GM Crying Over Better MPG Standards

[piasabird]

http://money.cnn.com/2006/12/26/news/companies/gm_fuel.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes

GM is running scared over a proposed reduction in fuel MPG standards.

 

[EagleKeeper]

"For one thing, it puts us, the domestic manufacturers, at odds with the desires of most of our customers, namely larger vehicles,"

Then why are sales of the larger vehicles/SUVs dropping?

If they can boast that they can increase the MPG every year; then apply some more technology to it.
It may cause some retooling, but the ability to increase the MPG does exists.

It is the price/profit that worries GM & Ford - that will dictate the market share.

 

[BlancoNino]

"Despite what the alarmists may think, we don't have any magic 100-mpg carburetor that we're holding back because we're in bed with the oil companies."

LOL

I looked up the Toyota Tundra and saw that the biggeset V8 available was a

4.7L V8
271HP @ 5400RPM
313 lb-ft of torque @ 3400RPM

GMC/Chevy

Well, lets just say they have a much wider range of engine options from a 4.8, 5.3, 6.0, etc...and the bigger engines make more torque and horsepower and they make it a lot lower.

I know for a fact that there is no way in hell my dad could do his job with the Tundra especially when he has to tow a trailor.

This is only going to hurt consumers if they are not going to be able to purchase these full-size pickups.

 

[catnap1972]

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper

"For one thing, it puts us, the domestic manufacturers, at odds with the desires of most of our customers, namely larger vehicles,"

Then why are sales of the larger vehicles/SUVs dropping?

If they can boast that they can increase the MPG every year; then apply some more technology to it.
It may cause some retooling, but the ability to increase the MPG does exists.

It is the price/profit that worries GM & Ford - that will dictate the market share.

Of course--they were nice and comfy sitting on their asses popping those belcher SUVs out like candy (and pocketing $10K+ profits on each), but now they're whining when they got caught with their pants pulled down.

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: catnap1972

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper

"For one thing, it puts us, the domestic manufacturers, at odds with the desires of most of our customers, namely larger vehicles,"

Then why are sales of the larger vehicles/SUVs dropping?

If they can boast that they can increase the MPG every year; then apply some more technology to it.
It may cause some retooling, but the ability to increase the MPG does exists.

It is the price/profit that worries GM & Ford - that will dictate the market share.

Of course--they were nice and comfy sitting on their asses popping those belcher SUVs out like candy (and pocketing $10K+ profits on each), but now they're whining when they got caught with their pants pulled down.

Until you realize the new tundra is going to sport an optional 5.7L V* this year. Trucks comes with big engines for a reason.

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper

"For one thing, it puts us, the domestic manufacturers, at odds with the desires of most of our customers, namely larger vehicles,"

Which is why a truly socially responsible company would realize that there are greater issues than the momentary self-indulgent whims of the market they created for their gas guzzlers.

GM has been slow to understand the market for decades. Hell! It took them forever to recognize the value of the double reading key that can be inserted with either side up. It doesn't take anymore tumblers. They just have to make the key symmetrical and change the cross section of the key insert to receive the new shape.

I know that's a relatively petty issue, but it's typical of their slow reaction time when good examples of better product designs and features are sitting right under their noses.

The bottom line is, there are serious societal reasons well beyond the immediate bottom line of self indulgence for a company to take a leadership role in directing vehichle design where it needs to go.

 

[dullard]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
This is only going to hurt consumers if they are not going to be able to purchase these full-size pickups.

Where has anyone ever said you won't be able to purchase what you want to purchase? The standards simply impose a fee if MPG is too low. If US customers want low MPG vehicles, they will get low MPG vehicles with a small added fee. Big whopping deal. He can still do his job just fine. And he can do it while breathing cleaner air and living a higher quality (and possibly quantity) life.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: dullard

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
This is only going to hurt consumers if they are not going to be able to purchase these full-size pickups.

Where has anyone ever said you won't be able to purchase what you want to purchase? The standards simply impose a fee if MPG is too low. If US customers want low MPG vehicles, they will get low MPG vehicles with a small added fee. Big whopping deal. He can still do his job just fine. And he can do it while breathing cleaner air and living a higher quality (and possibly quantity) life.

So consumers having to already spend extra money (which means more taxes too) on more fuel, have to pay even more?

Sorry, but if the price of gas isn't high enough to kick in the demand for full-size pickups that get better MPG, there is no sense in forcing the issue.

 

[redgtxdi]

This is true natural selection............


My message to GM would go something like this......


"You dumbasses had DECADES to get things right and you couldn't. You have been given more chance than EVARRR in the last decade and you STILL sat their with your thumbs up your A$$ES...................now it's do or die time!! You flippin' get it done...........or go the way of the dinosaur!!!!!! :music:This is our country??:music: Well, our country didn't get where we are by sitting around whining about what we COULDN'T do! Get your act together or cease to exist!!!!"

:|:roll::thumbsdown:

 

[BlancoNino]

Redgtxdi, GM is hardly going down the tubes. They still sell more vehicles than any other company on the planet.

 

[bctbct]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper

"For one thing, it puts us, the domestic manufacturers, at odds with the desires of most of our customers, namely larger vehicles,"

Which is why a truly socially responsible company would realize that there are greater issues than the momentary self-indulgent whims of the market they created for their gas guzzlers.

GM has been slow to understand the market for decades. Hell! It took them forever to recognize the value of the double reading key that can be inserted with either side up. It doesn't take anymore tumblers. They just have to make the key symmetrical and change the cross section of the key insert to receive the new shape.

I know that's a relatively petty issue, but it's typical of their slow reaction time when good examples of better product designs and features are sitting right under their noses.

The bottom line is, there are serious societal reasons well beyond the immediate bottom line of self indulgence for a company to take a leadership role in directing vehichle design where it needs to go.

socially responsible? wheres that come from. GM is a business that makes cars, their job is to produce what they can sell. Buyers make that decision. If you want a tax or pealty imposed on certain vehicles because of fuel economy...do that at the pump.

WAIT! We do do that at the pump...tax per gallon

BTW foreign car makers fuel ecomy is not better on bigger cars with bigger engines.

 

[redgtxdi]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
Redgtxdi, GM is hardly going down the tubes. They still sell more vehicles than any other company on the planet.

Not for long........T

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: bctbct
BTW foreign car makers fuel ecomy is not better on bigger cars with bigger engines.

Very true. If Toyota starts building a truck that gets the exact same gas mileage as a GMC Sierra, will there be a consumer fee on that?

 

[redgtxdi]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: bctbct
BTW foreign car makers fuel ecomy is not better on bigger cars with bigger engines.

Very true. If Toyota starts building a truck that gets the exact same gas mileage as a GMC Sierra, will their be a consumer fee on that?

Probably not. I think it's pretty evident that even our own government likes foreign cars better than our own........(aside from those bitchin' lookin' Suburbans in the presidential caravan)

However, if both automakers were put to the test to create a 1-ton truck that gets the best mpg it can, given a specific criteria on weight, mass, size, engine size, etc... etc............I'd put all of my money on Toyota and probably borrow a little more to bet ta' boot!!!! :thumbsup:

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: redgtxdi

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: bctbct
BTW foreign car makers fuel ecomy is not better on bigger cars with bigger engines.

Very true. If Toyota starts building a truck that gets the exact same gas mileage as a GMC Sierra, will their be a consumer fee on that?

Probably not. I think it's pretty evident that even our own government likes foreign cars better than our own........(aside from those bitchin' lookin' Suburbans in the presidential caravan)

However, if both automakers were put to the test to create a 1-ton truck that gets the best mpg it can, given a specific criteria on weight, mass, size, engine size, etc... etc............I'd put all of my money on Toyota and probably borrow a little more to bet ta' boot!!!! :thumbsup:

Amazing then how GM's 6.0L V8 full-size trucks get the same or better gas mileage as Toyota's 4.7L V8 Tundra, eh?
Cool... paypal me all your money now.

Brainwashed tool. :roll:


edit: there's a lot of reason to dislike American cars, but the fuel economy reason is for the idiots who know jack sh!t about cars in general. Pound for pound, displacement for displacement, power per power, GM cars get the best gas mileage bar none. A Corvette Z06 gets 26 hwy with 505 bhp.

 

[fallenangel99]

Lutz, a long-time critic of government fuel economy regulations, compared the attempt to force carmakers to sell smaller vehicles to "fighting the nation's obesity problem by forcing clothing manufacturers to sell garments only in small sizes."

Wow.

 

[International Machine Consortium]

Originally posted by: piasabird
http://money.cnn.com/2006/12/26/news/companies/gm_fuel.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes

GM is running scared over a proposed reduction in fuel MPG standards.

GM deserves to go out of business. If America truly desires larger vehicles, it needs to be marginalized further from the rest of the World until it wakes up.

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: bctbct
socially responsible? wheres that come from.

Probably from the need GM and other makers have to plan for the next generation of customers for transportation that works within the bounds enforced by natural phenomena of the planet.

A bunch of cars with no fuel won't be worth squat, and polluting ourselves into extinction would put a hell of a damper on future sales.

 

[International Machine Consortium]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
"Despite what the alarmists may think, we don't have any magic 100-mpg carburetor that we're holding back because we're in bed with the oil companies."

LOL

I looked up the Toyota Tundra and saw that the biggeset V8 available was a

4.7L V8
271HP @ 5400RPM
313 lb-ft of torque @ 3400RPM

GMC/Chevy

Well, lets just say they have a much wider range of engine options from a 4.8, 5.3, 6.0, etc...and the bigger engines make more torque and horsepower and they make it a lot lower.

I know for a fact that there is no way in hell my dad could do his job with the Tundra especially when he has to tow a trailor.

This is only going to hurt consumers if they are not going to be able to purchase these full-size pickups.

There are 4 cylinder diesel trucks that produce more torque than daddy's POS gas hog.

http://trucks.about.com/od/autobuying/a/torque.htm

http://www.greencarcongress.com/2006/07/mitsubishifuso_.html

Stop being suckered by the American car companies. The government needs to let them die the death they so richly have earned.

 

[International Machine Consortium]

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: catnap1972

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper

"For one thing, it puts us, the domestic manufacturers, at odds with the desires of most of our customers, namely larger vehicles,"

Then why are sales of the larger vehicles/SUVs dropping?

If they can boast that they can increase the MPG every year; then apply some more technology to it.
It may cause some retooling, but the ability to increase the MPG does exists.

It is the price/profit that worries GM & Ford - that will dictate the market share.

Of course--they were nice and comfy sitting on their asses popping those belcher SUVs out like candy (and pocketing $10K+ profits on each), but now they're whining when they got caught with their pants pulled down.

Until you realize the new tundra is going to sport an optional 5.7L V* this year. Trucks comes with big engines for a reason.

Study up my misguided friend. Stop spouting the oil company party line. It's crap.

 

[judasmachine]

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: catnap1972

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper

"For one thing, it puts us, the domestic manufacturers, at odds with the desires of most of our customers, namely larger vehicles,"

Then why are sales of the larger vehicles/SUVs dropping?

If they can boast that they can increase the MPG every year; then apply some more technology to it.
It may cause some retooling, but the ability to increase the MPG does exists.

It is the price/profit that worries GM & Ford - that will dictate the market share.

Of course--they were nice and comfy sitting on their asses popping those belcher SUVs out like candy (and pocketing $10K+ profits on each), but now they're whining when they got caught with their pants pulled down.

Until you realize the new tundra is going to sport an optional 5.7L V* this year. Trucks comes with big engines for a reason.

Now if we could just get the people who need them to buy them and the dimestore cowboys to lay off....

 

[International Machine Consortium]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
Redgtxdi, GM is hardly going down the tubes. They still sell more vehicles than any other company on the planet.

Toyota is closing in though. They came VERRRRRY close this year to outselling GM. It's only a matter of time.

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: catnap1972

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper

"For one thing, it puts us, the domestic manufacturers, at odds with the desires of most of our customers, namely larger vehicles,"

Then why are sales of the larger vehicles/SUVs dropping?

If they can boast that they can increase the MPG every year; then apply some more technology to it.
It may cause some retooling, but the ability to increase the MPG does exists.

It is the price/profit that worries GM & Ford - that will dictate the market share.

Of course--they were nice and comfy sitting on their asses popping those belcher SUVs out like candy (and pocketing $10K+ profits on each), but now they're whining when they got caught with their pants pulled down.

Yeah, GM and Ford are making an absolute fortune on their SUVs and Trucks...oh wait, they're both losing billions each year. Nice try.

 

[International Machine Consortium]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: redgtxdi

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: bctbct
BTW foreign car makers fuel ecomy is not better on bigger cars with bigger engines.

Very true. If Toyota starts building a truck that gets the exact same gas mileage as a GMC Sierra, will their be a consumer fee on that?

Probably not. I think it's pretty evident that even our own government likes foreign cars better than our own........(aside from those bitchin' lookin' Suburbans in the presidential caravan)

However, if both automakers were put to the test to create a 1-ton truck that gets the best mpg it can, given a specific criteria on weight, mass, size, engine size, etc... etc............I'd put all of my money on Toyota and probably borrow a little more to bet ta' boot!!!! :thumbsup:

Amazing then how GM's 6.0L V8 full-size trucks get the same or better gas mileage as Toyota's 4.7L V8 Tundra, eh?
Cool... paypal me all your money now.

Brainwashed tool. :roll:


edit: there's a lot of reason to dislike American cars, but the fuel economy reason is for the idiots who know jack sh!t about cars in general. Pound for pound, displacement for displacement, power per power, GM cars get the best gas mileage bar none. A Corvette Z06 gets 26 hwy with 505 bhp.

Oh really? What are you towing with that Corvette? :roll:

I tell you what, it wouldn't get 26 with ME driving it.

Why do you have to use language such as IDIOT, BRAINWASHED TOOL, JACK SH!T MORON?

I ask merely for information?
Or are you towing 10 CY of crushed stone with your Corvette again.



:laugh:

 

[compuwiz1]

The Yukon Denali's are selling quite well, in my market. I work in a GMC store. People who have the money to buy them, just don't care about economy.