Hearthstone

[darkewaffle]

shadow madness can be really fun with the right combo. Especially the return to your hand panda cards. Use shadow madness to take one of their cards, smack that card into something else on the board. If it survives send it to YOUR hand with the panda. now you can play that card and keep it

That's a slick idea. But last night I used SM and got a little ahead of myself, I shadow madness'd a nerubian egg next to a flametongue totem so it was 2/1 thinking "i'll smack something and take the 4/4 for myself" but of course once it was pulled to my side it was now 0/1, total oversight on my part lol.

Also is there any rule to how death rattles proc? I think I've heard it goes in the 'play order' but basically last night I ran my Cairne into an injured sylvanas, they killed each other, but Cairne's re-summon procced before the mind control effect so the Baine was taken. I believe Cairne was played before Sylvanas, so would that explain why that happened or would that happen that way every time regardless?

 

[EDUSAN]

Also is there any rule to how death rattles proc? I think I've heard it goes in the 'play order' but basically last night I ran my Cairne into an injured sylvanas, they killed each other, but Cairne's re-summon procced before the mind control effect so the Baine was taken. I believe Cairne was played before Sylvanas, so would that explain why that happened or would that happen that way every time regardless?

yeah, thats how it works.

The deathrattle triggers in order of play.
If your cairne was played first, it will trigger his deathrattle and then sylvana's deathrattle will be played

if you have a baron geddon and a ragnaros and the opponent has a 2 hp minion and you played ragnaros first, it could happen that ragnaross will deal 8 damage to that minion and then baron geddon do the 2 damage to everything (which is not nice)

If an opponent played haunted creeper and you played unstable ghoul later, if they both die at the same time the 1/1 spiders will spawn and then the ghoul will kill them (pretty useful to know this)

edit: i wish there was something that would remind you of minion order or something, like a little number in the top right corner

======
Another tip that is not related to deathrattle but to dying.

If a mage plays the "when a minion dies get 2 copies in your hand" secret and you kill all their minions together, the 1st minion played will get the 2copies (even if it was played before the secret)

 

[Rhezuss]

I seem to be having a hard time these past weeks...dunno why. I can't get under rank 16 where I always ended at Rank 11-12 in the past (not much but i'm ok with that). It's been getting very frustrating and I feel like quitting for some time, nothing is going my way since september...

I play mainly a Paladin deck that looks like this:

1X Humility
2X Equality
1X Holy Light
2X Wild Pyromancer
2X Instable Ghoul
2X Deathlord
2X Aldor Peacekeeper
2X Truesilver Champion
2X Consecration
1X Defender of Argus
2X Stampeding Kodo
2X Sludge Belcher
1X Black Knight
2X Sunwalker
1X Guardian of Kings
2X Avenging Wrath
1X Lay on Hands
1X Tirion Fordring
1X Ysera

I've been having great success with this deck for quite some time but now I keep losing at Ranks 16-18 with this...maybe it's time for a change.

 

[EDUSAN]

well... the decks i've been seeing in ladder play are or super fast face decks with undertaker and a ton of cheap deathrattle minions or SUPER slow control decks that run ysera as if it were a cheap early game card

Im struggling too (i play ctrl warrior) because i dont know what to focus on countering more, if early game decks or late game decks since there seems to be no middle ground.

in case you are facing more control decks i would leave out:

2x Unstable ghouls
2x Deathlord
1x avenging wrath
1x Wild Pyromancer? im not sure 2 is needed, you can use equality by itself with a consecration for the same effect

and add more late game cards, a ragnaros and a faceless manipulator could come in handy

against more aggro decks i woul still remove the deathlord, it gives me more problems than solutions

 

[Rhezuss]

Yeah i've been looking at removing the Deathlords...they can be played early and can stand some damage but the free minion gift to the opponent is a real PITA.

I'll rework the deck cause i'm sure the Paladin can do better. I've been tempted to add a Sword of Justice. I freaking love this card.

Pyros might be replaced too but I think i'll keep the Ghouls. They're cheap and cool early taunts.

I also tried a Warrior but I have the tendency of building decks without a lpan or strategy. I only put cards in there that I find fun to play or that look cool. I should be more thoughtful in my deckbuilding and look for more synergies.

Thanks for the tips EDUSAN.

 

[darkewaffle]

Honestly I don't build a deck without some silences. I generally always have at least an owl and a spellbreaker. I always did it even prior to Naxx and now with the prevalence of deathrattles and undertakers and KT and feugen/stalagg and sludge belcher etc, they're even more useful imo. One of my favorite things about playing shaman/priest is access to additional silence spells as well.

One general tip, imo, is to not fall too in love with wanting two of everything in your deck. Some cards are absolutely worth it, but I think you get more reliable performance out of having two cards filling the same niche when possible. Maybe sub an Unstable ghoul for an Abomination, maybe swap a Kodo for a Yeti, maybe an Avenging Wrath for Hammer of Wrath.

I'm no pro deck builder but with two peacekeepers around I don't think you need Humility (just be a bit less aggressive with the peacekeepers). I think with 2x Unstable Ghoul / Deathlord / Pyromancer / Equality / Consecration / Kodo / Avenging Wrath you're too focused on clearing/protecting vs garbage minions. I would drop some of those and diversify a little bit. You also have no card draw except for LoH - I think some safe choices would be Hammer of Wrath (minion clear or direct damage potential w/ a free card) or Azure Drake (hard to go wrong with them imo, and you might be surprised how nice +1 damage can be on consecrate/hammer at times).

Also the new pally Avenge secret is pretty nice imo. That can go a long way to getting you an edge early game (or buffing something up late) and having a secret out can mess with your opponent's head.

One of the better ways to independently determine how to improve is simply looking at what you lose against and thinking about what would have saved you / turned the tables. A silence? More cards? A taunt? A heal? etc.

 

[Wardawg1001]

I seem to be having a hard time these past weeks...dunno why. I can't get under rank 16 where I always ended at Rank 11-12 in the past (not much but i'm ok with that). It's been getting very frustrating and I feel like quitting for some time, nothing is going my way since september...

I play mainly a Paladin deck that looks like this:

1X Humility
2X Equality
1X Holy Light
2X Wild Pyromancer
2X Instable Ghoul
2X Deathlord
2X Aldor Peacekeeper
2X Truesilver Champion
2X Consecration
1X Defender of Argus
2X Stampeding Kodo
2X Sludge Belcher
1X Black Knight
2X Sunwalker
1X Guardian of Kings
2X Avenging Wrath
1X Lay on Hands
1X Tirion Fordring
1X Ysera

I've been having great success with this deck for quite some time but now I keep losing at Ranks 16-18 with this...maybe it's time for a change.

Well it looks like you are going for a control Paladin. The first thing that sticks out to me is the lack of card draw. Your only card draw mechanic is Lay on Hands, an 8 mana spell that basically consumes your entire turn. What this usually means is that if you use it when you have board control, you are probably going to lose board control the next turn because you used your entire turn on a spell that doesn't affect the board at all. If you have to use it when you are already behind on the board, you've likely lost the game already unless it draws something extremely clutch (eg. it draws an Equality and you already have a Wild Pyro on the board). That's not to say it's a bad card, but it is unreliable as the sole card draw mechanic, and it can be very difficult to find a good time to use it safely.

The other thing that pops out are 2x Unstable Ghoul, 2x Deathlord, and 2x Avenging Wrath. I would get rid of both the Ghouls, they just don't seem to fit the deck all that well. I would also get rid of at least one of the Deathlords, maybe even both of them. Same with Avenging Wrath - one is fine, but two is probably overkill.

Use these open slots to throw in some card draw. You can experiment with what works best, but I'd suggest at least two total of any of the following - Acolyte of Pain, Gnomish Inventor, Azure Drake.

If you have them, Cairne, Sylvannas, Loatheb, and Ragnaros all fit well in a control Paladin deck (you'd probably have to take out one or both of the Sunwalkers to fit these in). Some other options to consider are Harvest Golem, Shade of Naxxramas, Spellbreaker, and Earthen Ring Farseer.

 

[Rhezuss]

Thanks Wardawg and darkwaffle for the useful posts.

Looks like I need some silences and card draws, will work on that tonight.

I have almost every cards now so the choice is there. I just wanted to be sure this deck worked as it was last month. But I agree I need more draws and some silence to counter stuff more efficiently.

 

[HumblePie]

Thanks Wardawg and darkwaffle for the useful posts.

Looks like I need some silences and card draws, will work on that tonight.

I have almost every cards now so the choice is there. I just wanted to be sure this deck worked as it was last month. But I agree I need more draws and some silence to counter stuff more efficiently.

For card draw/cycle make sure you are playing cards that better suit the deck you are playing as.

As a control paladin, acolyte of pain isn't that useful unless you drop a blessing of kings on it. You have no way to reliably force more than 1 card draw off it otherwise. Azure drake is a good cycle card as the drake itself is powerful by itself as a card. Gadgtzan Auctioneer would be a poor choice with your high cost spell selection and lack of protection to keep it out.

Divine Favor tends to be the card draw favorite of choice for paladin decks, especially agro pally decks. Agro decks go for low casting cost cards to burn through your hand fast and then get more cards with Divine Favor. Still it can be useful if used wisely in a pally control deck.

I personally despise novice engineers as they are worthless for the card draw. Rather have a card that can be more useful overall for the cost. Dwarven loot hoarders are better for this as they can trade damage better.

Beyond that last good card draw is Hammer of Wrath. Which is also good in a control deck especially early on.

 

[Rhezuss]

Thanks Humble, looks like i'm on the way to a better deck!

 

[Wardawg1001]

One general tip, imo, is to not fall too in love with wanting two of everything in your deck. Some cards are absolutely worth it, but I think you get more reliable performance out of having two cards filling the same niche when possible. Maybe sub an Unstable ghoul for an Abomination, maybe swap a Kodo for a Yeti, maybe an Avenging Wrath for Hammer of Wrath.

I'm going to disagree with this. Its almost always better to use 2 copies of the same card for filling a specific purpose, so long as that purpose warrants taking up 2 cards in your deck at all. The reason is simply for consistency. Having a lower number of distinct cards increases the chances that you will consistently draw these cards in each game.

Strong constructed decks rely on combo's (some more than others, but its present in all of them). The more you diversify your deck, the harder it is to get all the pieces of your combo's into your hand when you need them. In your example you suggest removing one of the Kodo's for a Yeti. On the surface, this might seem like a pretty good idea - Yeti costs one less mana and it has 1 more attack then the Kodo. But control Paladins use Kodo's primarily as a combo card with Aldor Peacekeeper or Humility. It's a two card combo that can kill literally any enemy minion. Even if you find that on average you only need to use this combo once per game (which I think is probably not the case, but lets assume it is for arguments sake), its still a bad idea to remove one of the Kodo's, because doing so significantly decreases the chances that the Kodo will be in your hand when you need it.

Even outside of combo cards, you want to strive for consistency in your deck. The trade off you make of course is that you lose some diversity and may be poorly equipped to handle some threats. No deck can do everything, that's just the reality. But you don't need to be able to handle every single threat in every single game. So if you spread your deck too thin trying to have an answer for everything, you will end up with no core strengths, and a lot of cards that aren't very useful in any given match.

 

[darkewaffle]

Fair call on the Kodo and Humility/Peacekeeper, I didn't register that at the time. In that case, poor example.

I didn't necessarily mean diversity for the sake of diversity, but rather I think it's important to be able to perform your 'combos' or mitigate threats both in high and low mana situations. It's why rather than use two spellbreakers, I'll usually use an owl and a spellbreaker. I still get two silences, but if someone has a hyena or undertaker that's causing me trouble early I don't have to necessarily wait til turn 4 for a silence. Or I can silence for two mana midgame and still have room to lay another minion or two or cast a spell etc, which may not be possible with just spellbreaker. Alternatively, if I'm in a situation where I want a silence and a decent minion and can afford the mana, spellbreaker is suitable.

It's not always an applicable idea (especially for such unique effects as Kodo) but lets say you're a priest with SWD and some Big Game Hunters loaded to nullify big minions. You've got some dark iron dwarves since they're solid minions on their own and the +2 attack can make something SWD/BGHable or boost your own minions. But it means that combo is going to cost you a minimum of 9/7. Whereas if you slipped an Abusive Sergeant in instead you still get the +2 attack benefit to your minion when you need it (and for cheaper, albeit with a weaker minion) but your combo can now also be played for a cost of 6/4 - so you can play it earlier or for cheaper later. I think that flexibility is valuable.

You could even apply the same line of thought to just SWD and BGH. Or Kodo and SWP. Or Kodo and Cabal Shadow Priest. Or Lightning Bolt and Wolf Rider. Basically all cards that do more or less the same thing but at different costs and accomplish them in slightly different ways with different consequences.

 

[Firsttime]

I also play mostly Control Paladin. My deck looks like:

2x Equality
1x Holy Light
1x Crazed Alchemist
1x Doomsayer
2x Wild Pyromancer
2x Aldor Peacekeeper
1x Big Game Hunter
1x Mind Control Tech
2x Truesilver
2x Consecration
1x Defender of Argos
2x Sen'jin
1x Spellbreaker
2x Sludge Belcher
1x Kodo
Cairne
Sylvanas
TBK
2x Guardian of Kings
1x Lay on Hands
Tirion
Alexstrasza


The MCT and Alchemist are new, I'm testing them out right now, they took the place of my Acolytes which I agree with some others here I found underwhelming. The Alchemist is fun to play with in addition to the equality/aldors/kodo/BGH not sure of his long term stay, the MCT will probably get rotated out for something. I was looking for a few cheaper drops that maintain late game effect, I feel a second kodo or BGH would be better probably. I replaced ghouls, which annoyed the shit out of me with their negative hero power synergy, with the Sen'jins, which give you lots of 4 drops. The Doomsayer is there to give you a free turn in case shit gets wild early. I love that. Either they burn their turn attacking it giving you time to get to a 4 drop or their minions all die.

Early game with this deck is kinda weak for sure, but I'm able to recover 80% of the time turn 4 and on. Cairne is wicked sticky so I like him in control and Alex gives you nice late game burst if you haven't been able to get face damage because you've been spending too much time controlling, or you get a late game heal. Both options are good. Argus is nice for making dudes or other cheap minions stickier. I think BGH is pretty essential for the value plays, I'm tempted to run two for handlocks, but if too many hunters come back I'll probably stay at one. TBK is just too effective at cutting through Belchers or other control player's taunts.

 

[Rhezuss]

Nice deck man, I always wanted to try out the Crazed Alchemist.

I also build, a long time ago, a Pirate Paladin with all the Pirate cards I had and 2X Sword of Justice, plus the normal Paladin stuff. It worked surprisingly well for the time and yesterday I got all the Pirate cards and the achievement that gave my the Parrot lol...I might try a Warrior Pirate deck soon.

 

[Maleficus]

oh shit, Firsttime posting on AT? he is getting fo srs about derpstone.

I'm a fan of druid myself, too lazy to post my deck though.

 

[Fallen Kell]

I'm no pro deck builder but with two peacekeepers around I don't think you need Humility (just be a bit less aggressive with the peacekeepers). I think with 2x Unstable Ghoul / Deathlord / Pyromancer / Equality / Consecration / Kodo / Avenging Wrath you're too focused on clearing/protecting vs garbage minions. I would drop some of those and diversify a little bit.

He needs both the peacekeepers and the humility spells because he has no silence. And even then, I think he still gets beat over the head by a Priest with lightspawns (where changing attack doesn't do crap, you need to change their health).

 

[Firsttime]

oh shit, Firsttime posting on AT? he is getting fo srs about derpstone.

I'm a fan of druid myself, too lazy to post my deck though.

Stop stalking me creeper.

 

[Fallen Kell]

Also I felt bad for a Warrior I was fighting last night. We were going toe to toe the entire battle, when I finally got out some lightwells behind a sludge beltcher and a cleric (so I was pulling cards right and left). The only problem was I was running out of cards, but finally took over complete board control. And I finally drew my double health spells and inner strength spells (they were almost at the bottom of the deck). Even though I ran out of cards that turn, the last card in my deck was a +2 health + draw a card, which I used on one of the lightwells, and then doubled its health, and then faceless maniped it (so I had 3 lightwells out, 2 14/14, and 1 0/5). The warrior had INSANE amount of armor at this point (we are talking 40+), and he manages to draw a taunt, so I was only able to hit him with one of my lightwells. And then of course, because I have a damaged lightwell, that gets healed, which with my cleric out, I get another card (which I don't have), plus the normal card draw... I used my second faceless manip on another of the 14/14 lightwells to make 3 14/14's and the 0/5. And he then gets +5 armor + draw a card as his normal card, plays 2 more taunts... So again, I only get 1 hit on his hero, which now has 30 health and still 20 or so armor. But I also killed my cleric on one of his taunts, so I am at least no longer getting more card draw that I don't have. The lightwells are healing me up for all the fatigue damage I am taking (plus my +2 heal). And this is just how it keeps playing for several turns... I finally kill him, but I was taking 18 fatigue damage on the turn I finished him off. If it was any other minion that I had out there and not the lightwells, I would have lost that fight.

 

[EDUSAN]

Im playing mostly ctrl warrior, its the deck and class that i feel more confortable with nowadays. I do some tweaks here and there depending on meta (like having untable ghouls or cleave against hunters)

im pretty bad at doing tracking, i always forget. i should start doing it again. i feel like im in the 5x% win rate against most decks but i feel like against control priest i cant win.
Their mind control screw me up. Their Ysera screw me up, their shadowmadness screw my early game up. Their 2 shadow word death and pain screw me up.

They outlast me with their cabals, shadowmadness, mind control and thoughsteals.

The only way i feel i can win is....

Having someone on board, playing alexstrassa to take him from 30 to 15
attack with whatever i have to leave it at 10 or less to try to do a Enraged Grommash 10+ damage turn with the weapon or a cruel taskmaster

if i dont do like 30 damage in 2 turns, i cant win

 

[lupi]

Played first time this month over the weekend while watching the games. Had 3 quest where I needed 10 wins to clear all 3. Took about 15 games. The majority of classes I played against where warrior & priest. Must still be getting a lotof new players as I saw very few legendaries, a lot of basic cards and even a guy who opened a match with a wisp. Only saw 1 hunter and no locks.

 

[Fallen Kell]

I have seen whisps now and then still, especially in rush decks, or decks that use something that relies on number of cards played (like the rogue legendary and the other card that gains 1/1 for each card played after it is on the board).

 

[darkewaffle]

I think I saw a Wisp for the first time ever a few nights ago. And an Angry Chicken.

 

[Rhezuss]

In this order: Angry Chicken + Wild Pyromancer + Blessings of Kings on the chicken = Boss

Damn that gives me some ideas for some silly stuff...

Like a Warrior I built yesterday, around the Spite Smith or something, the dude that gives +2 to your weapon when enraged. I added the Arathi weaponsmith and a few other weapons like the one from Naxx, the 4/2 axe that does 1 damage to minions when it's exhausted. Worked quite fine at lower ranks (16-19) and was fun to play.

 

[EDUSAN]

In this order: Angry Chicken + Wild Pyromancer + Blessings of Kings on the chicken = Boss

Quite nice. would love to see some way to add charge to it

so...i have been thinking a way to do it in a warrior

if you have a card like commanding shout, does the angry chicken "receive" damage even if it can go below 1 hp?

Warrior

Angry Chicken, the charge card, commanding shout, whirlwind?

Coin -> Angry Chicken and the +1hp priestess -> inner rage

Priest...

Angry Chicken -> PW:S -> Holy Smite
(more awesomeness -> Angry Chicken -> Pw:S -> the double hp card -> inner fire -> holy smite ... you need all the cards in your deck lol)

Warlock...

i dont see a way to do it with warlock since they have no buff...

Hunter is easy....

Angry Chicken -> Houndmaster -> Arcane Shot

 

[darkewaffle]

I love the enraged smith lol, I don't get to use the additional effect all that often but it does scare some people into thinking they really need to remove it, which as a 4/6 minion isn't completely trivial at least. It's like it has fake-taunt. I use it in a warrior deck I like to goof around with.

Priest vs pally - thoughtstole 2x truesilver champions

Priest vs rogue - thoughtstole 3x deadly poison and no weapons lol

Hella pro.