Have we reached "Good Enough" in the GPU space?

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Snafuh

Member
Mar 16, 2015
115
0
16
Definitely not.
We still have to use all kind of ugly tricks to make games run on modern hardware. Lighting relies on a mix between dynamic effects and pre baked maps.
And higher resolution (4K) will become mainstream over the next few years.
 

tential

Diamond Member
May 13, 2008
7,355
642
121
Definitely not.
We still have to use all kind of ugly tricks to make games run on modern hardware. Lighting relies on a mix between dynamic effects and pre baked maps.
And higher resolution (4K) will become mainstream over the next few years.
Until 4k 120hz is possible and affordable and playable on a low end gpu with good graphical settings, we're not at the good enough phase

Gpus will be at the "good enough" when they can render vr that literally tricks me into forgetting I'm in a game.

Otherwise, gpu horsepower will never be enough. I think of new gpu upgrades every day, but display limitations hold me back so much.
 

poohbear

Platinum Member
Mar 11, 2003
2,284
5
81
ask yourself this, can games run CGI level graphics + physics yet? no? then it's certainly not good enough.
 

pooptastic

Member
Oct 18, 2015
87
1
36
I remember seeing Doom, which got me into PCs and PC gaming since it completely blew me away. Around then, Final Fantasy 6 also blew me away with it's graphics, as well as the story and soundtrack for it all.

Lately i've played a bit of GTAV, MGSV and am blown away with them graphically, and how fun they are too.

Not sure if the level of awesomeness is any different for the times. As good as stuff looks now, i don't see it stopping and stagnating any time soon.
 

Pottuvoi

Senior member
Apr 16, 2012
416
2
81
We have good enough CPUs and GPUs to play Nethack, but certainly that doesn't mean there is no more reason to improve the tech.
 

boozzer

Golden Member
Jan 12, 2012
1,549
18
81
5-10 years to get dual 16K 120Hz+? 10 years ago most people here had 1600x1200 at 85Hz, 1280x1024 at 60hz, 1680x1050 at 60hz, or at the most 1920x1200 at 60hz. Today we are only just barely getting 2560x1440 144hz and 3840x2160 60hz. Dual 16K is 32 times the pixels of 2160. If you want it at 120Hz+, and you do, then double that number again for hardware intensity needed. So we have to go roughly 64 times from today. Even if we pretend everyone 10 years ago played at 1280x1024, going from that to 2160 is only a 6.3 pixel increase - and the same Hz.

Decades.
I would be probably be dead or too old. damn that sucks. I wish moore's law lasted till I die
 

Revolution 11

Senior member
Jun 2, 2011
952
79
91
I would be probably be dead or too old. damn that sucks. I wish moore's law lasted till I die
I hope you never die then. ()

The good enough question is more related to a powerful combination of AMD's weakness and delays in foundry nodes than to console specs. A more powerful AMD would improve the price/performance ratio for both Nvidia and AMD GPUs. Faster foundry nodes would allow both companies to progress faster.

We are unlikely to see either scenario happen. :'(
 
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RussianSensation

Elite Member
Sep 5, 2003
19,458
765
126
ask yourself this, can games run CGI level graphics + physics yet? no? then it's certainly not good enough.

I love your response. :thumbsup:







Source

I think we have at least 20+ years of improvement ahead of us. Even performing real time global illumination is out of the question on modern GPUs in a game.

Console hardware is holding back some of the advancements in graphics though. The Division is another game that's getting downgraded. That means we are still ways off before graphics reach the point of "good enough." Of course everyone's definition of good enough is different.
 
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MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,751
3,068
121
I believe I saw something similar to what RussianSensation posted the other day, there are a few things going on in the background haven't even been disclosed lately I think.

CGI wise.
 

poohbear

Platinum Member
Mar 11, 2003
2,284
5
81
Nice link Russiansensation. But not only CGI graphics, but CGI graphics AND realistic physics. A great example the physics of Witcher 3 adding so much more to the immersion of the game, not just it's awesome graphics. (Wind, animations, fighting physics & hair animations)

20 years and hopefully with full VR sounds about right.
 

Pariah

Elite Member
Apr 16, 2000
7,357
20
81
I think most of you are missing the point the OP was asking about. He's asking if GPU's have reached the point of good enough based on current software and the continually slowing pace of its improvements. CPU's reached good enough years ago where the average user has no real need to upgrade anymore. GPU's are sprinting in that direction as well if they haven't already reached that point. 10 years ago, if you bought a topend GPU at release, it was superseded within 6 months by a new arch or refresh, and within a couple years it was a paperweight. The industry as a whole has slowed way down, and the pace of advancements is down to a crawl. It took AMD over a year and a half to replace the 290x with the marginally faster 390x refresh and then Fury a bit later.

For the average user who at best is using 1080p, I believe GPU's have reached good enough, and that will continue until the masses eventually move to 2160p.
 

Zodiark1593

Platinum Member
Oct 21, 2012
2,230
4
81
I think most of you are missing the point the OP was asking about. He's asking if GPU's have reached the point of good enough based on current software and the continually slowing pace of its improvements. CPU's reached good enough years ago where the average user has no real need to upgrade anymore. GPU's are sprinting in that direction as well if they haven't already reached that point. 10 years ago, if you bought a topend GPU at release, it was superseded within 6 months by a new arch or refresh, and within a couple years it was a paperweight. The industry as a whole has slowed way down, and the pace of advancements is down to a crawl. It took AMD over a year and a half to replace the 290x with the marginally faster 390x refresh and then Fury a bit later.

For the average user who at best is using 1080p, I believe GPU's have reached good enough, and that will continue until the masses eventually move to 2160p.

Even if 1080P is a permanent standard, GPUs have an extremely long way to go before real-time path-tracing effects (such as Global Illumination, accurate glass, etc) become feasible.

This takes brute-force, lots and lots of brute-force, potentially in the petaflops range for 60 fps let alone 120+ fps.
 

HeXen

Diamond Member
Dec 13, 2009
7,832
38
91
I've realized that even as amazing graphical games come out, I'm quickly ready for the next level after playing it for a bit. I remember when watching PS1 CGI video's back in the day, I would think, man can't wait until 3d games look that good and think how great it will be...then when it comes out, I can still find reasons to wish it could look better.

Point is, I don't think there will be any point where we're pacified with game graphics. All everyone does is nitpick out faults, circle them in red to highlight comparisons or mod/tweak/photoshop them to present them in screenshots. Today it's 4k, then it'll be 8k with VR or something, it never ends.
 

96Firebird

Diamond Member
Nov 8, 2010
5,712
316
126
Good luck trying to find a game developer to achieve that in a commercial viable game. Until that happens whatever tech demo showcase #182798172 it's not going to matter in the real world.

Exactly. Hardware isn't the only limitation with respect to life-like graphics, you need the manpower to design everything in a life-like manner. Some games may still release with scaled back models and textures, so we aren't at that point yet, but hardware isn't the only issue.
 

Pariah

Elite Member
Apr 16, 2000
7,357
20
81
Even if 1080P is a permanent standard, GPUs have an extremely long way to go before real-time path-tracing effects (such as Global Illumination, accurate glass, etc) become feasible.

This takes brute-force, lots and lots of brute-force, potentially in the petaflops range for 60 fps let alone 120+ fps.

Are there any games available today that cannot played at visual settings acceptable to the average gamer at 1080p using a midrange GPU?
 

adamantine.me

Member
Oct 30, 2015
152
4
36
www.adamantine.me
I got a 2gb card a few years ago and have been happy with it since. Even with demanding, large player count games I'm fine with 40+ FPS. Graphics aren't everything, so I'm content with just finding something that excels in other areas, or even exploring older titles that I never got a chance to check out. Thanks to Steam I have a long list of those.
 

SPBHM

Diamond Member
Sep 12, 2012
5,058
410
126
most gamers seem to think PS4/XB1 are good enough for current games, going by that something like a 7870 is also good enough
 

Zodiark1593

Platinum Member
Oct 21, 2012
2,230
4
81
Are there any games available today that cannot played at visual settings acceptable to the average gamer at 1080p using a midrange GPU?
Not to my eye. Once you get into cgi type-stuff, you can pick out flaws everywhere. One of those things you can't un-see.
 

ThatBuzzkiller

Golden Member
Nov 14, 2014
1,120
260
136
This is off-topic but I do not believe consoles are holding back technical achievement in ANY way ...

We should thank current gen consoles for pushing bindless and stateless compute ...

If it were not for them we wouldn't be getting a fast transition to physically based shading, more options for anti-aliasing, and many more ...

If anything, consoles ARE pushing the boundaries of what's possible! It was inspiring how Alex from Media Molecule outlined a way to get REYES rendering level of geometry on a CONSOLE!

Video cards with 2GB or less of video memory won't be relevant in the near future when comparing to consoles since they'll be bottlenecked in trying to achieve the same settings ...

If we excluded every video card that had under 2GB of video memory and didn't have at least an HD 7870 level of performance then what's in the PS4 would easily show up in the top 10th percentile. Some hardcore PC gamers keep complaining about how consoles are weak yet they refuse to face the fact that the majority of PCs that even have a dedicated DX11 capable video card are weaker than consoles so most the the blame should be pinned on PCs, not consoles.

This is not meant to be a "haha PC sucks, consoles rules" rant since I'm a high end PC user myself but is a post to show the modest view of the landscape or the reality for some ...
 

railven

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2010
6,604
561
126
Second post nailed it. My 980 Ti OC'd to 1425mhz screams like a banshee (stupid Corsair) but it still can't run FFXIV at DSR 4K. I have to settle for 1440p if I want smooth 60 FPS.

With my next monitor upgrade coming soon, I want ultra wide/4K and I don't want to touch multi-GPUs. So I will be upgrading, and Pascal/Arctic Islands better bring their A-Game!
 
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