GM CEO wants gas tax to go up $1/gal (WTH?)

[ElFenix]

Having a AWD SUV makes life easier, especially when dealing with the elements.

while awd should help with that, an SUV is also going to have a lot less feedback coming from the steering wheel and a lot less feeling through the suspension. not a wrx by and stretch.

 

[LegendKiller]

Having a AWD SUV makes life easier, especially when dealing with the elements.

For the added weight and decreased mileage, the chances you'd actually need any marginal improvement doesn't offset the costs. This is what's wrong with America, no ability to weigh risks vs costs to mitigate the risks. If only more people understood statistics and were able to understand stuff like Freakonomics better, we'd waste a whole lot less money on such foolishness.

 

[drinkmorejava]

This is what's wrong with America, no ability to weigh risks vs costs to mitigate the risks. If only more people understood statistics and were able to understand stuff like Freakonomics better, we'd waste a whole lot less money on such foolishness.

This is what's wrong with Europe, no ability to allow others to weigh risks vs costs to mitigate the risks. If only more people understood that it's none of their damn business and were able to understand stuff like Freakonomics better, we'd waste a whole lot less money telling other people what to do.

 

[freegeeks]

This is what's wrong with Europe, no ability to allow others to weigh risks vs costs to mitigate the risks. If only more people understood that it's none of their damn business and were able to understand stuff like Freakonomics better, we'd waste a whole lot less money telling other people what to do.

Legenkiller is American, I don't understand why you post this Europe drivel

 

[drinkmorejava]

Legenkiller is American, I don't understand why you post this Europe drivel

My bad, it was inappropriate for me to assume such a thing. LegendKiller, please accept my apology. I in no way intended to associate you with a group that you are not connected with. I hope that we can put this misunderstanding behind us and work to improve our communication in the future.

 

[Capt Caveman]

while awd should help with that, an SUV is also going to have a lot less feedback coming from the steering wheel and a lot less feeling through the suspension. not a wrx by and stretch.

Plus ground clearance. I lost count of the number of times, I was able to pull out of my parking space on the street without even shoveling out while folks in their Honda Fits/etc spent a hour to dig out then needing people to help push them out after a plow truck had come by.

For the added weight and decreased mileage, the chances you'd actually need any marginal improvement doesn't offset the costs. This is what's wrong with America, no ability to weigh risks vs costs to mitigate the risks. If only more people understood statistics and were able to understand stuff like Freakonomics better, we'd waste a whole lot less money on such foolishness.

This makes no friggin sense. As long as I have stuff to haul and live in the North East, I'll have an AWD SUV. Crap there are people driving sedans that cost more money and cost more to maintain than my SUV. Oh noes!!!!

And if it makes you feel better, I purchased a new one just a few weeks ago...

 

[epidemis]

Heres to hoping that this CEO dies from an electrical malfunction in one of his company cars.

I hope you die of cancer from benzen inhalation! Oh wait, it's just passerby's who do!

 

[LegendKiller]

This makes no friggin sense. As long as I have stuff to haul and live in the North East, I'll have an AWD SUV. Crap there are people driving sedans that cost more money and cost more to maintain than my SUV. Oh noes!!!!

And if it makes you feel better, I purchased a new one just a few weeks ago...

There's not a single reason why you need an SUV if you have 1-2 kids and don't haul. The weather, at least in the tri-state area doesn't warrant it. I laugh my ass off at people who think the worst weather here requires AWD or 4WD. What a joke.

Look up Tragedy of the Commons.

 

[Analog]

You are going to find a lot of people who can't plan and prepare for a $3,000 bill every time they register their cars - heaven forbid they have a couple of vehicles in their name

Exactly my point. They would have to unload them for more fuel efficient vehicles.

 

[Capt Caveman]

There's not a single reason why you need an SUV if you have 1-2 kids and don't haul. The weather, at least in the tri-state area doesn't warrant it. I laugh my ass off at people who think the worst weather here requires AWD or 4WD. What a joke.

Look up Tragedy of the Commons.

Sure. Ask the people that live up in Buffalo. In an emergency, I'd rather not have to wait til they plow the streets.

 

[spidey07]

There's not a single reason why you need an SUV if you have 1-2 kids and don't haul. The weather, at least in the tri-state area doesn't warrant it. I laugh my ass off at people who think the worst weather here requires AWD or 4WD. What a joke.

Look up Tragedy of the Commons.

There have been TONS of times where I didn't have enough space in my sedan. Can't take home TVs, large storage runs, car camping, can't tow shit, etc.

Loving my SUV, will never go back. And who are you to determine my "need"?

when a big snow storm hits here, guess who are the volunteers to get key medical and other personnel to their jobs? That's right, private SUV and 4x4 owners.

 

[LegendKiller]

Sure. Ask the people that live up in Buffalo. In an emergency, I'd rather not have to wait til they plow the streets.

Tell that to the guy in Miami or the one in Phoenix or the one in NYC or the one in Greenwich. We could play this game all day. I know plenty of people in Buffalo that don't drive SUVs and manage to live just fine. In fact, I think people in Buffalo somehow managed to live in Buffalo for a long time prior to SUVs. Imagine that. Quit creating a false dilemma.

 

[LegendKiller]

There have been TONS of times where I didn't have enough space in my sedan. Can't take home TVs, large storage runs, car camping, can't tow shit, etc.

Loving my SUV, will never go back. And who are you to determine my "need"?

when a big snow storm hits here, guess who are the volunteers to get key medical and other personnel to their jobs? That's right, private SUV and 4x4 owners.

And who are you to determine society's ability to support your "need". Ohh wait, you're the guy whose wife is an overpaid government bureaucrat while you bash unions, state employees, and want smaller government. Just like most Repuglicans, you can only think of yourself.

Yes, those huge snowstorms in KY. Geez, how are you possibly going to survive? I drove through "huge snowstorms" in a Toyota Tercel and didn't have problems. Stop being a little bitch.

 

[Capt Caveman]

Tell that to the guy in Miami or the one in Phoenix or the one in NYC or the one in Greenwich. We could play this game all day. I know plenty of people in Buffalo that don't drive SUVs and manage to live just fine. In fact, I think people in Buffalo somehow managed to live in Buffalo for a long time prior to SUVs. Imagine that. Quit creating a false dilemma.

You're the one creating a false dilemma. You don't like that others have a different opinion. Folks like SUVs for the higher clearance and visibility. Others for the space, safety, convenience. Going back to my original, it helps make life easier. Imagine that.

 

[LegendKiller]

You're the one creating a false dilemma. You don't like that others have a different opinion. Folks like SUVs for the higher clearance and visibility. Others for the space, safety, convenience. Going back to my original, it helps make life easier. Imagine that.

Higher clearance and visibility? ROFL. What did people do for the 70 years before the predominance of SUVs? Life was so much more difficult with those low clearance and visibility vehicles.

Again, tragedy of the commons. We'll use up every resource this country has for the most moronic things just because we think it's "easier" or more "convenient". In fact, we're just exporting wealth to the ME (partially funding terrorists which we export more wealth to the ME to fight), instead of using it efficiently to invest in the US. All so we can drive around in vehicles that provide no practical value the majority of the time. Meanwhile, people will bemoan our inability to innovate or be competitive or be driven into debt. The debt is partially caused by or current account deficit, which is funded partially be our importing of oil, reducing our net wealth. Thus, we just drive ourselves deeper in debt for the "convenience" of an SUV, when, in fact, a regular sedan or even a minivan would get much better MPG.

Meanwhile, we don't demand higher MPG cars like Europe, such as hybrid turbo diesels, because the car manufacturers make more money on soaking us for our stupidity. We fail to innovate even more and export more wealth for such foolishness.

But yet, fools like you, clap at this self-destructive behavior, saying that it's your "right" to be stupid. Sure, it is, but your stupidity is dragging this country down.

It's just like spidey bitching about "big government", yet bragging how his wife, who works for big government, makes so much money. Self serving assholes.

 

[drinkmorejava]

LegendKiller, does your accord have an unnecessary features? Wouldn't an Echo/Yaris be more resource efficient? Also, do you have any hobbies that require any physical hardware. If so, is any of it beyond the bare minimum in quality/quantity/size/expense/feature than necessary to complete said hobby. I hope you have such any item, otherwise it may be rather hard to convince you that there's more to life than just subsisting. Material goods won't bring one happiness, but they certainly enable it, and if a car brings someone happiness, you need a better reason than "it's wasteful," because almost everything people purchase beyond rice and beans meets that definition. Is there a wastefulness threshold that something must meet for it to be wrong, or is any level of waste unacceptable? Are your hobbies also a poor allocation of time? Couldn't the food that keeps you alive so you can expend time on things you enjoy be better spent on someone producing something?

 

[Squisher]

Higher clearance and visibility? ROFL. What did people do for the 70 years before the predominance of SUVs? Life was so much more difficult with those low clearance and visibility vehicles.

Again, tragedy of the commons. We'll use up every resource this country has for the most moronic things just because we think it's "easier" or more "convenient". In fact, we're just exporting wealth to the ME (partially funding terrorists which we export more wealth to the ME to fight), instead of using it efficiently to invest in the US. All so we can drive around in vehicles that provide no practical value the majority of the time. Meanwhile, people will bemoan our inability to innovate or be competitive or be driven into debt. The debt is partially caused by or current account deficit, which is funded partially be our importing of oil, reducing our net wealth. Thus, we just drive ourselves deeper in debt for the "convenience" of an SUV, when, in fact, a regular sedan or even a minivan would get much better MPG.

Meanwhile, we don't demand higher MPG cars like Europe, such as hybrid turbo diesels, because the car manufacturers make more money on soaking us for our stupidity. We fail to innovate even more and export more wealth for such foolishness.

But yet, fools like you, clap at this self-destructive behavior, saying that it's your "right" to be stupid. Sure, it is, but your stupidity is dragging this country down.

It's just like spidey bitching about "big government", yet bragging how his wife, who works for big government, makes so much money. Self serving assholes.

Are You Amish? Because people did without cell phones, computers, and calculators 70 years ago just fine too. However, a full frame SUV with its height can make winter driving easier especially to those in more rural areas. Not everyone is in the middle of a city that gets plowed regularly. Yeah, I've driven rear wheel drive vehicles in the winter. I prefer front wheel drive to that. Now, that I have a 4x4 pickup I can say that it out preforms any other vehicle I've driven in the winter. Do I need it? Well, no, but I prefer it. If I drove it more than a few thousand miles a year I'd probably do without it and go for something more fuel efficient, but it suits my needs.

 

[Capt Caveman]

Higher clearance and visibility? ROFL. What did people do for the 70 years before the predominance of SUVs? Life was so much more difficult with those low clearance and visibility vehicles.

Again, tragedy of the commons. We'll use up every resource this country has for the most moronic things just because we think it's "easier" or more "convenient". In fact, we're just exporting wealth to the ME (partially funding terrorists which we export more wealth to the ME to fight), instead of using it efficiently to invest in the US. All so we can drive around in vehicles that provide no practical value the majority of the time. Meanwhile, people will bemoan our inability to innovate or be competitive or be driven into debt. The debt is partially caused by or current account deficit, which is funded partially be our importing of oil, reducing our net wealth. Thus, we just drive ourselves deeper in debt for the "convenience" of an SUV, when, in fact, a regular sedan or even a minivan would get much better MPG.

Meanwhile, we don't demand higher MPG cars like Europe, such as hybrid turbo diesels, because the car manufacturers make more money on soaking us for our stupidity. We fail to innovate even more and export more wealth for such foolishness.

But yet, fools like you, clap at this self-destructive behavior, saying that it's your "right" to be stupid. Sure, it is, but your stupidity is dragging this country down.

It's just like spidey bitching about "big government", yet bragging how his wife, who works for big government, makes so much money. Self serving assholes.

LOL. Yes, I've owned a sedan before but guess what, I prefer the advantages that a SUV provides. A SUV that sells better in Europe than in the US and gets the same or better MPG than any of the current minivans. ROFL! If you want to debate, at least do your research.

Wait, so you only buy American made and don't own any luxury items even though you're some NYC banker? You don't own a HDTV right? B/c life was so difficult watching a SDTV. Oh wait....

 

[LegendKiller]

Are You Amish? Because people did without cell phones, computers, and calculators 70 years ago just fine too. However, a full frame SUV with its height can make winter driving easier especially to those in more rural areas. Not everyone is in the middle of a city that gets plowed regularly. Yeah, I've driven rear wheel drive vehicles in the winter. I prefer front wheel drive to that. Now, that I have a 4x4 pickup I can say that it out preforms any other vehicle I've driven in the winter. Do I need it? Well, no, but I prefer it. If I drove it more than a few thousand miles a year I'd probably do without it and go for something more fuel efficient, but it suits my needs.

Again, don't preach to me about height in rural areas. I grew up on a dirt road in rural MN and drove non-SUV vehicles the majority of the time. MNDOT studies show that SUVs are really no saver in winter and are, overall, actually worse. That's because they are heavier and slow at a slower pace and flip easier since they are higher.

Even then, how much do you really need it? Heavy snow winter is ~5mo in MN, of that, the roads are probably bad about 30 days total. That means that about 90% of the time you get no practical benefit from AWD/4x4. Even then, the practical benefit of the SUV isn't 10%, since most of that time a car will work perfectly. Let's say you get 3 days where the roads are unpassable via car and your SUV saves the day. That means that less than 1% of the time, per year, you'll get some sort of benefit.

Does an SUV cost more than 1% than a sedan? Absolutely, considering 99% of the time you're being charged 50% more in gas costs.

Silly, utterly silly. The inability to rationalize one's purchases causes a huge amount of waste. If the US reduced our oil consumption by even 10%, that'd save over $40bn per year. 50% would save the US economy ~200bn, that's just in today's prices, just with direct costs. Naturally, as US oil usage went down, prices would go down (supply/demand), so the overall we could probably save ~250bn. Just by one simple change.

That's why I wouldn't be bothered by a $1/gal tax. In fact, it would gain my emphatic support if it went into a trust to fund alt. energy projects mandated by a non-partisan appointed body of scientists and engineers that had eminent domain to built alt energy plants.

But I'm just a European socialist anyway.

 

[LegendKiller]

LOL. Yes, I've owned a sedan before but guess what, I prefer the advantages that a SUV provides. A SUV that sells better in Europe than in the US and gets the same or better MPG than any of the current minivans. ROFL! If you want to debate, at least do your research.

Wait, so you only buy American made and don't own any luxury items even though you're some NYC banker? You don't own a HDTV right? B/c life was so difficult watching a SDTV. Oh wait....

Which SUV has better mpg than a minivan? I can cherrypick models too, but, overall, they don't.

 

[drinkmorejava]

eminent domain

Enough said, we get it now. There are no individuals or rights. The community is above reproach. All actions must benefit the commune or else!

We've been asking you where you stand on other issues of waste or excess, but you will only talk about SUVs. Is this because you're being a hypocrite, or are SUVs the root of all of our problems?

 

[LegendKiller]

Enough said, we get it now. There are no individuals or rights. The community is above reproach. All actions must benefit the commune or else!

We've been asking you where you stand on other issues of waste or excess, but you will only talk about SUVs. Is this because you're being a hypocrite, or are SUVs the root of all of our problems?

Hardly, just trying to break through the ridiculous impasses we have had with projects such as the windfarm off of Martha's Vineyard or the solar projects in CA in the middle of the desert that people hate because it was a turtle nesting place 100 years ago. As far as personal property rights, as long as you are compensated for your property, what's the issue?

Which other issues on waste? We're talking about gas taxes, aren't we?

 

[spidey07]

My bad, it was inappropriate for me to assume such a thing. LegendKiller, please accept my apology. I in no way intended to associate you with a group that you are not connected with. I hope that we can put this misunderstanding behind us and work to improve our communication in the future.

Don't apologize to him. You pegged and owned him proper. See his posts below yours to see further proof.

 

[LegendKiller]

Don't apologize to him. You pegged and owned him proper. See his posts below yours to see further proof.

Go away socialist.

 

[SparkyJJO]

I'm a single guy and I drive an SUV. No, a car won't cut it.

I haul stuff. I can't fit nearly the same amount of equipment in a car as I can in my SUV.

Do I haul stuff every day? No. But here's the catch - I can NOT afford to have two cars. So I have one vehicle. Which is the evil SUV.

So don't anyone go telling me what I do or do not "need" as you have no idea. Neither should I go telling you what you do or do not "need." Plus, it doesn't always come down to what you "need" but also what you personally want. Does it really matter that much to you what I or another person drives? How does it negatively impact my neighbor that I'm driving an SUV? Hint: It doesn't. Nor does it affect you.

There are many vehicles out there that I personally dislike, but that doesn't mean I want people to stop driving them because of it. I hate smart cars, they are some of the stupidest vehicles out there, but that doesn't mean they should no longer be made or driven because I dislike them.

By the way, this past winter was 10x easier to deal with in my 4x4 SUV than my old car. Could I deal with it in my old car? Yes. Nothing wrong with having something that made it easier however!

Oh, and as far as the GM CEO goes, he's an idiot. And I'm a GM guy saying this. He needs to get out of there.