GOP Rep asks for Obamacare horror stories

[ivwshane]

Yes. That's why I do my own fact checking using the opposing parties numbers. Like my post just above this one.

So far I've noticed the liberal lies far outweigh the conservative lies.

edit: I'll give you a chance to review my math before you apologize.

We don't need to review your math, we need to see your source.



http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/attachments/49892-breakout-AppendixB.pdf

 

[MomentsofSanity]

Please link directly to primary sources for your cost estimates.

It is abundantly clear you have no idea what you're talking about, but if you point us to your source we can show you where you made the mistake or were lied to.

I see where he's getting his numbers now. That claim that look at at gross costs only of Medicaid expansion and exchange subsidies and ignored tax revenues and cost reductions. Even the CBO themselves debunked that claim.

 

[fskimospy]

Yes. That's why I do my own fact checking using the opposing parties numbers. Like my post just above this one.

So far I've noticed the liberal lies far outweigh the conservative lies.

edit: I'll give you a chance to review my math before you apologize.

Look, I already know you're wrong because I know a lot more about this issue and this bill than you do. The only question is where your error happens to be coming from. My guess is that you aren't doing apples to apples comparisons between years or you're adding in magical extra costs that the CBO doesn't address.

Just link your sources so we can find out which one it is. Don't dig yourself deeper, it will just be more embarrassing later for you.

 

[ivwshane]

I stopped believing the liberal lies years ago. I still recommend the same to you.
(Even though I know you'll keep hating the repubs/conservatives/anyone-but-obie no matter what... just because the liberal media keeps telling you to)

You probably were too busy nodding your head yes, but just review what the repub hater said line by line with an open mind. Even you should see the lies and exaggeration. I'll hope.

Sorry bud, I get my news from multiple sources, even right wing. That's how I know when posters like you are full of shit and are simply regurgitating talking points.

 

[ttown]

Please link directly to primary sources for your cost estimates.

It is abundantly clear you have no idea what you're talking about, but if you point us to your source we can show you where you made the mistake or were lied to.

I'm having trouble finding the CBO document from 6 years ago... but here's something i'm sure you'll believe: http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...&mid=E647FDB777C3217D2AA8E647FDB777C3217D2AA8

If my link is bad, search for "Obama 900 billion"

Here's the cbo link (credit to whoever above): http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/attachments/49892-breakout-AppendixB.pdf

 

[ivwshane]

I'm having trouble finding the CBO document... but here's something i'm sure you'll believe: http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...&mid=E647FDB777C3217D2AA8E647FDB777C3217D2AA8

If my link is bad, search for "Obama 900 billion"

Lol! Did you just fucking link to youtube videos! Holy shit! We've got another nutter!

 

[fskimospy]

I'm having trouble finding the CBO document... but here's something i'm sure you'll believe: http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...&mid=E647FDB777C3217D2AA8E647FDB777C3217D2AA8

If my link is bad, search for "Obama 900 billion"

Oh look. All of a sudden when challenged you can't find the source for your numbers despite claiming you fact checked them yourself previously.

You said CBO, not YouTube video. Show us the primary source. CBO estimates of the ACA have been big news in recent years and I've read all of them. Like I said before I already know you can't back up your numbers using the CBO because you're full of shit.

Looks like those conservatives might have been lying more after all, huh.

 

[fskimospy]

I'm having trouble finding the CBO document from 6 years ago... but here's something i'm sure you'll believe: http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...&mid=E647FDB777C3217D2AA8E647FDB777C3217D2AA8

If my link is bad, search for "Obama 900 billion"

Here's the cbo link (credit to whoever above): http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/attachments/49892-breakout-AppendixB.pdf

Yep, just as I guessed, not apples to apples dates. The $2 trillion number is from 2016-2025 while the initial estimates were for 2010-2019.

Apologize for being an idiot whenever you feel ready.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

I'm having trouble finding the CBO document from 6 years ago... but here's something i'm sure you'll believe: http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...&mid=E647FDB777C3217D2AA8E647FDB777C3217D2AA8

If my link is bad, search for "Obama 900 billion"

Here's the cbo link (credit to whoever above): http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/attachments/49892-breakout-AppendixB.pdf

Man you just insist on digging. The report shows gross cost increase of 1.993T. It also shows cost offsets of 643B. That is a net cost of 1.35 which is less than initial estimates. This is the fifth time they've reduced cost estimates from the initial report.

For your own link.

CBO and JCT currently estimate that the ACA’s coverage provisions will result in net costs to the federal govern- ment of $76 billion in 2015 and $1,350 billion over the 2016–2025 period. Compared with the projection from last April, which spanned the 2015–2024 period, the cur- rent projection represents a downward revision in the net costs of those provisions of $101 billion over those 10 years, or a reduction of about 7 percent.2

 

[fskimospy]

Man you just insist on digging. The report shows gross cost increase of 1.993T. It also shows cost offsets of 643B. That is a net cost of 1.35 which is less than initial estimates. This is the fifth time they've reduced cost estimates from the initial report.

For your own link.

He was trying to talk total outlays. His argument is deeply silly anyway but really all it boils down to is that he didn't notice that the CBOs original ten year estimate and this one cover dramatically different date ranges.

He just didn't know how to read the report, which is ironic considering how much shit he was talking.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

He was trying to talk total outlays. His argument is deeply silly anyway but really all it boils down to is that he didn't notice that the CBOs original ten year estimate and this one cover dramatically different date ranges.

He just didn't know how to read the report, which is ironic considering how much shit he was talking.

Yup. And wasted effort as he will either ignore it or double down. No willingness to break the bubble there im sure.

 

[ttown]

Oh look. All of a sudden when challenged you can't find the source for your numbers despite claiming you fact checked them yourself previously.

You said CBO, not YouTube video. Show us the primary source. CBO estimates of the ACA have been big news in recent years and I've read all of them. Like I said before I already know you can't back up your numbers using the CBO because you're full of shit.

Looks like those conservatives might have been lying more after all, huh.

Yes -- the CBO said the exact same thing 6 years ago. I was interested in this topic way back then, too. Sorry I didn't save a copy. I should have predicted the liberal's revisionist history and their attempts to say that however many trillions the aca costs is wonderful since it's a savings of over 90% of that number of trillions times 11.

I think it's funny that you and the guy above you a post or 2 are discrediting me since I linked to Obama's very own words. LOL.

Anyway... feel free to find something wrong with my math.

Before you give me a hard time about my 26.67% figure, I do need to correct it since I was using old data. Per the CBO linked previously, the number of uninsured without the ACA is 55,000,000... not the 45,000,000 Obama and the democrats lied to us about.

So, to correct the math: 12,000,000 newly insured thanks to the obamacare trainwreck / 55,000,000 uninsured without obamacare = 21.81% Sorry that's. worse than I previously reported. I'll try not to give the ACA so much credit next time.

Enjoy... and be sure to watch that video a few more times, even though i'm sure it's painful.

 

[fskimospy]

I already did point out where your math was wrong. You're comparing two ten year estimates that cover totally different time periods. The original CBO estimates are still available in case you want to check them. If you notice this was my first guess as to why you came to such a ridiculous conclusion.

The first thing you do when you're in a hole is stop digging. You fucked up and said something obviously wrong. Just own it and move on. Hopefully in the future you will be a little more careful when doing your 'fact checking'.

 

[Jhhnn]

I already did point out where your math was wrong. You're comparing two ten year estimates that cover totally different time periods. The original CBO estimates are still available in case you want to check them. If you notice this was my first guess as to why you came to such a ridiculous conclusion.

The first thing you do when you're in a hole is stop digging. You fucked up and said something obviously wrong. Just own it and move on. Hopefully in the future you will be a little more careful when doing your 'fact checking'.

The reason he came to an erroneous conclusion is because it's what he wants to believe. That's the same reason he won't admit to error, as well.

Expect a flipitty-flop into "I jus know..."

 

[fskimospy]

The reason he came to an erroneous conclusion is because it's what he wants to believe. That's the same reason he won't admit to error, as well.

Expect a flipitty-flop into "I jus know..."

My guess is a transition "well that's the cost estimate for the next ten years now and that's what counts!" without any acknowledgement that he's either a dumbass or a liar for his previous posts.

The one thing I'm pretty confident about is that there will be no post where he says "you know, I got it wrong and it looks like the predictions of the liberals were right after all. Maybe they aren't the liars that I thought."

 

[ivwshane]

My guess is a transition "well that's the cost estimate for the next ten years now and that's what counts!" without any acknowledgement that he's either a dumbass or a liar for his previous posts.

The one thing I'm pretty confident about is that there will be no post where he says "you know, I got it wrong and it looks like the predictions of the liberals were right after all. Maybe they aren't the liars that I thought."

I doubt it. These people who post youtube videos to back their claims are extremely ignorant or gullible. The only thing they don't seem susceptible to are cold hard facts.


CBD may not be classified as a disease but it should be.

 

[ttown]

I already did point out where your math was wrong. You're comparing two ten year estimates that cover totally different time periods. The original CBO estimates are still available in case you want to check them. If you notice this was my first guess as to why you came to such a ridiculous conclusion.

The first thing you do when you're in a hole is stop digging. You fucked up and said something obviously wrong. Just own it and move on. Hopefully in the future you will be a little more careful when doing your 'fact checking'.

I stand partially corrected.
You are correct that I erred by using the first 10 year projection compared to the new 10 year projection after obamacare has been (mostly) enacted and available to people since 2014. I don't think it's fair to say it's a "totally different time period" -- since Obama was responsible for delaying implementation for many years so as not to anger the dems voting base of not very smart people.

However, I'll concede to using figures from 2014 - 2024 instead of 2015 - 2025 which included one of the highest single-year costs.

Allow me to re-do the math with the corrected (or at least very good and reasonable guess for 2014) time period.

Original 10 year cost projection: $900,000,000,000

2015-*2024* cost projection: $2,069,000,000,000 - $145,000,000,000 (for 2025) = $1,924,000,000,000
Add back a low ball guess of $80,000,000,000 for 2014, the first year of true implementation: $2,004,000,000,000 (feel free to research the actual number that is probably slightly different... I chose the 2015 estimate, rounded down to avoid losing you in the weeds)

$2,004,000,000,000 / $900,000,000,000 = 2.23x original estimates

A little less than my initial post (that showed the math) of 2.298X, but not quite enough for you and others to get frenzied about, imo.
If you still have problems with the math, maybe you can try pointing it out without name-calling like liberals usually do. Name-callers lose by default.

And thanks for catching my year error. But I'm surprised you didn't notice the $900bb was from the "original" first 10yr estimate, considering you said you read all of them. It was a pretty well talked about number.


And slightly off topic: The CBO report shows costs increasing over time -- just like Conservatives predicted. Score another truth for the Conservatives.

(I still chuckle at the other guy that got all uppity when I linked a video of Obama talking about the $900bb. It's as if he knows instinctively that Obama was lying, so a video showing his lie must be a lie too.... or something like that. Kind of funny)

 

[ttown]

The reason he came to an erroneous conclusion is because it's what he wants to believe. That's the same reason he won't admit to error, as well.

Expect a flipitty-flop into "I jus know..."

Oh look... another false assumption made by a liberal.
Nope -- read the post above. I'm sorry I was one year off and have adjusted the numbers accordingly.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

Oh look... another false assumption made by a liberal.
Nope -- read the post above. I'm sorry I was one year off and have adjusted the numbers accordingly.

All you have succeeded in doing is demonstrate you have no idea what you are talking about.

The Medicaid expansions and subsidies for the ACA didn't begin until 2014. You are using 4 years of no cost outlays out of 10 and comparing it to 10 full years. Of course the number is going to be substantially higher.

Now. If you look at 2014-2019 in the original estimate and those same years in the 2014 estimate You'd at least be honest. I challenge you to do the actual comparison and come back and say it's 2-3 times higher. I'll even give you the links to both years estimates.

2010
https://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/amendreconprop.pdf

2014
https://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/45231-ACA_Estimates.pdf

There was a nominal increase and that was only due to the rulings about state exchanges. The most recent estimate for 2015 reduces the numbers from now to 2019 a further 21 billion from 2014's estimates.

 

[ivwshane]

As everyone has already pointed out to you, you have no idea what the fuck you are talking about.

To help dumb it down for you feel free to read this article:

http://useconomy.about.com/od/healthcarereform/a/Cost-of-Obamacare.htm

Time to get some new sources of info buddy

I stand partially corrected.
You are correct that I erred by using the first 10 year projection compared to the new 10 year projection after obamacare has been (mostly) enacted and available to people since 2014. I don't think it's fair to say it's a "totally different time period" -- since Obama was responsible for delaying implementation for many years so as not to anger the dems voting base of not very smart people.

However, I'll concede to using figures from 2014 - 2024 instead of 2015 - 2025 which included one of the highest single-year costs.

Allow me to re-do the math with the corrected (or at least very good and reasonable guess for 2014) time period.

Original 10 year cost projection: $900,000,000,000

2015-*2024* cost projection: $2,069,000,000,000 - $145,000,000,000 (for 2025) = $1,924,000,000,000
Add back a low ball guess of $80,000,000,000 for 2014, the first year of true implementation: $2,004,000,000,000 (feel free to research the actual number that is probably slightly different... I chose the 2015 estimate, rounded down to avoid losing you in the weeds)

$2,004,000,000,000 / $900,000,000,000 = 2.23x original estimates

A little less than my initial post (that showed the math) of 2.298X, but not quite enough for you and others to get frenzied about, imo.
If you still have problems with the math, maybe you can try pointing it out without name-calling like liberals usually do. Name-callers lose by default.

And thanks for catching my year error. But I'm surprised you didn't notice the $900bb was from the "original" first 10yr estimate, considering you said you read all of them. It was a pretty well talked about number.


And slightly off topic: The CBO report shows costs increasing over time -- just like Conservatives predicted. Score another truth for the Conservatives.

(I still chuckle at the other guy that got all uppity when I linked a video of Obama talking about the $900bb. It's as if he knows instinctively that Obama was lying, so a video showing his lie must be a lie too.... or something like that. Kind of funny)

 

[fskimospy]

I stand partially corrected.
You are correct that I erred by using the first 10 year projection compared to the new 10 year projection after obamacare has been (mostly) enacted and available to people since 2014. I don't think it's fair to say it's a "totally different time period" -- since Obama was responsible for delaying implementation for many years so as not to anger the dems voting base of not very smart people.

However, I'll concede to using figures from 2014 - 2024 instead of 2015 - 2025 which included one of the highest single-year costs.

Allow me to re-do the math with the corrected (or at least very good and reasonable guess for 2014) time period.

Original 10 year cost projection: $900,000,000,000

2015-*2024* cost projection: $2,069,000,000,000 - $145,000,000,000 (for 2025) = $1,924,000,000,000
Add back a low ball guess of $80,000,000,000 for 2014, the first year of true implementation: $2,004,000,000,000 (feel free to research the actual number that is probably slightly different... I chose the 2015 estimate, rounded down to avoid losing you in the weeds)

$2,004,000,000,000 / $900,000,000,000 = 2.23x original estimates

A little less than my initial post (that showed the math) of 2.298X, but not quite enough for you and others to get frenzied about, imo.
If you still have problems with the math, maybe you can try pointing it out without name-calling like liberals usually do. Name-callers lose by default.

And thanks for catching my year error. But I'm surprised you didn't notice the $900bb was from the "original" first 10yr estimate, considering you said you read all of them. It was a pretty well talked about number.


And slightly off topic: The CBO report shows costs increasing over time -- just like Conservatives predicted. Score another truth for the Conservatives.

(I still chuckle at the other guy that got all uppity when I linked a video of Obama talking about the $900bb. It's as if he knows instinctively that Obama was lying, so a video showing his lie must be a lie too.... or something like that. Kind of funny)

Nope, you still aren't using the right date ranges. As I mentioned before the initial estimates covered something like 2010-2019 and the estimate you cited covered 2016-2025. The year differential was not related to Obama delaying things, it was related solely to your incompetence.

Once you look at the years actually covered by the individual estimates you will see the ACA has actually been considerably cheaper than initially estimated. Since this tells you things you don't want to hear though I'm sure it will be ignored.

You made a lot of claims earlier and talked a lot of shit. You are either an idiot who doesn't know what he is talking about or a liar. There's no other possible answer. The liberals were right. As someone who claims they base their understanding on evidence you should have no problem accepting this.

I won't hold my breath.

 

[Moonbeam]

Imagine a world in which facts and not the group think altered realities ginned up by talking point shepherds to incite the fear of wallet robbing wolves everywhere and fabricated explicitly to keep the sheep coming to the polls to vote conservative, actually had some chance in determining our opinions. What a different world that would be. People like town and millions like mom might actually be able to reason.

 

[SheHateMe]

I remember my mom got a new job about a year before ObummerCare was put into place. I was still in college and still eligible to be covered by her insurance benefits. I remember her calling me one day to tell me that I would have to figure out what to do about health insurance because Blue Cross told her that they would not cover me because I have Diabetes. I was like "fuck...what can I do?".

I ended up having to pay for an independent plan from Blue Cross that was expensive as shit. It wouldn't cover anything for 90 days and to top it off...they told me I had to wait an additional 90 days because I have a pre-existing condition.

So, I told them "no thank you" and did my best to not get hit by a car or get sick during that time I didn't have insurance. My insulin was expensive as hell and I ended up just begging my doc for samples so that I could live (I have type 1).

FF to December 2013, I graduated from college and my mom had lost her job. I had been able to sign up for an ObummerCare plan when there was open enrollment. With that insurance, I was able to get prescriptions for my insulin and get my bloodwork and such done without having to pay everything 100% out of pocket. It was glorious and quite frankly...it saved my life because I was very depressed when I had to beg for samples at the doctor's office and ration off my insulin because I simply could not afford to pay $290 a box for my meds.

That sucked major ass and I will never forget how much that sucked. My bloodsugar was so awful back then, I was merely existing. Just doing enough to keep myself out of a diabetic coma.

 

[Texashiker]

All their predictions of doom and gloom have been proven wrong so she is searching for new lines of attack.

Is that why my daughter-in-law had to drive 2 and a half hours one way to find a doctor that took her insurance?

She needed her gallbladder taken out. The nearest doctor that would take the insurance she bought was on the other side of Houston.

Use mapquest or google maps and go from 75951 to Katy Texas.

 

[ivwshane]

Is that why my daughter-in-law had to drive 2 and a half hours one way to find a doctor that took her insurance?

She needed her gallbladder taken out. The nearest doctor that would take the insurance she bought was on the other side of Houston.

Use mapquest or google maps and go from 75951 to Katy Texas.

Seeing that you support politicians that create laws that essential force women's health clinics to close so that women have to travel pretty damn far, I give exactly....

Karma is a bitch, get to know her