German IT Distributor Publishes AMD+Intel Roadmaps: Z490, Z390, 8-Core CFL in Q4

[eek2121]

Embarrassing stuff from AMD once again. Looks like they don't have much faith with a unique branding. So Intel probably won't continue with Z490 for Icelake.

AMD has had record sales thus far for Ryzen. I wouldn't call that embarrassing unless you are referring to Intel. I'm not a shill for AMD, but realistically, when the best overall chip you can get for under $1000 is a 16 core 32 thread chip from AMD, Intel SHOULD be embarassed; Also, with 10nm STILL having problems and AMD steamrolling in with 7nm Ryzen 3xxx next year...yeah....

 

[LTC8K6]

Hopefully Intel can continue to be very competitive going into 2019.

The last thing we need is for a monopoly to return.

Competition is healthy and necessary.

 

[neblogai]

Hopefully Intel can continue to be very competitive going into 2019.

The last thing we need is for a monopoly to return.

Competition is healthy and necessary.

It would be better if AMD was faster and better choice in CPUs for at least next 5 years. AMD were almost out of money before Ryzen release and crypto madness. They managed to release Ryzen, but to achieve that- general RnD numbers had dropped, starving the GPU branch. To have competition in the market- it would be better if AMD were in the lead now, making money, getting rid of their debts and grow some fat- only then they'd have a more realistic chance to continually create products to compete vs rich, entrenched giants like Intel and nVidia.

 

[LTC8K6]

It would be better if AMD was faster and better choice in CPUs for at least next 5 years. AMD were almost out of money before Ryzen release and crypto madness. They managed to release Ryzen, but to achieve that- general RnD numbers had dropped, starving the GPU branch. To have competition in the market- it would be better if AMD were in the lead now, making money, getting rid of their debts and grow some fat- only then they'd have a more realistic chance to continually create products to compete vs rich, entrenched giants like Intel and nVidia.

Intel didn't influence the graphics card arena, and Intel didn't cause Bulldozer. Intel has actually been quite lazy in the CPU arena, and AMD basically did nothing about that for a long time.

Intel certainly was not "stepping on the gas" during their CPU lead time.

 

[jpiniero]

https://videocardz.com/76205/intel-makes-z390-chipset-official

Probably a mistake, but Intel made a product brief available for z390.

 

[mikk]

AMD has had record sales thus far for Ryzen. I wouldn't call that embarrassing unless you are referring to Intel. I'm not a shill for AMD, but realistically, when the best overall chip you can get for under $1000 is a 16 core 32 thread chip from AMD, Intel SHOULD be embarassed; Also, with 10nm STILL having problems and AMD steamrolling in with 7nm Ryzen 3xxx next year...yeah....

I'm talking about their notorious naming scheme stealing which is embarrassing unless you are fine with this confusing naming share between two incompatible platforms. It is ridiculous from AMD.

 

[A///]

Only 6 SATA ports? ;-(

 

[frozentundra123456]

Hopefully Intel can continue to be very competitive going into 2019.

The last thing we need is for a monopoly to return.

Competition is healthy and necessary.

I agree. Although I think they will remain competitive, and probably retain the single thread lead. And they have made much more progress in mobile than on the desktop, which has slipped under the radar on these forums. They now have quad core 15W and six core 45W chips that turbo over 4ghz. But yea, seems like the calls for competition for a lot of posters in this forum have disappeared. Pretty much as I thought all along, they dont really want competition, they want their favorite team to be ahead.

 

[LTC8K6]

https://videocardz.com/76205/intel-makes-z390-chipset-official

Probably a mistake, but Intel made a product brief available for z390.

No mention of 9th gen cpu support such as the supposed 9700K 8 core chip and the whole supposed 9000 line.

https://en.wikichip.org/wiki/intel/cores/coffee_lake_r#Coffee_Lake_R_Processors

 

[jpiniero]

No mention of 9th gen cpu support such as the supposed 9700K 8 core chip and the whole supposed 9000 line.

https://en.wikichip.org/wiki/intel/cores/coffee_lake_r#Coffee_Lake_R_Processors

I suppose it's possible that z390 is coming without any new processors to go with it.

 

[LTC8K6]

I suppose it's possible that z390 is coming without any new processors to go with it.

I would guess that the 8 core chip and the refreshed lineup will just not be labeled as the 9000 series. Probably 8800K for the 8 core.

 

[formulav8]

Intel Z390 gets Wireless-AC and USB 3.1 Gen2

After looking at the diagrams we can only see one main difference between Z390 and Z370 chipsets, the onboard Wireless-AC 802.11ac and Bluetooth 5. There are no changes to the number of PCIe lanes or memory support. There is, however, a change to USB 3.1 support. The Z390 supports Gen2 while Z370 only Gen1.

Throughout the marketing materials, Intel seems to underline the fact that Z390 is designed for unlocked processors (for overclocking). Sadly, there is no word about support for 8-core processors.

Intel:

The Intel® Z390 chipset and 8th Generation Intel® Core™ processors give you the edge you need to successfully defeat your rivals. Quickly upload and access your favorite streams and get the gaming boost you need with Intel® Turbo Boost Technology 2.0 and Intel® Hyper-Threading Technology (Intel® HT Technology)…

The appearance of Z390 on Intel website could further confirm that the launch is close, maybe even sooner than we thought. It might be worth watching Intel’s CEO keynote at Computex.

 

[eek2121]

I'm talking about their notorious naming scheme stealing which is embarrassing unless you are fine with this confusing naming share between two incompatible platforms. It is ridiculous from AMD.

There is nothing confusing about it. There is no z490 on the Intel side. Also, the "z" thing might be a mistake anyway. It could also be x490.

 

[StinkyPinky]

I would guess that the 8 core chip and the refreshed lineup will just not be labeled as the 9000 series. Probably 8800K for the 8 core.

That will just be confusing though. You'd have a 8 series cpu that is not even compatible with the z370 motherboard. That will catch a lot of people out (not that intel seems to care)

At least branding it a 9 series cpu will (somewhat) avoid that.

 

[Jan Olšan]

Pretty much as I thought all along, they dont really want competition, they want their favorite team to be ahead.

I think you misread the situation. The problem is that the current meager level of AMD success doesn't nearly ensure that healthy competition at all, not to mention ensuring it stays here in long term, with all those desirable effects that brings.

Look at the market: after year of riding Ryzen's improved competitiveness and mindshare, AMD has hardly any OEM sales, and their overall *DESKTOP* share (not to mention mobile/servers) has moved from 10 to paltry 12 %. And they had to cut prices on all the CPUs by 20-33% to achieve that. They are still just barely profitable (and that profit is tiny, not nearly enough to make any significant investments or debt reductions). And that is also thanks to the otherwise terrible crypto bubble (that better died swiftly...). Intel still eats all the profits and has 10x the revenue and what, 50x the profits? You only need to look at Intel being able to merrily sell its HEDT CPU for $2000 (2x more than two generations prior) even though there's Threadripper, which needs to be discounted heavily to keep selling, to see that the starting positions in the fight are still way too far from being equal.

As one of the other poster wrote above, AMD needs to get much stronger if the competition in the CPU market is to be ensured long-term. Guessing wildly, I'd say it needs at least double the revenue it will have in 2018 (6.5-7.0 billion), at least double the RD budget (800 millions/quarter, while it was ~400 in 2017), and then it needs to be bringing in about 1.5+ billions of yearly net profit and keep improving there, to keep the investors happy and the management from having to cut RD. They need to pay their debt on top of that. And they need to be able to field a new chip design every year instead of bi-annually (pinnacle ridge is the same design as summit ridge), if they are to be able to compete with Intel once it fixes its 10nm manufacturing. They also need to be able to design and pay mask costs for more chip variants, so that they can cover lowend/budget market under $100 - they are unable to do that now, you can clearly see how they are so cash strapped that they just can't afford to design chips for essential market segment. If not for anything else, this on its own tells you they are not in competitive enough position, because their size just doesn't allow them to field all the chip categories that the market needs. Result: some segments see no competition and the overall ability to keep Intel in check suffers.

So I am afraid that we really need Intel do tank for 2-3 more years so that AMD's position and healthy improves enough to make it really dangerous. Because now, it is not, it is still highly endangered instead. And that is without mentioning that it needs money and ability to press/market itself into big OEM and retail sales in the GPU segment too.

Even if Intel struggled for idunno, 5 years?, its position would hardly be endangered, you have to realize that. They wouldn't even lose that much of marketshare thanks to all those OEM deals and sheer economic strength. I'm not even convinces those 5 years of AMD lead would ensure the "long-term sustained competition" goal.

 

[LTC8K6]

That will just be confusing though. You'd have a 8 series cpu that is not even compatible with the z370 motherboard. That will catch a lot of people out (not that intel seems to care)

At least branding it a 9 series cpu will (somewhat) avoid that.

So far the Z390 and Z370 appear to be basically the same except for adding native USB 3.1 gen 2 and ac wifi, and the Z390 was described as being for 8th gen processors.
So either that chipset info is wrong/incomplete, or there are no new chips coming out with Z390, or the 8 core chip is 8th gen.

It could certainly be that Z390 supports 8th gen and 9th gen chips, but that is unlike Intel to do.

 

[ZGR]

I don't want either company to tank . Intel has had such a commanding lead for so long, that losing even a small portion of market share is a big deal for them.

 

[moinmoin]

And they need to be able to field a new chip design every year instead of bi-annually (pinnacle ridge is the same design as summit ridge), if they are to be able to compete with Intel once it fixes its 10nm manufacturing. They also need to be able to design and pay mask costs for more chip variants, so that they can cover lowend/budget market under $100 - they are unable to do that now, you can clearly see how they are so cash strapped that they just can't afford to design chips for essential market segment.

Since chips have a lead time of 3-5 years what you see currently is the output AMD managed during their lowest times. Their offerings are bound to diversify since, even though their numbers are paltry to their competition, relative to their own past years the market improvement already is huge.

 

[JoeRambo]

Since chips have a lead time of 3-5 years what you see currently is the output AMD managed during their lowest times. Their offerings are bound to diversify since, even though their numbers are paltry to their competition, relative to their own past years the market improvement already is huge.

I would not bet the farm on AMD tho. You can't really apply common sense to this company. I speak as veteran who has seen/used Athlon64/Opterons at home and server rooms. AMD already had windfall of resources during those days, but they were squandered (understatement).
It is perfect storm for Intel due to epic 10nm problems and what is probably one of the worst CEOs in industry, but they have massive resources to push through. It will take a new core design and probably 7nm with EUV for them to shine, but honestly their current products with proper pricing are just fine. Heck, even reduced margins work in their favor as shareholders will remove BK sooner, improving long term outlook.

 

[ehume]

[QUOTE="Jan Olšan, post: 39424468, member: 377204" . . . Even if Intel struggled for idunno, 5 years?, its position would hardly be endangered, you have to realize that. They wouldn't even lose that much of marketshare thanks to all those OEM deals and sheer economic strength. I'm not even convinces those 5 years of AMD lead would ensure the "long-term sustained competition" goal.[/QUOTE]
Concur, and you didn't even mention "contra revenue."

 

[Dayman1225]

Say Hello to what appears to be the 8-Core Coffee Lake being tested on the Kaby Lake Platform (Z370?) on Sisoftware

Genuine Intel(R) CPU 0000 @ 2.60GHz (8C 16T 2.59GHz, 8x 256kB L2, 16MB L3)

 

[LTC8K6]

Say Hello to what appears to be the 8-Core Coffee Lake being tested on the Kaby Lake Platform (Z370?) on Sisoftware

Genuine Intel(R) CPU 0000 @ 2.60GHz (8C 16T 2.59GHz, 8x 256kB L2, 16MB L3)

The vapor begins to coalesce...

 

[coercitiv]

The vapor begins to coalesce...

It better coalesce around Z370, since my original bet was to buy 8700 as a stopgap towards 8C, and use the locked CPU as the new HTPC chip.

 

[StinkyPinky]

Say Hello to what appears to be the 8-Core Coffee Lake being tested on the Kaby Lake Platform (Z370?) on Sisoftware

Genuine Intel(R) CPU 0000 @ 2.60GHz (8C 16T 2.59GHz, 8x 256kB L2, 16MB L3)

I hope that is the Z370 platform. It may just be a bug though as the software won't be able to detect a z390.

 

[Dayman1225]

I hope that is the Z370 platform. It may just be a bug though as the software won't be able to detect a z390.

It should be able to detect Z390 platform just fine as CNL/CFL platform because it uses the same chipset as H370, B360, H310, etc