Haswell-E Reviews

FlanK3r · Sep 1, 2014

beginner99 · Sep 2, 2014

cbn said:
Agreed. IMO low end X99 basically obsoletes high end Z97 (the exception being Mini-ITX)

(As far as the ram costs go, I'm seeing only a $30 to $40 delta at the 2 x 4GB gamer level. That doesn't really seem like much of a difference)

It's not the delta but the fact that you could reuse your ddr3 RAM with a 4790K.

Idontcare · Sep 2, 2014

beginner99 said:
It's not the delta but the fact that you could reuse your ddr3 RAM with a 4790K.

What is the net benefit of DDR4 over DDR3 at this time?

Higher capacity? (how much higher?) Lower power consumption? (how much lower?) Higher performance? (how much higher?)

I'm expecting DDR4 to do as much for me as DDR3-2400 did for me versus DDR3-1866, i.e. coming in right between jack and squat.

But I'm curious what the data shows. Do we get anything in return for not being able to re-use our existing DDR3 in the new build? Or is this a way to keep the memory makers alive and wealthy?

Abwx · Sep 2, 2014

Idontcare said:
What is the net benefit of DDR4 over DDR3 at this time?

Higher capacity? (how much higher?) Lower power consumption? (how much lower?) Higher performance? (how much higher?)

I'm expecting DDR4 to do as much for me as DDR3-2400 did for me versus DDR3-1866, i.e. coming in right between jack and squat.

But I'm curious what the data shows. Do we get anything in return for not being able to re-use our existing DDR3 in the new build? Or is this a way to keep the memory makers alive and wealthy?

........

http://www.hardware.fr/articles/924-4/ddr4-problematique-frequence.html

http://www.hardware.fr/articles/924-5/corsair-g-skill-ddr4-pratique.html

ShintaiDK · Sep 2, 2014

Idontcare said:
I'm expecting DDR4 to do as much for me as DDR3-2400 did for me versus DDR3-1866, i.e. coming in right between jack and squat.

DDR4 on the desktop is for IGP performance and to get >16GB on mITX.
Else DDR4 is mainly a server memory.

CHADBOGA · Sep 2, 2014

Idontcare said:
Would guess it comes down to clockspeeds, base and turbo.

Has anyone tested the latency of DDR4 in these Haswell-E systems? :hmm:

exar333 · Sep 2, 2014

Idontcare said:
What is the net benefit of DDR4 over DDR3 at this time?

Higher capacity? (how much higher?) Lower power consumption? (how much lower?) Higher performance? (how much higher?)

I'm expecting DDR4 to do as much for me as DDR3-2400 did for me versus DDR3-1866, i.e. coming in right between jack and squat.

But I'm curious what the data shows. Do we get anything in return for not being able to re-use our existing DDR3 in the new build? Or is this a way to keep the memory makers alive and wealthy?

You make some good points. I will jump on this platform when 16GB DIMMs are readily available. There isn't a point (IMHO) to switch over to DDR4 until this.

Since the performance (or 'enthusiast') parts get the leavings of server parts nowadays, DDR4 voltage and density are probably too hard to pass-up from a datacenter point of view.

The X58 and X79 platforms were generally never starved for memory bandwidth anyways (even X97 does fine with 2x channels). We really only see performance gains up to ~1600mhz DDR3 anyway (SOMETIMES up to 1866 for very specific edge-case uses) unless you are using a AMD APU.

*shrug*

aigomorla · Sep 2, 2014

Lepton87 said:
Even the worst 990X was better than the best 980X? How far did your CPU went? I assume 4.3-4.7GHz?

Im still using my 990X if your asking.

I havent found a replacement for a 4.4ghz @ 1.325Vcore cpu on all 6 cores.
Ive been waiting for a true upgrade..
Not a slanted diagonal upgrade.

I had my hopes in the 5960X, but the reviews across sites, are leaving a very sour taste in my mouth regardless of the fact its 8 cores.

Im am an enthusiast before a gamer, however the gamer aspect of me isnt too far off.

Idontcare said:
What is the net benefit of DDR4 over DDR3 at this time?

Higher capacity? (how much higher?) Lower power consumption? (how much lower?) Higher performance? (how much higher?)

I'm expecting DDR4 to do as much for me as DDR3-2400 did for me versus DDR3-1866, i.e. coming in right between jack and squat.

But I'm curious what the data shows. Do we get anything in return for not being able to re-use our existing DDR3 in the new build? Or is this a way to keep the memory makers alive and wealthy?

RAMBUS all over again... lolol...

I am also lost in the DDR4.
Although i do have money to burn on my new system, it again leaves a sour taste in my mouth when its burned on things which i dont see a net benefit.

*sigh*

Maybe i'll just end up getting a 4790K delid the cpu, and run it til haswell gets a refresh.
However my poor X58 system is starting to show its wear.
And id like to finally get Sata6G + USB3.0 onboard, but the killernic which is featured on all the new boards also leave a sour taste in my mouth.
I dont like killernic... i want the real Intel Nic, for compatability reasons.

When your running 8 cores, 32gigs of ram, who cares about cpu overhead....

Redstorm · Sep 2, 2014

aigomorla said:
And id like to finally get Sata6G + USB3.0 onboard, but the killernic which is featured on all the new boards also leave a sour taste in my mouth.
I dont like killernic... i want the real Intel Nic, for compatability reasons.

I hear you, the Killer Nic is an awful solution to a problem that never existed in the first place.

Their are some X99 boards with Dual Intel Nic's with teaming, from memory the ASRock WS board is one of them. The OC Formula has at least one Intel Nic (you can see it on the box shot).

Arachnotronic · Sep 2, 2014

Idontcare said:
What is the net benefit of DDR4 over DDR3 at this time?

Higher capacity? (how much higher?) Lower power consumption? (how much lower?) Higher performance? (how much higher?)

I'm expecting DDR4 to do as much for me as DDR3-2400 did for me versus DDR3-1866, i.e. coming in right between jack and squat.

But I'm curious what the data shows. Do we get anything in return for not being able to re-use our existing DDR3 in the new build? Or is this a way to keep the memory makers alive and wealthy?

DDR4 cost was the deal-breaker for me for moving to X99. I can't justify $450+ for 32GB of DDR4.

rge2 · Sep 2, 2014

Intel17 said:
DDR4 cost was the deal-breaker for me for moving to X99. I can't justify $450+ for 32GB of DDR4.

+1, DDR4 is more expensive and slower than DDR3...the fastest DDR4 currently out is 3000 CAS 15, which is about 5% slower than common DDR3 2400 CAS 10 in memory benchmarks. But that is just like when DDR3 first came out, it was more expensive and slower than DDR2.

Managerman (post 181 link below) posted passmark memory bench comparing X99 with 5960X ddr4 2666 CAS 15 vs X79 DDR3 1866 CAS 9, and ddr4 was 10% slower in passmark memory benchmark.
X79 DDR3-1866 Cas 9 Passmark memory bench = 3355
X99 DDR4-2666 Cas15 Passmark memory bench = 3028
http://www.overclock.net/t/1506847/intel-5960x-haswell-e-8-core-quick-observations/180#post_22743111

I was going to buy Haswell E just for a new 8 core toy, but with ddr4 currently slower than ddr3 and 5960X is clocking poorly like first haswells, ie some only 4.3 to 4.5 for 2/47 use and not much higher for benching (air/liquid), just cant bite. If it clocked like my DC and ddr4 was more mature.....maybe broadwell e will get me to switch, ddr4 should smoke ddr3 in a year as speed increases and timings come down.

tidy · Sep 2, 2014

Arachnotronic · Sep 2, 2014

rge2 said:
+1, DDR4 is more expensive and slower than DDR3...the fastest DDR4 currently out is 3000 CAS 15, which is about 5% slower than common DDR3 2400 CAS 10 in memory benchmarks. But that is just like when DDR3 first came out, it was more expensive and slower than DDR2.

Managerman (post 181 link below) posted passmark memory bench comparing X99 with 5960X ddr4 2666 CAS 15 vs X79 DDR3 1866 CAS 9, and ddr4 was 10% slower in passmark memory benchmark.
X79 DDR3-1866 Cas 9 Passmark memory bench = 3355
X99 DDR4-2666 Cas15 Passmark memory bench = 3028
http://www.overclock.net/t/1506847/intel-5960x-haswell-e-8-core-quick-observations/180#post_22743111

I was going to buy Haswell E just for a new 8 core toy, but with ddr4 currently slower than ddr3 and 5960X is clocking poorly like first haswells, ie some only 4.3 to 4.5 for 2/47 use and not much higher for benching (air/liquid), just cant bite. If it clocked like my DC and ddr4 was more mature.....maybe broadwell e will get me to switch, ddr4 should smoke ddr3 in a year as speed increases and timings come down.

Yup.

I think I'm going to wait patiently for the platform that follows X99. My current CPU is plenty fast, but I am in desperate need of a new GPU.

Let's hope either NVIDIA or AMD delivers something new soon, because this wait is terrible. Whichever launches first gets my money at this point...

Burpo · Sep 2, 2014

Got a grand?
http://wccftech.com/amd-radeon-r9-295x2-retailer-specific-promotional-deals-price-slashed-999/
How about $249?
http://wccftech.com/amd-launches-to...hics-card-performance-par-radeon-r9-280x-249/

Arachnotronic · Sep 2, 2014

Burpo said:
Got a grand?
http://wccftech.com/amd-radeon-r9-295x2-retailer-specific-promotional-deals-price-slashed-999/
How about $249?
http://wccftech.com/amd-launches-to...hics-card-performance-par-radeon-r9-280x-249/

I am currently running a GTX 770, and am looking for a significant boost from this level of performance.

I'm hoping for basically a "big" Tonga or a "big" Maxwell.

Madpacket · Sep 3, 2014

Just built a ITX based 4790K with 16GB of re-used RAM. The RAM I got ages ago which came free in a 80 dollar Celeron 847 & ITX mobo bundle. These two components together cost me less than the price of 5820K.

I like the idea of the X99 platform for a workstation / VM monster box but for a kick ass HTPC / Steam box they obviously don't make sense. Hopefully the price of the 8 core versions and DDR4 come down significantly but given the "meh" like performance increases over what already exists I'm not going to be an early adopter this time.

vMax65 · Sep 6, 2014

Madpacket said:
Just built a ITX based 4790K with 16GB of re-used RAM. The RAM I got ages ago which came free in a 80 dollar Celeron 847 & ITX mobo bundle. These two components together cost me less than the price of 5820K.

I like the idea of the X99 platform for a workstation / VM monster box but for a kick ass HTPC / Steam box they obviously don't make sense. Hopefully the price of the 8 core versions and DDR4 come down significantly but given the "meh" like performance increases over what already exists I'm not going to be an early adopter this time.

Same as you 4790K and 32gb ram (16gb reused from my old 2600K setup) running at 4.4 with low temps... I think waiting till things mature and costs drop but more importantly significant performance increase before moving over to DDR4 based systems over my 4790K... in gaming at least.

WhoBeDaPlaya · Sep 6, 2014

You fellas with a 5960X might want to watch it...
Two independent 5960X setups going up in smoke :
Phoronix
Legit Reviews

JDG1980 · Sep 6, 2014

WhoBeDaPlaya said:
You fellas with a 5960X might want to watch it...
Two independent 5960X setups going up in smoke :
Phoronix
Legit Reviews

Sounds like the motherboard manufacturers are cheaping out on the VRMs.

know of fence · Sep 10, 2014

Highest clocked 8 Core Xeon v3 vs Haswell-E http://ark.intel.com/compare/83361,82930 for 2K dollars it has a lower TDP and higher clocks, but the difference isn't that large.

There is barely any difference between some of the 6 cores, same TDP, price, base frequency, though there is an expensive 20MB cache Xeon variant.
http://ark.intel.com/compare/82932,82931,82765,81900

NTMBK · Sep 10, 2014

know of fence said:
Highest clocked 8 Core Xeon v3 vs Haswell-E http://ark.intel.com/compare/83361,82930 for 2K dollars it has a lower TDP and higher clocks, but the difference isn't that large.

It supports dual socket, ECC memory, VPro... it's a workstation chip.

know of fence · Sep 10, 2014

NTMBK said:
It supports dual socket, ECC memory, VPro... it's a workstation chip.

So? The price is still determined by binning rarity and clocks not those disabled features. There are plenty of 2 GHz Xeons with the same features ticked that are priced around anywhere from 900 to 600 USD.

NTMBK · Sep 10, 2014

know of fence said:
So? The price is still determined by binning rarity and clocks not those disabled features. There are plenty of 2 GHz Xeons with the same features ticked that are priced around anywhere from 900 to 600 USD.

It's priced according to a combination of features. Performance is one of those features, as is working QPI links etc. Either you can have a dual socket capable chip with less performance, or you can have better performance without dual socket capable, or you can pay more and get both. *shrug* Fairly standard market segmentation.

Darksinnder · Sep 17, 2014

CHADBOGA said:
Has anyone tested the latency of DDR4 in these Haswell-E systems? :hmm:

check out this review, has some good info on dd4 vs ddr3. http://youtu.be/-I_qKCSGS4U?list=UUkWQ0gDrqOCarmUKmppD7GQ

CHADBOGA · Sep 17, 2014

Darksinnder said:
check out this review, has some good info on dd4 vs ddr3. http://youtu.be/-I_qKCSGS4U?list=UUkWQ0gDrqOCarmUKmppD7GQ

Looks like latency will be holding DDR4 back as a must have upgrade.

Thanks for the link.

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