HELP! I've been kidnapped and taken to Mexico!!

[Eos]

There is no possibility that when you are asked to press 2 for English it's because whoever is being called wants ALL callers to get the best help possible. If a person has been here for a few months or any amount of time and are more comfortable with Spanish, then the company wants to provide that to them.

No chance at all.

 

[oznerol]

There is no official language of the US, and there never should be.

If someone wants to live here and not learn English, fine - I find it nowhere near disrespectful toward me or the United States. If someone can sustain a life for themselves in America without learning English then more power to them. Most will learn, however, that to maximize your potential you will need to learn English - however it is in no way a requirement to live in this country.

In the same regard, commercials can and should be in whatever language the advertisers choose. If the advertisers wish to isolate English-only speaking Americans such as myself, that is their prerogative. The fact that you get insulted that you aren't a target audience of an advertisement is simply absurd. Watch commercials on BET for a bit. You will notice that the vast majority of commercials cater toward black people. This is the same thing. There is nothing wrong with it.

And to anyone who brought up the whole illegal immigrant can of worms - this argument and that one are two separate entities. The only link between the two is the fact that Spanish is spoken.

Edit: spelling and such

 

[Linflas]

Originally posted by: ducci
There is no official language of the US, and there never should be.

If someone wants to live here and not learn English, fine - I find it nowhere near disrespectful toward me or the United States. If someone can sustain a life for themselves in America without learning English then more power to them. Most will learn, however, that to maximize your potential you will need to learn English - however it is in no way a requirement to live in this country.

In the same regard, commercials can and should be in whatever language the advertisers choose. If the advertisers wish to isolate English-only speaking Americans such as myself, that is their prerogative. The fact that you get insulted that you aren't a target audience of an advertisement is simply absurd. Watch commercials on BET for a bit. You will notice that the vast majority of commercials cater toward black people. This is the same thing. There is nothing wrong with it.

And to anyone who brought up the whole illegal immigrant can of worms - this argument and that one are two separate entities. The only link between the two is the fact that Spanish is spoken.

Edit: spelling and such

I agree with you to a point and that point is any requirement by government to accommodate those that do not speak English. This does not preclude government from providing services in languages other than English if they feel it is in the best interest of their constituents but in all cases they should not be legally required to provide ballots, drivers exams, official forms etc in any language other than English. As far as I'm concerned if private companies want to provide services in other languages that is their business.

 

[imported_quasi]

Pienso que español debe ser la lengua oficial de ATOT así que el OP continuará quejarse.

 

[IronWing]

Originally posted by: Linflas

Originally posted by: ducci
There is no official language of the US, and there never should be.

If someone wants to live here and not learn English, fine - I find it nowhere near disrespectful toward me or the United States. If someone can sustain a life for themselves in America without learning English then more power to them. Most will learn, however, that to maximize your potential you will need to learn English - however it is in no way a requirement to live in this country.

In the same regard, commercials can and should be in whatever language the advertisers choose. If the advertisers wish to isolate English-only speaking Americans such as myself, that is their prerogative. The fact that you get insulted that you aren't a target audience of an advertisement is simply absurd. Watch commercials on BET for a bit. You will notice that the vast majority of commercials cater toward black people. This is the same thing. There is nothing wrong with it.

And to anyone who brought up the whole illegal immigrant can of worms - this argument and that one are two separate entities. The only link between the two is the fact that Spanish is spoken.

Edit: spelling and such

I agree with you to a point and that point is any requirement by government to accommodate those that do not speak English. This does not preclude government from providing services in languages other than English if they feel it is in the best interest of their constituents but in all cases they should not be legally required to provide ballots, drivers exams, official forms etc in any language other than English. As far as I'm concerned if private companies want to provide services in other languages that is their business.

It comes down to votes. If voters, through their elected reps, okay the expenditure of public funds for multi-language signing, services, ballots, and forms then I don't see it as a problem. Having ballots in the languages of the voters is a good idea, IMHO as it encourages responsible voting.

 

[hanoverphist]

go to mexico city or any of the smaller towns between the border and there. stand in the street and ask them for a glass of water in english and see how fast you die of thirst. its a double standard. my family (dads side) is from mexico (my gramma was the first born here) and there is not one person in the family that doesnt speak english. my moms family is german and everyone speaks english. when they came over, they realized they needed to communicate to live and work here so they learned how. it pisses my relatives off to no end when they see "immigrants" not willing to learn the language. i have many friends that have similar backgrounds that say the same thing. some equate the lack of learning english as a mark of ignorance, not cultural significance.

me? i dont want to pay extra taxes to support these programs to print everything twice, record voice prompts in multiple languages and so on. if someone wants to never learn english, fine. dont expect me to talk to ya (i know, not a big loss there... unless im interviewing you for a job. then youre screwed. yes, in technical positions you can decline someone based on a lack of communication. cant train someone you cant communicate with, and you arent expected to pander to their language to break that barrier. already tested this rule many times.)

 

[oznerol]

Originally posted by: Linflas

Originally posted by: ducci
There is no official language of the US, and there never should be.

If someone wants to live here and not learn English, fine - I find it nowhere near disrespectful toward me or the United States. If someone can sustain a life for themselves in America without learning English then more power to them. Most will learn, however, that to maximize your potential you will need to learn English - however it is in no way a requirement to live in this country.

In the same regard, commercials can and should be in whatever language the advertisers choose. If the advertisers wish to isolate English-only speaking Americans such as myself, that is their prerogative. The fact that you get insulted that you aren't a target audience of an advertisement is simply absurd. Watch commercials on BET for a bit. You will notice that the vast majority of commercials cater toward black people. This is the same thing. There is nothing wrong with it.

And to anyone who brought up the whole illegal immigrant can of worms - this argument and that one are two separate entities. The only link between the two is the fact that Spanish is spoken.

Edit: spelling and such

I agree with you to a point and that point is any requirement by government to accommodate those that do not speak English. This does not preclude government from providing services in languages other than English if they feel it is in the best interest of their constituents but in all cases they should not be legally required to provide ballots, drivers exams, official forms etc in any language other than English. As far as I'm concerned if private companies want to provide services in other languages that is their business.

I think the opposite. Government documents should be in as many languages as necessary. It is not "catering" to a specific demographic, it is treating everyone equally and fairly. It is one of the basic principals this country was founded on (ignore slavery and women's rights).

There is no reason to not allow a non-English speaking citizen to get a US driver's license simply because they cannot speak English.

As I said before, English is not, never was, and never will be America's official language.

Just like we cannot ban black people or women from voting, we can't prohibit non-English speaking citizens from doing the same.

 

[IronWing]

Originally posted by: quasi
Pienso que español debe ser la lengua oficial de ATOT así que el OP continuará quejarse.

I could take the time to parse your message or run it through babel fish but I choose not to. If you wish to make your meaning known you'll provide a translation to reach more folks, or not. The market at work. I might be missing out, in which case I might choose to go through the effort to translate it, or not. It's a free country*.

*Okay, it isn't a free forum, but that is another issue.

Actually, I figured out everything but "Pienso" which is familiar so I must have known it at one time. Use it or lose it.

 

[NoShangriLa]

OP you better sit down & have a beer before you blow a blood vessel.

Here in Victoria/Vancouver Canada we have road signs in Chinese (China town), Chinese language ATM & Chinese speaking tellers, Chinese TV, Chinese announcement at the airports & malls.

 

[sdifox]

Originally posted by: Steve

Originally posted by: sdifox
Nor did I get schooled in Spanish when I got to Toronto.

Or French?

I already had 3 years of high school French back in Buenos Aires so I got the equivalence waiver. Phew, would have hated to have to do French again. Hated that.

 

[Chaotic42]

Originally posted by: Mill
Yes, there are *some* immigrants who refuse to assimilate and refuse to even attempt to learn English. But they aren't just Mexicans, and they aren't just Spanish speakers. You just notice Hispanics because they are the largest groups of immigrants. You think everyone working at your favorite sushi bar or Chinese restaurant speaks passable English? Highly unlikely.

Yes, but you don't see Russians or Vietnamese out protesting and throwing a fit in the streets. Every time a rally is held with Mexican flags waving and Hispanic music blaring, another few Gringos become hardended against Mexican culture.

The recent influx of illegals to the Gulf Coast has brought out a lot of anti-Mexican sentiment, justified or not.

We were all immigrants and one time or another -- unless, of course, you are Native American.

They migrated here too.

 

[WelshBloke]

Originally posted by: shinerburke


Like I said. Generations of other immigrants came here and adapted to our culture .

Your from the USA, you dont have any culture.

 

[glutenberg]

Originally posted by: NoShangriLa
OP you better sit down & have a beer before you blow a blood vessel.

Here in Victoria/Vancouver Canada we have road signs in Chinese (China town), Chinese language ATM & Chinese speaking tellers, Chinese TV, Chinese announcement at the airports & malls.

Hell, we have that here in Los Angeles, San Francisco, New York, and soon to be Houston as more Asians move out there. Once businesses realize how small a percentage of the world English-only speakers are, they quickly realize that as other nationalities start becoming more affluent, that catering to them can garner a larger domestic share and a subsequent larger share on the global level.

 

[Mill]

Yes, but you don't see Russians or Vietnamese out protesting and throwing a fit in the streets. Every time a rally is held with Mexican flags waving and Hispanic music blaring, another few Gringos become hardended against Mexican culture.

Wait, so that makes bigotry ok? It certainly does not. Secondly, there's not millions of Vietnamese and Russians in the fucking South. Thirdly, the outcry about immigration started LONG before there were any protests and rallies. Sorry, but that's just a bunch of BS you are speaking.

The recent influx of illegals to the Gulf Coast has brought out a lot of anti-Mexican sentiment, justified or not.

How do you know they are illegal? Did you check their papers?

They migrated here too.

The United States was not a country when they came here. There were no border laws. Let's argue logically, please.

 

[mooncancook]

Blame it on Capitalism!

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

It strikes me that the folks who argue for English as a national language in the U.S. haven't done much traveling. In Europe many different languages exist happily side by side. In India, it is the same. In the U.S. a good many English speakers don't even come close to sharing the same meanings with their 'common' language. Try asking for directions or ordering a meal in Southern California, Washington State, Boston, Georgia Lowlands, Tennesee, Maine, Minnesota or New York City from English speakers.

The point is, that if you truly wish to communicate, an unfamiliar spoken language is a minor barrier.

 

[Sinsear]

Originally posted by: joshsquall
This is why Congress needs to pass a law making English the official language of the US.

:thumbsup:

 

[Chaotic42]

Originally posted by: Mill
Wait, so that makes bigotry ok? It certainly does not.

No, it doesn't make bigotry okay. All of my evidence for this is anecdotal, so take it for however little it is worth. I'm just pointing out that whenever there are rallies and such on TV, it tends to get people flustered. It could only be the people that discuss this with me though.

Thirdly, the outcry about immigration started LONG before there were any protests and rallies.

Obviously. I just think that the rallies and protests are hurting them more than they are helping. I could be wrong though, it wouldn't be the first time.

How do you know they are illegal? Did you check their papers?

No, but the inability of some of them to carry out even the most basic of transactions like buying food at the store leads me to think that at least some of them are illegal, and from the comments of other known legal residents, they seem to think so too. Of course, as I said, I could be wrong.

The United States was not a country when they came here. There were no border laws. Let's argue logically, please.

True, but the idea that they have some inherent right to this land, a right that is greater than that of a natural-born American land-owning citizen, is flawed. Also, the United States wasn't here when the first Europeans arrived does that make them immune from the idea that whites, blacks, and Asians don't "belong" here?

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

Originally posted by: glutenberg

Originally posted by: Kadarin
I am in complete agreement with the OP. Mexican immigrants (legal and illegal) don't really seem to want to assimilate to American culture, but rather to force American culture to change to meet their desires.

How many Hispanics do you know? Do you even know the majority of them? Or are you using anecdotal evidence and generalizing as being the same everywhere?

Well, it's more so that they have a stronger voice in politics than say other minorities like Asian Americans. I live in the Bay Area and while Hispanics are a huge force in CA, it's more so in LA/SD. Here, we have a complete domination by Asians and I don't see them out making street signs in Chinese and what not. My hometown for example is 44% Asian and 51% white. Of the 44% Asian, over half are Chinese. I see that as just enough reason to put up Chinese road signs.

We Asian Americans have so many programs and initiatives designed to bring out political activeness amongst our people and it's tough. If culturally we were the same as Hispanics, I can guarantee you, you would be pressing 2 for Chinese and 1 for English when you call UPS.

 

[PieIsAwesome]

Jajaja fanatico ethnocentrico.

 

[Pacfanweb]

Originally posted by: Rogodin2
The hispanic population is doing what white people won't do, they work the land for the large ag corporations for wages that you won't work for.

If you're pissed off then grow your own food.

Rogo

Nice try, but incorrect. The illegals are doing jobs for less because they get paid under the table.....no taxes.
Plenty of Americans will gladly do those jobs, but they will demand higher pay to make up for the taxes that will come out of their checks.

Who the hell do you think did that work before the Mexican invasion?


And guess what...the companies that hire Mexicans for less certainly don't charge less for their goods and services now that their costs are less.

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb

Originally posted by: Rogodin2
The hispanic population is doing what white people won't do, they work the land for the large ag corporations for wages that you won't work for.

If you're pissed off then grow your own food.

Rogo

Nice try, but incorrect. The illegals are doing jobs for less because they get paid under the table.....no taxes.
Plenty of Americans will gladly do those jobs, but they will demand higher pay to make up for the taxes that will come out of their checks.

Who the hell do you think did that work before the Mexican invasion?


And guess what...the companies that hire Mexicans for less certainly don't charge less for their goods and services now that their costs are less.

You are smoking the good stuff if you believe that most of them don't pay taxes.

 

[IronWing]

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb

Originally posted by: Rogodin2
The hispanic population is doing what white people won't do, they work the land for the large ag corporations for wages that you won't work for.

If you're pissed off then grow your own food.

Rogo

Nice try, but incorrect. The illegals are doing jobs for less because they get paid under the table.....no taxes.
Plenty of Americans will gladly do those jobs, but they will demand higher pay to make up for the taxes that will come out of their checks.

Who the hell do you think did that work before the Mexican invasion?


And guess what...the companies that hire Mexicans for less certainly don't charge less for their goods and services now that their costs are less.

There was no "before the invasion", at least in the west. As long as there has been large ag in the west, large growers have hired Mexicans to do the nasty work.

Your comment on employers hits at the root of the problem. Illegals are not the primary beneficiaries of the current system. The employers are. They get cheaper labor, don't pay into SS, Medicare, or Workers Comp. They don't pay for health insurance for their employees so when those employees get sick or injured, they go to the local ER and the taxpayers end up footing the bill. It is a classic case of privatizing profit and socializing risk.

 

[Eos]

Can you imagine the balls on a large ag business owner who files taxes each year on, say 500,000 acres and only paid taxes on $250,000 in labor?

 

[MmmSkyscraper]

Originally posted by: MagnusTheBrewer
It strikes me that the folks who argue for English as a national language in the U.S. haven't done much traveling.

That's cos they don't have enough maps.