upgrade each year until they hit an acceptable PPI where it no longer matters that much.

As of right now, I fear that I will drop $600-800 and then next year I will be compelled to drop another $600-800 to get what I really wanted. I don't need a proof of concept, I had that. I want something that I don't need to make excuses for and can put on without thinking "what if."

As of right now, I am considering selling the Oculus for $1200 and getting a 34" ultrawide monitor. Then jump back into VR with next year's iteration when the specs and games are there. Still thinking on it though.

Hah, if I could predict accurately when someone would get their Vive, I could make a lot of money off r/Vive. :sneaky:

I'm predicting next week, though still no tracking confirmation. I preordered at 3 mins after the open, but it appears HTC/DRI are loosely following that order, when they do at all.

I should know something about my order on Tuesday. Oculus is having some problems getting things out.

 

[Sabrewings]

As of right now, I fear that I will drop $600-800 and then next year I will be compelled to drop another $600-800 to get what I really wanted. I don't need a proof of concept, I had that. I want something that I don't need to make excuses for and can put on without thinking "what if."

I hear ya and had similar concerns. That's why I'm pleasantly surprised at the Vive's modularity. The HMD itself simply unplugs from the harness and cables. No need for the rest of the kit to change. And the screen/lens modules fairly trivial to replace if an upgraded version was to be available.

But, I don't see it being a yearly thing. I think we'll see two years of these before a Gen 2 comes along which will be more about cost reduction and making them smaller/lighter. Solving the OLED resolution and refresh rate issue in a way that is economical will probably take longer to field.

 

[Kaido]

Engadget: Oculus Rift vs. HTC Vive: What we've learned after the reviews: Which headset is better for you? We break it down.

http://www.engadget.com/2016/04/08/oculus-rift-vs-htc-vive/

 

[Subyman]

Engadget: Oculus Rift vs. HTC Vive: What we've learned after the reviews: Which headset is better for you? We break it down.

http://www.engadget.com/2016/04/08/oculus-rift-vs-htc-vive/

I find it kind of surprising that they both are so incredibly close to each other. No one can really give a definitive win to either when comparing them apples to apples. The Vive obviously lets you do room scale, but that feature is effectively a $200 addition that Oculus will match at some point this year. Looking at just the head set, they are both incredibly close, no clear winner. I'm surprised that HTC was able to pull it off.

After absorbing all the launch week information and videos, I'm starting to lean more toward the Vive. The thing that tips me over the edge is Steam backing. I just hope Steam has a long view on this device instead of what they have previously done in the hardware space.

I'm curious to see Oculus's solution to room scale over the next few months.

 

[HeXen]

Keep in mind that for most of us here, this won't be our first and last purchase. We are the type that always manages to find the cash to upgrade if it's worthy enough. That said, it's not like choosing the Vive or the Rift is getting married to it, either will offer sufficiently similar experiences for the time being, especially once the Touch is released and in a couple of years we'll all likely have plenty of more choices with far better features. Some people on other forums are jumping on sides and attacking the other as if it'll be the only VR device they'll ever own...and maybe it will for those poor minimum wage sad jacks.

That is a good article. After watching hours and hours of footage, I'm going to hold off on VR for a while. I have a Rift coming, but I'll likely pass it on to someone else. The main reason is that there aren't any games I'm interested in at the moment. I can see how room scale can be a compelling experience, but again I haven't seen much that I want to jump into right now.

I can be swayed by a roomscale experience in a game like The Vanishing of Ethan Carter or Fire Watch, but I think it will be awhile before someone nails it enough for me to devote a room to.

The thing that had me wanting to get one right away was backward support for big games, but I'm not seeing devs add support right now.

Did you look into VorpX? I have read and seen a lot of YT reviews of others using it and they say it's very good, works almost as if they were made for VR. So far it has 150 titles and is growing to support more.
Just imagine playing Metro 2033, Fallout 4, Crysis 1,2,3...etc Redux in VR. You can view a list of compatible titles here: http://www.vorpx.com/supported-games/

Although I think all of those are seated only experiences of course, but still head tracking and 3D would make those games shine. It's the top reason I chose the Rift.

 

[ImpulsE69]

It's a tough call really. The problems that seem to be called out are:

1. Rift has a better selection of current games/apps ; but lacks the depth that touch and room scale bring

2. Overall Vive experience is better ; but lackluster lineup revolving mostly around room-scale which just leaves you wanting a fuller experience

This puts it in a dilemma that makes neither one the go forward solution until others start bypassing the Oculus store and API and other devs start making past things compatible.

It is a bit unnerving that people are getting so emotionally invested, but then, that's the way people are. I'm right, your wrong and let me rub it in your face with every little ounce of evidence I can, because reasons.