Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
Originally posted by: senseamp
All these GM bashing Toyota praising articles read the same. GM bad, Toyota good. GM cars are all like Hummers and Toyota cars are all like Priuses. Yadda yadda. They are written by people who either like saying things that everyone already knows, or they think GM is responsible for the world's environmental problems while Toyota cars are making the world a better place to live, even if they get pretty much the same mileage as similar GM cars, plus Toyota is trying desperately to succeed in the same segments that these envirohippies gave GM a hard time for succeeding in.
put it this way, toyota gives you the choice of choosing between a tundra and a prius.
gm canned their electric car program which also contained their hybrid program. toyota is instrumental in the push towards more and more high mpg vehicles, they showed that it could be done. toyota did something right, gm did something wrong. theres nothing equal about it.
never mind the american car companies were behind stalling or blocking enviromental standards that would have pushed them towards such progress long ago...and they did it over and over...
Originally posted by: senseamp
Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
Originally posted by: senseamp
All these GM bashing Toyota praising articles read the same. GM bad, Toyota good. GM cars are all like Hummers and Toyota cars are all like Priuses. Yadda yadda. They are written by people who either like saying things that everyone already knows, or they think GM is responsible for the world's environmental problems while Toyota cars are making the world a better place to live, even if they get pretty much the same mileage assimilar GM cars, plus Toyota is trying desperately to succeed in the same segments that these envirohippies gave GM a hard time for succeeding in.
put it this way, toyota gives you the choice of choosing between a tundra and a prius.
gm canned their electric car program which also contained their hybrid program. toyota is instrumental in the push towards more and more high mpg vehicles, they showed that it could be done. toyota did something right, gm did something wrong. theres nothing equal about it.
never mind the american car companies were behind stalling or blocking enviromental standards that would have pushed them towards such progress long ago...and they did it over and over...
Typical envirowhacko cliches. Evil GM killed the EV1. Waam. Toyota is great, never mind that they are trying to imitate GM in the big truck market. So much for their environmental standards. So we are supposed to give Toyota credit for being a failure in the big truck marketplace. If it was up to them, they'd be selling those same big trucks enivirohippies are bashing GM for selling.
Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
Originally posted by: senseamp
Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
Originally posted by: senseamp
All these GM bashing Toyota praising articles read the same. GM bad, Toyota good. GM cars are all like Hummers and Toyota cars are all like Priuses. Yadda yadda. They are written by people who either like saying things that everyone already knows, or they think GM is responsible for the world's environmental problems while Toyota cars are making the world a better place to live, even if they get pretty much the same mileage assimilar GM cars, plus Toyota is trying desperately to succeed in the same segments that these envirohippies gave GM a hard time for succeeding in.
put it this way, toyota gives you the choice of choosing between a tundra and a prius.
gm canned their electric car program which also contained their hybrid program. toyota is instrumental in the push towards more and more high mpg vehicles, they showed that it could be done. toyota did something right, gm did something wrong. theres nothing equal about it.
never mind the american car companies were behind stalling or blocking enviromental standards that would have pushed them towards such progress long ago...and they did it over and over...
Typical envirowhacko cliches. Evil GM killed the EV1. Waam. Toyota is great, never mind that they are trying to imitate GM in the big truck market. So much for their environmental standards. So we are supposed to give Toyota credit for being a failure in the big truck marketplace. If it was up to them, they'd be selling those same big trucks enivirohippies are bashing GM for selling.
i'm sorry you are just grasping at straws. it really doesn't matter if toyota sells trucks well or not. compared to gm they are simply better. its a low standard to beat as i already explained. but better is still better. if there were a disaster cutting global oil supplies or massive restriction of emissions through new laws which company would be in a better position to survive? ask yourself that. only a company whos made stupid decisions for decades would put themselves in such a position. its not about being envirowacko, its about being good at business. nice of you to trot out those nice cliche terms
btw you know the japanese could have hurt the american makes in the truck area long ago. they held back to prevent american backlash. it makes it all the more pathetic.
Originally posted by: Strk
Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
Originally posted by: senseamp
Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
Originally posted by: senseamp
All these GM bashing Toyota praising articles read the same. GM bad, Toyota good. GM cars are all like Hummers and Toyota cars are all like Priuses. Yadda yadda. They are written by people who either like saying things that everyone already knows, or they think GM is responsible for the world's environmental problems while Toyota cars are making the world a better place to live, even if they get pretty much the same mileage assimilar GM cars, plus Toyota is trying desperately to succeed in the same segments that these envirohippies gave GM a hard time for succeeding in.
put it this way, toyota gives you the choice of choosing between a tundra and a prius.
gm canned their electric car program which also contained their hybrid program. toyota is instrumental in the push towards more and more high mpg vehicles, they showed that it could be done. toyota did something right, gm did something wrong. theres nothing equal about it.
never mind the american car companies were behind stalling or blocking enviromental standards that would have pushed them towards such progress long ago...and they did it over and over...
Typical envirowhacko cliches. Evil GM killed the EV1. Waam. Toyota is great, never mind that they are trying to imitate GM in the big truck market. So much for their environmental standards. So we are supposed to give Toyota credit for being a failure in the big truck marketplace. If it was up to them, they'd be selling those same big trucks enivirohippies are bashing GM for selling.
i'm sorry you are just grasping at straws. it really doesn't matter if toyota sells trucks well or not. compared to gm they are simply better. its a low standard to beat as i already explained. but better is still better. if there were a disaster cutting global oil supplies or massive restriction of emissions through new laws which company would be in a better position to survive? ask yourself that. only a company whos made stupid decisions for decades would put themselves in such a position. its not about being envirowacko, its about being good at business. nice of you to trot out those nice cliche terms
btw you know the japanese could have hurt the american makes in the truck area long ago. they held back to prevent american backlash. it makes it all the more pathetic.
He's grasping at straws? Toyota really is trying hard to break into the truck market. You'll probably see a heavy duty from Toyota in the near future. Toyota wants to produce all of those big trucks GM does.
And yeah, GM killed the EV1, so what? It was a piece of garbage. GM is rapidly putting out hybrids though. Their hybrid system is a little different though. Right now they have the Saturn Vue. The Saturn Aura will have a hybrid out shortly. There also might be a hybrid Astra. GM has also stated it intends to put a production version of the Volt on the road.
Toyota's image is more green, that's for sure, but if you want green, buy a Honda.
Originally posted by: Strk
And yeah, GM killed the EV1, so what? It was a piece of garbage. GM is rapidly putting out hybrids though. Their hybrid system is a little different though. Right now they have the Saturn Vue. The Saturn Aura will have a hybrid out shortly. There also might be a hybrid Astra. GM has also stated it intends to put a production version of the Volt on the road.
Originally posted by: totalcommand
Who the F cares about trucks. Most of us here drive sedans and compacts, and in those categories Toyota absolutely destroys GM. Even in terms of looks now which is pathetic for GM!
Originally posted by: SarcasticDwarf
Originally posted by: Strk
And yeah, GM killed the EV1, so what? It was a piece of garbage. GM is rapidly putting out hybrids though. Their hybrid system is a little different though. Right now they have the Saturn Vue. The Saturn Aura will have a hybrid out shortly. There also might be a hybrid Astra. GM has also stated it intends to put a production version of the Volt on the road.
How was the EV1 a piece of garbage? Everything I have seen indicates that it worked pretty well (especially for the first model on an entirely new line).
Originally posted by: The Cornballer
Originally posted by: totalcommand
Who the F cares about trucks. Most of us here drive sedans and compacts, and in those categories Toyota absolutely destroys GM. Even in terms of looks now which is pathetic for GM!
lots of people drive pickups
or at least have one as a secondary vehicle.
Originally posted by: totalcommand
Who the F cares about trucks. Most of us here drive sedans and compacts, and in those categories Toyota absolutely destroys GM. Even in terms of looks now which is pathetic for GM!
Originally posted by: senseamp
Originally posted by: SarcasticDwarf
Originally posted by: Strk
And yeah, GM killed the EV1, so what? It was a piece of garbage. GM is rapidly putting out hybrids though. Their hybrid system is a little different though. Right now they have the Saturn Vue. The Saturn Aura will have a hybrid out shortly. There also might be a hybrid Astra. GM has also stated it intends to put a production version of the Volt on the road.
How was the EV1 a piece of garbage? Everything I have seen indicates that it worked pretty well (especially for the first model on an entirely new line).
For the money it cost, it was a piece of garbage.
Originally posted by: Strk
And yeah, GM killed the EV1, so what? It was a piece of garbage. GM is rapidly putting out hybrids though. Their hybrid system is a little different though. Right now they have the Saturn Vue. The Saturn Aura will have a hybrid out shortly. There also might be a hybrid Astra. GM has also stated it intends to put a production version of the Volt on the road.
Originally posted by: Staples
I love how the market shift is moving to small cars but all GM is doing is making more SUVs and putting no money into small car development.
Gee, lets guess why GM is going bankrupt.
Originally posted by: phoenix79
Originally posted by: Strk
And yeah, GM killed the EV1, so what? It was a piece of garbage. GM is rapidly putting out hybrids though. Their hybrid system is a little different though. Right now they have the Saturn Vue. The Saturn Aura will have a hybrid out shortly. There also might be a hybrid Astra. GM has also stated it intends to put a production version of the Volt on the road.
Using the saturn vue to defend GM isn't very smart. It's drivetrain is built by Honda, as are most of the new Saturns, hence the higher quality than ever. Sorry.
I had a 1993 Toyota Camry that had 280,000 mi on it when it got run over by an Explorer. The Camry purred like a kitten with never a major repair and ran great. I now drive a 97 Malibu with under 70k that I got in Janurary and have already had to replace the idler pulley when the bearing in it went and melted the plastic pulley and it left me stranded. I hate to say it but GM is nowhere near toyota in quality. BTW. I'm an Indiana boy in Alabama.
Japanese FTW
GM Stuffs the Ballot Box!
Slipping behind Toyota in sales, the giant automaker manipulates a Newsweek online survey, turning on the vote in a drive worthy of Karl Rove.
Originally posted by: SarcasticDwarf
Originally posted by: senseamp
Originally posted by: SarcasticDwarf
Originally posted by: Strk
And yeah, GM killed the EV1, so what? It was a piece of garbage. GM is rapidly putting out hybrids though. Their hybrid system is a little different though. Right now they have the Saturn Vue. The Saturn Aura will have a hybrid out shortly. There also might be a hybrid Astra. GM has also stated it intends to put a production version of the Volt on the road.
How was the EV1 a piece of garbage? Everything I have seen indicates that it worked pretty well (especially for the first model on an entirely new line).
For the money it cost, it was a piece of garbage.
What is your point? It was the very first vehicle in a completely new field of cars. The car itself was not bad at all (reasonable range, safety, features, etc). Remember, GM never once sold the EV1, it was purely a test vehicle. Every single one of the 800? on the road was leased, and most of the leasees loved them. Call it overpriced if you want, but calling it garbage indicates that there were many unreasonable problems with the car.
YepOriginally posted by: senseamp
Originally posted by: phoenix79
Originally posted by: Strk
And yeah, GM killed the EV1, so what? It was a piece of garbage. GM is rapidly putting out hybrids though. Their hybrid system is a little different though. Right now they have the Saturn Vue. The Saturn Aura will have a hybrid out shortly. There also might be a hybrid Astra. GM has also stated it intends to put a production version of the Volt on the road.
Using the saturn vue to defend GM isn't very smart. It's drivetrain is built by Honda, as are most of the new Saturns, hence the higher quality than ever. Sorry.
I had a 1993 Toyota Camry that had 280,000 mi on it when it got run over by an Explorer. The Camry purred like a kitten with never a major repair and ran great. I now drive a 97 Malibu with under 70k that I got in Janurary and have already had to replace the idler pulley when the bearing in it went and melted the plastic pulley and it left me stranded. I hate to say it but GM is nowhere near toyota in quality. BTW. I'm an Indiana boy in Alabama.
Japanese FTW
Let's face it, you are talking about cars that are 10 years old. Not really indicative of today's cars.
Originally posted by: SuperSix
Hahahaha..
GM stuffing the ballot box to win that "poll"..
GM Stuffs the Ballot Box!
Slipping behind Toyota in sales, the giant automaker manipulates a Newsweek online survey, turning on the vote in a drive worthy of Karl Rove.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17553636/site/newsweek/
That being said - I am a GM fan.
Originally posted by: SVT Cobra
Originally posted by: SarcasticDwarf
Originally posted by: senseamp
Originally posted by: SarcasticDwarf
Originally posted by: Strk
And yeah, GM killed the EV1, so what? It was a piece of garbage. GM is rapidly putting out hybrids though. Their hybrid system is a little different though. Right now they have the Saturn Vue. The Saturn Aura will have a hybrid out shortly. There also might be a hybrid Astra. GM has also stated it intends to put a production version of the Volt on the road.
How was the EV1 a piece of garbage? Everything I have seen indicates that it worked pretty well (especially for the first model on an entirely new line).
For the money it cost, it was a piece of garbage.
What is your point? It was the very first vehicle in a completely new field of cars. The car itself was not bad at all (reasonable range, safety, features, etc). Remember, GM never once sold the EV1, it was purely a test vehicle. Every single one of the 800? on the road was leased, and most of the leasees loved them. Call it overpriced if you want, but calling it garbage indicates that there were many unreasonable problems with the car.
I do hope you all are not basing your opinions off of "who killed the electric car" as it was extremely biased. Go read some editorials of some car magazine editors (gm bashers or not) for the real facts.