******Hardware and System Building Guide For New Users******

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Blain

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
23,643
3
81
Originally posted by: UsandThem
Originally posted by: Blain
Too many words... Newbies will never read this.

They will if members point them here.
What does that even mean? :shocked:

They post endless threads asking if their systems are good. Then after they get tons of answers, a few days later they post a new thread asking the same questions...
"Rate my system"
"Should I change anything"
"What do you guys think"
"Help me pick my parts"
"Are my parts compatible"
Etc... Etc... Etc...

If they don't read through all the other threads, what makes anyone think they'll read this one?

Good linkage though
 

ciwell

Member
Mar 24, 2004
188
0
0
I think what is needed is an entire new THREAD for people looking for system ratings. There seems to be enough to warrant that.
 

Blain

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
23,643
3
81
Originally posted by: ciwell
I think what is needed is an entire new THREAD for people looking for system ratings. There seems to be enough to warrant that.
AMEN Brother! :laugh:
Corral all those endless posts into a single thread. :thumbsup:

 

rivethead

Platinum Member
Jan 16, 2005
2,635
106
106


Speaking as a newbie, I think I can understand your frustration with newbies on this forum. But remember that some of us ARE trying to learn and DO value your input. I found anandtech just after new years and I now probably spend several hours a week lurking in this forum.

FWIW, I discovered this thread about 1 minute after making a post that is certain to annoy you.......http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...atid=27&threadid=1521729&enterthread=y

As you can see from my title, it is "yet another newbie need(ing) input on 1st build". I know there are a lot of these types of threads out there, but I hope I put in the extra effort to make it more bearable for the senior members to read (I put in my background, what I'm trying to accomplish, uses for the system, and where I feel my weaknesses are (memory and hard drives)).

Bottom line: please understand that some newbies do want to become a valuable member of this community and are willing to put forth the effort. The more you put into a forum, the more you'll get out of it.



This is a fantastic thread and I, for one, appreciate the work that went into it.
 

UsandThem

Elite Member
May 4, 2000
16,068
7,380
146
Rivethead, thank you for the compliments on my thread I put a lot of work into to help new members.

I know not all new members here are the "hit and run" kind. It just gets frustrating to have 50% of the posts here to be "build my computer" threads, when the questions they have already asked have already been answered.

It is always nice to see a new member take the time to do some research for their self. I think it is much more rewarding when you do the work and then build it. I mean if people want others to "build a pc" for them, why not just buy a Dell?

Welcome and let me know if you have any more questions or recommendations on what you would like to see in this thread........it is a work in progress.

 

rivethead

Platinum Member
Jan 16, 2005
2,635
106
106
:beer: to you.

I believe I understand your frustration with the "hit and run" newbies. I am an active participant in several stock message boards. These stocks pay dividends and invariable every quarter we see a flurry of "when is the dividend gonna be paid?" posts from newbies...even though the information is clearly stated in the company's press release! It is frustrating....and, of course, they never add anything to the thread (most are never heard from again).


Again, thanks for you work that went into this thread. For me, the timing could not be better!

I'll offer the following suggestions:

1) point to a thread/guide discussing the "how-to's" and basics of overclocking. While overclocking is not for everyone, it is a dominant theme in these forums and when building a system, the choice to overclock or not does have implications on your choices (as I'm quickly finding out!).

As I said in my "Yet another newbie needs help" thread....I started learning about all of this stuff shortly after January 1, 2005. Building my first system is my New Year's Resolution. What I'm finding is that overclocking may be an avenue to help me accomplish my ultimate goal: to build the most powerful system I can for the least amount of money (which is a lot of peoples goal!). Said another way, I want to find the sweet spot on that cost/capability curve.

2) Perhaps add some high level narrative on how to choose components/where to start conceptually. You offer some excellent choices for different system types (budget, mid, high, the BEAST), but HOW did you go about making your choices? I understand reading the reviews, etc. and you do point to excellent sites, but how about more narrative on the how?

Ok, I'm not really being clear on this, but here's an example: when I started researching all this stuff, I thought that I could easily choose a component at a time and be fine......I've learned that I was wrong. Each component decision will likely effect the other choices. I didn't realize that at first. A month ago, my thought process was like...."I'll buy one of those 7-5-4 motherboards, buy the cheapest AMD CPU I can find and put a cool PCI-E video card in it and then just take my 10GB HD from my Gateway system and slap that in there. Plus I'll steal my memory from my old Gateway (all 256K of it) and slap that in there and voila....a new powerful system on the cheap, running my Window 98 like a rocket!"

Uhh.....I've since learned that certain things won't work together so well and each component decision effects the others. It's all interelated. Plus certain decisions (like a fast CPU) can be negated by others (like a slow video card). I've learned much of this from lurking on these forums!

Would you agree, though, that as a starting point, the choice of motherboard is the most important decision? That's the way it seems to me. The motherboard drives everything else...


I'm sure I'm offering only one perspective (that of a newbie who's been learning about this stuff for only about 40 days). Hopefully others will offer others!
 

greergirl

Junior Member
Jan 30, 2005
12
0
0

Thank you so much for posting this. As one of the newbs, might I suggest something since I am
your intended audience? Since many of those retailers listed sell OEM products, it might be good to
have a link or section explaining the difference between retail vs OEM? I know the differences can vary
between components...but just a thought.
 

mgo

Senior member
Oct 6, 2001
232
0
0
I really like your recommendations and am glad to hear that it's a work in progress. Does that mean you intend to update your recommendations periodically?
 

UsandThem

Elite Member
May 4, 2000
16,068
7,380
146
Originally posted by: mgo
I really like your recommendations and am glad to hear that it's a work in progress. Does that mean you intend to update your recommendations periodically?

I will try and update things twice a week. I always listen to suggestions and advice to make this a batter thread to help new users.

The mods gave this a 30 day sticky, and then they will evaluate it after that and see if it will get another. It all comes down to new members using this and it being popular.

 

UsandThem

Elite Member
May 4, 2000
16,068
7,380
146
Originally posted by: greergirl

Thank you so much for posting this. As one of the newbs, might I suggest something since I am
your intended audience? Since many of those retailers listed sell OEM products, it might be good to
have a link or section explaining the difference between retail vs OEM? I know the differences can vary
between components...but just a thought.

I'll add that to my post. Thanks!
 

Thegonagle

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2000
9,773
0
71
Originally posted by: Bonesdad
nice job, btw SilentPCReview.com has some nice PSU reviews/advice/information.

They discuss other important issues, even if you're not going for complete silence; they talk about good cases, airlflow and cooling, and power consumption/heat production.

Many of the regulars at the SPCR forums are also regulars at other hardware forums, such as here at AnandTech.

SilentPCReview is a good all-around site.
 

AnotherGuy

Senior member
Dec 9, 2003
678
0
71
Great post in my opinion.. few comments or maybe preferences... specially on the Beast setup:

Power Supply - i think for $126 theres better ones than Antec, I'd get either a OCZ or Enermax, or Fortron instead of that.

Graphic card - maybe this option should be on a seperate Setup called EXTREME, but I hear a lot of great things about the X850 XT for ~$500, which is just $50 over the 6800GT and won't hurt the $1700 setup.

I'd call these just personal preferences but hey, great post!
 

UsandThem

Elite Member
May 4, 2000
16,068
7,380
146
Originally posted by: AnotherGuy
Great post in my opinion.. few comments or maybe preferences... specially on the Beast setup:

Power Supply - i think for $126 theres better ones than Antec, I'd get either a OCZ or Enermax, or Fortron instead of that.

Graphic card - maybe this option should be on a seperate Setup called EXTREME, but I hear a lot of great things about the X850 XT for ~$500, which is just $50 over the 6800GT and won't hurt the $1700 setup.

I'd call these just personal preferences but hey, great post!

It's really a toss up on the card. The thing that has hurt ATI for the last several months is:

1. Availabilty and price of their cards.

2. Basically letting the 6600GT be a buy because they were "clearing out" their 9800 Pros cards at higher prices than the 6600GT.

They seem to have gotten their act together lately, so you could see some ATI cards recommended soon

As far as the power supply goes, I'm a Antec guy, but there are several other good choices out there including OCZ, Fortron, and Enermax like you mentioned.



 

Old Man River

Member
Dec 23, 2004
92
0
0
I find this thread is very informative and appreciate the work you have do9ne on it: thank you. There will always be questions and I have one right now I need to deal with and hope someone could answer my question.

I have a new ANTEC Life Style Series Black Case with a True 380W PS, "SONATA" and I want to buy the AMD Athlon 64 3500+, Winchester 2.2 GHz, 939 Processor ? Retail and mount it on an ASUS "A8V Deluxe" Motherboard for my AMD Socket 939.

I think the CPU?s heat sink and fan included is mounted and I need no Arctic Silver 5; am I right? I?m unable to find this information anywhere right now.

My system will be:
AMD Athlon 64 3500+, Winchester 2.2 GHz, 939 Processor ? Retail
ASUS "A8V Deluxe" Motherboard For AMD Socket 939
Corsair 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-3200 - Retail
Corsair 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-3200 ? Retail
(1 Gig; I may add another gig later.)
ASUS ATI RADEON 7000 Video Card, 64MB DDR, 64-bit
Seagate 80GB 7200RPM IDE Hard Drive, Model ST380013A-RK, Retail
Lite-On Black 52X32X52X16 Combo Drive, BLACK, Retail *
NEC 1.44MB Black Internal Floppy Drive, OEM *
Zonet V.92 56K PCI Data/Fax Modem
Logitech X-120 2.0 Speaker ?RETAIL
ACER AL1714CB Black 17" LCD Monitor - Retail
APC 350VA Back-UPS

 

rivethead

Platinum Member
Jan 16, 2005
2,635
106
106
You are correct. If you buy the retail version of the AMD processors, they come with a heatsink/fan and a thermal pad which peforms the same function as Arctic Silver 5.
 

UsandThem

Elite Member
May 4, 2000
16,068
7,380
146
Originally posted by: rivethead
You are correct. If you buy the retail version of the AMD processors, they come with a heatsink/fan and a thermal pad which peforms the same function as Arctic Silver 5.

:thumbsup:

As long as you are not going to do heavy overclocking, just use the thermal pad on the bottom of the retail heatsink/fan.

That will be a nice system, however the video card will hold you back if you play games.

 

Old Man River

Member
Dec 23, 2004
92
0
0
At this moment, I don?t plan on doing any overclocking, nor games, but...who knows what this ol man will do next?

I took your advice and changed my selection for a video card to an ASUS nVIDIA GeForce FX5200 Video Card, 128MB DDR, 64-bit RETAIL. If I were to get into the extreme uses, or overclocking, then I will go to a higher price card, most likely another ASUS.

I just want a system I can upgrade if I want and have the room to do so. Thank you all for your advice.
 

UsandThem

Elite Member
May 4, 2000
16,068
7,380
146
Originally posted by: Old Man River
At this moment, I don?t plan on doing any overclocking, nor games, but...who knows what this ol man will do next?

I took your advice and changed my selection for a video card to an ASUS nVIDIA GeForce FX5200 Video Card, 128MB DDR, 64-bit RETAIL. If I were to get into the extreme uses, or overclocking, then I will go to a higher price card, most likely another ASUS.

I just want a system I can upgrade if I want and have the room to do so. Thank you all for your advice.

Have you ordered your parts yet?

 

Old Man River

Member
Dec 23, 2004
92
0
0
No, just the ANTEC "SONATA" Black Case, a couple of 120mm Fans, and some doo-dads. I?ve been studying this, making my list, and planning my budget for three orders each month starting this March; It?s been in the works for the last few months and I first planned on two computers: one was to be a low end so to try my skills and another one was to be one that was mid-range so to get me some speed on my applications for writing and navigating the Internet.

I threw those plans out and now I am going with this newer CPU and the parts that will complement that. Then I want to get me an IBM, or Acer Laptop. As I?ve posted before, the Hurricanes destroyed some of my computers and having restored one of them, I need something I can rely on that is newer, up-to-date, and can be easily fixed by me. I think this will do me just fine.

I?ve learned a lot from this forum and if I had not come here, I would not be able to accomplish what I want to do. Thanks again.

 

UsandThem

Elite Member
May 4, 2000
16,068
7,380
146
A note to new members

I try to help people and try to respond to all PM's. However, I can't respond to PM's everyday. I work and have a family.

Here is an example (A PM sent to me) on how not to get any help from me.

Originally posted by: Usandthem

The prices (except for Nforce4 motherboards) will remain steady for the next month. AMD just dropped their prices on their CPU's about a week ago. nforce4 prices should start to decline a little over the next month or so.

I used Mushkin because it is good ram and their Cas2.5 stuff is priced really well. I personally have Kingston in my system because it was at a good price after a mail in rebate. I would only use Kingston, Corsair, Mushkin, and Crucial.

Out of those I would choice who had the best price on what I was looking for. I run my ram at Cas2.5 even though it is rated at Cas2. Nvidia and VIA chipsets don't handle the ram as good as some Intel chipsets, and I probably lose 1-2% performance running it at Cas2....not a notible difference. I choice stability over trying to get my system just a little faster.

Welcome to the forums.

Originally posted by: Minthec


Hey again, I was just looking at your system specs and I'm curious as to why you don't oc? I'm about to build my first pc and was looking to oc the amd a64 3200+ winchester to 2.6 but I'm also leaning towards leaving it at 2.0 because of fears of ruining the entire thing... Anyways that's why I ask

Originally posted by: Minthec

Do you mind if I run by the specs on the new pc I plan on assembling UsandThem?


Originally posted by: Minthec

Actually I take that request back. I thought you were a very nice guy considering you posted that buyers guide thread, yet you ignored the pm before my last one and I just read your smug reply to one of my posts. I'm not sure what caused me to rub you the wrong way but I'll just steer clear of you from now on and I hope you do the same

Originally posted by: Usandthem

Whatever.

I have no idea what you are rambling about. Smug comment?

Sorry, I can't respond to every PM every day. I live in this place called "the real world" where I work, and then I come home and spend time with my children. Do you know how many messages I get a day requesting help? A lot.

You, in the future, should really consider your comments and your sensitvity level before sending someone a childish PM or email. You will burn bridges here very fast, and nobody will want to help you (like me now )

I gave you a detailed PM and a builders guide, but obviously you must expect that I owe you something more.



 
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