Hauting video of "Elliot Rogers Retribution" student shoots and kills Sorority girls

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Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,595
7,653
136
This guy though - he had every advantage and appears to have had a good life. The flaw here is with him, possibly his parents, not society.

A kid like this could find hope in a better society. With outreach programs that are able to identify and target the weak and vulnerable, the mentally ill such as him.

Yes he was deeply flawed, but how difficult would it have really been to address those issues? Someone said $500 and a hooker. That's not so far off. Instead of having positive reinforcements, all he found were mostly negative ones. That's not entirely his fault, because we can do better. We can be better, and as a society lift up and protect the weak.

Is that not, after all, how we are supposed to measure ourselves?
 

kia75

Senior member
Oct 30, 2005
468
0
71
A kid like this could find hope in a better society. With outreach programs that are able to identify and target the weak and vulnerable, the mentally ill such as him.

Yes he was deeply flawed, but how difficult would it have really been to address those issues? Someone said $500 and a hooker. That's not so far off. Instead of having positive reinforcements, all he found were mostly negative ones. That's not entirely his fault, because we can do better. We can be better, and as a society lift up and protect the weak.

Is that not, after all, how we are supposed to measure ourselves?

$500 and a hooker wouldn't of helped, the kid had more then $500, and he had a BMW. As for positive reinforcement, one of his dad's friend, an expert with the ladies, offered to teach the kid how to talk to girls. There were tons of good reinforcements, and his sibling, who were raised by the same parents, were doing quite well for themselves.

I wouldn't even say the parents are to blame, because they sent him to counseling, they reported his behavior to police, and after reading his manifesto, seem like good parents. They encouraged him to make friends, they sent him to college and nice private schools. From reading his manifesto I can't really see anything they did wrong. They weren't even absent parents ala poor little rich boy stereotypes. Don't get me wrong, Rodgers hated his parents. The reason he hated his parents though are rather flimsy, he hated his mother for buying a plane ticket to England for his sister's boyfriend, and for being a women. He hated his father because the father didn't give the kid his house and because the father has sex with his stepmother. The stepmother gets a lot of hate in the manifesto but as far as I could tell she expected the kid to clean up after himself and play nice with his half-brother and friends, which drove the kid up a wall.

The problem wasn't that the kid couldn't get laid, it was the kids narcissism and inflated sense of self-worth. The kid quite 2 jobs because they were "beneath him". He encouraged his mother to "marry a rich man" and was angry that she didn't do what was best for him by marrying a rich man. He never talked to girls, expecting one to magically fall on his cock. He didn't make friends, relying on his mother making play-dates when he was small, or the school pairing him up with either room-mates or counselors for a social life, and he seemed very angry that the inferior people that surrounded him didn't magically become his friends. He was convinced that the world would magically become better if everyone did what he said and was trying to come up with a plan that would make him the undisputed ruler of all the world, controlling everybody's life and became completely and utterly depressed when he realized the cruelty and injustice of life because he would never rule the world.


There's a section in his manifesto where the kid, determined to lose his virginity before age 22, goes to a random house party. He sees a bunch of kids flirting on a ledge with a 10 foot drop and gets angry that he's still a virgin. He decides to push the girls off of the ledge! As you can imagine, people don't take kindly to being pushed off ledges, there's a struggle and he winds up being the one that falls off the ledge, shattering his leg. The kid is now livid that none of the girls that he tried to push off the ledge help him with his shattered leg! He believed that one of the girls WHO HE JUST TRIED TO KILL should have offered to sleep with him to make him feel better about his shattered foot!

The kid had issues and as of right now I don't think society has the resources to fix him. Maybe some people really would be better off taken away from society.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,415
14,307
136
Actually he sounds a lot like you class-envy whining dipshits. Just substitute his jealousy over anyone successful with women, and your ilk whining about anyone successful at making money, and the whiny, entitled, shitbagness sounds a lot the same.

Nice try, but there's already a name for people with authoritarian attitudes about other people having sex, and that name isn't liberal or leftist.
 

Zaap

Diamond Member
Jun 12, 2008
7,162
424
126
Nice try, but there's already a name for people with authoritarian attitudes about other people having sex, and that name isn't liberal or leftist.
Nice attempt at spin (for you that is- weak for most anyone else) but the worst class-envy twats exhibit a similar misplaced sense of self-importance and entitlement.

This kid expected women to just magically serve his entitled little fantasies. He of course couldn't be told that his lack of success with them was pretty much entirely his own fault, his own lack of ability, not the fault of those he scapegoated. When (of course) people didn't go for his entitlement demands, he started imagining dumb revenge fantasies. (In his case, being a true violent nut, he actually carried them out.)

Many class-envy twits exhibit a similar sense of entitlement when it comes to self-serving fantasies about anyone they label as "the rich" being somehow on the hook to serve them and pay for their existences. They can never be told their lack of success is pretty much entirely their own fault, and their own lack of skills needed for the things they want to demand from others. When (of course) people don't agree to their entitlement demands, they start imagining dumb revenge fantasies.

Like I say, most of it is just a lot of passive-aggressive hot air ("Kill the rich! Make-believe Revolution! Everyone will become criminals and rob/kill everyone who disagrees with me!!!" etc etc.) so most will never really do anything but sit on their fat asses and keep bitching about things, but the chickenshit sense of entitlement to something provided by someone else without the person earning it is very similar.
 

jackstar7

Lifer
Jun 26, 2009
11,679
1,944
126
Nice attempt at spin (for you that is- weak for most anyone else) but the worst class-envy twats exhibit a similar misplaced sense of self-importance and entitlement.

This kid expected women to just magically serve his entitled little fantasies. He of course couldn't be told that his lack of success with them was pretty much entirely his own fault, his own lack of ability, not the fault of those he scapegoated. When (of course) people didn't go for his entitlement demands, he started imagining dumb revenge fantasies. (In his case, being a true violent nut, he actually carried them out.)

Many class-envy twits exhibit a similar sense of entitlement when it comes to self-serving fantasies about anyone they label as "the rich" being somehow on the hook to serve them and pay for their existences. They can never be told their lack of success is pretty much entirely their own fault, and their own lack of skills needed for the things they want to demand from others. When (of course) people don't agree to their entitlement demands, they start imagining dumb revenge fantasies.

Like I say, most of it is just a lot of passive-aggressive hot air ("Kill the rich! Make-believe Revolution! Everyone will become criminals and rob/kill everyone who disagrees with me!!!" etc etc.) so most will never really do anything but sit on their fat asses and keep bitching about things, but the chickenshit sense of entitlement to something provided by someone else without the person earning it is very similar.

I'm sure you can point to studies about this behavior and which political leanings exhibit them. Or is it a class strata? Who are the weak ones that you are so much better than? Tell us more about them.
 

CitizenKain

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2000
4,480
14
76
Nice attempt at spin (for you that is- weak for most anyone else) but the worst class-envy twats exhibit a similar misplaced sense of self-importance and entitlement.

This kid expected women to just magically serve his entitled little fantasies. He of course couldn't be told that his lack of success with them was pretty much entirely his own fault, his own lack of ability, not the fault of those he scapegoated. When (of course) people didn't go for his entitlement demands, he started imagining dumb revenge fantasies. (In his case, being a true violent nut, he actually carried them out.)

Many class-envy twits exhibit a similar sense of entitlement when it comes to self-serving fantasies about anyone they label as "the rich" being somehow on the hook to serve them and pay for their existences. They can never be told their lack of success is pretty much entirely their own fault, and their own lack of skills needed for the things they want to demand from others. When (of course) people don't agree to their entitlement demands, they start imagining dumb revenge fantasies.

Like I say, most of it is just a lot of passive-aggressive hot air ("Kill the rich! Make-believe Revolution! Everyone will become criminals and rob/kill everyone who disagrees with me!!!" etc etc.) so most will never really do anything but sit on their fat asses and keep bitching about things, but the chickenshit sense of entitlement to something provided by someone else without the person earning it is very similar.

These are things spoiled idiot manchildren believe, no one else does. Lets hear more about how entitlement from someone living off their parents.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,415
14,307
136
Nice attempt at spin (for you that is- weak for most anyone else) but the worst class-envy twats exhibit a similar misplaced sense of self-importance and entitlement.

This kid expected women to just magically serve his entitled little fantasies. He of course couldn't be told that his lack of success with them was pretty much entirely his own fault, his own lack of ability, not the fault of those he scapegoated. When (of course) people didn't go for his entitlement demands, he started imagining dumb revenge fantasies. (In his case, being a true violent nut, he actually carried them out.)

Many class-envy twits exhibit a similar sense of entitlement when it comes to self-serving fantasies about anyone they label as "the rich" being somehow on the hook to serve them and pay for their existences. They can never be told their lack of success is pretty much entirely their own fault, and their own lack of skills needed for the things they want to demand from others. When (of course) people don't agree to their entitlement demands, they start imagining dumb revenge fantasies.

Like I say, most of it is just a lot of passive-aggressive hot air ("Kill the rich! Make-believe Revolution! Everyone will become criminals and rob/kill everyone who disagrees with me!!!" etc etc.) so most will never really do anything but sit on their fat asses and keep bitching about things, but the chickenshit sense of entitlement to something provided by someone else without the person earning it is very similar.

Not bad. 139 more pages of this and you'd have a decent manifesto.
 

Darwin333

Lifer
Dec 11, 2006
19,946
2,329
126
Negative. There are some red flags in his childhood stories. 2nd grade behavior card, 6th? grade a girl shoved him. Porn was somehow this traumatic thing that scarred him. His mental illness was there from day 1.

As I said, I skimmed. I didn't have the time or the desire to read all 150ish pages.
He was overly obsessed with seeking validation from others, and dramatically over reacted with jealously and rage when he didn't find that validation.

That is definitely true from what I read.

He turned to it for a period of time, after being rejected. There were periods where he claimed to not touch WoW. Did you miss the part where he was too distraught to even enjoy that?

Yes, I missed that part.

Instead of? No.. he started off wanting the former, but turned twisted and evil towards the latter. At some point the little kid died inside. His hopes turned to despair.

Instead of simply aspiring to have what he wanted versus wanting to ensure that no one else got it. There is quite a bit of difference.
 

Darwin333

Lifer
Dec 11, 2006
19,946
2,329
126
he is in California

what are the rules in your state to get somebody involuntarily commit ed? i think for adults its normally a court order.

In my state they can hold you at a mental health facility for 72 hours with basically just reasonable concern from loved ones or medical professionals. During those 72 hours (pretty sure) the coroner evaluates you and can grant the facility another week or two without involving the judicial system at all. After that time (not sure if its a week, two or in between) they need a judge to sign off on holding you any longer but by then they have had the time to properly evaluate you.
 

Darwin333

Lifer
Dec 11, 2006
19,946
2,329
126
The kid wasn't institutionalized... so there's a problem there...

Not sure of the laws in the state of Cali but from the therapists actions I would assume that calling the authorities is the first step to getting someone institutionalized. A therapist generally doesn't have the staff to force someone to do something against their will even if they have the legal authority.
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
126
I'm happy you made this post, as I was just about to ask if anyone had heard from you after this incident.

My sources tell me Neh is more interested in toasters than women. I've also heard that he has had no difficulty whatsoever picking up toasters.

That being said, if I heard about somebody going bezerk and going on mass toaster murder spree, THEN I would be worried.
 

bradly1101

Diamond Member
May 5, 2013
4,689
294
126
www.bradlygsmith.org
It's a fruitless argument at this point, and especially in this place. Gun manufacturers and their lobbyists are so firmly entrenched in the U.S., even if all gun manufacturing stopped today, we'd still be at near saturation levels for the rest of our little, American lives.

Our congress is very much in the pocket of the NRA, so no reasonable background check law will ever get through. A gun sold to an insane person or a criminal is still a sale. And the more guns that are sold to the 'bad guys,' the more guns we need in the hands of the good guys. More sales!

But then we Americans succumb to so much sales marketing, we're killing ourselves with food and alcohol too. We're suckers. I just can't imagine suckling at the teat of fear (they're coming for your guns!, you need to have a gun for protection wherever you go!) that the NRA presents, which of course spurs more gun sales. Continuing behavior that doesn't work, or especially is harmful, is the very definition of insanity.

The dream of our country being free of regular, often gun violence will never be realized (at least in our lifetimes).
 

shira

Diamond Member
Jan 12, 2005
9,567
6
81
My sources tell me Neh is more interested in toasters than women. I've also heard that he has had no difficulty whatsoever picking up toasters.

That being said, if I heard about somebody going bezerk and going on mass toaster murder spree, THEN I would be worried.

He's better be careful where he sticks it or he could get burned. :awe:
 

irishScott

Lifer
Oct 10, 2006
21,568
3
0
It's a fruitless argument at this point, and especially in this place. Gun manufacturers and their lobbyists are so firmly entrenched in the U.S., even if all gun manufacturing stopped today, we'd still be at near saturation levels for the rest of our little, American lives.

Our congress is very much in the pocket of the NRA, so no reasonable background check law will ever get through. A gun sold to an insane person or a criminal is still a sale. And the more guns that are sold to the 'bad guys,' the more guns we need in the hands of the good guys. More sales!

But then we Americans succumb to so much sales marketing, we're killing ourselves with food and alcohol too. We're suckers. I just can't imagine suckling at the teat of fear (they're coming for your guns!, you need to have a gun for protection wherever you go!) that the NRA presents, which of course spurs more gun sales. Continuing behavior that doesn't work, or especially is harmful, is the very definition of insanity.

The dream of our country being free of regular, often gun violence will never be realized (at least in our lifetimes).

Clearly you haven't researched this.

1. California has Universal Background Checks and waiting periods.

2. Last year New York City sent letters threatening confiscation to legally licensed gun owners in the city limits, all because they owned a rifle or shotgun that held more than 5 rounds. We're talking bolt-action .22s here, not anything that could even remotely be designation an "assault rifle".

#2 is what the gun control advocates want, and so long as that is the case there is no "reasonable" gun control that won't be exploited and abused, and criminals will continue to not give a shit.
 

nehalem256

Lifer
Apr 13, 2012
15,669
8
0
It's a fruitless argument at this point, and especially in this place. Gun manufacturers and their lobbyists are so firmly entrenched in the U.S., even if all gun manufacturing stopped today, we'd still be at near saturation levels for the rest of our little, American lives.

Our congress is very much in the pocket of the NRA, so no reasonable background check law will ever get through. A gun sold to an insane person or a criminal is still a sale. And the more guns that are sold to the 'bad guys,' the more guns we need in the hands of the good guys. More sales!

But then we Americans succumb to so much sales marketing, we're killing ourselves with food and alcohol too. We're suckers. I just can't imagine suckling at the teat of fear (they're coming for your guns!, you need to have a gun for protection wherever you go!) that the NRA presents, which of course spurs more gun sales. Continuing behavior that doesn't work, or especially is harmful, is the very definition of insanity.

The dream of our country being free of regular, often gun violence will never be realized (at least in our lifetimes).

Of course given that the guy this thread is about killed 3/6 victims by knifing them means bringing up gun control is pretty stupid.

Somehow I don't think banning guns would have been too helpful.
 

Venix

Golden Member
Aug 22, 2002
1,084
3
81
Clearly you haven't researched this.

1. California has Universal Background Checks and waiting periods.

2. Last year New York City sent letters threatening confiscation to legally licensed gun owners in the city limits, all because they owned a rifle or shotgun that held more than 5 rounds. We're talking bolt-action .22s here, not anything that could even remotely be designation an "assault rifle".

#2 is what the gun control advocates want, and so long as that is the case there is no "reasonable" gun control that won't be exploited and abused, and criminals will continue to not give a shit.

bradly1101 is one of the most painfully incompetent simpletons on this forum. Case in point: The quote in his signature attributed to Wayne LaPierre is actually from Canada News Network, a satirical site like The Onion. Haha.
 

mooncancook

Platinum Member
May 28, 2003
2,874
50
91
Is it wrong for me to think that he shouldn't be dead, instead he should be serving in prison and have his sex wishes fulfilled there by the inmates?
 

Matt1970

Lifer
Mar 19, 2007
12,320
3
0
Having read much of his life story, from himself, he was born with a strong need of validation from others. Had a broken family, a stepmother who he fought with, and few positive influences in his life. There are a few red flags with his childhood stories.

There are millions of kids who go through the same things this kid went through and they aren't out killing people. This kid was a sheltered spoiled little narcissistic brat who couldn't handle it when a few things in life didn't go his way.
 
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