Hearthstone

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lupi

Lifer
Apr 8, 2001
32,539
260
126
Never thought of that as I haven't really played with him, but quite an interesting thought.

For rag though, you'd go from a 1 health rag tossing fire to an 8/8 that could only attack like normal.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
So the current brawl. The Optimaltron where the "rule" of the brawl is to give you a perfect mana curve draw rate for both players shows as I said before the code already exists for manipulating draws for players. This is the second time this brawl has come up too. It's not a far stretch to implement this code in a manner I've described above with a minor weighting system. I am not saying that Blizzard is doing that, just I have my suspicions that they are. It wouldn't be hard to implement at all and they have shown they already have the code to do so.

Now as far as this brawl goes, I'm wrecking it. Since I am guaranteed to be drawing on the same "curve" as my opponent I tend to win. I have won all but 1 brawl and even that was a very close one. Renolock just dominates this brawl like crazy. Especially since I'm guaranteed to basically draw Reno when I need him it seems like.

This is a brawl I like. No RNG, everyone draws the same. Which means the winner is determined more by skill than by luck. When skill is the weightier factor I tend to win games like this.
 

Vivendi

Senior member
Nov 21, 2013
697
37
91
I started ladder this month today and got to rank 10 in three hours. I feel like it would have taken half that if I didn't kept losing Pirate decks (Warrior, Rogue, even Shamans). Still haven't made any new decks yet so I was using Midrange Shaman with no new cards from the new expansion.

The new pirate card is insanely strong. I thought Blizzard was shying away from Charge cards. But now they have printed a free one. It's stupid IMO. Even Miracle Rogues are running it, it's so strong. It can end up dealing 2-4 free damage as well as thinning ur deck. Which basically wins you an extra 5% games at least.
 

quikah

Diamond Member
Apr 7, 2003
4,104
672
126
The new pirate card is insanely strong. I thought Blizzard was shying away from Charge cards. But now they have printed a free one. It's stupid IMO. Even Miracle Rogues are running it, it's so strong. It can end up dealing 2-4 free damage as well as thinning ur deck. Which basically wins you an extra 5% games at least.

The bigger issue is small time buccaneer IMO, essentially a 3/2 for 1 mana. They should reduce the health to 1 or just give it +1 attack or something.
 

Vivendi

Senior member
Nov 21, 2013
697
37
91
The bigger issue is small time buccaneer IMO, essentially a 3/2 for 1 mana. They should reduce the health to 1 or just give it +1 attack or something.

You're right, that card is a big problem as well. It will be probably be the one that gets nerfed first if they ever even consider nerfing the pirate package.
 

Vivendi

Senior member
Nov 21, 2013
697
37
91
The 3rd secret for me was 'all cards cost 1 if hand has 9 cards' or something like that.

Had some fun in this brawl, trying out different ways to kill the Cow King. I even drew a game when the game ended because of turn limit being reached. It's also possible to become the Cow King yourself but haven't tried that yet.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
So I just want to report the thing about guaranteed legendary at 40 packs isn't quite 100%. Been keeping count since MSG came out on December 1st. I got Ara Blackpaw as a legendary in my second free pack the day of release. I have since opened 62 packs of MSG and have yet to get another legendary card from that set. Quite frankly it is very annoying. I tend to open about 5 packs on average per week of casual play. I do believe that the chances for a legendary go higher the more packs you open, but I still think Blizzard weights that percentage based on being a paying customer or not to their system. It's about the only explanation I can think of.
 

Fallen Kell

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
6,097
461
126
Possibly. I have gotten a lot of legendaries in packs over the years, but I also put in some money (bought most of the expansions with money instead of gold).

On another note, anyone use any particular mods for the game? I never have, but I have seen plenty on youtube. Just wondering what everyone else has been doing.
 

JTsyo

Lifer
Nov 18, 2007
11,819
953
126
I don't play enough for the mods to be a must. The one that shows the cards in your deck and which ones you played seems useful.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
Possibly. I have gotten a lot of legendaries in packs over the years, but I also put in some money (bought most of the expansions with money instead of gold).

On another note, anyone use any particular mods for the game? I never have, but I have seen plenty on youtube. Just wondering what everyone else has been doing.

I use decktracker. Works good with helping tracking the possibility of the card you are getting, figuring out secret cards, deck building/swapping in excess of the amount provided by Blizzard, and tracking your performance with most decks as well as various other sundry metrics.

It's how I know why my mana curve is always screwed up when it comes to draws in comparison to others. My best decks are pure agro decks that have nothing costing over 4/5 and only a couple of those at most like a couple doom guards for a zoo-lock deck as an example.
 

Vivendi

Senior member
Nov 21, 2013
697
37
91
I rarely play anymore. I still enjoy most of the Tavern Brawls however. I really liked playing as the White King in the last one. I had a really good winrate with it (over 75%). I've actually started missing some quests now and then and last month was the first time in a long time I didn't get even rank 10 because of not playing ranked at all.

As for add-ons, I also have a deck tracker installer, but I rarely use it.
 

quikah

Diamond Member
Apr 7, 2003
4,104
672
126
The current meta is a disaster. It is literally 50% shaman & warrior on standard ladder. They completely screwed the balance of the game.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
The current meta is a disaster. It is literally 50% shaman & warrior on standard ladder. They completely screwed the balance of the game.

Yah pretty much. Agro decks, mostly shaman/warrior, as basically the majority of the games in rank.MSG was not a balanced release.
 

JTsyo

Lifer
Nov 18, 2007
11,819
953
126
The current meta is a disaster. It is literally 50% shaman & warrior on standard ladder. They completely screwed the balance of the game.
There was a post on bnet that they would balance at the end of the month.
 

quikah

Diamond Member
Apr 7, 2003
4,104
672
126
There was a post on bnet that they would balance at the end of the month.

Riiight. I am not confident in their ability to balance. We will see. I think they are relying on the standard rotation more than anything.
 

lupi

Lifer
Apr 8, 2001
32,539
260
126
Hope you're ready to open your wallets, blizz just announced they are going full P2W with next rotation. Several standard cards being banned to wild and no adventure relase for the year.
 

Concillian

Diamond Member
May 26, 2004
3,751
8
81
Hope you're ready to open your wallets, blizz just announced they are going full P2W with next rotation. Several standard cards being banned to wild and no adventure relase for the year.

Well... On one hand, it will be a little more expensive per year. I make pretty much every meta deck with about 120 packs per expansion. If you play to complete every daily and get a few 10g for 3 wins and such, you end up with around 500g a week or about 110 packs per expansion and paying for the adventure with gold under their previous model. This drops to about 86 packs per expansion with the new model. They have promised additional gold logging in daily, so we have to wait and see how much it offsets... It would have to be around 20g per day to bring things back to parity with the previous model. I'm willing to bet money it'll be within ±5g of that so the end result is very similar to their previous strategy for a F2P player. The math is simple, and the entire game is basically a math problem... they know their players will do the math and will whine to high heaven if it's too unfavorable.

On the other hand, adventures were not all that impactful for changing the way the game is played and Hearthstone's largest problem is that a meta gets stale and the game kinda drags. Karazhan, for example, changed things very little. The most fun in hearthstone is the week or two following an expansion release. People are playing tons of different experimental decks and it's just when the game is most fun. A change like this is very likely a positive experience for a dedicated player.

For me personally, I welcome it. The money aspect has little to no effect on me. I play regularly and have since Naxx. I get rank 5 each month for the dust value of the golden epic (6k dust per year). I play tavern brawl to get a pack a week (another ~5k dust per year on avereage). I do dailies and sit on gold waiting for an expac. I buy the $50 intro bundle each expac and supplement those packs with gold for around 120 packs total. I don't expect this to change. With this I have always been able to get all the commons and rares, then craft the epics and legendaries I'm missing to make whatever meta decks I want to play. Doing this, I stay caught up and am currently sitting on over 10k gold and 10k dust right now just waiting for the next expac. Is this P2W? Maybe, but I don't really consider it that. It's like ~$10/mo to play a living game. Cheaper than when I played WoW, but more expensive than when I bought XCOM:Enemy Unknown bought a year after release and spent 500+ hours playing it.

The problem with Hearthstone right now is that the game isn't "living" enough. It doesn't change often enough and adventures don't change it enough when they happen (Karazhan example again). This should be a step in the right direction for keeping the game more interesting in the long term.

As for the cards rotating out of standard, you say it like it's a surprise. Several standard cards being banned to wild... umm that's a rotation. Several hundred cards get banned from standard and move to wild... not sure what you were expecting to happen.
 
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lupi

Lifer
Apr 8, 2001
32,539
260
126
They are moving classic cards to wild, card which everyone and their brother would have told you to craft as they are the most valuable since it was stated they wouldn't be going to wild once they introduced these crappy formats.

And there have been several key cards each expansion which everyone was able to get for a relatively low cost, now everything relies in how much money you pump into the current expansion as they've now shown a desire to kill any cards that otherwise wouldn't be limited in time.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
Well... On one hand, it will be a little more expensive per year. I make pretty much every meta deck with about 120 packs per expansion. If you play to complete every daily and get a few 10g for 3 wins and such, you end up with around 500g a week or about 110 packs per expansion and paying for the adventure with gold under their previous model. This drops to about 86 packs per expansion with the new model. They have promised additional gold logging in daily, so we have to wait and see how much it offsets... It would have to be around 20g per day to bring things back to parity with the previous model. I'm willing to bet money it'll be within ±5g of that so the end result is very similar to their previous strategy for a F2P player. The math is simple, and the entire game is basically a math problem... they know their players will do the math and will whine to high heaven if it's too unfavorable.

On the other hand, adventures were not all that impactful for changing the way the game is played and Hearthstone's largest problem is that a meta gets stale and the game kinda drags. Karazhan, for example, changed things very little. The most fun in hearthstone is the week or two following an expansion release. People are playing tons of different experimental decks and it's just when the game is most fun. A change like this is very likely a positive experience for a dedicated player.

For me personally, I welcome it. The money aspect has little to no effect on me. I play regularly and have since Naxx. I get rank 5 each month for the dust value of the golden epic (6k dust per year). I play tavern brawl to get a pack a week (another ~5k dust per year on avereage). I do dailies and sit on gold waiting for an expac. I buy the $50 intro bundle each expac and supplement those packs with gold for around 120 packs total. I don't expect this to change. With this I have always been able to get all the commons and rares, then craft the epics and legendaries I'm missing to make whatever meta decks I want to play. Doing this, I stay caught up and am currently sitting on over 10k gold and 10k dust right now just waiting for the next expac. Is this P2W? Maybe, but I don't really consider it that. It's like ~$10/mo to play a living game. Cheaper than when I played WoW, but more expensive than when I bought XCOM:Enemy Unknown bought a year after release and spent 500+ hours playing it.

The problem with Hearthstone right now is that the game isn't "living" enough. It doesn't change often enough and adventures don't change it enough when they happen (Karazhan example again). This should be a step in the right direction for keeping the game more interesting in the long term.

As for the cards rotating out of standard, you say it like it's a surprise. Several standard cards being banned to wild... umm that's a rotation. Several hundred cards get banned from standard and move to wild... not sure what you were expecting to happen.


I play almost everyday. It's my sitting on the shitter game. I usually manage to get about 400g -500g a week which is 5-6 packs a week with the brawl. I do not buy anything in this game and refuse to. The game just isn't worth it. If they make it worse that it already is for players like me, and it's bad enough if my suspicions about the code are correct for no paying players, then I'm dumping the game completely.
 

Concillian

Diamond Member
May 26, 2004
3,751
8
81
They are moving classic cards to wild, card which everyone and their brother would have told you to craft as they are the most valuable since it was stated they wouldn't be going to wild once they introduced these crappy formats.

And they're giving you the dust back for free so you can craft something relevant. Not just giving full disenchant value, but straight up giving you the full disenchant dust and you can keep the cards that move to hall of fame... How is this seen as a problem?
 

lupi

Lifer
Apr 8, 2001
32,539
260
126
Because the dust they give you will be used on cards that will also then disappear, and that time they won't be giving you the dust.
 

Concillian

Diamond Member
May 26, 2004
3,751
8
81
Because the dust they give you will be used on cards that will also then disappear, and that time they won't be giving you the dust.

It depends. You can use the dust to craft Grom or Edwin, for example. You can also choose to disenchant cards that move to wild, which F2P players kind of need to do to stay relevant.

I don't think the changes are being done as a money grab. I think they're being done because the dedicated players have legitimate gripes with the game and they're trying to fix that. This change is a huge step in demonstrating that they're willing to make significant changes to improve the state of the game. The main complaint is that they sit by and wait MONTHS with really big problems in the game. This, coupled with the recent nerf announcement including a change to a card in the current expansion. This is the first time they've ever nerfed a card in the most recent release. All previous nerfs have waited for a new adventure or expansion before changing an obvious problem card. These are big steps and they're making these changes because they're bleeding committed players who are sick of seeing problems sit around for months before getting adjusted.

I think you're interpretation borders on conspiracy theory.
 

HumblePie

Lifer
Oct 30, 2000
14,665
440
126
so if you dust your normal rag and sylvana, get golden versions, and then recraft them after you'll end up with more dust than you started with once these changes go live?

Yah, just did the math. Basically get about 400 dust per for doing that.

-1600 initial normal cost
+400 for dusting normal
-3200 for crafting gold
+3200 for dust refund
+1600 for dusting gold
-1600 for crafting normal again

Which means you are only -1200 in the hole for crafting a normal rag or sylvana instead of -1600 for each. Which means you "make" 400 dust in the end for each.

This only works on rag and sylvana because gold legendaries are disenchanted for half their value instead of 1/4 their value unlike anything else in the game. Besides commons which are 1/8th their value.
 
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