GTX 960 is expected to launch next month.

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skipsneeky2

Diamond Member
May 21, 2011
5,035
1
71
$80 or so gap between the $249 rumored 960 and the 970,guessing a 960ti either won't be in the listing or priced so close to the 970 that it will become the new bargain gpu to get?
 

Stizzle

Junior Member
Dec 4, 2005
4
0
0
I just got the EVGA 760 SC ACX for a relatively cheap price on Amazon. £140. Not sure if the deal is still going on. Don't think I'll regret it though as I doubt the 960 will be anywhere close to that, probably priced (and performs) similar to the 770. At least in terms of UK pricing, I've heard it'll retail for around £200. Most likely getting a 760 SC for £140 was pretty good bang for buck! I think...

Edit: Nope, the price has gone back up to £166. No idea why it was going for £140 for the past few days but I'll take it...
 
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tviceman

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2008
6,734
514
126
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Not happy with these specs.

I'd prefer the 980m ones.

The 980m is a highly binned GM204. This looks to be a totally new, smaller chip. Less power consumption than a 270x with performance probably around 90% of a 290. It will be a hell of a chip (just like GM204 is) with a somewhat weak perf/$ ratio.
 

Attic

Diamond Member
Jan 9, 2010
4,282
2
76
SLI on these will work on a 500-550w PSU with 2x6pin.

For <$500 that could be a very enticing setup as it should handily outperform GTX980 in supported games. I'm thinking 960 and 960ti is going to drop though with the 960 at closer to 200-230 with the ti coming at 250-270.


The 970's are selling like hot cakes at $330-370.
 

Magic Carpet

Diamond Member
Oct 2, 2011
3,477
232
106
AMD is going to be in a lot of trouble if those are the true specs of the card for $250. At first glance it makes you think it'll be closer to 780 than 770 performance.
If it comes out with any lesser specs, it's going to be "a pass" for me. But... if you consider the 980 a mid-range GPU (which it is), then maybe this can be suitable for the role of an "entry" gaming GPU instead. The nearly 1-year old 750/750 ti isn't any good for 2015 and beyond.
 

raghu78

Diamond Member
Aug 23, 2012
4,093
1,475
136
AMD is going to be in a lot of trouble if those are the true specs of the card for $250. At first glance it makes you think it'll be closer to 780 than 770 performance.

Other than the power efficiency this chip does not bring anything new to the USD 250 price point. R9 290 cards are selling for USD 270 with mail in rebate of USD 20 - 30 and a decent game bundle. R9 290 is 4% slower than GTX 970 at 1440p. at 1080p the gap is slightly more.

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/MSI/GTX_970_Gaming/27.html

so other than power constrained and space constrained cases the R9 290 is still a very good buy.
 

el etro

Golden Member
Jul 21, 2013
1,581
14
81
Between the Videocardz rumor and the Wccftech rumor, i stay with the Videocardz one.

Very much probable GM206 haves a 192 bit bus(Is a 1080p capable card, no more!)
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,667
440
126
SLI on these will work on a 500-550w PSU with 2x6pin.

For <$500 that could be a very enticing setup as it should handily outperform GTX980 in supported games. I'm thinking 960 and 960ti is going to drop though with the 960 at closer to 200-230 with the ti coming at 250-270.


The 970's are selling like hot cakes at $330-370.

People paying $330+ for a 970 are being silly. Many a deal for just at $300 or under for one.
 

tviceman

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2008
6,734
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Between the Videocardz rumor and the Wccftech rumor, i stay with the Videocardz one.

Very much probable GM206 haves a 192 bit bus(Is a 1080p capable card, no more!)

This. Halving the available bandwidth and ROP power would produce too much of a gap in performance between GM204 and GM206. 192-bits it is. I can definitely see Nvidia releasing a GM204 based 960 TI LIMITED SPECIAL EDITION in the future. The 960 should end up somewhere between a GTX770 and 780 in performance. For it's power consumption and chip size, it will be great. However, given AMD's current aggressive pricing and bundling, perf/$ will be meh. Bargain shoppers may be advised to look elsewhere unless they just want Nvidia. It's hard to recommend Nvidia lately though as AMD has been on their game with regards to developer and driver support in addition to superior game bundles.
 

skipsneeky2

Diamond Member
May 21, 2011
5,035
1
71
Hopefully this is 3gb at least or damn close to 780 performance or game over,people mind as well spend a bit more and grab a 290.I want a 3 or 4gb card depending on price and this 960 could very well push me right over to a 290.A low tdp card that can deliver near 780 performance would be excellent with 3+gb but 2gb hell no no matter if its 780 or better performance.

Am hoping honestly for a 4gb card,idk if 4gb is exactly a requirement for a single gpu assuming performance can hold to it or even 3gb for that matter.I do know for sli 4gb is a requirement for the latest of games.
 

jpiniero

Lifer
Oct 1, 2010
14,841
5,456
136
It'd have to be 1408 cores (with clocks near the 970/980) to be close to 780 performance. 1280 cores/128 bit would be slower than the 770, maybe slightly faster in games where nVidia only enabled the cheats on Maxwell.
 

Keysplayr

Elite Member
Jan 16, 2003
21,209
50
91
Remember, Maxwell arch is very deceiving. With 832 shader deficit and memory bandwidth cut by a third, a 980 handily outperforms a 780Ti.
With a 1216 shader deficit and memory bandwidth cut by a third, GTX970 comes close or trades blows with GTX780Ti. So it really is a mystery how a GM206 top end card will perform.
 

SlickR12345

Senior member
Jan 9, 2010
542
44
91
www.clubvalenciacf.com
Remember, Maxwell arch is very deceiving. With 832 shader deficit and memory bandwidth cut by a third, a 980 handily outperforms a 780Ti.
With a 1216 shader deficit and memory bandwidth cut by a third, GTX970 comes close or trades blows with GTX780Ti. So it really is a mystery how a GM206 top end card will perform.

By "handily" you mean by 3-5fps in most games at 1080p resolutions and above?

By trading blows on the 970 you mean being 3-5fps slower at 1080p resolutions and above?

The 980 achieves bellow 60fps in 90% of the newer games at 1440p resolutions. Hardly good for gaming in 2015, when titles are just going to get more and more demanding.

If we are seeing this high demanding games in 2014 just a year after consoles were released, expect additional 10-30% more demanding games in 2015.
 

Keysplayr

Elite Member
Jan 16, 2003
21,209
50
91
By "handily" you mean by 3-5fps in most games at 1080p resolutions and above?

By trading blows on the 970 you mean being 3-5fps slower at 1080p resolutions and above?

The 980 achieves bellow 60fps in 90% of the newer games at 1440p resolutions. Hardly good for gaming in 2015, when titles are just going to get more and more demanding.

If we are seeing this high demanding games in 2014 just a year after consoles were released, expect additional 10-30% more demanding games in 2015.

We can probably do this all day, but...

http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_980_sli_review,12.html

Handily, consistently, regularly, usually.... pick an adverb.

You know that my point was meant to highlight the fact that Maxwell does TONS more with TONS less. We can probably expect the same with GM206.
 

digitaldurandal

Golden Member
Dec 3, 2009
1,828
0
76
Just go read all the old PSU forums here, on hardcore, and a few others across the net. Read a bunch of old jonnyguru and larvae stuff. This is experience I'm speaking from of years of working this stuff. I am not aware of a major study being done to collect such data for your easy consumption though. It's basically and industry joke. Go talk to just most good PC repair shop people and I'm not talking young geek squad kids but the old farts like me that have been doing it for decades.

Someone at a PC Repair shop is going to see the ones that fail. How many are not failing? What do you think is a fair split of failing within 1 year and not failing within 1 year? What percentage do you think have to fail in order to make the claim that they are DESIGNED (emphasis yours) to fail?

Essentially, you are making a claim based on your own experience and some forum posts. You present no data and make a claim that manufacturers want their product to fail quickly.

I find it far more likely that: 1 they use cheap parts, 2 they are all using the same cheap parts, and 3 some component in those parts has a high failure rate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_plague

This is not an indication that the part was designed to fail. No manufacturer designs their part to fail. They might design it to maximize profits. They might not design it to last for 5+ years. To say the part was designed to fail is a far stretch.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,667
440
126
Someone at a PC Repair shop is going to see the ones that fail. How many are not failing? What do you think is a fair split of failing within 1 year and not failing within 1 year? What percentage do you think have to fail in order to make the claim that they are DESIGNED (emphasis yours) to fail?

Essentially, you are making a claim based on your own experience and some forum posts. You present no data and make a claim that manufacturers want their product to fail quickly.

I find it far more likely that: 1 they use cheap parts, 2 they are all using the same cheap parts, and 3 some component in those parts has a high failure rate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_plague

This is not an indication that the part was designed to fail. No manufacturer designs their part to fail. They might design it to maximize profits. They might not design it to last for 5+ years. To say the part was designed to fail is a far stretch.

They have a built in limited lifetime. That means they are designed to fail. Computers sold by makers have almost no margin on them. Dell, HP, Asus, and whomever you want to name does not make much money per unit sold. They don't even sell that many units. So where does the money come from? Services. Plain and simple. Stores make money on the upsell of high margin items like cables and printers. Pre-built computer companies make money on the back end services. It has always been that way.

So a company that makes it's profit when the products it owns FAILS is going to make sure that product has a failure rate. It's pure simple logic. Of course they don't them all failing in 6 months time as that would make consumers lose confidence in their product. Instead the failure rate is pretty much design to be just outside the 1 year mark on average. It's at that mark where most consumers aren't willing to buy another new computer yet, and don't want to be without their old one. With proprietary hardware built into those pre-built systems, the makers are assured they will make money off the replacement parts if not the service to replace those parts as well.

Again, this is not speculation. I have many a friend who has worked at dell, some of them pretty far up the management chain to be people that MAKE those decisions.

It's like lightbulbs. Incandescents didn't have a long lifespan and were fairly cheap to make. Since there is a fairly high turn over volume on those lightbulbs, the companies that make them can afford to sell them pretty cheap do to the assured sales volume based off failure rates. LED lights cost practically the same to make as incandescent lightbulbs used to cost to make. However, they have a much longer lifespan and carry a much larger price tag for that reason.

Do you not get get how these various markets work to turn a buck? I can point out other fun stuff that is very similar from just about any tech product sector. Especially when there isn't a hyper competitive market for that specific item.

So back to power supplies, good ones you buy yourself for your system from good makers tend to cost more and last far longer. I have had power supplies last for decades now that were quality built. They produce the same electrical characteristics that they produced from day one of usage. No extra ripple, no signal degradation, no popping caps, and no heat build up problems. Can't say that about any cheapie power supply ever. Do you know WHY the "capacitor" plague you linked to in your article still continues to this very day? Because it does what computer makers want them to do. Last for a finite time then go POP! As well as be cheap. The power supply makers from back then to even now know which caps are good to last for decades and which ones don't. So any guess as to why the cheapie caps that go pop are still in use today in modern tech equipment? If you can't figure that out you need to re-read what I've posted here as well as do some more research.
 

SteveGrabowski

Diamond Member
Oct 20, 2014
7,121
5,998
136
Computers sold by makers have almost no margin on them. Dell, HP, Asus, and whomever you want to name does not make much money per unit sold.

I thought the OEMS made decent money from the bundled crapware. E.g., McAffee, WildTangent Games, and so on.
 
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