Gotta love those PETA people.

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unxpurg8d

Golden Member
Apr 7, 2000
1,373
0
71


Open season on New Yorkers 'cause of the lack of housing...hmmmm. Gives new meaning to "apartment hunting".


 

SmiZ

Senior member
Oct 6, 2000
869
0
0
Humans have run the natural predators of deer out of most areas. This means something has to take it's place. Even if the population in your area is not out of control, it is heading that way. Deer breed just like anything else, and with nothing to hold their numbers down, they soon take over all resources available to them.

If you ever have the unfortunate experience of watching an animal starve, I think you might change your tune about hunting.

Your comment about taking out new yorkers because of lack of apartment space is humorous. Take a look at the overpopulation thread in this forum. Humans are no exception to the laws of nature, and we're headed in the same direction of overpopulation that deer have already reached in many areas. Good luck trying to implement a hunting system to thin our numbers though.


Take a look at insurance costs and deaths that can be attributed to deer overpopulation. I live in upper New York state and know many people personally who have hit deer on the roads here. Some did not survive. Having less deer would not solve this problem, but it would help.

Hunters pay for licenses, then go out and do a service for the community that would have to be done anyway. Can you imagine garbage men paying for the right to collect your trash?

I am all for the humane treatment of animals, but sometimes thining their numbers is the kindest thing we can do.
 

chansen

Golden Member
Oct 9, 1999
1,133
0
71
Well done, unxpurg8d.

Oh, and for future flames, I would appreciate it if you could make an effort to compose a rebuttal that does not use the word "suck" or any of its' derivatives. Not only will your efforts result in a better forum, but they will add an illusion of credibility to your arguements.

Regards,
Craig
 

SmiZ

Senior member
Oct 6, 2000
869
0
0


<< , I would appreciate it if you could make an effort to compose a rebuttal that does not use the word &quot;suck&quot; or any of its' derivatives >>




Who was that directed at?
 

chansen

Golden Member
Oct 9, 1999
1,133
0
71
SmiZ, definitely not you. Thank you for a well-written response. Yes, I understand the need (I just don't like it). I'm sure that some of my arguements sound as ridiculous as those of George W. Bush supporters.

On your driving point, I too have nearly been taken out by a deer. I was also driving too fast. Not that all deer-auto incidents are entirely the driver's fault, but the deer are rarely able to come &quot;out of nowhere&quot; on highways.

Then again, I'm afraid of what I might do if confronted with hitting any animal or swerving into a tree. I'm quite sure that my decision would be based on whether or not there were other occupants in the car and how many of them had air bags. I agree that I am biased on the side of animals. My arguement is that someone has to be.

Regards,
Craig
 

veryape

Platinum Member
Jun 13, 2000
2,433
0
0
Mithras,you are wrong. Hunters kill for the thrill of it most times. Otherwise they would buy their deermeat just like they buy hamburger,already dead. I know many so you cannot convince me otherwise.

Who says the deers would die of starvation? I have never heard of that happening,even in places where hunting is outlawed. Its a stupid excuse in my opinion but i'm sure some of you will feel the need to show me otherwise

The PETA people go way to far too often but animals are just as alive as we are and do not need to be harvested when we have enough at the supermarket.

As a vegitarian and a lover of animals and nature I really hate that most of humanity is as ignorant as it is. Since we are killing the overpopulated,why not kill all of Africa,China and any other overpopulated place since we are doing some culling?

Animals survived many years without our help and likely will still be here when we kill ourselves off. We are no more important than animals and when we realize that we will be much better off. It amuses me that when someone really cares for animals they are automatically treehuggers even though they have nothing to do with each other. Thats like me walking around calling hunters murderers,it just does not really apply.

Without our weapons we are NOTHING. And Chansen,I also would rather kill the hunter. Sorry,didn't see you New York overpopulation comparison.
 

chansen

Golden Member
Oct 9, 1999
1,133
0
71
By the sounds of it though, only I would fire a warning shot. I could be convinced of such a tactic...

Regards,
Craig
 

Zucchini

Banned
Dec 10, 1999
4,601
0
0
hehe, peta is just a bunch of nutcases I'm starting to think a strict vegan diet causes your brain to slowly shrivel Well, back to eating my left over KFC mmmm, breakfast
 

sharkeeper

Lifer
Jan 13, 2001
10,886
2
0
PETA is going way too far. They give legitimate organisations such as WWW and Greenpeace a bad name. Saying Dairy is rape and meat is murder is just plain out of line.

This recent push with cows and milk has made them look bad. When they do push for something I agree with (like banning elephants in circuses) people won't take the time to think about it like they should.

Reminds me a few years back when I was behind a person with bumpster stickers touting MEAT IS MURDER. I passed them and looked over at the person. It was a lady probably in her 50's eating a BIG hamburger while driving! I started laughing like a madman! (it's hard to imagine)

Perhaps it was her son's car??? hehehe

Cheers!
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,483
8,344
126
veryape, do you think that it's possible that some of us hunt for BOTH the kill and the food? Hint: most of us do it for both of those reasons.

On the topic of domesticated deer meat - what happens when you domesticate something? It gets fat because that's the way the raisers want them to be. Well, sorry to break it to you, but one of the most attractive qualities about deer meat is it's LACK OF FAT. If you domesticate deer for meat, then you negate that lack of fat quality.

Not to mention the fact that for a $25 permit and a $50 locker fee, a hunter can walk away with up to 100 pounds of deer meet(40-60 pounds is most common). Do you have any idea what it costs for ultra lean hamburger per pound? Answer: about $1.75 a pound. Deer meat is even leaner than the ultra lean hamburger. And then, for another $25 a hunter can apply for a doe only permit for another 40-60 pounds of meat. That is almost 120 of meat for $100.

This also includes lean steaks, sirloins, and hams that you could get from a deer. It is INCREDIBLY cost effective for a hunter to supply the dinner table with deer meat. My unlce who has 4 children can save about 50% when substituting deer meat for domesitcated cow meat from the grocery store.

About the starving and disease thing - come to the midwest. This winter will be a very, very bad winter. Many deer will die because the ground has been covered with snow for almost two months now. It would have been even worse if shotgun season hadn't thinned down the heard. About 7 years ago, the state limited the number of kills that you could have, and dropped several of the different types of seasons. Well, around 100,000 deer died because of disease that year.

I won't even go into the number of automobile accidents that are prevented because of thinned herds. The tons of corn and soybeans that farmers loose a year to deer. Or the hundreds of thousands of dollars of damage that deer do to gardens, flowers, and shrubbery on peoples land.
 

Zucchini

Banned
Dec 10, 1999
4,601
0
0
sharkeeper,

Yup, they don't realize they only cause a backlash worsening any problem they were trying to solve.
 

SmiZ

Senior member
Oct 6, 2000
869
0
0
veryape:

Ignore the facts if you will, believe what you must, but deer do starve every winter.

Deer hunting is a necessary evil. I don't think it's the best thing in the world, and I wouldn't be for it if there was a plausible better way to control deer population. The only better way I can think of is bring the wolves back. (This has been done in some areas with lots of success) This doesn't work, however, in more people populated areas because parents aren't too excited by the posibility of having their children eaten while waiting for the school bus.

Many other methods have been tried with little success. I saw a film about a small town on long island where they had a huge deer problem. The tried birth control (injecting the doe to make them infertile), sharp shooters, and many other methods, but in the end, nothing really worked.

The problem of deer overpopulation was brought about by people. We are the ones who drove the natural predators out of our living spaces because we didn't want them around. Now we are faced with the problems it has caused. Hunting is the best method we have in the current situation.
 

Thorn

Golden Member
Oct 9, 1999
1,665
0
0


<< population would be akin to proposing open season on New Yorkers because there are no good apartments left >>


Fine with me, start with Hillary.

Deer no longer have sufficient predators to keep their pop in check and if it weren't for hunters there would be no end to the disasters caused on highways and agriculture with those vermin running around. Yes, vermin, they may be cute and seemingly gentle but wait until your $16K car gets totaled by an 8 point buck and see how you feel.

Here in East TN the White Tail are a plague, Egypt didn't have nearly as many frogs as we have deer.


On a side note, I got to see an Elk about a week ago in the Smokey Mtn Ntnl Park and it was nothing short of magnificent. I can't wait til these make a good strong comeback so we can bow hunt them. Mmmmmmm... hunting elk with a bow, now THAT is sport!
 

AndrewR

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
11,157
0
0
While some of the tree huggers might hope that a hunter is shot in the confusion, that would actually be the WORST thing to happen to PETA, since someone could make a nice little case against them to bankrupt that worthless organization with legal fees.

The husband of a coworker of mine hunts fairly avidly. He does so for sport and for food, as they prepare and freeze everything from his kills and is apparently quite adept at cooking deer meat. They aren't the richest people around so it definitely helps them save a great deal of money, according to my coworker.

However, I guess it would be better for the deer to starve.
 

Schola

Golden Member
Oct 9, 1999
1,479
0
76
Those PETA people get evertything the deserve Prety stupid idea that one was,

schola
 

Viper GTS

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
38,107
433
136
Mmmmmmm... hunting elk with a bow, now THAT is sport!

There's a herd of 25-30 of them running around up on my hill. My parents have seen them several times, crossing the roads, or moving across fields.

Come'n get 'em if you want.

Viper GTS
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,483
8,344
126


<< Mmmmmmm... hunting elk with a bow, now THAT is sport! >>



No. Hunting Grizzly Bears with a bow is a sport
 

Vikaden

Golden Member
Apr 10, 2000
1,302
0
0
the real way to hunt dear is to find them on the road, turn on the KC lights and open up on them with a Browning .50 cal machine gun
 

GL

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
4,547
0
0
Does anyone know how chickens are &quot;processed&quot; at your local poultry processor? Well, my sister had a lovely tour of one such place when she worked at a computer company a few years ago and they had a contract with the processor. Here's the gist of it:

1) Chickens are hung alive upside down on a moving clothes-line-type belt.
2) Chickens are dipped in water then brought out of the water...alive.
3) Chickens are then exposed to an electric fence and electrocuted...they're now dead.
4) Chickens necks are then cut and everything else processed.

Now, somehow a hunter shooting a deer in a number of place that will ensure an instant kill is a more humane way to die than the more widely accepted way of killing poultry.

I could never shoot a deer myself but I'm glad that there are hunters out there that keep the population of certain animals in line. Let's face it...if they didn't do so, certain animals might go extinct.

-GL
 

UnixFreak

Platinum Member
Nov 27, 2000
2,008
0
76
a &quot;chicken-hugger&quot; now thats what I would like to see. &quot;save the chickens!! they have feelings too!!&quot;
 

Antisocial Virge

Diamond Member
Dec 13, 1999
6,578
0
0
<<.if they didn't do so,
certain animals might go extinct.>>

Wrong. Nature takes care of itself. Been doing it long before hunters were around. Its called carrying capacity. If natural predators don't get them, disease will.
 

GL

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
4,547
0
0
Antisocial-Virge,

What makes you think that man is not part of nature?

-GL
 

Antisocial Virge

Diamond Member
Dec 13, 1999
6,578
0
0
Well man is part of nature but even if you take them out of the equation &quot;nature less man&quot; will still take care of it. Most extinctions are caused by man actually.

Wildlife management is not the management of wildlife its the management of humans. Population too high..hunters hunt more. Population too low..hunters hunt less. You get the point

Actually does anyone have a link to this story? I live in Ohio and I never heard of this but I would love to send a link to my parents.
 
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