HDR+AA not working on X1800XTs

[nRollo]

Sorry Zenoth. It looks like a blurry mess to me, and I don't buy that you're the only one in the world who seems to know this works.

I do have a friend with a X1800XT, and I'll look into it with him this weekend, post my findings here? He doesn't have Far Cry, but I do.

 

[Cookie Monster]

Thats pretty cool feature, but can you notice a difference between HDR and HDR with AA?

 

[M0RPH]

Originally posted by: Rollo
Sorry Zenoth. It looks like a blurry mess to me, and I don't buy that you're the only one in the world who seems to know this works.

What an a$$.

 

[crazydingo]

Originally posted by: Zenoth
Wow, I wonder why I still keep posting. Bah, I'm trying to make my time taken for the contribution of the thread worth a little humble something I guess.

Dont worry, most of us believe you. The only people to not believe are the ones with known motives.

I'm sure intelligible people also saw the truth.

 

[fierydemise]

Zenoth thanks for your effort, you've contributed more to this thread then those from either side (no names needed)

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: fierydemise
Zenoth thanks for your effort, you've contributed more to this thread then those from either side (no names needed)

Has he contributed anything?

Xbit Labs says it doesn't work

We traditionally check the ability of the new graphics card to work in the HDR lighting mode and we also include the results of ATI?s RADEON X1800 which support HDR in Far Cry after installation of a special patch from CryTek. Unfortunately, the patch is not very fast and doesn?t allow turning on FSAA. It is also unavailable to ordinary users as yet, so it?s too early to comment upon the results of the RADEON X1800 cards.

Hmmm, so on 11/15/05 (two weeks ago) Xbit labs was telling us that with the as yet unavailable patch that turns on Far Cry HDR you can't use AA, and performance is slow?

Yet here's Zenoth, telling us he's playing Far Cry with HDR and AA all the time!

Maybe you should email Xbit and tell them how to get that HDR+AA going Zenoth! They'd be impressed!

Who's not contributing anything but FUD? Not me I guess. :roll:

 

[TheHans]

Those screenshots don't look like they have HDR... I remember before I uninstalled Far Cry, that blood didn't look right with it on, and that you couldn't see the sun properly because the light would bloom, there was also more contrast between the blue of the sky and the white of the clouds. I can clearly see the sun in 37md, the sand in 55cs is usually blindingly white.

Heres a screenshot, I dug up from when I was still using my 6800GT.

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/1918/farcry00024wc.jpg

 

[Zenoth]

TheHans, that's because HDR in Far Cry can be modified by the user.

You open up the Console, and type \r_hdrrendering x

"x" is the HDR "brightness" variant.

A known number for "best quality" is 7.

The picture you've linked us to is, as I recognize it, from an higher variant. I know, since I've tried myself.

The higher it is, and the more it looks like your picture. Forests look "darker" ... with more "depth" from afar especially, water seems more "clear", and pretty much any other textures got an higher contrast. And even the sky itself seems "bloomed" on higher variants, which isn't good. The only source of light in the sky should be the Sun ... and not the actual whole sky.

 

[Zenoth]

And, Rollo, while I can understand your doubt, I can't do much on my side.

I play it that way. It looks just as it is in the pictures, and even better, since it's happening in front of me, live, and not on mere .JPG's. That way, and only that was as I believe, can you really see it for yourself, and believe it. And man it looks holy-beautiful, even at a standard resolution like 1024 x 768. And curiously, it's the resolution XBit Labs suggest for X1K series with HDR enabled.

Perhaps they jumped too fast on conclusions, who knows.

S'not because they are "Xbit Labs" that they never make mistakes.

And even if they are right ... than why am I able to play as I play it ?

I don't know. Maybe I'm just lucky, and the immortal spirits in ATi-sylum granded my machine with powers yet to be understood by men.

 

[Zenoth]

Oh ... I forgot.

All I did to play with HDR in the first place was to search on Google, and I found that: http://www.krazygamers.com/?view=article&article=255

I did as they said. It worked, and I'm an happy first-person-shooter player at the moment. End of story ?

 

[TheHans]

I was using level 7. HDR adds a lot of blooming. You can see that in HL2: Lost Coast and maybe to a lesser extent in Day of Defeat: Source. If I remember correctly, all the number values did was change the type of glare you see.

I believe these are the values that change the intensity of the HDR bloom and contrast.
r_HDRBrightOffset
r_HDRBrightThreshold
r_HDRLevel

 

[BFG10K]

Quit yer trolling.

Quit yer Rollo butt-kissing.

HDR + AA was never hyped on 7800's was it?

Rollo takes issue with with X1800 FP HDR not working with AA even though he's been repeatedly told it will work after a game patch. Of course Rollo ("fair and balanced") would never start a troll thread against nVidia stating it never works on 6800/7800 cards when using FP blending.

It's very similar in fact where he started a troll thread slamming ATi for needing beta drivers to fix problems in new games despite nVidia doing the exact same thing and we got no response and no retraction, as per his usual trolling tactics.

Or like when he slammed ATi for ripping him off as they weren't giving him anything new, even while he was purchasing fourteen NV4x cards and telling us 6600GT/6800 SLI is viable.

Or like when claimed it was a "tiny hairdryer sound and non-issue" on his 5800U and then proceeded to slam the X1800 for noise issues.

Or like when he was proclaiming the death of ATi because of no SM 3.0 or soft shadows even though there were no games that took advantage of it, but now he's telling us features that aren't being used in games are useless.

This thread is nothing more than his usual trolling and blatant double standards and as usual you're right here to defend the steaming pile he created.

It sure as hell was on the X1000's now wasn't it sunshine.....

To quote yourself: "no sh!t sherlock".

Go and start another thread stating that 7800's don't work with HDR + AA and you'll get a lot of "No sh!t sherlock" replies.

I see. So we can slam a product that has an ability to use a feature but needs to be patched first it but we can't slam a competitor's product that doesn't offer said feature at all? Fair and balanced, hmmm?

 

[DaveBaumann]

Anything prior to thr 1.4 patch will not have HDR at all for Radeon X1000 boards. The 1.4 path enabled both HDR and AA, but the AA has to be enabled via the command line.

http://www.beyond3d.com/reviews/ati/r520/index.php?p=06#rop

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: DaveBaumann
Anything prior to thr 1.4 patch will not have HDR at all for Radeon X1000 boards. The 1.4 path enabled both HDR and AA, but the AA has to be enabled via the command line.

http://www.beyond3d.com/reviews/ati/r520/index.php?p=06#rop

Dave, I'm glad to see you back, you can undoubtedly shed light on this, given your relationship with ATI.

1. So you agree with me that Zenoth did NOT use HDR+AA simply by editing the command line a la "KrazyGamers" and turning on AA? I'm thinking he's getting AA only.

2. Did ATI provide you with the HDR + AA screenshots, or just the patch and methodology to

The images above are taken from a version of Far Cry that enables their HDR rendering mode to operate with FSAA on ATI's new boards, which only took a few hours to enable.

?

3. Why do you think XBit Labs could not enable the HDR? They are usually pretty good from what I've seen?

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Zenoth
Oh ... I forgot.

All I did to play with HDR in the first place was to search on Google, and I found that: http://www.krazygamers.com/?view=article&article=255

I did as they said. It worked, and I'm an happy first-person-shooter player at the moment. End of story ?

Unfortunately not. I don't think you realize that you're not playing with HDR plus AA, and I sincerely doubt an article from 2004 got you to the point that you could do it.

Why do I think that?

Well, Xbit Labs say they couldn't do it, even with a patch you don't have access to.

The guys at Rage 3d say they can't do it.

Dave Baumann, owner of B3d and noted web reviewer says you need a patch you don't have access to and a "couple hours of work" to do it. (and I somehow doubt that it takes Dave a couple hours to change the command line like we've all been doing since last summer)

It was very nice of you to go to the work of doing those screen shots, but it's pretty obvious they're not what you think they are. I'm sorry, but you are misleading the public and I have to call you on it.

People might buy X1800XTs thinking "Oh boy! EXR HDR + AA! Zenoth says so!" and find out "WTF? This doesn't work and for all we know may never!".

I don't think you have any agenda, I think you are just mistaken, and there's no shame in that.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

Quit yer trolling.

Quit yer Rollo butt-kissing.

You should start "Rollo listening" BFG, you might learn something!

HDR + AA was never hyped on 7800's was it?

Rollo takes issue with with X1800 FP HDR not working with AA even though he's been repeatedly told it will work after a game patch.

The patch is unavailable. Far Cry patches are released, recalled, and released again months later. So, it's "not working".

Of course Rollo ("fair and balanced") would never start a troll thread against nVidia stating it never works on 6800/7800 cards when using FP blending.

Why would I? They never said it would? So far, nVidia's HDR+ AA is exactly the same quality as ATIs. (unless you count the Serious Sam2 with serious render errors that is unplayable even at 10X7 2X?)

Or like when he slammed ATi for ripping him off as they weren't giving him anything new, even while he was purchasing fourteen NV4x cards and telling us 6600GT/6800 SLI is viable.

Those had new tech, and were well worth buying, eight of them were sweet SLI sets!

Or like when claimed it was a "tiny hairdryer sound and non-issue" on his 5800U and then proceeded to slam the X1800 for noise issues.

I've always said noise isn't a big hot button to me, but to a man like you who downgraded to have a fanless video card, check out the review I found last night!
http://www.tbreak.com/reviews/printpage.php?id=407

Also, ATI utilizes a dual slot cooling solution that is sure to wake your neighbors up at full speed but then again, this is just a reference card and hopefully retail cards will have a quieter solution.

I don't think there's a X1800XT in your future BFG- it would probably drive you from the house! :laugh:

Or like when he was proclaiming the death of ATi because of no SM 3.0 or soft shadows even though there were no games that took advantage of it, but now he's telling us features that aren't being used in games are useless.

Those features WERE the death of ATI BFG, nVidia had a 79% high end DX9 market share last I saw.

This thread is nothing more than his usual trolling and blatant double standards and as usual you're right here to defend the steaming pile he created.

No trolling. Helping people make good video card buying choices by pointing out EXR HDR +AA does not exist for ATI retail customers, a WHOLE TWO MONTHS after release of the cards? Why do you have a problem with that?

Go and start another thread stating that 7800's don't work with HDR + AA and you'll get a lot of "No sh!t sherlock" replies.

I see. So we can slam a product that has an ability to use a feature but needs to be patched first it but we can't slam a competitor's product that doesn't offer said feature at all? Fair and balanced, hmmm?

[/quote]
Yep, we sure can. If I'm GM and I sell a car with a new wonder spoiler that will help when the car is in flight, and then say, "Well, it would help if the guys that build the wings would ever get those to market" the spoiler doesn't have much use, does it?

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: crazydingo

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Anyway, this thread is about the X1800XT using HDR+AA. Go and start another thread stating that 7800's don't work with HDR + AA and you'll get a lot of "No sh!t sherlock" replies.

Hey keys surprisingly you dont seem to have any problems with the misleading title of this thread ..

Hey Dingo, surprisingly, you never asked me if I thought it was misleading myself. Which I do not. If you believe it is misleading, why not say so, and also point out why with something to back it up instead of wasting a post telling me how my mind should be handling the thread title.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

Quit yer trolling.

Quit yer Rollo butt-kissing.

HDR + AA was never hyped on 7800's was it?

Rollo takes issue with with X1800 FP HDR not working with AA even though he's been repeatedly told it will work after a game patch. Of course Rollo ("fair and balanced") would never start a troll thread against nVidia stating it never works on 6800/7800 cards when using FP blending.

It's very similar in fact where he started a troll thread slamming ATi for needing beta drivers to fix problems in new games despite nVidia doing the exact same thing and we got no response and no retraction, as per his usual trolling tactics.

Or like when he slammed ATi for ripping him off as they weren't giving him anything new, even while he was purchasing fourteen NV4x cards and telling us 6600GT/6800 SLI is viable.

Or like when claimed it was a "tiny hairdryer sound and non-issue" on his 5800U and then proceeded to slam the X1800 for noise issues.

Or like when he was proclaiming the death of ATi because of no SM 3.0 or soft shadows even though there were no games that took advantage of it, but now he's telling us features that aren't being used in games are useless.

This thread is nothing more than his usual trolling and blatant double standards and as usual you're right here to defend the steaming pile he created.

It sure as hell was on the X1000's now wasn't it sunshine.....

To quote yourself: "no sh!t sherlock".

Go and start another thread stating that 7800's don't work with HDR + AA and you'll get a lot of "No sh!t sherlock" replies.

I see. So we can slam a product that has an ability to use a feature but needs to be patched first it but we can't slam a competitor's product that doesn't offer said feature at all? Fair and balanced, hmmm?

Wow, you actually just cemented in stone everything I just said. In an argumentative way of course, but I'll take it.

 

[Creig]

So exactly how much does Rollo pay you to follow him around yelling "QFT!" after every one of his posts?

Oh wait, again, I'm sorry. You're not done trolling yet. Do let us know when you intend to state someting intelligent and sensible.

 

[crazydingo]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: crazydingo

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Anyway, this thread is about the X1800XT using HDR+AA. Go and start another thread stating that 7800's don't work with HDR + AA and you'll get a lot of "No sh!t sherlock" replies.

Hey keys surprisingly you dont seem to have any problems with the misleading title of this thread ..

Hey Dingo, surprisingly, you never asked me if I thought it was misleading myself. Which I do not. If you believe it is misleading, why not say so, and also point out why with something to back it up instead of wasting a post telling me how my mind should be handling the thread title.

Hehe, surprisingly you dont find it misleading. Why? Because you are a part of the "Rollo listening club" (in better words). ! SHOCK !

Zenoth has provided concrete proof that it works.

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: fierydemise
Zenoth thanks for your effort, you've contributed more to this thread then those from either side (no names needed)

Has he contributed anything?

Xbit Labs says it doesn't work

We traditionally check the ability of the new graphics card to work in the HDR lighting mode and we also include the results of ATI?s RADEON X1800 which support HDR in Far Cry after installation of a special patch from CryTek. Unfortunately, the patch is not very fast and doesn?t allow turning on FSAA. It is also unavailable to ordinary users as yet, so it?s too early to comment upon the results of the RADEON X1800 cards.

Hmmm, so on 11/15/05 (two weeks ago) Xbit labs was telling us that with the as yet unavailable patch that turns on Far Cry HDR you can't use AA, and performance is slow?

You know there is a difference between "Xbit Labs says it doesn't work" and "Xbit Labs says it doesn't work yet". I assume you know the difference yet continue to be ignorant in that regard.

And Xbitlabs is using Cat 5.9 when 5.11 were already released and used by all review sites. I dont need to look any further.

Originally posted by: Rollo
Who's not contributing anything but FUD? Not me I guess. :roll:

You. (Isnt that obvious, especially to yourself)

 

[Acanthus]

Who woulda thought, problems with EXR HDR + AA.

Nvidia took support out of their drivers due to issues, but the ati fanboi crowd thought that the magic ATi driver team could fix it.

What do you know? it doesnt work right for them either.

I called this months ago.

 

[DaveBaumann]

1. So you agree with me that Zenoth did NOT use HDR+AA simply by editing the command line a la "KrazyGamers" and turning on AA? I'm thinking he's getting AA only.

Prior to the 1.4 path you will not be able to utilise FP16 blending HDR and FSAA in Far Cry.

2. Did ATI provide you with the HDR + AA screenshots, or just the patch and methodology to

The screenshots were taken by myself once the patch was in place; I also don?t publish fake or vendor supplied benchmarks in the reviews. The ?couple of hours? reference is how long it apparently took CryTek to implement.

3. Why do you think XBit Labs could not enable the HDR? They are usually pretty good from what I've seen?

I don?t know what they have done, but it there where a couple of patches ? a DLL was made available first, which had some issue enabling it, then a patch came later, which I could get working via the command line options but not in the games control panel (there is no ?HDR? option in the control panel); I don?t know what ?patch? they were using. I know that Damien from Hardware.fr had issues getting the patch to work as well, while Rys from Hexus has also got it to work (example below) but he hasn?t actually done his tech article yet.

http://www.lungexpress.com/images/b3d/farcry_hdr_aa.jpg

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: DaveBaumann

1. So you agree with me that Zenoth did NOT use HDR+AA simply by editing the command line a la "KrazyGamers" and turning on AA? I'm thinking he's getting AA only.

Prior to the 1.4 path you will not be able to utilise FP16 blending HDR and FSAA in Far Cry.

2. Did ATI provide you with the HDR + AA screenshots, or just the patch and methodology to

The screenshots were taken by myself once the patch was in place; I also don?t publish fake or vendor supplied benchmarks in the reviews. The ?couple of hours? reference is how long it apparently took CryTek to implement.

3. Why do you think XBit Labs could not enable the HDR? They are usually pretty good from what I've seen?

I don?t know what they have done, but it there where a couple of patches ? a DLL was made available first, which had some issue enabling it, then a patch came later, which I could get working via the command line options but not in the games control panel (there is no ?HDR? option in the control panel); I don?t know what ?patch? they were using. I know that Damien from Hardware.fr had issues getting the patch to work as well, while Rys from Hexus has also got it to work (example below) but he hasn?t actually done his tech article yet.

http://www.lungexpress.com/images/b3d/farcry_hdr_aa.jpg

Thanks for all the info Dave, I hope you find the time to hang around here more often, info like you have is ALWAYS welcome!

So the bottom line is Zenoth is NOT RUNNING HDR+AA, and Zenoth, Morph, and Dingo owe me an apology for doubting my correct info yet again. Sweet.

BTW- I only asked about the screenshots because I did not know if Ubi/Crytek had released the patch that would enable this to anyone as yet given what Xbit said. I understand you do your own testing.

Thanks again!

 

[nRollo]

One more question Dave- can you tell us what sort of performance you were getting/settings/system?

Reason I ask is in my testing with a 7800GTX/3800+ I got 39/42/46/51 fps average on the four benches I ran at 16X12 HDR7 0X8X.

So if that screenshot is at 10X7 HDR 2X8X an 33fps average, a person might rather play at 16X12 0X8X and be running in the 40-50fps range.

In a game like Far Cry an average fps of 33 is unplayable, way too many dips below that magic 30fps threshold- don't you think?

 

[crazydingo]

Originally posted by: Rollo
So the bottom line is Zenoth is NOT RUNNING HDR+AA, and Zenoth, Morph, and Dingo owe me an apology for doubting my correct info yet again. Sweet.

Apology, nice one! :laugh:

The only one that needs to apologise is YOU, as clearly Dave has pointed out HDR+AA works and you claimed otherwise. (FUD)