Got pulled over last night

[IcePickFreak]

I noticed around here pretty much all cops now use blue LED pen lights when conducting the field sobriety test on people, in fact it's what they'll make you follow with your eyes for the "follow my finger" part of the test. I find that a bit odd since I've always read about how blue light is the biggest strain on the eyes (opposite of how red is the least and always used for low-light conditions) and can even bug em out a bit.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

How about we stop using 'i love you' as an insult, but otherwise whooz is right on this.

I have a strong desire to slit my wrists and I don't know why....


Oh wait... This is OT. Ok.... My world is ok. Had to double check.

 

[Powermoloch]

good thing I don't drink

yes, 0 sip of alcohol :awe:

but I still got pulled over for doing dumbshit while driving

 

[randomrogue]

I think they told me at driver's school to refuse the field sobriety test. To protect your rights you're better off going down to the station. This allows you more accurate testing and more time to burn off alcohol. You should have done this. I think you're lucky as hell to blow a 02.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

I noticed around here pretty much all cops now use blue LED pen lights when conducting the field sobriety test on people, in fact it's what they'll make you follow with your eyes for the "follow my finger" part of the test. I find that a bit odd since I've always read about how blue light is the biggest strain on the eyes (opposite of how red is the least and always used for low-light conditions) and can even bug em out a bit.

so for that test I don't think it was that bad for me with the LED light. As long as they don't shine it in your eye, it's not gonna bug you.

I was following his finger, but I messed up about 2/3 or 3/4 in when he started going up down. I moved my head, but I caught myself and said "Sorry, I moved my head." He did it again and I tracked, fine, but that was the end where he moved his finger into my nose and I guess I was supposed to go cross-eyed.

Upon reading more of the rules, I probably came close to failing the heel-toe test. One of the instructions says to mark a point if I don't stay heel-toe during the instructions. I do remember him showing me what I'm going to do, but this is where I'm a bit annoyed. He didn't say to stay like that while he was going to do the walk himself and show me how to pivot. He didn't tell me to stay in heel-toe formation while watching. I found it uncomfortable. Not that I was going to fall, but I believe I relaxed a little during his instructions. Heck I just tried standing heel toe and standing still. I can't even stand completely still. There's a bit of imbalance in the pose as it is even when sober. The other points seem very easy to score if they really want to get you for a DUI.

interesting read: http://www.shouselaw.com/fst.html

 

[olds]

.... I was confident that I was ok though, especially knowing the 1 drink per hour rule, and feeling just fine.

....

According to AAA (I teach their Defensive Driving Course), that rule only applies to males over 250 #. For everyone else, it take about 2 hours.

 

[Newbian]

When defendant Newbian was asked to recite the alphabet backwards, he stated, --- Heck, I can't even do that sober.

Good point but sadly it's kinda true as it is a pain to do the song backwards.

 

[alkemyst]

Good point but sadly it's kinda true as it is a pain to do the song backwards.

The funny part of this was in my DUI the cop asked me to say the alphabet, I swore he said backwards (I mean, who couldn't say it forwards). It didn't help he was roadside while having me do all this on the middle line of a road that had cars going up and down it.

He had on his report "Driver began reciting alphabet incoherently: First attempt, z,y,x,w,v...stopped and asked them to start where they left off [now instead of telling me to start over, he said where I left off]. Second attempt: u,t,s,r,q,p....stopped driver again repeated instructions to start where they left off....third attempt, o,n....stopped driver. Driver almost fell several times during alphabet [this would have been me getting the F out of the way of a car flying down the road]. My lawyer had a copy of the video, he wanted to sue for indangerment...I just wanted to get back on with my life.

I was stopped in front of where I was living at the time...the chick I was breaking up with that weekend called a cop to wait for me that she hung out with I had found later.

I had my beer tab with me...I started drinking at 6pm or so and it was 2am...I believe it was 4 beers I had (I forget now, it was 10 years+ ago)...it may have been 6. regardless it should have been impossible for me to blow a .168 like I did (edit: in the cops defense, yes just because I had a beer tab with me doesn't mean I went somewhere else, had someone buying me drinks/paid cash, or had a bottle with me...however; I know that was all I drank and I was sort of pissed I was milking drinks that night since I needed to save money for moving out). The only way I figure that was able to happen was due to me splitting the entire bottom of my lip that morning while fighting with my ex...she had this pull out shelf that was extended about chin level, I went storming around the corner to grab my wallet and keys to let her know I'd be moving out the next day. As I turned I clipped the sharp edge full speed. My bottom teeth and the shelf touched after going through my lip about 2" across. I was a mess until about noon.

It was still bleeding a bit even middle of the following week. I probably should have gotten stitched up. I was also the biggest reason I was slurring and I told the officer several times. I was also hard for me to blow on the breath test and the first time I shot blood all out the bottom of my mouth. It was the most fucked up night I have had.

 

[Whisper]

I think they can politely suspend your license if you do that, though. Maybe it varies state to state, I'm not sure.

I know that in GA, your license is automatically suspended if you refuse the breathalyzer; I'd imagine most other states are the same. Not sure about refusing the sobriety tests, but I wouldn't be surprised if the penalty was the same.

As for the person who asked if they can still arrest you for DUI if you pass the breathalyzer but "fail" the sobriety tests--it probably depends on the law, but I believe technically they can, as they tests are meant to assess motor/coordination impairment. Whether or not the charges would actually "stick," though, is another matter.

 

[alkemyst]

Breathalyzer only measures BAL...so if you are doped up it wouldn't show. This is the loophole the cop can use to still make an arrest.

That said, at least in Florida...not blowing a failure even if that means refusing the breath test and taking the automatic suspension puts you in a MUCH better defence seat to beat the charge.

In fact, most lawyers will tell you a 1st offense is not worth the cost of trying to defend it if you failed the breath test (assuming a basic non-incident traffic stop). Not only that but if you do try and fight it, you cannot drive at all until you win or lose your case. If you pay it out, you can be driving within 3 months. If you fight it your first court date alone is usually 12 months out. Then you usually have to have another or two just due to the way they handle it.

A lot of judges around here are not in agreement with the mandatory minimums and all the other BS. In fact, my judge acknowledged 'something was up' with the way I was stopped and she had review my video and called it 'ridiculous I was put in that situation'. The cop didn't show for the trial...that doesn't change anything.

She gave me all the minimums, let me pay $10/hr for my community service (40 hours I think, maybe 80)...I cut a check for the ~$2000 and then fast tracked the rest of the bullshit you have to do. I think when I was done it was right around $5000 I was out of pocket over it. My insurance never was affected.

 

[newParadigm]

It's best not to lie to the cop, the next question will be where did you just come from, etc.

Either choose to answer his questions or not, but lying is going to get you screwed.

Keep in mind the best advice if you know you will fail a breath test, is to refuse it.

It's a lot easier to fight that in court than if you blow a failure. There are lots of reasons one can use why they didn't want to blow. Fear of AIDS can be one. Yes, you automatically forfeit your license, but you'd do the same in a failed breathe test.

You can legally refuse field side tests as well...they are not a requirement and just extra evidence for court.

Just did some research. There is a legal difference in all states (except Montana) between the breathe test done at the road side, and the breath test done at the station, after you have been arrested.

The roadside breathe test (PAS) is used to determine probable cause for the arrest, while the second test done at the station after the arrest, is used as evidence against you. If you refuse both the feild sobriety tests and the roadside breathe test, the officers have to determine if they have probable cause to arrest you based on your driving before your were pulled over, and you conduct with the officers during the stop. Even if you fail the BAC test at the station, your lawyer could potentially get the case thrown out if he can prove that there was insufficient probable cause for the initial arrest.

Also, the only state that imposes penalties for refusing the road side breath test is Montana, while almost all states impose penalties for refusing the BAC test at the police station (because these penalties are often DMV as opposed to court imposed, they can stay in effect even if you are cleared and the charges are dropped).

Hope that clears things up a bit...

~newParadigm

 

[CRXican]

It's best to say you haven't had anything to drink. The default answer they always hear is "I had two beers." No matter how much you try to down play the number it's a mistake because you admitted to drinking.

Even if you came from a bar that doesn't mean you were drinking. As for the eye test it sounds like you don't know what that's for either. Moving your head isn't what they're looking for although that does show you've got issues if you keep moving it.

They're looking for Nystagmus: http://www.avvo.com/legal-guides/ugc/dui-field-sobriety-tests-nystagmus-the-eye-test

Good lawyers will look at this test to discredit the officer since they don't train much on it and are not "smart" enough or expert enough to really know what they're seeing.

From the link up there:

Under federal standards, the officer is supposed to use an objective scoring criteria for each of the three tests, and the total score determines whether the suspect passed or failed. In reality, few officers understand the test, administer it correctly, or use objective scoring. Many simply report that they “detected the presence of nystagmus”, and subjectively count that as a failure. It is, however, the characteristics of nystagmus, not the simple presence, which is relevant to determining possible impairment. And, unfortunately, many things cause nystagmus and some of us have it under normal conditions.

 

[alkemyst]

That is correct I believe, I don't want to speak for all counties/states.

Probable cause is very hard to beat except in road blocks or non-moving violations (yes, in my 'classes' about 20% of the class were never driving when they were arrested for DUI). While driving, like in my police report...they will write in...how you passed over a line, stopped abruptly, swayed while being spoken too, slurred your words, smelled like alcohol, etc...all things that are totally subjective.

The long and short of it is if you never get measured, your lawyer has a much easier task of getting you off. This is only assuming you were simply stopped and didn't crash into anything or anyone.

 

[alkemyst]

It's best to say you haven't had anything to drink. The default answer they always hear is "I had two beers." No matter how much you try to down play the number it's a mistake because you admitted to drinking.

Even if you came from a bar that doesn't mean you were drinking. As for the eye test it sounds like you don't know what that's for either. Moving your head isn't what they're looking for although that does show you've got issues if you keep moving it.

They're looking for Nystagmus: http://www.avvo.com/legal-guides/ugc/dui-field-sobriety-tests-nystagmus-the-eye-test

Good lawyers will look at this test to discredit the officer since they don't train much on it and are not "smart" enough or expert enough to really know what they're seeing.

From the link up there:

This is true, only if you haven't failed a blow / blood test. That's where all all the mandatory stuff comes in.

You are right though, most cops really can't accurately measure nystagmus. I'd be willing to bet 75%+ of every cop in the US would fail a basic 75 question test on it and the landmarks to look for.

Add that to the fact that they also don't ever get a baseline on the person arrested.

A lot of the testing was created to maximize the arrests. They are very profitable despite the law saying it costs them money.

Even the founder of MADD is against the way her fight turned out today. She swears people should be able to have a drink or two and drive home.

0.08% only killed people when that accident was going to happen anyway.

performance at 0.08% varies greatly between people.

performance at 0.10% much more so...keep going.

If you pounded down 12 drinks in an hour and hopped into your car, then yeah you are fucked and should be.

 

[911paramedic]

I got trapped at a DUI checkpoint and the cop asked if I had been drinking that night. I said the truth, that I had one drink about three hours previous. He had me follow a pen light with my eyes, then sent me on my merry way.

I've asked people what they would do, and it's either telling the truth like I did or lying and saying you haven't been drinking at all, to avoid a field test (which you might fail). They justify this because you clearly knew you were under the DUI limit, so why set yourself up for failing a test even though you are sober. My feeling is you never want to lie to a cop, because you never know where the lying might lead.

It will lead to a charge of giving false information to a leo, that much is for sure.

I find that a little hypocritical when you consider they can lie to a certain degree during interrogation.

 

[KlokWyze]

It's best to say you haven't had anything to drink. The default answer they always hear is "I had two beers." No matter how much you try to down play the number it's a mistake because you admitted to drinking.

Even if you came from a bar that doesn't mean you were drinking. As for the eye test it sounds like you don't know what that's for either. Moving your head isn't what they're looking for although that does show you've got issues if you keep moving it.

They're looking for Nystagmus: http://www.avvo.com/legal-guides/ugc/dui-field-sobriety-tests-nystagmus-the-eye-test

Good lawyers will look at this test to discredit the officer since they don't train much on it and are not "smart" enough or expert enough to really know what they're seeing.

From the link up there:

Great points. You always to keep a tight lip around cops. Be polite/curteous, but be able to defend yourself. They are out to make criminals out of whoever they can. Don't give them any reasons to target you.

 

[Fenixgoon]

This is true, only if you haven't failed a blow / blood test. That's where all all the mandatory stuff comes in.

You are right though, most cops really can't accurately measure nystagmus. I'd be willing to bet 75%+ of every cop in the US would fail a basic 75 question test on it and the landmarks to look for.

Add that to the fact that they also don't ever get a baseline on the person arrested.

A lot of the testing was created to maximize the arrests. They are very profitable despite the law saying it costs them money.

Even the founder of MADD is against the way her fight turned out today. She swears people should be able to have a drink or two and drive home.

0.08% only killed people when that accident was going to happen anyway.

performance at 0.08% varies greatly between people.

performance at 0.10% much more so...keep going.

If you pounded down 12 drinks in an hour and hopped into your car, then yeah you are fucked and should be.

just as an FYI, the old breathalyzer tests were based off of a reaction with chromium, IIRC, that had multiple steps, which could lead to false (and very high) alcohol breath readings. this method was challenged in court and eventually thrown out, which led to breathalyzers as we know them today.

modern breathalyzers are based on fourier transform infrared spectroscopy (FTIR), which is a very precise method of measuring alcohol content.

no one's beaten that in court...yet


one of my science teachers was a very practical guy, to say the least

 

[runzwithsizorz]

Good point but sadly it's kinda true as it is a pain to do the song backwards.

LOL, and here I thought I was the only one who, by habit/rote instinctively did that. Officer wrote on my report, "suspect recited alphabet in rhyme".
This is why most lawyers will tell you to refuse the field test, and to say as little as possible, and yes, even lie. Lord knows over ten thousand lies will be told on the witness stand, under oath, by cops, TOMORROW! In most cases, if the cop asks you to step outside your vehicle, he's already made up his mind, the rest is just damning evidence gathering.

 

[OutHouse]

For future reference: You are not required by law to perform roadside sobriety tests, you can politely refuse.

In colirado, doing that is automatic suspension of your DL. Stop giving bullshit advice.

 

[cuppkake]

In colirado, doing that is automatic suspension of your DL. Stop giving bullshit advice.

Hm, I am not familiar with colirado, where is that located?

 

[thegimp03]

I'm guessing they don't let you leave if you refuse the test.

My buddy passed all the field sobriety tests, but refused the breathalyzer and the cops took him to jail and did a test there. We picked him up at the jail a couple hours later when we had found someone else to drive us there and he said the results would be mailed within 3 weeks. So he spends 3 weeks analyzing about how much he'd had to drink and thinking about whether he'd gotten a DUI or not. The report finally got delivered after 3 weeks and had the bad news he'd been dreading all along. He got a fine of $1,600 and had to do a bunch of community service, couldn't drive for 4 months or so, etc.

The crappy part was that he didn't get pulled over because of a DUI checkpoint or a cop tailing him down the road. Another person was drunk sitting in the back seat, found a package of Top Ramen packages and started throwing them one-by-one out the window of the moving car. Some random guy driving behind my friend calls 911 and follows my friend home. Two police cars and a paddy wagon show up to grab my friend as he gets home and initiate the field sobriety tests...

 

[Macamus Prime]

If most of you aren't allowed to drive while drunk,... how the hell are you going to go home and beat your families?!?

Damn oppressive cops!!

 

[newParadigm]

In colirado, doing that is automatic suspension of your DL. Stop giving bullshit advice.

Yeah, I'm not sure that I'm going to take the advice of someone who can't even spell the name of the state the live in correctly...

 

[alkemyst]

In colirado, doing that is automatic suspension of your DL. Stop giving bullshit advice.

AFAIK FST's are not required. Perhaps post up the law for us.

 

[ichy]

If I knew I was below the limit and I was given a choice between field sobriety tests and a breathalyzer I'd choose the breathalyzer, even a crappy portable one. The reliability of field sobriety tests is a joke, and you stand a decent chance of failing them even if you're sober.

I had a friend, fairly big guy (6'4, 200 pounds) who had one drink over the course of an evening. He got pulled over, failed every FST (he's an uncoordinated klutz) and then blew a .02. It boggles my mind that discredited, unscientific BS like FSTs are even allowed anymore.