HDR+AA not working on X1800XTs

[DaveBaumann]

Sorry, first line of that post was supposed to read "HDR via FP16 blending and AA is not an automatic thing...

Originally posted by: Matthias99
Interesting... the driver doesn't know to do the sampling on the FP16 buffer when this mode is being used? Although I guess if it did, it could break things that aren't driving the display directly from that buffer...

The control panel AA/AF options are really only a hack, all these things should really be controlled by the developer, but they are just there as a shortcut and older games didn't use primary buffers that weren't the display buffers as much. The drivers can only really force these things, reasonably, on the display buffer - something such as rendering to an FP16 surface is just like a render to texture operation to the graphics board/driver and it it wouldn't be correct to assume that all render targets should have AA forced.

Originally posted by: KeepItRed
What kind of problem is this? Software or hardware related?

So there will be a patch coming?

Its both - it just the natural progression of things.

First hardware didn't support FP16 surfaces - then hardware did, but without blending - then hardware supported FP16 blending, but without AA - now there's hardware with FP16 blending and AA support and more will inevitably follow. Developers are at the point of using hardware with FP16 blending, becuase NV40 supported it for some time, and now that there's hardware that can support both FP16 blending and AA dev's will start enabling AA on it in time, as CryTek have already done, in an apparantly short order.

 

[BFG10K]

HDR+AA not working on X1800XTs

Does FP HDR + AA work on your 7800? Nope and it never will because your hardware doesn't support it, unlike Far Cry and Serious Sam 2 which simply requires developer AA support to make it work on R520 cards.

I don't recall you ever creating a troll thread to slam nVidia's AA-less HDR limitation but that's to be expected from you.

Personally, I wondered a lot about what performance would be for this, even if it was working.

Yet you didn't seem to wonder about performance when you were pimping AA-less HDR and soft shadows on nVidia cards.

 

[Jeff7181]

Since the Source engine can do both HDR and AA on both ATI and nVidia hardware, I'd have to say that any game that can't is due to poor/lazy development. I don't care if you consider the method of HDR that Valve used for the Source engine to be true HDR or not... and I don't care what the hardware supports or doesn't support. The same effect is achieved. Valve managed to do it... why isn't anyone else? Why are other developers telling us one or the other when Valve gave us both?

 

[AznAnarchy99]

Originally posted by: lavaheadache

Originally posted by: Rollo
It would seem the value of the much hyped HDR+AA on the X1800XT was grossly overstated, at least at this point in time:

Serious Sam2

There is a rendering problem with HDR enabled on the ATI Radeon X1800 XT.

Therefore, we had to do the unthinkable for a high-end video card and set the resolution to 1024x768. To our surprise, -- even at 1024x768 with 4XAA and then 2XAA -- performance was unplayable in some situations in the game. As hard as it is to believe, we found that we had to disable AA at 1024x768 just to get acceptable HDR performance in Serious Sam 2 on the Radeon X1800 XT.

FarCry

I wonder how long it will take before X1K owners can use HDR + AA in Farcry.

Wth is the patch?

Does anyone know of a link to an article that actually has HDR + AA working?

For something that was hyped as the "big IQ improvement", this is disappointing to say the least.

Personally, I wondered a lot about what performance would be for this, even if it was working.

As usual, Rollo either posts something positive about NVidia or something negative about ATi. You are about as predicatable as bad gas after eating Wendy's chili! Back when the 6series came out and HDR on farcry, I recall you stating how great and all it was. You were running it on an SLI setup where it probably was decent. For those of us on AGP 6 series cards and non-sli rigs we thought all the hyped "big IQ improvement" was disappointing to say the least aswell. So the x1800 is having a few glitches, Remember pure video? Where was that feature?. I know it said it on the box to my 6800GT! I would just love to hear you say that both companies are equally competetive and both capable of comparable products. FA FA FA FANBOY!!!!

i think most of us already knew this

 

[Ackmed]

Originally posted by: lavaheadache
You were running it on an SLI setup where it probably was decent.

SLI gives no boost in HDR in Farcry. Which is pretty ironic to me. Since both were so highly touted features, yet they dont help Farcry at all.

A patch will give HDR+AA, just like a patch gave HDR to begin with. We had to wait several months to get HDR in Farcry, and even waited thru a recalled patch. Now that the shoe is on the other foot, its A-O.k.

 

[Zenoth]

Works well in DOD:S for me.

I haven't tried in Far Cry. But isn't Far Cry's "HDR" actually just a Bloom effect anyway ?

And, personally, I don't believe that feature was that "much hyped" at all in the first place.

Why is it only now, after a month+ of X1K availability that people try to see it if works well or not.

 

[crazydingo]

HDR+AA not working on X1800XTs (not true), misleading title. Double standard keys ..

 

[RobertR1]

Wow. Rollo is getting lamer day by day. It's now Ati's fault that Crytek and Ubisoft haven't released a patch for their game??

To top it off, he's been following "ackmed" on Rage3d, Beyond3d and perhaps other boards, like an e-stalker of sorts, which simply shows a persons character, or lack there of. To make this guy a Mod a would be board suicide.

 

[Ackmed]

I have him ignored on all forums, and ignored/deleted his PM's without reading them. Im done with him. I wont read, or reply to any of his posts. So he can follow me around all he wants now.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: RobertR1
Wow. Rollo is getting lamer day by day. It's now Ati's fault that Crytek and Ubisoft haven't released a patch for their game??

Just reporting the news. The HDR+AA was a much hyped distinguishing feature of the X1800XT, and the only game I know that it works on is one level of HL2, and it works for nVidia cards as well on that. Doesn't work on Far Cry, Serious Sam 2, or SC:CT as far as I know. From the looks of the performance hit it takes on Serious Sam 2, as reported by HardOCP, it may well be worthless anyway?
Don't you think people considering video card purchases might want to factor all this into the equation, "RobertR1"?

To top it off, he's been following "ackmed" on Rage3d, Beyond3d and perhaps other boards, like an e-stalker of sorts, which simply shows a persons character, or lack there of. To make this guy a Mod a would be board suicide.

LOL So it's OK for Ackmed to follow me all over the internet and post FUD in my threads or nitpick them? What's that say about HIS character? I've put up with it for years, but now I'm going to take a much more active interest in Ackmed/Fallguy/Emilees activities.

I find it fairly interesting that wherever I go on the net, there's old Ackmed jumping in to defend ATI, any time of the day....almost like it was his job or something.....

Not to worry though, Team ATI, if Ackmed only posts the truth, I have nothing to say to him. :beer:

BTW- what was your name before you were banned?

 

[Paratus]

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: Elfear

Originally posted by: Matthias99

Originally posted by: Elfear
I'd expect a patch is coming soon. Pretty sure HDR + AA works in HL2: Lost Coast.

As mentioned before (and in a million other threads), the Source engine uses a completely different method of doing HDR than FarCry. They're not directly comparable.

Sorry I guess my post was a little misleading. I realize the HDR implementation is different between the two companies, I was just pointing out to Rollo that HDR + AA does in fact work on the X1800 series cards.

I actually knew that it worked on the HL2 Lost Coast level for both companies products, but I consider that more a tech demo. You can't play through HL2 with HDR +AA on, at least AFAIK.

Strangely enough while updating my Moms Dell XPS Gen 2 with Cat 5.11s so my Dad could play HL2, (he stopped like 6 months ago because steam told him is drivers were out of date.......) I noticed that in the HL2 control panel under advanced video options it had the same HDR selections as lost coast. I did't get a chance to play with it however so I'm not sure if actually did anything.

 

[RobertR1]

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: RobertR1
Wow. Rollo is getting lamer day by day. It's now Ati's fault that Crytek and Ubisoft haven't released a patch for their game??

Just reporting the news. The HDR+AA was a much hyped distinguishing feature of the X1800XT, and the only game I know that it works on is one level of HL2, and it works for nVidia cards as well on that. Doesn't work on Far Cry, Serious Sam 2, or SC:CT as far as I know. From the looks of the performance hit it takes on Serious Sam 2, as reported by HardOCP, it may well be worthless anyway?
Don't you think people considering video card purchases might want to factor all this into the equation, "RobertR1"?

HDR was a much talked about feature when the 6800 series was launched but it was quite some time before you saw it in FarCry. Until SC:CT came out, FarCry was the only game with HDR. Does that mean buying a 6800series for it's much boasted feature set was a waste?

If you want to report "news," contact the studios that make those games and ask them for info on the HDR+AA patches for their respective games. Then, come back and let us know as to why there are no patches currently and what we can expect or not. That's called news reporting. You're just stating common knowledge information. "News" consists of fact finding and research. Give it a shot.

BTW- what was your name before you were banned?

Put your "Jump To Conclusions" mat back in the closet. I haven't been banned from this board but I'll work on it, just for you.

 

[Wreckage]

Originally posted by: RobertR1
Wow. Rollo is getting lamer day by day. It's now Ati's fault that Crytek and Ubisoft haven't released a patch for their game??

To top it off, he's been following "ackmed" on Rage3d, Beyond3d and perhaps other boards, like an e-stalker of sorts, which simply shows a persons character, or lack there of. To make this guy a Mod a would be board suicide.

No it's ATI's fault for bragging about features months ago that still don't exist. How many people are running H.264 or X1800 crossfire or FP16 HDR + AA or even have a mid-range x1600?

NONE

ATI make promises not products.

 

[Zenoth]

That doesn't exist ?

Please get your words right.

Why can I see AAA take actual effect with full HDR enabled in DOD:S with my X1K XL ?

Oh, true, sorry, surely not because it's possible on the new generation, since it doesn't exist.

I made that possible by myself. I'm a good independent engineer, and I created the feature for my own pleasure.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Zenoth
That doesn't exist ?

Please get your words right.

Why can I see AAA take actual effect with full HDR enabled in DOD:S with my X1K XL ?

Oh, true, sorry, surely not because it's possible on the new generation, since it doesn't exist.

I made that possible by myself. I'm a good independent engineer, and I created the feature for my own pleasure.

Not that I doubt you Zenoth, but do we have some professional verification this works. No offense, but I've seen more than a few posts where people thought they were using features and really weren't. (e.g. FarCry HDR + AA on nV40s)

 

[Zenoth]

Ok, well, I'm gonna go take some screenshots.

If that wouldn't be enough, then I might always try to take a video with Fraps, but don't blame me with the poor quality.

I'll be back in a few minutes.

 

[TheHans]

Zenoth, did you read the whole thread?
It has already been stated by Matthias99 that Half-Life 2 and all other games based upon the Source engine have a different HDR implementation that DOES NOT use a fp16 buffer, it does not requie Shader Model 3.0 support in any way. Any card can do HDR + AA in Half-life 2 and the other Source games.
Didn't you notice Steelski mentioning that he can use AA when using HDR in HL2: Lost Coast?
Even I can use HDR + AA in HL2: Lost Coast with my 7800gtx. There is no need to post screenshots, we believe you.
Anyway from what I've seen on the review sites, it looks like HDR + AA works on the x1800 cards, it's just slow.

 

[Zenoth]

I took some.

Settings:
1280 x 960
6 x Quality Adaptive A-A
16 x High Quality A-F
Everything set to High / Full HDR

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/2377/dodflash00006uj.jpg
http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/3096/dodflash00015qt.jpg
http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/72/dodflash00021my.jpg
http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/7532/dodflash00035wd.jpg
http://img400.imageshack.us/img400/5339/dodflash00044ug.jpg
http://img400.imageshack.us/img400/7410/dodflash00056ir.jpg
http://img400.imageshack.us/img400/8054/dodflash00067qt.jpg
http://img400.imageshack.us/img400/2823/dodflash00075rt.jpg
http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/1958/dodflash00088tp.jpg

 

[Zenoth]

Oh I see.

Well, I didn't know about the FP16 thing for the Source's HDR.

Alright then.

Well, sorry I can't try in Far Cry since I don't have it.

Hmmm, perhaps I could in AOE III ? Isn't it just Bloom or is it HDR ?

Give me a game where I could try. I can't think of one right now using "true" HDR.

 

[TheHans]

I think AOE III uses real HDR.
Try Splinter Cell 3, in SM3 mode.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: TheHans
Zenoth, did you read the whole thread?
It has already been stated by Matthias99 that Half-Life 2 and all other games based upon the Source engine have a different HDR implementation that DOES NOT use a fp16 buffer, it does not requie Shader Model 3.0 support in any way. Any card can do HDR + AA in Half-life 2 and the other Source games.
Didn't you notice Steelski mentioning that he can use AA when using HDR in HL2: Lost Coast?
Even I can use HDR + AA in HL2: Lost Coast with my 7800gtx. There is no need to post screenshots, we believe you.
Anyway from what I've seen on the review sites, it looks like HDR + AA works on the x1800 cards, it's just slow.

Ah, I didn't know DOD is a source game. I hate war games, don't want to shoot the soldiers with a rifle, just a preference.

So I looked it up and see DOD is only four levels of WWII style HL2 mod, and that this will work for the 6800/7800 as well.

So I still haven't seen a link to a game where the ATI HDR+AA makes their cards a better buy than a 7800GTX.

I've seen about 100 posts from guys saying "This is the next big thing" but no proof of it?

 

[Sc4freak]

I'm pretty sure the hardware is physically capable of it, but no games (as of yet) support it.

 

[RobertR1]

Originally posted by: Sc4freak
I'm pretty sure the hardware is physically capable of it, but no games (as of yet) support it.

You don't understand Rollo's thinking, freak. It only Ok for nvidia to release features that are not immediately available for play. When nvidia releases future tech, it's amazing, when Ati does it, it's a waste and must be scoffed at.

Rollo,
Are you busy doing due diligance by asking the the different gaming studios on the status of their HDR+AA patches? After all, it is fair and balanced news that we expect of you......

 

[M0RPH]

Originally posted by: Rollo

So I still haven't seen a link to a game where the ATI HDR+AA makes their cards a better buy than a 7800GTX.

I've seen about 100 posts from guys saying "This is the next big thing" but no proof of it?

And you were pushing the SM3 on Geforce cards as a reason to choose them over ATI well before there were any games to take advantage of it. People don't buy cards just for games that are currently out, they buy them with future games in mind as well.

 

[BFG10K]

From the looks of the performance hit it takes on Serious Sam 2, as reported by HardOCP, it may well be worthless anyway?

You mean like HDR on the NV4x series and soft shadows on nVidia cards in general?

Again that didn't stop you pimping those features as "must have" and claiming the death of ATi because they didn't have them.

How can you continue to post in this thread with a straight face?