GTX 780 Ti in 2016: Benchmark vs. GTX 1080, 1070, RX 480, More

Page 2 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.
Status
Not open for further replies.

Atreidin

Senior member
Mar 31, 2011
464
27
86
Interesting find!

Of course, he quoted a post from Dec. 9th and neglected to mention the post from Dec. 13th in the same thread, which is 5 days ago, that mentions that the driver team is aware of the issue and is looking into it. Sounds good, that's totally not troll-like behavior at all. Nope.
 
Reactions: Gikaseixas
Mar 10, 2006
11,715
2,012
126
Of course, he quoted a post from Dec. 9th and neglected to mention the post from Dec. 13th in the same thread, which is 5 days ago, that mentions that the driver team is aware of the issue and is looking into it. Sounds good, that's totally not troll-like behavior at all. Nope.

I hope they get it fixed soon.

Anyway, more on topic, yeah, 780 Ti/Kepler have pretty much run their course. Maxwell/Pascal are much better architectures.
 
Mar 10, 2006
11,715
2,012
126
It's incredible how AMD has used the console advantage to make such a long lasting architecture. It's obvious nVIDIA in these past few years has designed for the short term whereas AMD has designed for the long term.

That's not really a fair characterization. I doubt when NVIDIA's architects sat down to design Kepler, they knew a priori that the architecture wouldn't age well. They made their architectural bets at the time (and those bets were made well in advance of product launch), and it was what it was.

AMD's GCN had advantage of being in long-lasting devices that developers worked to squeeze every last bit out of, which was likely key to the longevity that we are seeing from GCN. GCN itself was also just a really solid architecture at launch.

nVIDIA is still using an architecture with roots all the way back to Fermi so it's impressive that they've come so far on efficiency but I think Volta will be a big change for them in light of GCNs longevity.

Maxwell was a big change from Fermi/Kepler. Volta might be another big change, but who knows what they have cooking with that arch.
 
Mar 10, 2006
11,715
2,012
126
This shows how nVIDIA purposefully designs their architectures to be viable for a 2-year period, then marks them down with inadequacies or abandons driver support for them.

That's really not how chip design works. Nobody wants to build an architecture that doesn't last, because that means having to reinvent the wheel down the line. Building a great base and then wringing more performance by improving it over time is a much smarter strategy than throwing everything out every product cycle or two.

Kepler is a shining example of an architecture touted as the next best things since sliced bread, it’s power efficiency was marketed as a feature versus the more capable GCN HD7000 cards back in the day, but nVidia hid the fact that it couldn't do compute to for shit!

How exactly did NVIDIA hide this? The architecture details were pretty public.

When you can twist the tech media into buying into your hype and have an advantage at the given time in a certain APi (DX11) the masses will flock to your product, the 700$ tag for a 3GB card is/was a rip off of massive proportions, especially when the 290x with 4GB was around 10-15% slower in nVidia favored titles at worst!

At the time, the 780/780 Ti did well in the games that people played. What makes you think that hype was bought?

A deficit it has reclaimed over the years and is still a viable gaming card, all while the 780Ti now has to compromise on the most basic of things like texture resolution for it not to choke.

This fate will befall every graphics card eventually. VRAM requirements rise over time.

What a perfect example of hype over substance. The Maxwell cards are next, they have no muscles to Flex in DX12 and see relatively little gain in Vulkan compared to modern GCN cards.



I see good boosts for 1080 here in Vulkan over OpenGL 4.5. Pascal looks like it's doing OK here to me, which is even more impressive considering how good NVIDIA's OpenGL/DX11 drivers are.

And Pascal will suffer the same fate, it still doesn't see the same gains in DX12 compared to GCN, high core clock can only carry you so far.

Work done per cycle * core clock is the performance equation in a basic sense. There is no shame in getting the performance that you're aiming for by improving the second variable in this equation as long as you can do it efficiently.

And what do you think nVidia’s pitch is going to be for Volta? Full DX12 capabilities, hardware async? The more I look at it the more I see nVidia being the Apple of the GPU world, it looks good when it’s new and hot, but man does it lose value over time, it’s shiny but it ain’t worth the cost relative to the competition. This is why I will never buy another x80 card from nVIDIA ever again.

Apple products tend to hold their value very well (great resale value), and Apple offers OS updates on its older phones, in very stark contrast to practically every other phone maker. I actually think your analogy is correct, but it doesn't negatively reflect on NVIDIA, IMO.

Anyway, I see from your sig that you have a GTX 1070. If you feel so strongly that NVIDIA isn't building products to last, why didn't you choose a product from an alternative vendor?
 
Last edited:
Reactions: Sweepr
Mar 10, 2006
11,715
2,012
126
So is it Nvidia deliberately slowing down old chips or is it the new loads being too much for them? Can't really have it both ways.

The new loads are clearly increasingly difficult for the older Kepler chips. I think that's pretty clearly demonstrated in the benchmarks. Kepler was a design that probably defined circa 2008, made it to market in early 2012, and was forced to last in the marketplace until late 2014 since "big" Maxwell chips didn't arrive until then.
 

stormkroe

Golden Member
May 28, 2011
1,550
97
91
Unbiased observation here, as I currently favor nVidia but have had both brands over the years (I still prefer 3Dfx to either).
Is our current state of gpu longevity really because AMD was frighteningly predictive in the 'long term trend'? Or because they happened to land the contract making gpus for the development targets of 90%+ of all games coming out? Don't get me wrong, they're great, but I think praising their long-game is the tail wagging the dog.
 

greatnoob

Senior member
Jan 6, 2014
968
395
136
This almost feels like a meme. "Kepler! Losing performance since launch!"

Probaby time for 780Ti owners to chime in so they can tell us all the games they cant play anymore.

https://i0.wp.com/www.babeltechreviews.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/Launch-Chart-780-Ti.jpg

Your chart's "Newest games" are from 2013 (oldest being from 2009), how well does the $700 780 TI fare against a $150 1050ti in 2014 and newer games?

EDIT: oldest game from 9 years ago, Crysis.
 
Last edited:

Bacon1

Diamond Member
Feb 14, 2016
3,430
1,018
91


I see good boosts for 1080 here in Vulkan over OpenGL 4.5. Pascal looks like it's doing OK here to me, which is even more impressive considering how good NVIDIA's OpenGL/DX11 drivers are.

The only card I see gaining from Vulkan for Nvidia is the 1080, which appears to be CPU bound prior.. Much like we've seen from DX12 games.

1060? Even

970? Slight loss

1050 Ti? Loss

780 Ti? Big loss

770? Loss

1050? Big loss

So out of the 4 Pascal cards, 3 of them lose performance. I wouldn't say that Pascal is doing OK.
 
Mar 10, 2006
11,715
2,012
126
The only card I see gaining from Vulkan for Nvidia is the 1080, which appears to be CPU bound prior.. Much like we've seen from DX12 games.

1060? Even

970? Slight loss

1050 Ti? Loss

780 Ti? Big loss

770? Loss

1050? Big loss

So out of the 4 Pascal cards, 3 of them lose performance. I wouldn't say that Pascal is doing OK.

The 1060/1050 Ti may be better balanced in terms of compute/gfx resources than 1080 is, leaving some spare compute capabilities on the table that are exploited by Vulkan/Async Compute on the bigger GPU.
 

greatnoob

Senior member
Jan 6, 2014
968
395
136
The 1060/1050 Ti may be better balanced in terms of compute/gfx resources than 1080 is, leaving some spare compute capabilities on the table that are exploited by Vulkan/Async Compute on the bigger GPU.

Pascal looks like it's doing OK here to me, which is even more impressive considering how good NVIDIA's OpenGL/DX11 drivers are.
So Pascal isn't doing too well then is it? Just the expensive 1080...
 
Reactions: DamZe

greatnoob

Senior member
Jan 6, 2014
968
395
136
I'm not looking to participate in an AMD vs NVIDIA flame war. If that's your takeaway then by all means use that conclusion to inform your GPU purchases.

No I'm just making sure you know that the 1050, 1050ti and 1060 are also Pascal cards, not just the 1080. "Pascal looks like it's doing OK here," is not true when there's a regression or simply no increase in performance in other Pascal cards.

"I'm not looking to participate in an AMD vs NVIDIA flame war."

If correcting your unsubstantiated claims is what you define as a "flame war" then feel free to not make such claims so nobody has to correct them. Seems like you may have confused me with yourself:
If you feel so strongly that NVIDIA isn't building products to last, why didn't you choose a product from an alternative vendor?
 
Mar 10, 2006
11,715
2,012
126
No I'm just making sure you know that the 1050, 1050ti and 1060 are also Pascal cards, not just the 1080. "Pascal looks like it's doing OK here," is not true when there's a regression or simply no increase in performance in other Pascal cards.

1080 is based on the Pascal architecture. Claiming that it is fundamentally the Pascal architecture is deficient when there is clearly a Pascal-based GPU that gains from a move to DX12/Vulkan seems to suggest that there is something else at play here besides the architecture.

If correcting your unsubstantiated claims is what you define as a "flame war" then feel free to not make such claims so nobody has to correct them. Seems like you may have confused me with yourself:

GTX 1080 is based on the Pascal architecture. GTX 1080 gains from a move to DX12/Vulkan. Therefore, we have at least one example of a Pascal architecture product gaining from DX12/Vulkan, strongly suggesting that it is not the Pascal architecture that is flawed.

Async compute seems to be very useful when a GPU has unused compute resources that can be utilized to boost performance. Perhaps the GTX 1060/1050 Ti are so well utilized under DX11 that there's just not really headroom to gain much under DX12, while the same can't be said for 1080/Titan XP?

It might be worth exploring this in more detail and reporting back to us with your findings
 

Leyawiin

Diamond Member
Nov 11, 2008
3,204
52
91
Its rather pathetic that its now performing about like a GTX 950 now. What's equally frustrating is the wait for AMD's answer to the GTX 1070 and 1080. Would have been nice to have another option when I bought my GTX 1070 in September.
 
Reactions: Headfoot and DamZe

greatnoob

Senior member
Jan 6, 2014
968
395
136
1080 is based on the Pascal architecture. Claiming that it is fundamentally the Pascal architecture is deficient when there is clearly a Pascal-based GPU that gains from a move to DX12/Vulkan seems to suggest that there is something else at play here besides the architecture.

Like I said: "I'm just making sure you know that the 1050, 1050ti and 1060 are also Pascal cards, not just the 1080."

One expensive card does not encompass the entire Pascal lineup...
 

escrow4

Diamond Member
Feb 4, 2013
3,339
122
106
I bought a 780Ti Ghz back in late 2014 for around $700 USD equivalent, sold it earlier this year for around $220 USD. In the 1.5 year meanwhile (roughly) I played everything I wanted to play at near maxed out settings and picked up a 1070 a few months ago. Which was the whole point. It sure is nice moaning about GPUs and their prices but they are nothing but an entertaining hobby. You can spend a few hundred rebuilding engines or on fine hookers or on shiny new higher end GPUs. Is same. All that aside, the 780Ti was never future forward. Whether that was deliberate or not (it probably was) move on. Things age. Especially GPUs. The 1070 will eventually start to creak and everyone will move on to the new shiny. Meh.
 

esquared

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 8, 2000
23,785
4,965
146
This thread is about trolling, personal attacks, off topic derailing, to name a few.

It's locked.

Now let it be known that anyone who starts to post these sorts of threads to get a rise from the other side will be removed from the VC&G forums for a period of not less than 30 days.

We're tired of this and why you folks are not, is beyond me.


esquared
Anandtech Forum Director
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
sale-70-410-exam    | Exam-200-125-pdf    | we-sale-70-410-exam    | hot-sale-70-410-exam    | Latest-exam-700-603-Dumps    | Dumps-98-363-exams-date    | Certs-200-125-date    | Dumps-300-075-exams-date    | hot-sale-book-C8010-726-book    | Hot-Sale-200-310-Exam    | Exam-Description-200-310-dumps?    | hot-sale-book-200-125-book    | Latest-Updated-300-209-Exam    | Dumps-210-260-exams-date    | Download-200-125-Exam-PDF    | Exam-Description-300-101-dumps    | Certs-300-101-date    | Hot-Sale-300-075-Exam    | Latest-exam-200-125-Dumps    | Exam-Description-200-125-dumps    | Latest-Updated-300-075-Exam    | hot-sale-book-210-260-book    | Dumps-200-901-exams-date    | Certs-200-901-date    | Latest-exam-1Z0-062-Dumps    | Hot-Sale-1Z0-062-Exam    | Certs-CSSLP-date    | 100%-Pass-70-383-Exams    | Latest-JN0-360-real-exam-questions    | 100%-Pass-4A0-100-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-300-135-exams-date    | Passed-200-105-Tech-Exams    | Latest-Updated-200-310-Exam    | Download-300-070-Exam-PDF    | Hot-Sale-JN0-360-Exam    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Exams    | 100%-Pass-JN0-360-Real-Exam-Questions    | Dumps-JN0-360-exams-date    | Exam-Description-1Z0-876-dumps    | Latest-exam-1Z0-876-Dumps    | Dumps-HPE0-Y53-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-HPE0-Y53-Exam    | 100%-Pass-HPE0-Y53-Real-Exam-Questions    | Pass-4A0-100-Exam    | Latest-4A0-100-Questions    | Dumps-98-365-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-98-365-Exam    | 100%-Pass-VCS-254-Exams    | 2017-Latest-VCS-273-Exam    | Dumps-200-355-exams-date    | 2017-Latest-300-320-Exam    | Pass-300-101-Exam    | 100%-Pass-300-115-Exams    |
http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    | http://www.portvapes.co.uk/    |