Hillary Clinton win's election for Obama

[Napalm]

So several months ago, the pundits were all telling us that Hillary was giving McCain ammo by staying in the race and bringing up Ayers and Wright - she would destroy Obama...

Tonight I am watching the TV and all these lame ads come on TV attacking Obama and the pundits are talking about how the GOP negative ads never really seemed to have any legs...

Well why didn't they - in any other election the Ayers and Wright stuff would have been more than enough to bury a candidate - especially a black one with very little National experience.

Then it hits me between the eyes: 1) Hillary desensitized everyone to this material by bringing it out early, and repeating it often. 2) Was this part of the Democratic plan all along? How else does one explain her hanging on and attacking so strongly when it was mathematically impossible for her to win? Then falling into line so dramatically 8 weeks before the election.

I may be wrong on the latter, but I think the former is undeniable...

N

 

[nageov3t]

wish I cared enough to bump the Obamanaut posts calling for the wise and beautiful woman to drop out after super tuesday and how she was destroying the party

 

[Balt]

I don't think it was part of the plan all along, but it definitely did help as you say to get it all out there early.

 

[OneOfTheseDays]

Had McCain run those Rev. Wright ads months ago it would have had a much more damaging effect. Hillary had nothing to do with McCain's own campaign incompetence.

 

[Napalm]

Originally posted by: OneOfTheseDays
Had McCain run those Rev. Wright ads months ago it would have had a much more damaging effect. Hillary had nothing to do with McCain's own campaign incompetence.

Well - he ran the Ayers stuff much earlier and that had zero traction....

 

[Napalm]

Originally posted by: loki8481
wish I cared enough to bump the Obamanaut posts calling for the wise and beautiful woman to drop out after super tuesday and how she was destroying the party

Dude - where do you get off using a term like that in reference to a woman? Don't get me wrong, I hate Clinton for many, many valid reasons - but using the "c-word" is both sexist and ignorant... Grow up.

 

[evident]

Originally posted by: Napalm

Originally posted by: loki8481
wish I cared enough to bump the Obamanaut posts calling for the wise and beautiful woman to drop out after super tuesday and how she was destroying the party

Dude - where do you get off using a term like that in reference to a woman? Don't get me wrong, I hate Clinton for many, many valid reasons - but using the "c-word" is both sexist and ignorant... Grow up.

i think he was being sarcastic, in that alot of the obama supporters here were pretty pissed at hillary back then.,

 

[Vic]

McCain's problem was that negative campaigning only hurts your opponent's numbers. It does nothing to lift your own. That's where his campaign screwed up. Someone posted some data earlier today that showed that McCain's polling numbers have scarcely budged in 6 months.

 

[Moonbeam]

Hehe, you guys are out in a hay field in the wind grasping at straw. The Ayers Wright stuff was as big a steaming pile from Hillary as it was from McSame.
NOBODY, get that NOBODY with two brain cells to rub together gives a shit about that garbage. We have just been through 8 years of total disaster and the economy is in the shitter thanks to a gigantic moron named George Bush. 90% McFeces was doomed from the start. That senile old bastard and the Noob are a catastrophe waiting to happen.

Get Fvcking real. Republicans were a bunch of crooks and idiots and that's why you lose. You dropped your load in the toilet from miles in the air and a giant wave of your own bull shit is coming to bury you.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: OneOfTheseDays
Had McCain run those Rev. Wright ads months ago it would have had a much more damaging effect. Hillary had nothing to do with McCain's own campaign incompetence.

this x 6

 

[AstroManLuca]

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: OneOfTheseDays
Had McCain run those Rev. Wright ads months ago it would have had a much more damaging effect. Hillary had nothing to do with McCain's own campaign incompetence.

this x 6

Holy shit, I agree with JS80.

Yes, McCain's campaign was laughably incompetent. W's Swift Boat attacks on John Kerry were equally low-lifey but far more effective. I have a feeling McCain was rarely in the driver's seat, because he himself is a likable enough guy on his own that if the campaign truly reflected his own values he would have been much closer to Obama in the polls.

I'm still not sure he could have won even if his campaign had been managed well, but it would have been a much closer race if they had made better decisions. This may be one of the first times in history that the choice of a VP candidate could be legitimately blamed for costing the election.

 

[Siddhartha]

Originally posted by: Napalm
So several months ago, the pundits were all telling us that Hillary was giving McCain ammo by staying in the race and bringing up Ayers and Wright - she would destroy Obama...

Tonight I am watching the TV and all these lame ads come on TV attacking Obama and the pundits are talking about how the GOP negative ads never really seemed to have any legs...

Well why didn't they - in any other election the Ayers and Wright stuff would have been more than enough to bury a candidate - especially a black one with very little National experience.

Then it hits me between the eyes: 1) Hillary desensitized everyone to this material by bringing it out early, and repeating it often. 2) Was this part of the Democratic plan all along? How else does one explain her hanging on and attacking so strongly when it was mathematically impossible for her to win? Then falling into line so dramatically 8 weeks before the election.

I may be wrong on the latter, but I think the former is undeniable...

N

If talking about Wright or Ayers had connected with the voter, Mr Obama would not be the Democratic nominee of President.

 

[cubby1223]

Obama out-campaigned McCain by preemptively playing the race card.

And those who blame Palin - don't. Just about everyone who doesn't like Palin are those who were already in bed with Obama. She got screwed over in the Couric interview by their own campaign staff.

Really, blame the campaign staff. They did everything they possibly could to throw the election.

 

[cubby1223]

Originally posted by: Napalm

Originally posted by: OneOfTheseDays
Had McCain run those Rev. Wright ads months ago it would have had a much more damaging effect. Hillary had nothing to do with McCain's own campaign incompetence.

Well - he ran the Ayers stuff much earlier and that had zero traction....

If you ask most Obama supporters, I bet they *still* don't have any idea who Ayers is. Who covered the story outside of Fox News? That's why Ayers had no traction - few even knew about it.

 

[smack Down]

Originally posted by: cubby1223
Obama out-campaigned McCain by preemptively playing the race card.

And those who blame Palin - don't. Just about everyone who doesn't like Palin are those who were already in bed with Obama. She got screwed over in the Couric interview by their own campaign staff.

Really, blame the campaign staff. They did everything they possibly could to throw the election.

Right it is the campaign's staff that palin has never read a newspaper.

 

[smack Down]

Originally posted by: cubby1223

Originally posted by: Napalm

Originally posted by: OneOfTheseDays
Had McCain run those Rev. Wright ads months ago it would have had a much more damaging effect. Hillary had nothing to do with McCain's own campaign incompetence.

Well - he ran the Ayers stuff much earlier and that had zero traction....

If you ask most Obama supporters, I bet they *still* don't have any idea who Ayers is. Who covered the story outside of Fox News? That's why Ayers had no traction - few even knew about it.

The Ayers story got no traction because other then McCain few are old enough to remember the 60s

 

[AFMatt]

Obama will win because he has America snowed with talks of "change" without saying how exactly he will change things, and hopes of a welfare check made up of money taken from the rich (that check will of course be erased when the ones who see their taxes raised look for a place to makeup the losses.. ie higher prices, lower pay, fewer jobs).
The only real change we will see is the Democrats currently in office, who are some of the biggest crooks in government and played a large part in the housing market troubles, will have a President on their side. Once it's all said and done, all of our taxes will go up unless Obama has a magic wand that can produce the money he wants to spend on new programs.

McCain will lose because he is a Republican. Since Bush is a Republican and at fault for the financial crisis since he didn't babysit CEOs or something, and he couldn't force the Democrats to heed the warnings on Fannie and Freddie (McCain also tried, and was blocked by Dems), and the war in Iraq because he made all 374 "Aye" votes, that means McCain is like him. It's that guilt by association thing every Obama supporter tries to throw in people's faces when they bring up Ayers or Wright.

Should be an interesting 4 years...

 

[rchiu]

Originally posted by: AstroManLuca

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: OneOfTheseDays
Had McCain run those Rev. Wright ads months ago it would have had a much more damaging effect. Hillary had nothing to do with McCain's own campaign incompetence.

this x 6

Holy shit, I agree with JS80.

Yes, McCain's campaign was laughably incompetent. W's Swift Boat attacks on John Kerry were equally low-lifey but far more effective. I have a feeling McCain was rarely in the driver's seat, because he himself is a likable enough guy on his own that if the campaign truly reflected his own values he would have been much closer to Obama in the polls.

I'm still not sure he could have won even if his campaign had been managed well, but it would have been a much closer race if they had made better decisions. This may be one of the first times in history that the choice of a VP candidate could be legitimately blamed for costing the election.

Yeap, totally agree. McCain campaign is one of the worst I've seen. He couldn't decide which based he wanna run after, independents or conservatives and in the end, he tries both half heartedly. His VP tells the story exactly. I don't blame McCain for picking Palin, he has no choice if he wanna go after the conservative base. But the way their campaign handled her and not going after media hard for the negatives on her is just stupid. Plus there are even people who only supported Palin half heartedly in McCain's own campaign. Well, I guess if that's the case they should have gone with Lieberman in the first place and get it over with.

And agree on the Wright ad's. Who cares about Ayers, 99% of the people never heard of him. If McCain is serious about negative, he should have used Wright, together with Ayer, together with khalid. Obama has much deeper relationship with Wright, and Wright's problem has been well documented. Plus unlike Hillary Clinton, McCain don't have to worry about the black votes by going after Wright. Compare to swift boat, McCain's negative campaign is like a child's play, so pathetic he shouldn't even tried.

 

[cubby1223]

Originally posted by: smack Down

Originally posted by: cubby1223
Obama out-campaigned McCain by preemptively playing the race card.

And those who blame Palin - don't. Just about everyone who doesn't like Palin are those who were already in bed with Obama. She got screwed over in the Couric interview by their own campaign staff.

Really, blame the campaign staff. They did everything they possibly could to throw the election.

Right it is the campaign's staff that palin has never read a newspaper.

No. But it is the campaign staff's fault that for preparing her for her first interview on a big stage, tried to cram her with all the campaign talking points to recite, instead of letting her be herself and answer questions how she would like to. Not to mention they make the first big interview in a hostile environment where they in addition have no control over the editing process.

If the campaign had put her on Fox News first then Couric later, probably would have been a much difference public reaction. As much as the liberals like to condemned O'Reilly, he is the highest rated of all cable news programs and has a large base of central independents. While 30m were watching Obama's infomercial, 7m were watching the Factor, and even *fewer* people were watching Larry King where McCain was that night. :roll:

The McCain campaign strategists played right into Obama's hands by having them distance themselves as far as they could from Fox News.

 

[smack Down]

Originally posted by: cubby1223

Originally posted by: smack Down

Originally posted by: cubby1223
Obama out-campaigned McCain by preemptively playing the race card.

And those who blame Palin - don't. Just about everyone who doesn't like Palin are those who were already in bed with Obama. She got screwed over in the Couric interview by their own campaign staff.

Really, blame the campaign staff. They did everything they possibly could to throw the election.

Right it is the campaign's staff that palin has never read a newspaper.

No. But it is the campaign staff's fault that for preparing her for her first interview on a big stage, tried to cram her with all the campaign talking points to recite, instead of letting her be herself and answer questions how she would like to. Not to mention they make the first big interview in a hostile environment where they in addition have no control over the editing process.

If the campaign had put her on Fox News first then Couric later, probably would have been a much difference public reaction. As much as the liberals like to condemned O'Reilly, he is the highest rated of all cable news programs and has a large base of central independents. While 30m were watching Obama's infomercial, 7m were watching the Factor, and even *fewer* people were watching Larry King where McCain was that night. :roll:

The McCain campaign strategists played right into Obama's hands by having them distance themselves as far as they could from Fox News.

I don't know if anyone told you this before & million people doesn't win an election.

As much as I hate to say I bet even Fox news has more integrity then to let a guess edit their own interview.

Face it, Palin was a failure and anything else is just lipstick on a pig.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: cubby1223
Obama out-campaigned McCain by preemptively playing the race card.

And those who blame Palin - don't. Just about everyone who doesn't like Palin are those who were already in bed with Obama. She got screwed over in the Couric interview by their own campaign staff.

Really, blame the campaign staff. They did everything they possibly could to throw the election.

You're dead wrong on Palin. I, and many other of my 3rd party friends didn't give a sht about either candidate until Palin opened her mouth (we were going to vote Baldwin). That was the turning point, no way in HELL will that dipsht ever be near the White House if I can do something about it by voting.

 

[Bowfinger]

Originally posted by: cubby1223
If you ask most Obama supporters, I bet they *still* don't have any idea who Ayers is. Who covered the story outside of Fox News? That's why Ayers had no traction - few even knew about it.

Nonsense. Nobody besides right-wing partisans cares about the Ayers "story" because there is no story. McCain/Fox wallowed in that puddle for months, but despite all their zeal and noisy splashing, they never could come up with any real mud to sling. All they had was a lot of empty innuendo.

 

[midway]

Originally posted by: cubby1223

Originally posted by: Napalm

Originally posted by: OneOfTheseDays
Had McCain run those Rev. Wright ads months ago it would have had a much more damaging effect. Hillary had nothing to do with McCain's own campaign incompetence.

Well - he ran the Ayers stuff much earlier and that had zero traction....

If you ask most Obama supporters, I bet they *still* don't have any idea who Ayers is. Who covered the story outside of Fox News? That's why Ayers had no traction - few even knew about it.

The reason Ayers had no traction is that it is a connection that is almost entirely fabricated. Not to mention that it was for a board of an organization funded by someone who John McCain trumpets as a supporter. It's hard to make "It's okay for me but not for him" stories stick when there is easily identifiable duplicity.

 

[StageLeft]

Who knows, but yeah things like this have a tendency to peter out and in this case nobody cared about wright or ayers later on, it was all old news. If this had all been kept secret but come out exactly a month ago, obama's numbers would have been destroyed.

 

[Bowfinger]

Originally posted by: loki8481
wish I cared enough to bump the Obamanaut posts calling for the wise and beautiful woman to drop out after super tuesday and how she was destroying the party

She did cause tremendous damage, some of which lingers to this day (e.g., bitter people like you who still trash Obama every chance you get). In spite of that, the party did a good job of putting itself back together. Hillary played a key role in that, much to my surprise, by making what appeared to be a sincere effort to pull her supporters back in and align them behind Obama. She deserves kudos for that.