HELP! I've been kidnapped and taken to Mexico!!

[Chaotic42]

Originally posted by: aurareturn
Why should they be forced to become what we are?

Because they came here.

 

[w3stfa11]

I'm so fricking sick and tired of road signs in Spanish, government forms in Spanish, Spanish announcements being made in Target/Wal-Mart/Sears/etc... and going into a restaurant and nobody working there can speak anything but Spanish.

Hmm, how exactly does that bother you? It doesn't bother me one bit. Extra government forms in Spanish? Jeesh, what's your beef? Give me a break!

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: shinerburke

Originally posted by: fisher

Originally posted by: 2Xtreme21

Originally posted by: shinerburke

Originally posted by: 2Xtreme21
Tell that to the Native Americans who were forced to listen to our foreign language (while we systematically raped everything they had).

Have some tolerance. How is it affecting you other than bringing out the bigot in you?

Oh STFU. The whole Native American argument is weak as water. If you want to get into that sort of stupidity then let's go all the way back to when human kind first wandered out of Africa. I have a Masters Degree in Native American History and Culture so don't think you're talking to an idiot when it comes to that subject.

The point is the Mexicans are the only people in the history of this country who have immigrated and refused to assimilate. Instead of doing what generations of immigrants before them have done, learn our culture and language, they bull headedly insist on maintaining the very culture they escaped from and don't want to learn our language. It is ridiculous that governments have had to go to the expense of printing a multitude of official forms in Spanish, that they have had to replace perfectly good street/highway signs with new bilingual ones. How fucked up is that? If you can't read the language you sure as hell shouldn't be driving and likely don't even have a license or insurance.

So your argument is, because I am better than they are, they should conform to what I believe and how I act. The beauty of this country is you have the freedom to speak whatever language you want and practice whatever culture you choose without fear of discrimination.

i'm fairly certain that speaking whatever language you want is not a freedom of this country. the problem is that other cultures are trying to make us conform to them, which is garbage and PC America is letting it happen.

Yep.

Like I said. Generations of other immigrants came here and adapted to our culture and language. It is only these new Mexican immigrants, many of them illegal, who refuse to do so.

As an example....

Here in Tulsa the schools are now having to setup classrooms in several of the schools that are Spanish only. Seriously. WTF? They are having to do so because the students don't speak English and their parents refuse to let them be taught English. Personally I think they should load their ass up and get back to Mexico, but no we have to understand them and help them. Bullcrap. God damned PC bleeding heart liberals are selling the country down the river with that kind of stupid thinking.

I know what you're saying....but seriously. It isn't really that the Mexicans are refusing to assimilate as it is us, because they aren;t the ones changing the classrooms (and everything else). Its the school systems, the DMV, etc. They're the ones putting Spanish on everything.

Just like it isn't the Mexicans who forced the NFL to flash the Spanish stuff on air...the NFL decided on their own to do it.

So all of those immigrants in the past you're referring to? The fucking government (and other entities) didn't pander to them left and right like ours is doing now for the Mexicans.

 

[aurareturn]

Originally posted by: Chaotic42

Originally posted by: aurareturn
Why should they be forced to become what we are?

Because they came here.

Tell me where it says in the law that mexicans have to adapt to our culture?

 

[waggy]

its mexician love day or osmething like that.

 

[IronWing]

Originally posted by: waggy
its mexician love day or osmething like that.

Not really. I 'm just trying to get my mind around the idea that there is someone sitting in front of the boobtube watching football and bitching that someone is out to destroy our culture. TV and apathy killed our culture decades ago.

 

[SpunkyJones]

Originally posted by: aurareturn

Originally posted by: Chaotic42

Originally posted by: aurareturn
Why should they be forced to become what we are?

Because they came here.

Tell me where it says in the law that mexicans have to adapt to our culture?

The other side of that coin is that we should not have to adapt to them. They come here and don't want to learn english, thats fine. Just don't expect everything you need for daily life to be in spanish.

 

[alkemyst]

Well I was looking for University of Miami (SECOGS actually) and tried to stop in a McDonalds of all things for directions/phone book.

First the menu was all in spanish, there was a small section in english. I asked for help and got 'No speaka engrish'. It's a freaking McDonalds.

The same people were probably the ones that were trying to get spanish as the official language of all of Florida just because a large population of minorities in Miami speak it.

The red neck crowd which is about 90% of the state in area and probably a good percentage in population went nuts on this.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: 2Xtreme21
Tell that to the Native Americans who were forced to listen to our foreign language (while we systematically raped everything they had).

Have some tolerance. How is it affecting you other than bringing out the bigot in you?

Unfortunately we came and kicked their ass and made it our country. I am all for learning the language of the land even if it's not my own.

However, last I checked in the USA, english is the language.

 

[Sukhoi]

+1 for the OP! :thumbsup:

 

[Pliablemoose]

Might as well get accustomed to it http://www.hispanictips.com/20...k-beating-abc-cbs-nbc/

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: shinerburke

Like I said. Generations of other immigrants came here and adapted to our culture and language. It is only these new Mexican immigrants, many of them illegal, who refuse to do so.

Last I checked, you HAD to know english to get a green card. The rub is most of these people are illegals sending their kids to our schools (I agree that you are an american if born here, but many of these kids came over after the fact and without birth certicates there is no proof).

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: aurareturn
This thread is ridiculous and so is the OP.

Grow a brain and get a perspective please. Not everyone can just learn a language like that working 50 hours a week and taking care of the family. It's extremely hard, near impossible, for someone who is older than 25 to really learn a new language and use it effectively.

And no, they don't have to learn our culture and shouldn't. Our culture isn't the best culture there is. They have their own culture, and Americans have their own. Why should they be forced to become what we are?

Because they are either Americans or not. If you live here you are an American, if you are visiting then it's fine to speak whatever language and believe in what ever nation you like.

 

[IronWing]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: shinerburke

Like I said. Generations of other immigrants came here and adapted to our culture and language. It is only these new Mexican immigrants, many of them illegal, who refuse to do so.

Last I checked, you HAD to know english to get a green card. The rub is most of these people are illegals sending their kids to our schools (I agree that you are an american if born here, but many of these kids came over after the fact and without birth certicates there is no proof).

I don't know about getting green cards but there are plenty of native Spanish speakers around here whose families were here before there was a a US here and they kept on speaking Spanish the whole time. It really doesn't matter. The market will sort things out in time.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: BoomerD

Originally posted by: Rogodin2
The hispanic population is doing what white people won't do, they work the land for the large ag corporations for wages that you won't work for.

If you're pissed off then grow your own food.

Rogo

Rogo...here's where you & I differ...

YES, they do work that MOST American's won't do for the wages paid, BUT, many would do if the pay was better.
Unfortunately, they don't stick to ag jobs...they're in construction, restaurants, grocery stores, fast-food joints, anywhere that relatively unskilled labor is needed...
Here in Kahleeforneeya, it's gotten so bad that something like 50% of the residential construction is done by Mexican labor...not all of them qualified for the work, but they work cheaper than White people, and usually learn fairly quickly...if they want to keep their jobs...
Hell, the manager of the local Safeway's Bakery department was just deported for being an illegal immigrant...not exactly one of the "jobs that Americans don't want."

That is a Catch 22 though. Prior to illegals, americans did crop picking and the other stuff. Enter Juan Valdez and promises to work 2x the hours for 1/2 the pay only problem is he has no social security number or bank account. Joe Farmer is having a hard enough time turning a profit with the US importing major crops instead of just using our own.

He hires him and tells the other guy there is no more work for him.

This is why there is a minimum wage.

 

[Chaotic42]

Originally posted by: aurareturn
Tell me where it says in the law that mexicans have to adapt to our culture?

In order to come here legally, they have to pass a citizenship test, which is in English as far as I know.

I'm not saying they should give up their culture, but at least try to learn English. Of course, we're all so worried about offending them that it will never happen.

 

[Idontcare]

History repeats...look to history and consider the following quote regarding the Decline and Fall of Rome and see the parallels to the US and immigration from Mexico requiring unprecendented levels of cultural accomodations:

Vegetius
The military historian Vegetius theorized, and has recently been supported by the historian Arthur Ferrill, that the Roman Empire ? particularly the military ? declined partially as a result of an influx of Germanic mercenaries into the ranks of the legions. This "Germanization" and the resultant cultural dilution or "barbarization", led to lethargy, complacency and loyalty to the Roman commanders among the legions and a surge in decadence amongst Roman citizenry.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fall_of_Rome#Vegetius

Or you could laugh at history and claim the effects will be minimal, unavoidable, and morally criminal to attempt to stop.

No other influx of immigrants has had this level of expected/required/implied sense of entitlement in the US. For some reason no one has allowed Asian, Indian, African, European, etc immigrants collectively and in wholesale command infrastructure changes in the US's culture to the extent that the Mexican immigration movement is commanding.

It's your country, let others do with it as you like. But don't act like this has never happened before or that it is without an expected outcome.

 

[IronWing]

Originally posted by: Chaotic42

Originally posted by: aurareturn
Tell me where it says in the law that mexicans have to adapt to our culture?

In order to come here legally, they have to pass a citizenship test, which is in English as far as I know.

I'm not saying they should give up their culture, but at least try to learn English. Of course, we're all so worried about offending them that it will never happen.

And the native Spanish speakers who are citizens, just like their parents, grandparents, and great-grandparents? Should they be forced to learn English? If you believe so, why?

 

[cruzer]

This reminds me of this local Walmart circular printed in Arizona, once an American state, but now unofficially Mexico Del Norte: Scan
Notice they didn't put an American flag with the other prop flags on the bookcase, cause we don't play soccer in America I guess.

This is why Congress needs to pass a law making English the official language of the US.

Good luck with that my friend cause it in Arizona the people voted for and passed that state proposition and within days a special interest group had a self-hating liberal judge throw it out.

 

[Dirigible]

Actually, you gringos came here (California) speaking your foreign English tongue and taking my family's land by force in the 1840s and throwing my ancestors into poverty. I'll speak Spanish if I damn well please.

Of course, I can't speak Spanish, 'cause after 160 years of being part of the U.S. you kinda get americanized.

On a more serious note, I don't understand getting riled up about this. I'm a believer in freedom. Let people speak whatever language they want. Right now I think that not speaking English in this country limits your options and isn't a good choice. But it may be that we'll all have to learn Spanish in the future. Maybe we'll have to learn Chinese. Maybe we'll learn multiple languages. So what? Change happens. Life is like that.

 

[IronWing]

Originally posted by: Idontcare
History repeats...look to history and consider the following quote regarding the Decline and Fall of Rome and see the parallels to the US and immigration from Mexico requiring unprecendented levels of cultural accomodations:

Vegetius
The military historian Vegetius theorized, and has recently been supported by the historian Arthur Ferrill, that the Roman Empire ? particularly the military ? declined partially as a result of an influx of Germanic mercenaries into the ranks of the legions. This "Germanization" and the resultant cultural dilution or "barbarization", led to lethargy, complacency and loyalty to the Roman commanders among the legions and a surge in decadence amongst Roman citizenry.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fall_of_Rome#Vegetius

Or you could laugh at history and claim the effects will be minimal, unavoidable, and morally criminal to attempt to stop.

No other influx of immigrants has had this level of expected/required/implied sense of entitlement in the US. For some reason no one has allowed Asian, Indian, African, European, etc immigrants collectively and in wholesale command infrastructure changes in the US's culture to the extent that the Mexican immigration movement is commanding.

It's your country, let others do with it as you like. But don't act like this has never happened before or that it is without an expected outcome.

What a bunch of crap. Spanish speakers are forcing nothing on you. Vote with your dollars. If the US ever collapses, it won't be because of immigrants, it will be because of fiscal irresponsibility and voter apathy.

 

[IronWing]

Originally posted by: cruzer
This reminds me of this local Walmart circular printed in Arizona, once an American state, but now unofficially Mexico Del Norte: Scan
Notice they didn't put an American flag with the other prop flags on the bookcase, cause we don't play soccer in America I guess.

This is why Congress needs to pass a law making English the official language of the US.

Good luck with that my friend cause it in Arizona the people voted for and passed that state proposition and within days a special interest group had a self-hating liberal judge throw it out.

Damn Constitution, ruins everything.

 

[Chaotic42]

Originally posted by: ironwing
And the native Spanish speakers who are citizens, just like their parents, grandparents, and great-grandparents? Should they be forced to learn English? If you believe so, why?

I think so, simply because we've already settled on a de facto language, which I believe should become our national language. Now, I'm not saying that we should send police out to test these people at 2am and drag them to jail, but I would not be against a tax increase or money-shift that would go towards English education for these people.

Why would you not want to learn the language that the rest of the country is speaking anyway? I can't imagine going to China and not learning Chinese. It's absurd.

 

[Chaotic42]

DP

 

[BeauJangles]

Originally posted by: Idontcare
History repeats...look to history and consider the following quote regarding the Decline and Fall of Rome and see the parallels to the US and immigration from Mexico requiring unprecendented levels of cultural accomodations:

Vegetius
The military historian Vegetius theorized, and has recently been supported by the historian Arthur Ferrill, that the Roman Empire ? particularly the military ? declined partially as a result of an influx of Germanic mercenaries into the ranks of the legions. This "Germanization" and the resultant cultural dilution or "barbarization", led to lethargy, complacency and loyalty to the Roman commanders among the legions and a surge in decadence amongst Roman citizenry.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fall_of_Rome#Vegetius

Or you could laugh at history and claim the effects will be minimal, unavoidable, and morally criminal to attempt to stop.

No other influx of immigrants has had this level of expected/required/implied sense of entitlement in the US. For some reason no one has allowed Asian, Indian, African, European, etc immigrants collectively and in wholesale command infrastructure changes in the US's culture to the extent that the Mexican immigration movement is commanding.

It's your country, let others do with it as you like. But don't act like this has never happened before or that it is without an expected outcome.

This is a pretty bad comparison. The Roman military decline was due to a huge number of factors, not just the influx of Barbarians, who frequently sought to learn Latin (yikes for your comparison). Their presence negatively affected the military because of the manner in which they entered the empire - not their language. In fact, some of the best Roman generals and soldiers of the decline period were "barbarians."

Superficially your comparison is great, especially because the US-Roman connection has become so popular lately, but further examination will show you that language was not one of the major contributing factors to the decline.