HDR and Lost Coast on X850XT

[btdvox]

Hey guys i have a x850xt and i was researching some stuff on SM3.0, i never really saw any textrue difference and in far cry 1.3 and 1.1 i didnt notice any difference from this card and my 6600 gt other than the much higher framerates, my question is in some of the magazines im reading like maximum pc it says lost coast will only be using sm3.0 hence only Nvidia so far, but on Bit-Tech and on alot of other forums i noticed everyone saying because Half life 2 is a ATI sponsored game, they will implement it using shader model 2.0b as will alot of other cards that can handle it. Is this true? here is a excerpt from Bit-Tech :

http://www.bit-tech.net/gaming/2005/06/14/hl2_hdr_overview/1.html

"HDR is the latest feature in the quest for greater rendering fidelity: Crytek have already added it to Far Cry as part of their 1.3 Patch and it is integral to Epic's Unreal Engine 3.0. Valve recently revealed that they are working on a special HDR showcase for Half Life 2 titled Lost Coast. Whilst Far Cry only implemented HDR via Shader Model 3.0, hence only working on Nvidia's latest-generation cards, Lost Coast will implement it via Shader Model 2.0, allowing for it to work on ATI's current generation.


then they talked to someone from valve its self, seems pretty reliable. which is pretty sweet! any thoughts?

 

[Wreckage]

There are different types of HDR. Far Cry uses FP16 HDR. This is a form of specific hardware accelerated HDR which the current ATI cards do not support. However HDR (High Dynamic Range) can be done using standard rendering methods that do not include specific hardware acceleration. Lost Coast will use HDR that does not have specific hardware acceleration.

The use of SM3.0 in Far Cry was for performance only and not to add any specific visual difference. Once games come out that are programmed from the ground up using SM3.0 you will notice a clear difference in visual effects.

 

[bdoople]

HDR makes FarCry a whole new game. There's also a patch for HL2 now that you can add as a mod and play HL2 over again in HDR. It's amazing. Not as good as FarCry, but that's because FC actually uses HDR, HL2 is just emulating it. Amazing none the less.

 

[pyrosity]

Originally posted by: bdoople
HDR makes FarCry a whole new game. There's also a patch for HL2 now that you can add as a mod and play HL2 over again in HDR. It's amazing. Not as good as FarCry, but that's because FC actually uses HDR, HL2 is just emulating it. Amazing none the less.

Yeah, that HL2 "mod" of sorts doesn't change much beyond bloom. HDR lighting is often confused to simply be a bloom effect; what true HDR does, actually, is allow superbright lights to be rendered right next to superdark darks among other new lighting controls. For instance, as shown in the HDR demos for Lost Cost, looking at the sun changes perceived brightness, colors, etc., just as looking at bright lights does in real life.

 

[bdoople]

Originally posted by: pyrosity

Originally posted by: bdoople
HDR makes FarCry a whole new game. There's also a patch for HL2 now that you can add as a mod and play HL2 over again in HDR. It's amazing. Not as good as FarCry, but that's because FC actually uses HDR, HL2 is just emulating it. Amazing none the less.

Yeah, that HL2 "mod" of sorts doesn't change much beyond bloom. HDR lighting is often confused to simply be a bloom effect; what true HDR does, actually, is allow superbright lights to be rendered right next to superdark darks among other new lighting controls. For instance, as shown in the HDR demos for Lost Cost, looking at the sun changes perceived brightness, colors, etc., just as looking at bright lights does in real life.

Yeah, thats what I was getting at with the difference between true HDR in FC and the emulation in HL2. Im sure FC isnt as impressive at this point as Lost Coast will be, but still sweet. Simple things in FC like when you're in a dark cave or building, and you see sun it blurs everything for a second or two until your "eyes" get used to the light. Sweetness.

 

[Munky]

Originally posted by: pyrosity

Originally posted by: bdoople
HDR makes FarCry a whole new game. There's also a patch for HL2 now that you can add as a mod and play HL2 over again in HDR. It's amazing. Not as good as FarCry, but that's because FC actually uses HDR, HL2 is just emulating it. Amazing none the less.

Yeah, that HL2 "mod" of sorts doesn't change much beyond bloom. HDR lighting is often confused to simply be a bloom effect; what true HDR does, actually, is allow superbright lights to be rendered right next to superdark darks among other new lighting controls. For instance, as shown in the HDR demos for Lost Cost, looking at the sun changes perceived brightness, colors, etc., just as looking at bright lights does in real life.

I've seen that effect in many older games (even MGS2 on my "primitive" PS2), you don't need SM3/HDR for that either.

EDIT: Oh yeah, I also have soft shadows in GT4

 

[biostud]

15/06/2005 Update: as mentioned in the original story, the net is rife with speculation that ATI specifically asked Valve to hold back Lost Coast until the launch of their next-gen GPU, R520, reported to be on the 26th of July. We can now firmly dispell that theory, thanks to an email follow-up from Doug Lombardi:

On the release date, right now we're looking at some time in July. The only reason for the change in date was internal development - no external factors.

Meanwhile, this will run on the X800 as well as the 6800 line of cards, as well as the coming highest-end products from both ATI & NVIDIA - it was shown on dual 6800s at E3.

So there you have it folks - no conspiracy theories here!

Since r520 was supposed to launch in July, and apperently Lost Cost too but none have been...........

 

[ronnn]

Or valve missed a deadline, always a first time for everything.

 

[otispunkmeyer]

Originally posted by: munky

Originally posted by: pyrosity

Originally posted by: bdoople
HDR makes FarCry a whole new game. There's also a patch for HL2 now that you can add as a mod and play HL2 over again in HDR. It's amazing. Not as good as FarCry, but that's because FC actually uses HDR, HL2 is just emulating it. Amazing none the less.

Yeah, that HL2 "mod" of sorts doesn't change much beyond bloom. HDR lighting is often confused to simply be a bloom effect; what true HDR does, actually, is allow superbright lights to be rendered right next to superdark darks among other new lighting controls. For instance, as shown in the HDR demos for Lost Cost, looking at the sun changes perceived brightness, colors, etc., just as looking at bright lights does in real life.

I've seen that effect in many older games (even MGS2 on my "primitive" PS2), you don't need SM3/HDR for that either.

EDIT: Oh yeah, I also have soft shadows in GT4

lol ill stand by me saying that the PS2 is alot more powerful than people give it credit for....you just need highly skilled guys to play with it thats all.

quirky piece of hardware the PS2, one of my all time favourites.

 

[Fenuxx]

NVIDIA's and ATi's versions of HDR are a bit different. NVIDIA's at the moment, is more of a "true" HDR. That's why they're touting it in their "Power of 3" thing .

 

[biostud]

but HDR means no AA right?
what about AF?

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: biostud
but HDR means no AA right?
what about AF?

AA and AF will work fine with HDR in Half life 2.

 

[bdoople]

AF is fine, but for "true" HDR (in FC) you can't use AA. Since the HL2 mod is just emulating HDR (or the bloom effect) you can use AA. I run 8xSSAA and HDR, 16xAF and it's marvelous.

 

[Polish3d]

Lost Coast really needs to hurry the f up. :|

 

[hans030390]

Lost coast will run in Sm2, maybe sm3. it'd have to. I saw the minimum requirements for the LC and it mentioned the x800 and 6800 series.

 

[bdoople]

It seems odd to me that HL2 is an ATI optimised game and they would use HDR and SM3 which are supposed to be NVIDIA only technologies. Maybe I am confused.

 

[reever]

Maybe I am confused.

Yes, you are

 

[Cheesetogo]

Why can't you use AA with HDR?

 

[BlingBlingArsch]

whats so good bout HDR. From the screenshot ive seen, it can look pretty unrealistic, maybe its not implemented very well in the current gen of cards?

like in lost coast
http://static.flickr.com/33/57269814_03778533fb.jpg

 

[flexy]

yeah noticed that too

 

[xtknight]

It gets kind of irritating when someone asks the same questions about HDR everyday. We need a sticky on this. PLEASE use the search function (it's working now), or read up on the Half Life 2 HDR article. http://arstechnica.com/articles/culture/lostcoast.ars/1 I recommend you read the whole thing. Anyone with any doubts about HDR and how it's implemented should at least read page 3.

 

[JBT]

Originally posted by: BlingBlingArsch
whats so good bout HDR. From the screenshot ive seen, it can look pretty unrealistic, maybe its not implemented very well in the current gen of cards?

like in lost coast
http://static.flickr.com/33/57269814_03778533fb.jpg

I don't think that is HDR. That is just the textures on the rock that they used... Turn HDR off and that should look the same.