Gnome 2.14 released....

[Nothinman]

I am merely using Windows 95's UI as example to say things havent moved on in over a decade!

So? Do you have any ideas of changes that would actually be better?

At most the 'Deskbar' is a widget. I was merely saying it's not particularly groundbreaking nor innovative, thus no reason to choose gnome above anything else.

It's called progress, they took a few existing ideas and combined them in a new way to make things easier. Most software development is evolutionary, not revolutionary.

Of course data has to be displayed as text (duh). But at the risk of repeating other posts I have made, there are three dimensional ways of working that would benefit a computer users health and risk of injury MASSIVELY.

Once people become used to something it's extremely difficult to get them to switch no matter how much better the alternative is. People still eat McDonald's every day and look how bad that is for them.

 

[gruven]

Originally posted by: drag
That's very nice. Can't wait for it to hit Debian.

My thoughts exactly.

 

[screw3d]

Isn't it supposed to come out today? I don't see it anywhere.. what am I missing?

 

[Seeruk]

Originally posted by: doornail

Originally posted by: Seeruk
Is it me or is that little story guaranteed to come out within the 1st 10 posts of any interface forum post

Gosh, facts can be so darn annoying.

See that smiley face there at the end of the sentence? It represents happiness / mirth / joy.... under no possible interpretation can it be seen as being annoyed.

Unlike a lot of people, I couldn't give a flying rats ass who invented what.

Which, sadly makes your comments less insightful.

Now THIS I find amusing so it deserves another smiley face
So I guess because my views aren't tainted with what is basically a BRAND obsession they are disqualified from being worthy? Jesus H Christ!!! Get a freakin grip on reality.

But what I do care about is looking beyond the candy and the petty arguments of the OS obsessives who infest tech forums (like anandtech) that like to identify themselves through a freaking operating system.

Dude, you troll Linux threads on here like it was your day job. You seem more than a little obsessed with a particular OS.

This surely goes to show how obsessive you really are and why you are often labelled a zealot! I don't know what your reading age is but, run a search for my threads and you will find me recommending Linux in many situations and circumstances. You will also see me lambast windows. TBH the only OS I never recommend is OSX because I have yet to find an example of something where it does something that either a free Linux or Paid for Windows doesn't do better.

There's the door and until you can discuss anything without being a complete dick I suggest you nail it shut behind.

I don't care about Linux, I don't care about Microsoft, I don't have a Bill Gates obsession or pretend to have one in order to think I look cool on that thar interweb.
In fact truth be known... I don't see anything in the upcoming Vista, the upcoming OSX or any upcoming Linux Desktop that excites me ... nothing at all.

Thus my points above about what the next stage of desktop development could be like. Not all this 'me-too' catchup, not this year's Gnome with extra glitter, not next years Windows with extra transparency and moustache for a start menu...

SOMETHING THAT ACTUALLY BENEFITS THE INTERACTION BETWEEN MAN AND MACHINE!

 

[drag]

Originally posted by: Seeruk
I don't care about Linux, I don't care about Microsoft, I don't have a Bill Gates obsession or pretend to have one in order to think I look cool on that thar interweb.
In fact truth be known... I don't see anything in the upcoming Vista, the upcoming OSX or any upcoming Linux Desktop that excites me ... nothing at all.

Then what are you doing here? You know that this is a forum specially dedicated to discussing these sort of opinions and happennings.

Coming here and complaining about "fanboy'ism" is sort of like going to a basketball game and then pointing out how silly everyone is acting for rooting for one team or another when all that they should be caring about is the game.


If you want to get all into the 'future' why bother with pointing devices at all? Or screens? The future is a direct mind link were visualizations and guis and windows are mostly obsolete, except as ways to help you orginize your thoughts. It'll be more like a command line then anything else.

I seen a few shows about people working on this stuff. I've seen one guy that could steer and accelerate his sailboat just by concentrating. People have games were you just sit and stair at the screen with your hands folded as you control your little character just by thinking about it. Or more accuractly; by consiously controlling your brain waves.

 

[Seeruk]

Originally posted by: Nothinman

I am merely using Windows 95's UI as example to say things havent moved on in over a decade!

So? Do you have any ideas of changes that would actually be better?

Well I thought I just posted some!! But I suppose what I am really getting at is that companies such as Microsoft (in particular) and Novell have the resources to really do something dramatic, have the money for the next level of research and to move things on. But they don't, they just rehash with extra spangles every few years. Kinda the the equivalent to the game developers that cash in with sequels as opposed to using a profit to move things on.

At most the 'Deskbar' is a widget. I was merely saying it's not particularly groundbreaking nor innovative, thus no reason to choose gnome above anything else.

It's called progress, they took a few existing ideas and combined them in a new way to make things easier. Most software development is evolutionary, not revolutionary.

I'd call it more of a consolidation of a ideas, but I have no problem with it! I have already said its a handy little tool... just not a defining moment in desktop history

Of course data has to be displayed as text (duh). But at the risk of repeating other posts I have made, there are three dimensional ways of working that would benefit a computer users health and risk of injury MASSIVELY.

Once people become used to something it's extremely difficult to get them to switch no matter how much better the alternative is. People still eat McDonald's every day and look how bad that is for them.

You will never find me argue about McDonalds... it epitomises everything thats wrong with the world tbh Of course change is tough and you can never force it on people. But 99% of computer users are really not very good typers! Yet they still use a keyboard rather than voice recognition. My dad sucks as a typer (I only use 2 fingers myself!) yet when WinXP introduced voice controls, I showed him how to use them and he uses them along with voice recognition for just about everything except for typing in a web address!

I really think the transition from a mouse to something like a nintendo revolution controller would be very quick and painless for all.

But an interface is built from the mechanics-up. The last thing to be created should be the 'desktop'. Much more thought has to go into the route from brain to data with the 1st concern being the reduction of all the incredible restrictions of movement we have from the wired typewriter and 2-d pointing device we have now.

 

[drag]

try using quotes instead of bolding text. It makes it difficult to read your stuff that way and almost impossible to reply to you properly.

 

[Seeruk]

Originally posted by: drag

I don't care about Linux, I don't care about Microsoft, I don't have a Bill Gates obsession or pretend to have one in order to think I look cool on that thar interweb.
In fact truth be known... I don't see anything in the upcoming Vista, the upcoming OSX or any upcoming Linux Desktop that excites me ... nothing at all.

Then what are you doing here? You know that this is a forum specially dedicated to discussing these sort of opinions and happennings.

Coming here and complaining about "fanboy'ism" is sort of like going to a basketball game and then pointing out how silly everyone is acting for rooting for one team or another when all that they should be caring about is the game. [/quote]

Not really, I am surrounded by people of tech nature at work, experts in their fields, from notes, to IPV6, to holographic storage, to Unix, to Oracle, to Data centres, to government OSS projects.... we run the IT for the olympics!

Yet despite their various areas of expertise, their differing views, their different experiences over decades of IT..... they don't argue and debate technology in the childish way it's done here.
It's not a matter of brand v's brand, i.e. MS v's Linux or Nvidia v's ATI, AMD v's Intel omgwtflolzroflcopter.... its strengths and weaknesses, benefits and threats, picking the best combination of tools to get from a to b in a way that benefits both the user and the sponsor of a project.... ya know? GROWN UP TALK!

The one type of person who doesn't get employed here is the kind of person who says 'huhu m$ sux, Linux rules' because already you have proven that you are indoctrinated with one side's marketing propaganda and won't be able to make a valid and balanced decision on the solution in hand.

If you want to get all into the 'future' why bother with pointing devices at all? Or screens? The future is a direct mind link were visualizations and guis and windows are mostly obsolete, except as ways to help you orginize your thoughts. It'll be more like a command line then anything else.

I seen a few shows about people working on this stuff. I've seen one guy that could steer and accelerate his sailboat just by concentrating. People have games were you just sit and stair at the screen with your hands folded as you control your little character just by thinking about it. Or more accuractly; by consiously controlling your brain waves.

All great stuff. But the problem (I am guessing!) is that theses were all small companies or hobbyists? WTF aren't the big companies doing this?? Because it costs more money (sometimes), because they have grown too big to take a risk (perhaps?), or because they are all basically run by beancounters (almost definitely ). Which all leads back to what I originally was getting at... OSS shouldn't be restricted like this and thus has the advantage of being able to be adventurous enough to attempt something like this. If the wet dream of Linux Fundamentalists is to come true, and Linux is adopted worldwide at the expense of Windows... then it will take something as groundbreaking as that... not playing catchup or adding a desktop widget.

 

[Seeruk]

Originally posted by: drag
try using quotes instead of bolding text. It makes it difficult to read your stuff that way and almost impossible to reply to you properly.

I know .... just been lazy this morning and in a rush to go to work soon

 

[doornail]

Originally posted by: Seeruk
So I guess because my views aren't tainted with what is basically a BRAND obsession they are disqualified from being worthy? Jesus H Christ!!! Get a freakin grip on reality.

...

There's the door and until you can discuss anything without being a complete dick I suggest you nail it shut behind.

Calm down please. From my humble perspective;

1. Saying you don't care about the history of subject while you offer a poorly formed opinion on said subject is almost as bad as;

2. Saying you don't care about the subject at all as a defense of those opinions. Which is almost as bad as;

3. Getting upset and namecalling people who do have an interest in the subject and are well versed on its history.

All three of which you've done on this page. And for pete's sake, stop calling people "zealots" for holding a different opinion. It's the same thing as writing "M$" or "Microshaft". It kills your credibility. Now, maybe you're right and you criticize every OS. I don't know, I don't read every thread.

What did the fish say when it ran into a cement wall?

Dam!

 

[Sunner]

Originally posted by: Seeruk
The mouse has to go!! It strains the tiniest and 'most painful if injured' muscles of the hand and wrist. ALL THAT DOUBLE CLICKING! Instead of a double click... a simple forward motion with a finger or an object would suffice. Instead of stretching two fingers for an 'alt-tab'... a gesture such as turning the hand through 90 degrees on a vertical axis would be both simple, more natural AND FASTER. A thumbs-up with the hand instead of clicking on an OK button, a thumbs down to cancel, playing an FPS shooter could be steered through motion detection with the left hand, whilst holding an imaginary gun with trigger in the right hand.

These few simple examples would reduce RSI injuries by the thousands as they would be natural movements using the whole arm and shoulders rather than a couple of tiny and easily damaged muscles in the hand. Such an input device would not require the sitting of the operator at the desk in a stiff, unnatural and stressful position. You could be lying back on a sofa like you are when you use a TV remote, or standing whilst doing something else.

Or they could get their lazy asses to a gym and get those wrists some exercise, goes a long way towards preventing that kind of injuries.
Come to think of it, if they did, they could spend a lot of time at McDonalds(whyever you would wanna eat there is another matter entirely) without getting fat too.

 

[Seeruk]

Originally posted by: doornail
1. Saying you don't care about the history of subject while you offer a poorly formed opinion on said subject is almost as bad as;

Not what I said

I said I don't care who makes what, or care about the history, it's irrelevant. It's code at the end of the day and neither should be a factor in any decision making process.

2. Saying you don't care about the subject at all as a defense of those opinions.

Where did I say that?

3. Getting upset.

I'm far from upset! Chuckling away with a colleague right now

and namecalling people who do have an interest in the subject and are well versed on its history

You call it namecalling, we call it a fair description of dismissing comments on not being obsessed with an OS.

And for pete's sake, stop calling people "zealots" for holding a different opinion.

As soon as you stop picking an argument with anyone whose views don't conform to your own

What did the fish say when it ran into a cement wall? Dam!

Fish can't talk

 

[Seeruk]

Originally posted by: Sunner

Originally posted by: Seeruk
The mouse has to go!! It strains the tiniest and 'most painful if injured' muscles of the hand and wrist. ALL THAT DOUBLE CLICKING! Instead of a double click... a simple forward motion with a finger or an object would suffice. Instead of stretching two fingers for an 'alt-tab'... a gesture such as turning the hand through 90 degrees on a vertical axis would be both simple, more natural AND FASTER. A thumbs-up with the hand instead of clicking on an OK button, a thumbs down to cancel, playing an FPS shooter could be steered through motion detection with the left hand, whilst holding an imaginary gun with trigger in the right hand.

These few simple examples would reduce RSI injuries by the thousands as they would be natural movements using the whole arm and shoulders rather than a couple of tiny and easily damaged muscles in the hand. Such an input device would not require the sitting of the operator at the desk in a stiff, unnatural and stressful position. You could be lying back on a sofa like you are when you use a TV remote, or standing whilst doing something else.

Or they could get their lazy asses to a gym and get those wrists some exercise, goes a long way towards preventing that kind of injuries.
Come to think of it, if they did, they could spend a lot of time at McDonalds(whyever you would wanna eat there is another matter entirely) without getting fat too.

Seriously though, the wrist injuries in particular Carpel Tunnel Syndrome, are completely unavoidable.

If you don't know.. its the worst and most painful of all the RSI related injuries (though strictly not a strain. Basically imagine a piece of pipe cleaner going up and down a pipe hundreds/thousands of times a day. Even if it is the cleanest pipe in the world... the pipe cleaner will still accumulate debris on it from the inside of the pipe and the pipe itself.

This builds up over the years ending in an inflamation and damagethat is painful enough to COMPLETELY end all hope of you moving your hand's muscles without agonising pain for the rest of your life.

There is no cure :/

 

[Sunner]

Seems like these guys disagree with you.

 

[Seeruk]

Don't see much disagreement there.

Yes it can be 'treated'.... with painful, dehabilitating, and insanely expensive surgery.... but a few more years of computer use and you are back at square one.

Trust me I know... my father has it

Thus why I taught him to use voice controls & voice recognition in Windows XP.

 

[Seeruk]

http://www.ctsplace.com/cts_board/about1007.html

"I had surgery july 28th.05 Been through alot of PT, and nothing is working. I cant put any pressure on my right wrist. Burning pain from shooting up arm, then alot of aching. I dont know what to do any more.
Dr. says maybe get a little better, but doesent hold out much hope. Plus iam on workmans comp. And who knows how long they will deal with this.
Has anyone been through this? And if so what did you do? Please anyone help. Dont know how much more i can take. "

Very very typical of the success rate of surgery.

 

[doornail]

So ... anyone try the new Gnome yet?

 

[Seeruk]

I'll be emerging tonight

 

[Brazen]

Originally posted by: Seeruk

Originally posted by: drag

I don't care about Linux, I don't care about Microsoft, I don't have a Bill Gates obsession or pretend to have one in order to think I look cool on that thar interweb.
In fact truth be known... I don't see anything in the upcoming Vista, the upcoming OSX or any upcoming Linux Desktop that excites me ... nothing at all.

Then what are you doing here? You know that this is a forum specially dedicated to discussing these sort of opinions and happennings.

Coming here and complaining about "fanboy'ism" is sort of like going to a basketball game and then pointing out how silly everyone is acting for rooting for one team or another when all that they should be caring about is the game.

Not really, I am surrounded by people of tech nature at work, experts in their fields, from notes, to IPV6, to holographic storage, to Unix, to Oracle, to Data centres, to government OSS projects.... we run the IT for the olympics!

Yet despite their various areas of expertise, their differing views, their different experiences over decades of IT..... they don't argue and debate technology in the childish way it's done here.
[/quote]LOL, the irony is, it's people like you who turn these discussions childish!

 

[Brazen]

Originally posted by: doornail
So ... anyone try the new Gnome yet?

With a little looking, I found a linux disto called Foresight Linux (it's homepage says it is specifically for showcasing Gnome) that has Gnome 2.14. I hod hoped maybe I could find a LiveCD, but what I did find was a VMWare image that can be played in the free VMWare Player or any of the VMWare products.

edit: Just realized, even though the LiveCD section on the Gnome website says the latest livecd is 2.12, I clicked on the download location for 2.12 and at the very bottom was an ISO for the 2.14 LiveCD - here.

 

[Seeruk]

Originally posted by: Brazen

LOL, the irony is, it's people like you who turn these discussions childish![/quote]

Care to explain? Or are you spouting crap as usual

 

[Sunner]

Originally posted by: Seeruk
http://www.ctsplace.com/cts_board/about1007.html

"I had surgery july 28th.05 Been through alot of PT, and nothing is working. I cant put any pressure on my right wrist. Burning pain from shooting up arm, then alot of aching. I dont know what to do any more.
Dr. says maybe get a little better, but doesent hold out much hope. Plus iam on workmans comp. And who knows how long they will deal with this.
Has anyone been through this? And if so what did you do? Please anyone help. Dont know how much more i can take. "

Very very typical of the success rate of surgery.

You'll have to excuse me if I don't take anecdotes as evidence of anything.
Anyways, sidetracking the thread slightly, I was just bored really...

 

[Seeruk]

Originally posted by: Sunner

Originally posted by: Seeruk
http://www.ctsplace.com/cts_board/about1007.html

"I had surgery july 28th.05 Been through alot of PT, and nothing is working. I cant put any pressure on my right wrist. Burning pain from shooting up arm, then alot of aching. I dont know what to do any more.
Dr. says maybe get a little better, but doesent hold out much hope. Plus iam on workmans comp. And who knows how long they will deal with this.
Has anyone been through this? And if so what did you do? Please anyone help. Dont know how much more i can take. "

Very very typical of the success rate of surgery.

You'll have to excuse me if I don't take anecdotes as evidence of anything.
Anyways, sidetracking the thread slightly, I was just bored really...

Anecdotes?? You mean the experiences of sufferers are worthless because you obviously know better or something?

You must have been bored to post something so idiotic

 

[Sunner]

Originally posted by: Seeruk
Anecdotes?? You mean the experiences of sufferers are worthless because you obviously know better or something?

You must have been bored to post something so idiotic

Yes, the anecdotal evidence of one person is useless.
For every one of those, you can find another that came out fine, one that ate some pills made out of grinded rhino horns and got cured, etc etc.
All are equally useless.

 

[Seeruk]

OK you are right. CTS doesnt exist, its imaginary and caused by people not benchpressing enough down at the sweatbox.

:roll: