Question Genoa builders thread.

[vityan666]

I've had some stability problems for 1-2 months, which possibly caused by RAM seating(But memtest always passing, and memory corruption BSOD/SEL entry occuring after a week or two). So after fully reseating all DIMM modules I decided to try BIOS update again(This time to v1.5), but was prepared for it to not work well for me.
I used MicrocodeExtractor tool to check the microcode version in Smicro 1.5 BIOS, featuring AGESA 1.0.0.8, and found that they bundled newer microcode which has Inception vulnerability fix inside(Which, is bundled officially by AMD only in AGESA 1.0.0.9). All well - Updated BMC and BIOS with full reset on both and got code 91 again like in previous time.

I tested all possible settings in BIOS including new options(Used riser cable with PCI-E USB card to not pull/push into the PCI-e clot on the mobo btw each setting test), to no avail. Restored my settings for this board and removed the PCI-e USB card and dropped the GPU in - It worked with this BIOS.
Added secondary PCI-E USB card which worked during previous 1.4 try(For one Boot only), and noticed it had solder points which can touch the Smicro radiator and suspected it was the cause of it not working more than once during previous try. So I slot-switched it with my Raid controller and it works just fine. PERR errors are not happening anymore on boot with this BIOS, while 1.1a got me errors on different slots every boot.
Both USB cards have ASmedia controller with a Via hub(Working one is USB 3.0, problematic is USB 3.1). I've order another one by Startech which features the same newer ASMedia 3.1 controller, but without hub - It used two controllers directly servicing 2 ports each - didn't tested it yet, because stability test was more important.

The system runs well and stable for more than 2 weeks now and this is great. The only downside is that I feel CPU temps got up 5-7 degrees with this BIOS...




One air cooler announced and available for purchase:
EDIT: Sry, this one seems only to match the smaller SP6/sTR5 socket...
Which proofs of rumors that TR Pro 7000 will end up in a SP6 socket instead of SP5...

Arctic Announces the Freezer 4U-M CPU Cooler for Servers​

Another one, this time AIO only announced:

SilverStone Intros XE360-SP5 AIO Liquid CPU Coolers for AMD Socket SP5

SilverStone introduced the XE360-SP5, an all-in-one liquid CPU cooler for AMD Socket SP5, making it fit for servers and workstations based on the EPYC "Genoa" and "Genoa-X" processors, and its upcoming Ryzen Threadripper HEDT processors, assuming AMD sticks to this socket infrastructure. The...

www.techpowerup.com

Some ppl suspect it will not work good top mounted in horizontal position because pump is in the radiator and not on the waterblock. Interesting ...

 

[Markfw]

I've had some stability problems for 1-2 months, which possibly caused by RAM seating(But memtest always passing, and memory corruption BSOD/SEL entry occuring after a week or two). So after fully reseating all DIMM modules I decided to try BIOS update again(This time to v1.5), but was prepared for it to not work well for me.
I used MicrocodeExtractor tool to check the microcode version in Smicro 1.5 BIOS, featuring AGESA 1.0.0.8, and found that they bundled newer microcode which has Inception vulnerability fix inside(Which, is bundled officially by AMD only in AGESA 1.0.0.9). All well - Updated BMC and BIOS with full reset on both and got code 91 again like in previous time.

I tested all possible settings in BIOS including new options(Used riser cable with PCI-E USB card to not pull/push into the PCI-e clot on the mobo btw each setting test), to no avail. Restored my settings for this board and removed the PCI-e USB card and dropped the GPU in - It worked with this BIOS.
Added secondary PCI-E USB card which worked during previous 1.4 try(For one Boot only), and noticed it had solder points which can touch the Smicro radiator and suspected it was the cause of it not working more than once during previous try. So I slot-switched it with my Raid controller and it works just fine. PERR errors are not happening anymore on boot with this BIOS, while 1.1a got me errors on different slots every boot.
Both USB cards have ASmedia controller with a Via hub(Working one is USB 3.0, problematic is USB 3.1). I've order another one by Startech which features the same newer ASMedia 3.1 controller, but without hub - It used two controllers directly servicing 2 ports each - didn't tested it yet, because stability test was more important.

The system runs well and stable for more than 2 weeks now and this is great. The only downside is that I feel CPU temps got up 5-7 degrees with this BIOS...




One air cooler announced and available for purchase:

Arctic Announces the Freezer 4U-M CPU Cooler for Servers​

Another one, this time AIO only announced:

SilverStone Intros XE360-SP5 AIO Liquid CPU Coolers for AMD Socket SP5

SilverStone introduced the XE360-SP5, an all-in-one liquid CPU cooler for AMD Socket SP5, making it fit for servers and workstations based on the EPYC "Genoa" and "Genoa-X" processors, and its upcoming Ryzen Threadripper HEDT processors, assuming AMD sticks to this socket infrastructure. The...

www.techpowerup.com

Some ppl suspect it will not work good top mounted in horizontal position because pump is in the radiator and not on the waterblock. Interesting ...

First, sorry to hear about your stability problems. I have 4 Genoa (3 9554 and a 9654) and all are very stable, NEVER have rebooted, and only down time is when PGE (power grid) was down.

As for the cooler, thanks, but its also in the Zen 4 thread. I may try one for Genoa number 5, but that will be a bit, so it might be Zen 5 server chip.

 

[vityan666]

Markfw
I've just added fixing comment in the original message regarding Antec(Unfortunately), self quoting:

EDIT: Sry, this one seems only to match the smaller SP6/sTR5 socket...
Which proofs of rumors that TR Pro 7000 will end up in a SP6 socket instead of SP5...

 

[Markfw]

Markfw
I've just added fixing comment in the original message regarding Antec(Unfortunately), self quoting:

You said the one air cooler is available for purchase, but I don't see it anywhere. Can you link where I can buy it ? The final specs might also say it works for SP5.

 

[vityan666]

You said the one air cooler is available for purchase, but I don't see it anywhere. Can you link where I can buy it

It was mentioned in the source article:

Availability
The new Freezer 4U-M is available from today in the ARCTIC Webshop, on Amazon as well as on eBay starting at a price of 53,99€ (RRP 64,99€).

Personally I saw it on spanish Amazon, here:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjsnOHf_N-BAxVLcfEDHSd_ApAQFnoECBQQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.amazon.es%2FARCTIC-ACFRE00133A-Freezer-4U-M%2Fdp%2FB09VDM2P92&usg=AOvVaw1S-4ArKBukTyuIHjY5JMvt&opi=89978449

And on official Arctic store here:

Freezer 4U-M | Multikompatibler 4U Single-Tower-CPU-Kühler | ARCTIC

Neu in unserem ARCTIC Store verfügbar | Multikompatibler 4U-M Server Kühler | Singler Tower CPU Kühler | Server Kühler 4U | Server Kühler 4HE | Kostenlose Lieferung in Deutschland | Schnelle Abwicklung und Lieferung |

www.arctic.de

I'm almost sure SP5 is out of question because this cooler is multi-socket and while SP6 is similar in size to LGA 4677 and can be added easily, sp5 is just much larger one and probably will require cooler to be dedicated only to it(Like the second AIO one - But its not available for purchase yet and has its own drawbacks...

 

[Markfw]

It was mentioned in the source article:


Personally I saw it on spanish Amazon, here:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjsnOHf_N-BAxVLcfEDHSd_ApAQFnoECBQQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.amazon.es%2FARCTIC-ACFRE00133A-Freezer-4U-M%2Fdp%2FB09VDM2P92&usg=AOvVaw1S-4ArKBukTyuIHjY5JMvt&opi=89978449

And on official Arctic store here:

Freezer 4U-M | Multikompatibler 4U Single-Tower-CPU-Kühler | ARCTIC

Neu in unserem ARCTIC Store verfügbar | Multikompatibler 4U-M Server Kühler | Singler Tower CPU Kühler | Server Kühler 4U | Server Kühler 4HE | Kostenlose Lieferung in Deutschland | Schnelle Abwicklung und Lieferung |

www.arctic.de

I'm almost sure SP5 is out of question because this cooler is multi-socket and while SP6 is similar in size to LGA 4677 and can be added easily, sp5 is just much larger one and probably will require cooler to be dedicated only to it(Like the second AIO one - But its not available for purchase yet and has its own drawbacks...

And on Amazon, it says TR5. what is that ?

 

[Markfw]

OK, in addition to what is already said, look at this website. It is supposed to support 64 core Bergamo ? That has 12 memory channels ? I call BS on this whole article.

AMD SP6 socket for next-gen Zen4 EPYC series has been pictured, same size as SP3 - VideoCardz.com

AMD SP5 socket has been confirmed It didn’t take long for the rumors about AMD’s next-gen SP6 socket to already find a confirmation through newly leaked photos. Over at AnandTech forums one can find photos and schematics for the socket codenamed SP6. This socket has been explained in leaked...

videocardz.com

And reading further its sourced from this forum from a year ago !

Page 195 - Discussion - Speculation: Zen 4 (EPYC 4 "Genoa", Ryzen 7000, etc.)

Page 195 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

forums.anandtech.com

 

[vityan666]

Markfw
I think sTR5 is the expected name for upcoming TR 7000 Pro socket, which is just SP6 clone for TR.

It is supposed to support 64 core Bergamo ? That has 12 memory channels ? I call BS on this whole article.

Nope, Bergamo is SP5, like our Genoa. SP6(LGA-4844) will house the incoming Epyc Siena(8004) with Zen4c cores and 8ch memory controller.

Like on this mobo:

https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=SIENAD8-2L2T#Specifications

 

[Markfw]

Markfw
I think sTR5 is the expected name for upcoming TR 7000 Pro socket, which is just SP6 clone for TR.


Nope, Bergamo is SP5, like our Genoa. SP6(LGA-4844) will house the incoming Epyc Siena(8004) with Zen4c cores and 8ch memory controller.

Like on this mobo:

https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=SIENAD8-2L2T#Specifications

And they are going to fit 96 cores for threadripper in a socket the size of TR3 ? I don't think so.

 

[Markfw]

OK, starting to see a pattern here. This might make sense. All Genoa 12 channel memory will be SP5, and all 8 channel (only Siena ??) will be socket SP6. Threadripper for the first time will also have 2 variants,, the 7995 and the >64 core variants with socket Sp5 and the 8 channel (64 cores and less ??) will be socket SP6.

Not sure of the dividing line, but unfortunately, it does look like both server and threadripper will have 2 sockets to support them.

So we know... Genoa,Genoa-X and Bergamo will be 12 channel and SP5.
It does look like Siena will be SP6 due to that motherboard.
Threadripper. Here is where its confusing, but 96 core and maybe 64 core with SP5 and 12 channel memory ??
And everything else SP6 and 8 channel memory ???

The next few weeks/months will be interesting.

 

[vityan666]

Markfw

And they are going to fit 96 cores for threadripper in a socket the size of TR3 ? I don't think so.

OK, starting to see a pattern here. This might make sense. All Genoa 12 channel memory will be SP5, and all 8 channel (only Siena ??) will be socket SP6. Threadripper for the first time will also have 2 variants,, the 7995 and the >64 core variants with socket Sp5 and the 8 channel (64 cores and less ??) will be socket SP6.

And everything else SP6 and 8 channel memory ???

Nearly exactly. All SP6 CPUs will have 8 channel memory, but not only this.
Actually first rumors talked about the 96 core TR and mentioned it will use SP6 socket(Not the SP5) - We will know for sure within 2 weeks as official announce is close. Epyc Siena is easy to fit into smaller SP6, because max core count is lower(96 instead of 128), The cores are smaller(ZEN 4c), IOD die is smaller(8 channel mem controller, less PCI-E lines) - which frees a lot of space on the die. TR Pro 7000 will use regular ZEN4 cores, but same smaller IOD die and same cores limit of 96, so its feasible for it to fit into SP6 but be harder to cool down due to higher base/boost frequencies and smaller and tighter area to cool.
I hope rumors to be wrong as well, but Arctic's announce made me even more confident that our great SP5 socket will not get love from cooling solutions mfgs.

 

[mikegrok]

https://www.amd.com/content/dam/amd/en/documents/products/epyc/amd-epyc-8004-series-processors-datasheet.pdf

The SP6 is up to 64 cores, starting at 8 cores for under $450 retail. 96 PCIe lanes, 6 ecc ddr5 channels, each can support 2 dimms.

The IO die is a cut down die from an epyc cpu. The other parts are lower binned. This is where all of the slow components go, or components with a bunch of bad blocks on the IO die.

That being said, it natively supports 16 sata channels (losing 16 PCIe channels), and would make an awesome home lab server.

 

[Markfw]

Well, there is one plus to SP6. It looks like the SP3 coolers will work, and I have like 10 of the Noctua NHU-14 HSF's.

 

[mikegrok]

My Hardware:
Epyc 9124,
92GB ram in 3 sticks
1 118GB optane for windows boot, 1 118GB optane for proxmox boot, and freenas boot, and Virtual Memory partitions so it does not pollute the zfs log.
1 intel d7-p5600 6.4TB u.2 SSD(new, 5 years at 3dwpd),
1 1TB HDD for temporary use (I ordered a 14TB as a backup drive to the intel ssd)
U.2 is currently on a pcie card, but I have ordered a cable for it that will take about 3 weeks to get here.
Monitor: dell 1600x1200 from 15 years ago. it works for what I use it for now, I will probably upgrade to a 4k soon.
GPU:
IPMI has 1280x1024 max res, so I mostly use a GPU.
Nvidia RTX 4070, 2 slot
Nvidia 750ti, 2 slot, installed with monitor so I have more ram available for stable diffusion, I may replace that later.
Motherboard: Supermicro H13SSL-NT

 

[eracerx]

Anyone here try the Silverstone XE04-SP5 cooler?

It looks pretty similar to the Lori Cooler 4U, but definitely a different cooler.

Both rated at 400W, the Lori's weight is stated at 480g, but I just weighed it and it's 845g with fan and shroud and 680g without.
The Silverstone is listed as 922g so I'm assuming that's with the fan. Fewer heatpipes but a perhaps a bit more mass, and I'm assuming higher build quality as well.

$130 is a bit steep if it's going to perform on par with the $50 Lori...

 

[Markfw]

I already have one that looks like that. Not going to spend another $130 to see if its 5% better.

 

[eracerx]

I already have one that looks like that. Not going to spend another $130 to see if its 5% better.

I agree. Given you experience with your current cooler and Genoa, what percentage gain would you expect to see if we're fortunate enough that Noctua releases a cooler for SP5?

 

[mikegrok]

In general if your current cooler is insufficient, your money is better spent on air conditioning, or some sort of outside ventilation as winter (free air conditioner) is coming. If you are close to the max temp in an 85F room, lowering the room air temperature to 68f will do wonders.

And walmart window air conditioners start around $60.

Also increasing room humidity will increase the amount of cooling capacity the existing air in the room has.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Also increasing room humidity will increase the amount of cooling capacity the existing air in the room has.

Careful with that though. Dust+increased humidity can result in mold growth. Lost a 486 mobo that way.

 

[Markfw]

In general if your current cooler is insufficient, your money is better spent on air conditioning, or some sort of outside ventilation as winter (free air conditioner) is coming. If you are close to the max temp in an 85F room, lowering the room air temperature to 68f will do wonders.

And walmart window air conditioners start around $60.

Also increasing room humidity will increase the amount of cooling capacity the existing air in the room has.

I have a 3 ton AC unit in a house that normally requires a 2 ton. The house stayds good, but the CPUs (by the internal sensors (supermicro, BMC I think it is) say they are running 93C. I bet they would run faster with a better HSF. Oh, and this is with all 128 threads/cores loaded to 100%

 

[Markfw]

Using this one its 87

http://www.portvapes.co.uk/?id=Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps&exid=attachments/20230421_131807-jpg.79792/

 

[mikegrok]

Heat pipes can move a fixed amount of heat which is dependent on the surface area of the interior of the heat pipe. They are sized based on the exterior of the heat pipe. A heat pipe can move 30w max. I think that 30w is based on the fluid flow in one direction, so a heat pipe that connects to a hot plate in the middle can move double the heat.

the 9554 is a 400w chip. 400/30 = 13.333, so you need 14 6mm heat pipes minimum.

I am using the dynatron j12 which has 6 double ended heat pipes, giving it a maximum heat transference of 12*30, or 360w. It is rated for 320w, which is probably appropriate. When you go looking at heat sinks, count the pipes, it matters.

the freezer one earlier still has 6 heat pipes and adds a fan. Since your limitation is due to the heat pipe max not the fins, that will not help you. I will post later if I see one that may work.

A water cooler may be helpful as that does not have the hard limit, and is just based on surface area at both ends and a temperature differential.

 

[KaneTW]

I'm planning a 1S workstation build based on likely either the 9384X or 9554. It's going to be my main PC, but primary things are EDA/simulations/CAD/(games).

All the regular form factor boards are pretty uninteresting (no 12ch memory, or not enough PCIe slots, or or or), so it's likely I'll go with GENOA2D24G-2L+ or GENOAD24QM3-2L2T/BCM# with a custom MCIO <> CEM adapter and a NVMe backplane (dunno yet if U.2/U.3 or E3--depends on what pricing my disti will give me for E3 SSDs)

Low noise is a strong requirement, so pretty much every high heat component will be watercooled along with some linear airflow across the board for AICs and passive components)

The main things I'm torn about is 9384X vs 9554 (or just go ham and get the 9654/9684X..?) and whether it will be worth waiting for Threadripper. (I don't super care about USB as I can just get ports via an AIC, and I will have plenty of AICs available).

 

[mikegrok]

check out some of these coolers:

Best Amd Sp5 CPU Cooler Manufacturer | Lori

Looking for AMD SP5 LGA6096 socket ‘Zen 4 Genoa’ Industrial CPU Coolers, Please contact Lori cooler to buy.

www.loricooler.com

For air cooled coolers:

Lori AMD SP5 Active 2U Server Cpu Cooler

Buy Amd Sp5 2u CPU cooler, The SP5 2U Cpu Cooler has been fully tested and validated by Lori to ensure the best quality and cooling performance.

www.loricooler.com

May work better. heat is distributed to the fins 2 ways.
Through 4 heat pipes to the top of the fins, (4*2*30=240w) but more importantly through the plate to the fins directly. That is not limited to the fluid flow resistance inside of the heat pipes, and only heat flow in the (probably copper) heat sink material under the nickel plating. The flow of heat not through heat pipes is directly relational to the temperature delta between the heat source and the air temperature, until you approach the melting temperature of copper, which should not come into play.

 

[Markfw]

check out some of these coolers:

Best Amd Sp5 CPU Cooler Manufacturer | Lori

Looking for AMD SP5 LGA6096 socket ‘Zen 4 Genoa’ Industrial CPU Coolers, Please contact Lori cooler to buy.

www.loricooler.com

For air cooled coolers:

Lori AMD SP5 Active 2U Server Cpu Cooler

Buy Amd Sp5 2u CPU cooler, The SP5 2U Cpu Cooler has been fully tested and validated by Lori to ensure the best quality and cooling performance.

www.loricooler.com

May work better. heat is distributed to the fins 2 ways.
Through 4 heat pipes to the top of the fins, (4*2*30=240w) but more importantly through the plate to the fins directly. That is not limited to the fluid flow resistance inside of the heat pipes, and only heat flow in the (probably copper) heat sink material under the nickel plating. The flow of heat not through heat pipes is directly relational to the temperature delta between the heat source and the air temperature, until you approach the melting temperature of copper, which should not come into play.

I have 2 of the first 2 shown. The first one keeps them at 93. The second keeps them at 87c, but the second one has cheap fan mounting hardware, and I had to hardwire it (literally) to keep it fro making noise on of the the 2 I have. I want a Noctua one !

I have one of the ones in the second link I think, but its a jet engine.