GM new incentive program

[Ktulu]

Link

Link

in case you missed the last round of employee discounts.

 

[night]

haha, gm and ford are going down.


..... how come the second link sends me to paypal 0_o

 

[Ktulu]

Originally posted by: night
haha, gm and ford are going down.


..... how come the second link sends me to paypal 0_o

fixed

 

[Bekker]

Originally posted by: night
haha, gm and ford are going down.


..... how come the second link sends me to paypal 0_o

Why would you want GM and Ford to go down? Did it never dawn on you that it is essential for the national defense that we have domestic vehicle production as it is one of the basic industries? That's part of Econ 101. Also, why would you want all tehir employees to lose jobs?

Instead of wanting them to "go down," I feel we should be glad they are now feeling the pressure to produce better and cheaper vehicles to compete effectively with anyone worldwide.

just my 2 cets.

 

[grappa]

Originally posted by: Bekker

Why would you want GM and Ford to go down? Did it never dawn on you that it is essential for the national defense that we have domestic vehicle production as it is one of the basic industries?

And did it occur to you that both Ford and GM outsource the majority of their parts and labor to countries like China, Canada and Mexico? Heck, Chrysler calls it "right-sourcing"! Talk about doublespeak!

Nowadays there are more American-made parts and labor in brands like Honda and Toyota than in Ford and GM. So do some research before you send your money overseas.

 

[Bekker]

grappa,

You have a valid point, but most of the assembly lines of US auto brands are still here. Of course, so are many non-domestic lines. If production had to be converted to wartime uses, we would have to rely on what we can do internally if forced to do so.

Competition is great. American made forced Japan and others to drastically improve their products for this market, just as non-domestics are now forcing us to respond. There is a place for both domestics and non-domestics. I hope both thrive.

 

[rancherlee]

I see GM is kinda in trouble, they are relying on there SUV's too much though and they really have Nothing new thats really Hot in the market. Ford's New Fusion seems to be one heck of a car and should help them out along with the MANY Hybreds ford has coming out in the next few years.

 

[JoeyM]

I would love a brand new Cadillac Sedan Deville. Black with shiny chrome rims. If I could get it for under 30k, I'd be all over it.

Joe

 

[Hacp]

They are clearing out inventory for their new models, which are supposed to be more fuel efficient and more competative with the japanese brands.

 

[DWC]

Originally posted by: JoeyM
I would love a brand new Cadillac Sedan Deville. Black with shiny chrome rims. If I could get it for under 30k, I'd be all over it.

Joe

Easy. Visit Autotrader.com and pick up an "off-lease" caddy with low mileage for a steal. Paid $26,000 for a one year old DeVille DHS with 19,000 miles on it two years ago. A high percentage of Devilles are leased and with GM's liberal early return program there are a glut of such Caddys available. In the Detroit-Flint metro region 95% of Caddys are leased. $26,000 for a MSRP $50,000 vehicle!

 

[cparent]

Originally posted by: grappa

Originally posted by: Bekker

Why would you want GM and Ford to go down? Did it never dawn on you that it is essential for the national defense that we have domestic vehicle production as it is one of the basic industries?

And did it occur to you that both Ford and GM outsource the majority of their parts and labor to countries like China, Canada and Mexico? Heck, Chrysler calls it "right-sourcing"! Talk about doublespeak!

Nowadays there are more American-made parts and labor in brands like Honda and Toyota than in Ford and GM. So do some research before you send your money overseas.

You are wrong.


and also, any american that likes their job and their lifestyle should want to help the big 3 get back up. A majority of the money in this country is from the big 3. If they fold, the money will not be pouring out of Detroit any more. Therefore, Ohio will fall because less people buying personal products. New york will fall because nobody will be investing any more. Illinois will fall because no one has any money to put in banks any more. California will fall because people wont buy wine or movies anymore. Wait, california will be fine with all of the illegal imigrants. And then, after everything takes a dump, we can all thank our foreign car buying neighbors that bought inferior foreign cars (JD Powers tests show American cars are superior in quality yet again) for our new Chinese Overlords!

./rantoff

 

[night]

Originally posted by: cparent

bought inferior foreign cars (JD Powers tests show American cars are superior in quality yet again) for our new Chinese Overlords!

./rantoff

well i work on the things and and we can argue this until we kill ourselves but im telling you there is no way in hell i would consider honda and toyota inferior. nissan and mitsu are debateable, but not honda/toyota

 

[Trikat]

American cars superior to foreign cars?
Which foreign brands are you talking about, because Honda/Toyota/Nissan/BMW/Merc/Mazda all beat American in reliability.
If your American car is going to break down every so often that fact alone makes it a pathetic car to buy.
I mean those repairs will add up to a large amount of money and you would be better off buying an import.
Handling favors the foreign cars and also interior quality.

I'm not saying I want GM or Ford to go down, I just want them to start making cars that are reliable, not as cheap quality overall, and have better performance. In other words follow the example of imported cars.

 

[imported_Sonnyboy]

not only do ford and gm outsource their parts but they do a shared-services approach to their administrative services such as accounting, etc. . .which is pretty much outsourcing.

 

[Thoreau]

Go cparent! Way to strike back with factual information, moron.

I'm with night when it comes to quality between foreign and domestic.

In any case, back to the topic at hand, GM *is* flailing their arms wildly in a failing attempt to recoup major losses from their gas guzzling, cookie-cutter, overpriced model lineup. Using even the new Fusion from Ford (BASE MSRP: $17,795) as an example, it only gets 23/31MPG for a similar, if not higher, price than a Honda Civic (BASE MSRP: $14,360) (minus the ones recalled recently) that gets 30/38MPG. Hmm, tough call! Even the Ford Focus only pulls in at 26/34MPG and starts at $13,995.

 

[RiDE]

Originally posted by: cparent

Originally posted by: grappa

Originally posted by: Bekker

Why would you want GM and Ford to go down? Did it never dawn on you that it is essential for the national defense that we have domestic vehicle production as it is one of the basic industries?

And did it occur to you that both Ford and GM outsource the majority of their parts and labor to countries like China, Canada and Mexico? Heck, Chrysler calls it "right-sourcing"! Talk about doublespeak!

Nowadays there are more American-made parts and labor in brands like Honda and Toyota than in Ford and GM. So do some research before you send your money overseas.

You are wrong.


and also, any american that likes their job and their lifestyle should want to help the big 3 get back up. A majority of the money in this country is from the big 3. If they fold, the money will not be pouring out of Detroit any more. Therefore, Ohio will fall because less people buying personal products. New york will fall because nobody will be investing any more. Illinois will fall because no one has any money to put in banks any more. California will fall because people wont buy wine or movies anymore. Wait, california will be fine with all of the illegal imigrants. And then, after everything takes a dump, we can all thank our foreign car buying neighbors that bought inferior foreign cars (JD Powers tests show American cars are superior in quality yet again) for our new Chinese Overlords!

./rantoff

That has got to be the most ignorant post in this hijacked thread.

 

[Bozo Galora]

did I stumble into off-topic?

Anyway, next year (2006) China will export the "Cheri" into the U.S.. This will be a full sized sedan made in a Japanese
furnished state of the art factory with CNC and robotic machinery for $15,000. This will mark the end of the U.S. auto industry
and all its associated vendors.
America is finished.
There is no such thing as a service economy.
The American middle class is finished.
Its over.
The World no longer needs the U.S. factory worker to create the goods for consumption.
The World no longer needs the U.S. computer geek genius to create anything related to the PC revolution.
Protected status as the only player in the game has disappeared completely.
And there isnt a goddamned thing you can do about it.
Its irreversible.
The current generation doesnt even WANT to work, even if you gave them the $25/hr factory job.
They dont even show up.
I know, I hire people for my factory.
America as a nation will no longer exist - there will be an American Uniion - like the European Union.
They have already offered up a name for the new currency - the "Amero". (Like the Euro)

For those that can still read and comprehend, or even have the ability to concentrate for more than 25 seconds on any one subject, you may wish to read this:
http://www.gold-eagle.com/editorials_05/willie101205.html

 

[DaveCSparty]

I'm from Detroit and an auditor for a big accounting firm here. A majority of all our clients are automotive parts manufacturers. It's crazy how much work actually goes into a car.

Our clients have factories across the country in small industrial towns (think Sandusky Ohio in Tommy Boy). If the Big 3 goes down, a lot of people will be out of work for sure. They are a big part of our economy. You have suppliers to automotive parts makers that makes parts for other parts makers. There are a few layers of manufacturing before a single part even make it to GM or Ford.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is that cparent is not THAT far off. There's gonna be a domino effect for sure.

 

[Bekker]

GM's current radio ad campaign says they use 80% domestic parts whereas domestic non-USA producers use only 20%

But, all that aside, has anyone heard how high the incentives might be?

 

[RideFree]

Yes, I fear that the Detroit economic model is soon to suffer it's own form of nuclear winter.
The bad news. . .Wal-Mart is the only antidote to self-inflicted radiation poisoning on the horizon. The real bad news. . .the Wal-Mart economic model!
It is exactly like the majority posts to this thread have been saying, especially Bozo's & Dave's & Trikat's & Sonny's, etc..

A question: How long does anyone think that we can sustain the notion that our paper currency will continue to purchase commodities and consumables? I have a deal for you. Take this wheelbarrow full of dollars and buy a loaf of bread from the PRC in the year 2035.
(I personally don't think it will take until 2035 but I used that date because I'm an optimist at heart.)
How long before we crack the $100Billion trade-deficit barrier on a monthly basis?
How long can we sustain trading Dollars for oil when it becomes apparent that it is more efficient to simply burn the Dollars & capture the energy output from the flames?

Now, to shop for that new Chevy pickup with that Duramax engine built in Japan, and that Allison transmission & Eaton rear-end both made in Mexico.

 

[szechuanpork]

Originally posted by: Bozo Galora
did I stumble into off-topic?

Anyway, next year (2006) China will export the "Cheri" into the U.S.. This will be a full sized sedan made in a Japanese furnished state...[/L]

cheri...also a good magazine

 

[DWC]

Originally posted by: cparent

You are wrong.


and also, any american that likes their job and their lifestyle should want to help the big 3 get back up. A majority of the money in this country is from the big 3. If they fold, the money will not be pouring out of Detroit any more. Therefore, Ohio will fall because less people buying personal products. New york will fall because nobody will be investing any more. Illinois will fall because no one has any money to put in banks any more. California will fall because people wont buy wine or movies anymore. Wait, california will be fine with all of the illegal imigrants. And then, after everything takes a dump, we can all thank our foreign car buying neighbors that bought inferior foreign cars (JD Powers tests show American cars are superior in quality yet again) for our new Chinese Overlords!

#1 A majority of the money in this country is NOT from the big 3. Maybe it used to be but definitely not anymore.

#2 Big 3? Are you forgetting that #3 is no longer an American firm? Think German.

 

[ClockerXP]

Please keep this ON TOPIC or move your discussion to the OT forum.

 

[cparent]

http://www.jdpower.com/cc/auto/ratings/pvs/PowerVehicleSelector.jsp

You can slide quality and long term dependability over on any car type and American Cars come out on top over Asian cars.

and

http://www.detnews.com/2005/autosinsider/0506/30/B01-232784.htm


U.S. cars quality and long term dependability > Asian with the exception of Lexus

 

[mordrid52]

Originally posted by: Thoreau
Using even the new Fusion from Ford (BASE MSRP: $17,795) as an example, it only gets 23/31MPG for a similar, if not higher, price than a Honda Civic (BASE MSRP: $14,360) (minus the ones recalled recently) that gets 30/38MPG. Hmm, tough call! Even the Ford Focus only pulls in at 26/34MPG and starts at $13,995.

Had you actually bothered to check some basic facts in your rush to bash American cars, you would have seen that the Fusion is a midsize car compared to the compact sized Civic. If you compare apples-to-apples, it looks like this.

4 cylinder Manual transmission:
Ford Fusion, 23/31 mpg, 160 horsepower
Honda Accord, 26/34 mpg, 166 horsepower
Mazda 6, 23/31 mpg, 160 horsepower
Nissan Altima, 24/31 mpg, 175 horsepower
Toyota Camry, 24/33 mpg, 154 horsepower

6 cylinder Automatic transmission:
Ford Fusion, 21/29 mpg, 221 horsepower
Honda Accord, 20/29 mpg, 244 horsepower
Mazda 6, 20/27 mpg, 220 horsepower
Nissan Altima, 20/30 mpg, 250 horsepower
Toyota Camry, 20/28 mpg, 190 horsepower

Looks pretty competitive to me, but don't let me interrupt your hatefest.