Question GPU pricing should clearly be higher across the board, but by how much?

[moonbogg]

The 6600XT is sold out everywhere with pricing between $4-600 roughly. That card would normally cost roughly $2-250. I think gamers are buying these. They aren't getting all snapped up by miners. Also, gamers have shown a willingness to pay $2000 for a 3080Ti on ebay. I think it's clear that if Nvidia and AMD simply increased prices across the board by 2-4X, they'd still sell every card instantly.
What price range do you think people would buy cards at? I propose the following for honestly being perfectly reasonable and acceptable (meaning, people will pay it). If a product instantly sells out, that means people spend no time deliberating. It's a no-brainer purchase which means there is a lot of room left to increase prices until sales start to flatten out a little and normalize. If something sells out instantly you can charge more easily.

I think the following prices moving forward, pandemic or not, would still see every model sell out instantly.

Low-end (X50 class) - $400 (faster than integrated solutions, so should cost more than a high end APU)
X60 - $800 (not a stretch considering 6600XT sold out at $600)
X70 - $1500
X80 - $2000
X80Ti - $2500
Titan - $3000-$5000

 

[Saylick]

I used to think that no one would spend >$1000 for a graphics card, but that belief got blown up once I saw Nvidia release the original Titan, and now that people are willing to spend >$2000 for a graphics card, I feel pretty confident that PC gaming is just becoming more and more of a luxury than ever before. As a whole, we should all stop paying ludicrous and exorbitant prices for graphics cards, but there's always going to be people where PC gaming is their main hobby and are thus willing to pay whatever it takes to get the latest and greatest. I mean, let's be real: PC gaming as a hobby isn't even that expensive relatively speaking. You can buy a nice desktop for a few grand, which is comparable to buying a nice set of golf clubs, camera + lenses, 3D printer, competition pistol/rifle, mountain bike, etc. The point is, there's plenty of hobbies that involve gear/equipment, and the price tag on the nice stuff is within the same price range as a nice PC.

 

[moonbogg]

I bought an Alienware, kept the 3080, and sold the rest of the machine to my brother. So I “only” ended up paying $1200-$1300 for the card.

There is a shortage of silicon hitting multiple industries right now. I’m in the Steam Deck waiting line and just ordered a 3080 laptop last night, so it will be interesting to see how long it takes for those to actually land in my hands.

That's probably the smartest way to get a card right now. The Steam Deck is sold out so hard it's crazy. They say if you don't have one preordered now, you won't have the chance to get one until like 2023 or something crazy like that.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

That's probably the smartest way to get a card right now. The Steam Deck is sold out so hard it's crazy. They say if you don't have one preordered now, you won't have the chance to get one until like 2023 or something crazy like that.

Yeah, my Steam Deck is scheduled for Q2-2022.

I just checked my Legion 7 order and it has slipped from the end of October to the end of November. I’m guessing I won’t see it this year. I knew I should’ve jumped on the Legion 5 Pro with the 3070 which was in stock yesterday.

 

[kondziowy]

For me prices are already too high.
I'm stuck on Vega64 1 year longer than planned. Now I can buy low-end card for the same money as I bought high-end card 3.5 years ago. I don't feel like buying. I probably would buy 6600XT if my card broke down right now, but if this trend continues, I will consider consoles / hobby outside of PC gaming.

I mainly play multiplayer games. Less people buying cards = less players online = I'm out.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I mainly play multiplayer games. Less people buying cards = less players online = I'm out.

Miners score another headshot! /s

 

[jpiniero]

For me prices are already too high.
I'm stuck on Vega64 1 year longer than planned. Now I can buy low-end card for the same money as I bought high-end card 3.5 years ago. I don't feel like buying. I probably would buy 6600XT if my card broke down right now, but if this trend continues, I will consider consoles / hobby outside of PC gaming.

You might be able to get a pretty high amount if you sold the Vega 64. I don't know how you would then get the 6600 XT but you could upgrade for maybe not that much. Worth the effort? I dunno.

 

[Mopetar]

I don't know but I recall people saying Vega was a decent miner so you might be able to at least trade up for something that has better gaming performance. You can probably upgrade without spending money at any rate.

 

[kondziowy]

I would run 6600xt at 3440x1440 on pcie 3.0. Seems like, for me, there is nothing to gain over Vega64. Heck, some benchmarks show a loss in performance at 4K, but at ultra deails which I would not run...

 

[Timorous]

That reminds me, I recently purchased a Navi 23 RDNA 2, but I am having a hard time getting it out of its packaging. The company I bought it from forced me to buy it as part of a pre-built. The packaging is larger then expected, and the GPU is well hidden. I initially thought it would be right behind the center console, but it seems more complicated then that.

Also, I am beginning to realize this excessively over built case also has a lithium battery built into a bottom tray that will be difficult to dispose of. My e-waste recycler is refusing to accept the michelin pilot super sport case rollers. I get they are going for the premium case experience with the whole airbag protection system, but all I want to do is get the GPU out and dump the rest. The build quality and custom OEM parts on these cases is just getting ridiculous! They put a custom water cooling loop with an "octovalve" and a heat pump in for some reason.

It getting downright frustrating to get a GPU out of its packaging these days.

Those plaid cases are pretty impressive.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Another way to address pricing issues is to make sure miners buy mining cards and gamers buy gaming cards. This is done by creating two waiting areas outside of a store for the different customers to wait their turn to enter. Everyone knows how this works and it does work, and it goes like this: Gamers go in first and get their gaming card. They are in an out fast, so no big deal. Mining customers have to wait outside for them to finish, so they will enjoy the shade created by the large shadow cast from overhead in the waiting area. The motivation for treating miners better by giving them shade while gamers have no sun cover (gamers finish sooner after all) can be expressed with the following words:

A little kindness goes a long way
Never ignore a miner on a hot summer's day
Verify their GPU needs and queue them in the shade
It needn't take long, no cause for dismay
Live and let live, thanks for shopping and we hope you enjoyed your stay

What prevents a miner from getting in the gamer line?

 

[klinkman]

I am lucky enough to have a microcenter down the street and went and did the lottery a couple times and ended up with a 3080 ftw3 last week. I knew the resale pricing was crazy, but i didnt realize how much the MSRP has gone up! My last card purchase was another 3080, but it was a founders addition when they first came out and i think it was 699 or 799, right? or maybe i am remembering wrong.
So when i asked the price for the new one last week they said 1399 and i was a bit shocked because i though microcenter was sticking close to MSRP prices... when the employee told me that IS msrp from evga i couldnt believe it. The MSRP has basically doubled since initial release. I know its a third party board with the bells and whistles that come with it, but still, pretty nuts.

All that said, i still bought it as i needed a new card for work. Not sure what the fix is or if there is a good one, but it does suck fighting different kinds of users for the same products, miners vs. gamers vs. 3d professionals .

 

[jpiniero]

So when i asked the price for the new one last week they said 1399 and i was a bit shocked because i though microcenter was sticking close to MSRP prices... when the employee told me that IS msrp from evga i couldnt believe it. The MSRP has basically doubled since initial release. I know its a third party board with the bells and whistles that come with it, but still, pretty nuts.

I'm sure that wasn't the original MSRP of that evga card. Third parties are able to set any MSRP they like.

The 3080 FE's MSRP is indeed $699.

 

[klinkman]

I'm sure that wasn't the original MSRP of that evga card. Third parties are able to set any MSRP they like.

The 3080 FE's MSRP is indeed $699.

You are right, and it made me double check. Microcenter had 3080's and 3080 ti's and i ended up with the ti by the time my spot came up. So i was comparing 3080 founders price to a ti's price. in reality the founders ti is 1199 msrp and the evga was 1399. WAY closer then my initial stupid brain was thinking.
More then i was hoping to spend but oh well.

 

[GodisanAtheist]

For me prices are already too high.
I'm stuck on Vega64 1 year longer than planned. Now I can buy low-end card for the same money as I bought high-end card 3.5 years ago. I don't feel like buying. I probably would buy 6600XT if my card broke down right now, but if this trend continues, I will consider consoles / hobby outside of PC gaming.

I mainly play multiplayer games. Less people buying cards = less players online = I'm out.

-Indeed. Same boat with my 980Ti.

Had $300-400 mentally budgeted away for a monster upgrade off my current card, but it looks like that money is going to go into a nice inflatable Kayak for me instead.

 

[moonbogg]

What prevents a miner from getting in the gamer line?

Gaming cards won't mine. They game. If mining is detected, the card bricks itself, warranty voided, gg no re.

 

[Mopetar]

Gaming cards won't mine. They game. If mining is detected, the card bricks itself, warranty voided, gg no re.

This won't work since one minor screw up and you have the biggest PR nightmare to deal with ever. Look at how much the internet blew up over a small number of high-end Nvidia GPUs getting bricked by an open beta (or whatever it was) and imagine what happens if your cards trip inadvertently.

The anti-mining drivers that Nvidia tried to include basically failed after a week when non-gimped drivers leaked. Even putting that aside there's already some public workarounds that let the crippled cards mine at 70% performance.

Finally, there's nothing preventing someone from developing a new algorithm that isn't flagged by the cards as being mining. Anyone who mines with the cards just stops updating drivers and doesn't care about whatever anti-mining crud gets added. Play this game of whack-a-mole enough and the drivers get bloated and developer time wasted.

 

[NTMBK]

I blame Intel. If they had kept their promises we would all be using 5nm Intel CPUs, nobody would want AMD server or desktop chips, Apple would not have moved away from Intel, and there would be plenty of TSMC capacity to go around for GPUs.

 

[moonbogg]

This won't work since one minor screw up and you have the biggest PR nightmare to deal with ever. Look at how much the internet blew up over a small number of high-end Nvidia GPUs getting bricked by an open beta (or whatever it was) and imagine what happens if your cards trip inadvertently.

The anti-mining drivers that Nvidia tried to include basically failed after a week when non-gimped drivers leaked. Even putting that aside there's already some public workarounds that let the crippled cards mine at 70% performance.

Finally, there's nothing preventing someone from developing a new algorithm that isn't flagged by the cards as being mining. Anyone who mines with the cards just stops updating drivers and doesn't care about whatever anti-mining crud gets added. Play this game of whack-a-mole enough and the drivers get bloated and developer time wasted.

I misspoke. When I said "bricked" I really meant EXPLODE with enough force to destroy the entire PC.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I misspoke. When I said "bricked" I really meant EXPLODE with enough force to destroy the entire PC.

I think that was in one of the later 'Die Hard' movies, the one with the hackers.

 

[ultimatebob]

I honestly don't think that I'd be willing to spend more than $400 on a gaming video card. If I have to spend more than that, I might as well just get a new gaming console.

 

[aigomorla]

I might as well just get a new gaming console.

Only problem is you and the 5 million other people have that same thought, so consoles are now at scalper prices as well.
Its just a horrible year period to be a gamer.

 

[ultimatebob]

Only problem is you and the 5 million other people have that same thought, so consoles are now at scalper prices as well.
Its just a horrible year period to be a gamer.

True, but if I can't get a new gaming console for under $500, I'm not going to buy one of those, either. I guess that I'm going to get really good at Candy Crush on my iPhone while I wait this out

 

[Mopetar]

I misspoke. When I said "bricked" I really meant EXPLODE with enough force to destroy the entire PC.

Hope your PC isn't under your desk next to you when that happens due to programmer error and a bad detection algorithm. Or when someone thinks it would be funny to put out some malware that trips that functionality.

I'd get a really solid metal case. Anything else is going to probably result in a nice burst of shrapnel to the groin. Your idea is award winning! Unfortunately it's a Darwin Award though.

 

[moonbogg]

Hope your PC isn't under your desk next to you when that happens due to programmer error and a bad detection algorithm. Or when someone thinks it would be funny to put out some malware that trips that functionality.

I'd get a really solid metal case. Anything else is going to probably result in a nice burst of shrapnel to the groin. Your idea is award winning! Unfortunately it's a Darwin Award though.

Jokes aside though, I think gaming GPUs should have mining completely disabled. They could charge gamers normal prices and charge miners 4X the price and everyone would be totally fine with this. A device used to play games should have no overlap with a device used to literally print money. It's bad for a lot of reasons. If it catches on in a huge way, you'll have everyone stay home and do nothing.
Who in their right mind would sit in traffic for 4 hours a day and force themselves to pretend like they give a crap about making some other dude rich while their employer holds a metaphorical gun to their head in the form of health insurance and the threat of halting payments needed for outrageous rent costs so their kids have a place to live? Geez, now that I think about it, maybe everyone should quit their jobs and just mine instead...

 

[VirtualLarry]

Who in their right mind would sit in traffic for 4 hours a day and force themselves to pretend like they give a crap about making some other dude rich while their employer holds a metaphorical gun to their head in the form of health insurance and the threat of halting payments needed for outrageous rent costs so their kids have a place to live? Geez, now that I think about it, maybe everyone should quit their jobs and just mine instead...