Health insurance options in the US' screwed up system?

[Jeff7]

This is Off Topic material, but I figure it'll end up here eventually anyway.

And I should change my line of work. Health insurance in the US sounds great.
My employer is facing a 50% price increase in insurance costs versus last year. It must be nice to be in an industry where your customers can be screwed over for life, physically or financially, if they don't pay for your services. I work for a small US-based manufacturing company, and I think we'd go out of business in less than 2 months if we announced a 50% price increase to our vendors.


Are there any reasonable options in the US for health insurance? I'm starting to read up on Obamacare to see what the deal is with that, and maybe leave my employer's plan. (If it was any other market, I'd say that the major players are deliberately trying to price themselves out of business.)
Most of the rest of the first world can handle government-run healthcare; for whatever reason, many here would rather swallow a spoonful of ebola-laden vomit. *shrug*


Or are all of the available options equally lousy?



Edit:

Please note that if insurance is obtained through an employer it can cost up to 9.5% of your income and still be considered affordable.

Dandy. That's an interesting definition of "affordable" there. I guess it's more affordable if you're pulling in $200k and could pay that percentage easily. Not as easy to pay close to 10% if you'd be making $20k/year. But hey, if you're making that kind of money, you don't really have a voice in politics anyway, so no one in government needs to care.
Ok, it's a progressive scale. Good.



Update:
Yes, there was an increase, but it was greatly reduced by changing the type of plan. It ended up being roughly 17% for the company. The paycheck deduction increased as well, but for me (single with no dependents) it's slightly under $3.50 per week. I definitely can live with that.
It's Highmark's Community Blue plan.

- Deductible didn't change.
- Plenty of preventative care procedures are 100% covered, and the deductible doesn't apply to them. (Not the case for mental health problems, interestingly.)
- All copays increased.

 

[glenn1]

My employer is facing a 50% price increase in insurance costs versus last year.

Congratulations, your 50% increase will be helping give free or reduced healthcare to other people. The extra money will ensure Obama can claim credit that the elderly, poor, or people with pre-existing conditions don't have to bear the entire costs of their care. Thank you for your generous support.

 

[fskimospy]

This is Off Topic material, but I figure it'll end up here eventually anyway.

And I should change my line of work. Health insurance in the US sounds great.
My employer is facing a 50% price increase in insurance costs versus last year. It must be nice to be in an industry where your customers can be screwed over for life, physically or financially, if they don't pay for your services. I work for a small US-based manufacturing company, and I think we'd go out of business in less than 2 months if we announced a 50% price increase to our vendors.

Are there any reasonable options in the US for health insurance? I'm starting to read up on Obamacare to see what the deal is with that, and maybe leave my employer's plan. (If it was any other market, I'd say that the major players are deliberately trying to price themselves out of business.)
Most of the rest of the first world can handle government-run healthcare; for whatever reason, many here would rather swallow a spoonful of ebola-laden vomit. *shrug*

Or are all of the available options equally lousy?

Is your employer facing a 50% increase in total health care costs? FYI this is HIGHLY unlikely. It is much more likely that they are trying to increase your contribution 50%.

If your employer continues to offer qualifying insurance to you, you are not eligible for subsidies to purchase your own plan on the exchanges, meaning that sticking with your employer's plan is almost certainly better.

If they are removing health insurance for you guys entirely then yeah the exchanges would be your best option.

 

[fskimospy]

Dandy. That's an interesting definition of "affordable" there. I guess it's more affordable if you're pulling in $200k and could pay that percentage easily. Not as easy to pay close to 10% if you'd be making $20k/year. But hey, if you're making that kind of money, you don't really have a voice in politics anyway, so no one in government needs to care.

It could also be that you're really angry about something you don't understand:

 

[Newell Steamer]

Positive ACA story: where is your proof? Oh, THAT link,.. yeah, well, CNN.com isn't exactly a reputable news site,..

Negative ACA story: spits on ground,.. a'yup, must be true.

 

[Jeff7]

Congratulations, your 50% increase will be helping give free or reduced healthcare to other people. The extra money will ensure Obama can claim credit that the elderly, poor, or people with pre-existing conditions don't have to bear the entire costs of their care. Thank you for your generous support.

And to those with pre-existing conditions, screw 'em all. I know they can't get insurance because they'd be bad investments. The sooner they kindly die of their illnesses, the better it'll be for our economy.

And also screw those who are too poor to afford preventative healthcare. Preventing problems is more expensive than treating chronic illnesses after the fact anyway - or if they can't afford treatment, then they can just rot away, quietly. Fewer sickly parasites dragging down society.


(As you can tell, I don't like hearing the whining about "What, now someone has to make sure that people who are already sick will get care?" It really sounds like "Can't we just ignore them, and let the problem solve itself for free?" Or "Well then they shouldn't have been in a car accident or gotten cancer in the first place." Or "They should have saved up $500k to pay for unforeseen medical expenses. Not my problem."
Having a healthy population can easily lead to a stronger economy and better standard of living. But that doesn't show up on quarterly financial statements, so it doesn't really matter to anyone.)




We already pay much more than many other first-world nations do for healthcare, not only in taxes, but then we also have to pay inflated premiums on top of that, and in return we get service that is not close to the top. Meanwhile, healthcare mutual funds continue to do well.There is indeed a good time to be had in that industry, but it's not those who need to use the service. Someone's expecting a good return on their investment, and that investment is enhanced by sucking money out of a captive audience.

Is your employer facing a 50% increase in total health care costs? FYI this is HIGHLY unlikely. It is much more likely that they are trying to increase your contribution 50%.

If your employer continues to offer qualifying insurance to you, you are not eligible for subsidies to purchase your own plan on the exchanges, meaning that sticking with your employer's plan is almost certainly better.

If they are removing health insurance for you guys entirely then yeah the exchanges would be your best option.

We were told that the cost to the company will increase by 50% over what they're paying our provider right now, and said "There are going to be some big changes. We don't know what they are yet, but it's coming."
If they do double our weekly contribution....well, I should be glad there. The contribution is about $2/week right now.

It could also be that you're really angry about something you don't understand:

Ah, good, a progressive scale. I'm still going through that same site. Emphasis on "up to 9.5%," it would appear.

 

[Newell Steamer]

We were told that the cost to the company will increase by 50% over what they're paying our provider right now, and said "There are going to be some big changes. We don't know what they are yet, but it's coming."
If they do double our weekly contribution....well, I should be glad there. The contribution is about $2/week right now.

So, you will pay $52 more each year? 50% increase on $2 is $1... so it will be $3 total per week,.. that is not double.

You clearly don't like ACA - we get that. But, you aren't clear on what the actual issue/problem is.

 

[fskimospy]

We were told that the cost to the company will increase by 50% over what they're paying our provider right now, and said "There are going to be some big changes. We don't know what they are yet, but it's coming."
If they do double our weekly contribution....well, I should be glad there. The contribution is about $2/week right now.

I of course have no idea what your company's situation is but such an increase would be pretty bizarre without some major changes happening at your company. If it did happen that would mean that your company either had a crazy sweet deal to begin with, is getting screwed now, or is not being entirely honest with you.

 

[IGBT]

your obama care premiums and co pay are largely based on your income. The more you earn..the more obama care will pilfer from you and "redistribute" to someone else.

 

[infoiltrator]

When I worked my employer had to shop benefits every year or two. Note, insurance company profits are up almost everywhere.
When I became 65 medicare kicked in, not free by any measure, or full coverage.
But I'm a volunteer on the Board of Directors for a Community Health Center non-profit (Health Center "enjoys" state and federal grants). By law 51% of Board are required to be patients. Non paid volunteer position.
Employee Health care costs rose over 12%. CEO was not thrilled.
State had let contracts covering health care. Budget was adjusted.
So Community Health Center negotiated State coverage. State decided to reduce payments, pending and future.
You do not want to know the paperwork requirements involved. Which wouldn't matter if they made sense, or worked as intended.
Federal Gov has also reduced payments.
Government cannot pass health budgets, or raise taxes, so guess what?
Health has no choice but to raise costs. Gov programs are not meeting agreed payments.
There are reasons besides medical for health care cost rising. Gov and Insurers right at the top. (Insurers use client numbers to leverage cost reductions).
And by law, many health providers cannot turn patients away.

Preventive medicine is much cheaper than treatment after the fact. True.

 

[Jeff7]

So, you will pay $52 more each year? 50% increase on $2 is $1... so it will be $3 total per week,.. that is not double.

You clearly don't like ACA - we get that. But, you aren't clear on what the actual issue/problem is.

All I've got at this point is what they said. They said that the company's costs would increase by 50%. I don't know what of that will be passed along to us, or what it will mean for the deductible - or for annual raises.

So, you will pay $52 more each year? 50% increase on $2 is $1... so it will be $3 total per week,.. that is not double.

You clearly don't like ACA - we get that. But, you aren't clear on what the actual issue/problem is.

Really? I don't? Where was I clear on that? I favor the idea of universal healthcare, something along the lines of a public utility.
We manage to botch it in this country because special interests have their hands firmly in the government's pants, and then there's malpractice insurance and lawsuits for high dollar values which doesn't help anything.

your obama care premiums and co pay are largely based on your income. The more you earn..the more obama care will pilfer from you and "redistribute" to someone else.

You're talking to someone who supports a progressive tax scale - but also someone who doesn't like the idea of the constant shift of more and more of the country's resources toward those who already have most of it. Trickle-down was a farce, and it's not even "trickle-up." It's more of a steady stream.



Bleh. I guess I just never had to worry about healthcare costs or really even think about them much.
- Parent's plan covered me when I was younger.
- Was on COBRA for a short time during college.
- "Plan" during college was "don't get sick" - I didn't have any plan for a few years there. Woo.
- Employer after college started me on insurance right away, and it's always been a negligible cost and a reasonable deductible. They're making it sound like those good times might end, and jimmies have been rustled. I guess I'll have to wait and see what really happens. Bleh.


Of course, they might just be trying to drum up support for the glorious Republican future - upper management here has made it apparent at any opportunity that they horribly hate Obama and anything he does.
Maybe I need to make six figures to understand any of it. They all want to screw you over in the pursuit of their own goals, but the different sides just approach it differently.

 

[OverVolt]

Healthcare is screwed the end.

 

[Newell Steamer]

Really? I don't? Where was I clear on that? I favor the idea of universal healthcare, something along the lines of a public utility.

My bad.

I read the other posters and lumped you in with them - my apologies.

 

[Linux23]

what is it so hard about America where we can't get our healthcare shit together. let me make it simple.

1. have people (everyone) pay a fair share of their income into a general health insurance fund.

2. the money pooled should be able to cover every man, women and children in america.

[there should never be any more surprise medical bills sent to you from the hospital with charges you don't understand]

3. Negotiate prices on medication and services. There is no dam good reason 1 aspirin should cost $30. None.

I think the above is fair as eventually everyone is going to need medical care at least once in their lifetime.

 

[sactoking]

My employer is facing a 50% price increase in insurance costs versus last year.

Do you work for a company with 50 or fewer employees? If yes, do you know if your employer has been getting insurance through a Chamber of Commerce or other association?

 

[OverVolt]

Do you work for a company with 50 or fewer employees? If yes, do you know if your employer has been getting insurance through a Chamber of Commerce or other association?

Wow its almost as if we have 8,000 pages of healthcare reform laws and its confusing as shit. They must have passed it without reading it or something.

 

[unokitty]

According to UN stats for health care, US spends two and a half times more than the average industrialized nation.

Of course, US politicians receive millions of dollars from the 'Health Care' industry so the politicians aren't hurting.

Looks to me that he US has less of a 'Health Care' industry and more of a medical billing industry.

Don't like that?

How many millions of dollars did you give to the politicians that write the laws?

How many lobbyists do you have courting the politicians?

How many former politicians do you employ?

If you answered none to the above questions, then:

Shut up!
Pay up!
And move on!

Uno

 

[bradly1101]

Other countries pay for their sophisticated health-care systems with dreaded taxes. They spread the cost load differently but if it's going to cost the big guy more, the rich are having none of that in this country. Where is the line between public good, responsibility to pay back and greed?

 

[The Merg]

Other countries pay for their sophisticated health-care systems with dreaded taxes. They spread the cost load differently but if it's going to cost the big guy more, the rich are having none of that in this country. Where is the line between public good, responsibility to pay back and greed?

As soon as it goes from being charitable to affecting the big guy's bottom line.

- Merg

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Congratulations, your 50% increase will be helping give free or reduced healthcare to other people. The extra money will ensure Obama can claim credit that the elderly, poor, or people with pre-existing conditions don't have to bear the entire costs of their care. Thank you for your generous support.

...Don't forget that in nations with evil socialized medicine, businesses don't even have to worry about health insurance issues. Interestingly, those nations spend a significantly smaller percentage of their GDP on health care while having 100% coverage.

So where is the 50% increase really going? It's ultimately going into the pockets of health insurance company executives and hospital executives in addition to paying for tons of paper-pushers that do not provide any actual health care.

 

[sportage]

I love getting into these fights.

First of all, people love to blame Obamacare for rising costs in healthcare, especially higher employer based healthcare premiums.
Like without Obamacare, we'd never see a rate increase ever again. Right?

And why did healthcare costs continue to rise MORE frequently before Obamacare?
Because one thing that can not be controlled are people getting sick or having car accidents.
And, before Obamacare, what do you think would happen?

People came to the ER, poor people, uninsured people, and the ER provided care which was never paid for by that patient in need.

So what do you imagine happened next?
Do you think the hospital and insurance company just said "OH WELL", toss the bill, give them their care for free?
Sorry but, no.
Simply doesn't work that way, FYI.

What happened was that YOU paid for every single one of those un-insured ER visitors.
And you paid through ever increasing employer based insurance premiums.

I hate to break the news, but whether old, young, poor, rich, black, white, man, or woman, NO ONE gets their healthcare in America for free.

Either they pay, or more likely YOU paid for them, pre-Obamacare.
But one way or the other, someone pays for that ER visitor.
So better them pay with their own insurance, rather than you through ever increasing employer based insurance rates.

Obamacare did a minor fix, but with some major reforms.
First, Obamacare created "pools" where all the existing insurance companies, like Blue Cross Blue Shield and many others, simply pooled together allowing customers to deal directly with insurance company exchanges when employer based insurance was not an available option.

This insurance through pools i.e. Obamacare, allowed those people that get sick and show up at the ER, the uninsured and penniless, to instead go to a regular doctor for care.
MUCH cheaper than the ER visit.

And to help the poor afford Obamacare-pooled insurance, Obamacare gave these people some tax credits and rate deductions.

I could go on and on, but you get the idea?

So, I am very sorry to break the news to those that just constantly insist on blindly blaming Obamacare for their insurance woes (queue Fox News), and for the rising cost of employer based health insurance premiums, but you have already been paying THRU THE NOSE for those uninsured far BEFORE Obamacare existed.

People can finally have a real shot (no pun) at healthcare insurance when they are not offered insurance from the employer.
Or, when people are between jobs, or in college, or self employed.
YES, you can now get insured America.

So, to sum up, it sounds to me like all of these I HATE OBAMACARE folks would realistically rather have and support NATIONAL UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE. Which Obamacare IS NOT.

Then, your full care would be covered and paid for with income taxes and sales taxes.
Not only would everyone have great health insurance, but also coverage for everything from A thru Z.
And because everyone would be insured under Universal, everyone would also be paying into the system of government healthcare probably thru sales taxes.
And that would greatly lower ones individual costs of today.

And, it sounds to me that what the problem really is for Obamacare haters, is that they do not want to pay for the uninsured. Period.
But remember, under Obamacare we have a lot more people finally insured AND paying for their own care.
Plus, far fewer ER visits from the uninsured which need I remind that YOU were actually paying for in the long run, like it or not.
If you had employer based insurance, you paid that ER bill every time, pre-Obamacare.

In a perfect world, no one would get sick and would never need healthcare.
And insurance for profit would never exist or need exist.
But we do not live in that perfect world.

In this real world (outside of the Fox News pretend world), people get sick and someone WILL pay.
With more people insured under Obamacare and visiting the doctor rather than the expensive ER, that in itself going to save everyone much money.
And that savings only happens if more people are insured rather than uninsured.
And Obamacare DID THAT.
With more insider and thus visiting a doctor rather than the expensive ER.

Costs will always go up in healthcare.
That is because we live in a non-perfect world with this hungry wild animal called INSURANCE FOR PROFIT.
But having more people insured vs not is the correct way to go.
And Obamacare, while not perfect, allows millions more to have their own health insurance, not yours as it was pre-Obamacare.
And that is the way you want it.
.
.
.

 

[Jeff7]

what is it so hard about America where we can't get our healthcare shit together. let me make it simple.
...

"Greed." Simple as that.

If someone falls off the side of a boat in the middle of the ocean, how much do you charge them for throwing them a floatation device?

Answer: As much as you want. Their choice is to pay for the service or drown.
If the "competitive" market consists of other people with lifesavers, but they also decide that they don't want to lower their costs, then you're pretty well screwed.
Drowning can be cheap. Or you can survive and then spend most of your life paying off the debt that allowed you to stay alive. Some people seem to consider that to be a perfectly reasonable system.

Do you work for a company with 50 or fewer employees? If yes, do you know if your employer has been getting insurance through a Chamber of Commerce or other association?

We're right around 50 people. I don't know exactly how many.
They mentioned a broker for insurance, but I don't know the specifics.
I do know that here, like many other places, management is swayed by typical trivialities from sales reps. ("Nice person," or "takes me to lunch a lot," or "says he's doing everything he can to get us a lower rate.") For example, our expensive 401k plan: It's cheap for the company, and the owner seems to know the guy well. All of the investment options are fairly expensive though.
So the product or service might matter at some point in time, but the sales rep might matter more. For a reference point, we've changed vendors already simply because the sales rep we worked with changed employers. Not because of the price or quality or service, but because he's a "good guy to work with." Ugh.

...Don't forget that in nations with evil socialized medicine, businesses don't even have to worry about health insurance issues. Interestingly, those nations spend a significantly smaller percentage of their GDP on health care while having 100% coverage.

So where is the 50% increase really going? It's ultimately going into the pockets of health insurance company executives and hospital executives in addition to paying for tons of paper-pushers that do not provide any actual health care.

And to the almighty wealthy shareholders, who are expecting these companies to turn a tidy profit.

 

[sm625]

Obamacare is just a racket to increase corporate profits and rob the people who were dumb enough to vote for him (or his counterpart Romneycare Romney). That's all it is, all it was, and all it ever will be. But despite being robbed and raped by Obama, these morons will line up to vote for his corporate stooge successor.

 

[sactoking]

We're right around 50 people.

2 possibilities (and certainly not the only ones):

1. Your small group renewed the plan in 4th quarter of 2013, allowing it to be in effect for pretty much all of 2014 without complying with the ACA. This is the first compliant renewal.

2. Your small group was getting insurance through a Chamber of Commerce or other association. In the past small groups and individuals could aggregate through associations to qualify as a large group, and generally get lower rates. The ACA uses the Public Health Service Act language relating to associations, which means that the Department of Labor is now involved in determining if an association is bona fide. Long story short, associations generally cannot qualify as a large group anymore, the constituent members are rated on their own merits. That means a small group that used to be rated as a large group must now be rated as a small group.

 

[IronWing]

The total premiums for my health plan (employee + employer share) will go up by 4.2% for 2015. This is the smallest annual increase since I started buying health insurance twenty years ago. Thanks Obama.

OTOH, the price on one maintenance drug for my wife has increased 235% over the last ten years, topping $300/month starting this month. Thanks big pharma. The drug has been evergreened so it won't go to generic for an additional ten years. Thanks big pharma and the corrupt US patent system.