Holy cow... so I checked out Tesla S in person today, I had no idea.

[Insomniator]

In one or two more generations, people won't have any attachment to old combustion engines and they will seem like ridiculous ancient technology.

I love the sounds, feelings, vibrations, scents etc of normal cars but the Tesla is a flat screen TV emerging from a world of CRT's. A complete replacement once costs are down.

 

[Scarpozzi]

I'm just waiting to see what happens when it rains on these things. I'm no rocket scientist, but water and electricity don't mix....and it's hard to drive safely when you're actively being shocked.

 

[zoiks]

I'm just waiting to see what happens when it rains on these things. I'm no rocket scientist, but water and electricity don't mix....and it's hard to drive safely when you're actively being shocked.

Wut?

 

[mmntech]

In one or two more generations, people won't have any attachment to old combustion engines and they will seem like ridiculous ancient technology.

I love the sounds, feelings, vibrations, scents etc of normal cars but the Tesla is a flat screen TV emerging from a world of CRT's. A complete replacement once costs are down.

It will be a while yet. There's basically two types of EVs out there.

1) Cars like the Model S. They're built for the luxury market. Get comparable range to petrol cars in their class. But at a very high price. The Model S starts at $70k+, which is more than a BMW M3. Yes, there's almost no maintenance cost but its still out of reach for a big chunk of car buyers

2) Semi-affordable city runabouts that get about 60-80mi of range. It's good enough for short in-town hops but not for regular commuting on the highway. Especially since most businesses won't have charging outlets available. Commuters tend to make up the bulk of car buyers though, where city folk prefer to take transit rather than own a car. These EVs also tend to cost double what a comparably equipped petrol cars costs. The iMIEV for example costs $10k more than the Prius C in Canada. That's 10 years worth of gas for the Prius according to the EPA. Fuel prices just aren't high enough to make the economically viable.

Unless there's a huge spike in gas prices, or there's a quantum leap in battery technology, EV adoption will be gradual. Lithium used in EV batteries is difficult and costly to mine. Plus China holds much of the world's supply. Batteries are the biggest cost of producing EVs and hybrids.

There's been talk of swappable packs. Drive up to a station that just puts a new one in. Which I don't think would work on the real world as you'd need standardized battery packs for all cars. Which ain't gonna happen.

I'm hearing promising things with graphene super capacitors. I think that will be the future, though they're still in the prototype stage yet. If they get them doing as promised, it will be a fundamental game changer in the automotive industry. Cheap, clean vehicles that can charge as fast as it takes to fill a gas tank.

 

[Kaido]

1) Cars like the Model S. They're built for the luxury market. Get comparable range to petrol cars in their class. But at a very high price. The Model S starts at $70k+, which is more than a BMW M3. Yes, there's almost no maintenance cost but its still out of reach for a big chunk of car buyers

The downside is that maintenance on the Teslas is a pain. Not only in terms of places to get it fixed, but also in fees. It used to be a required $600-per-year fee for maintenance in order to keep the warranty intact, but they recently changed that:

http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/creating-world’s-best-service-and-warranty-program-0

More details here:

http://www.teslamotors.com/service#/service-plans

However, like in my state (Connecticut), we don't even have an authorized maintenance facility yet. They're building one down in Milford near the Supercharger station, but that's a 100-mile round-trip from Hartford, which is about an hour and a half of driving. They do have a valet service where they pickup & drop off your car and give you a loaner. Or you can pay for a guy to come out (a "ranger") and do maintenance on it, for a fee. The $600 charge is kind of ridiculous though. That covers the annual inspection, or every 12,500 miles, and only includes the following:

1. Replacement parts like brake pads and windshield wipers (excluding tires)
2. 24-hour roadside assistance
3. System monitoring
4. Remote diagnostics
5. Hardware upgrades

So really, $600/year for brake pads (which take forever to wear out because it mostly relies on the regenerative system & so they hardly wear down IRL) & wiper blades ($20?). Plus if you get in a fender-bender or other kind of accident, you can't just run it down to any old shop in town since the infrastructure just isn't there. And you still have to pay for your own tires! So really, it's a nice illusion, but from reading about service experiences on the Tesla forums, it can be even more of a hassle to get it worked on than a regular ICE car. I mean, I can take my Honda Civic anywhere to get gas, an oil change, repairs, and service. And it's not like getting service is a headache - it only takes 5 minutes to fill up with gas once a week, and 15 or 20 minutes to do an oil change & tire rotation. You still have to do tire rotations on the Tesla too!

 

[The Boston Dangler]

Lithium Ion Batteries - Nail Penetration Test youtube video.

Just a data point.

Uno

a data point out of context is bullshit. how about "gasoline - lit match test" as a data point?

what's happening inside the battery is the nail shorting the anode and electrode, causing the cell to release hydrogen, which is ignited by the short. a non-conductive penetrator would likely not cause a fire.

i've attended rc car races with 400 participants, each charging several lithium-polymer batteries, close to 2000 total. these are high-performance batteries rated 7.4 - 14.8V, 300A is average but now the new ones hit 700A. there's usually 1 fire, and it's always caused by the owner:

a) intentional overcharging
b) prolonged external short
c) reverse polarity
d) improper installation, damage, and re-use

why so many li-po fires in consumer electronics? 1. what % of them are actually burning with no fault of the owner? 2. they are built down to a price.

 

[MagickMan]

Yup, waiting for the new midrange model in a few years. Should be fun!

*whisper* Psstt... 18 months, but you didn't hear it from me. :whiste:


I couldn't wait though, so I ordered an S a few weeks ago. Right now I'm looking at a Dec 15 delivery. Merry Xmas!

Edit: Oh, and they'll try to get you to lease the battery pack, make sure to do that. Get the "big mofo" warranty/service deal too, it's ~$4Gs and gives you B2B for 120k miles. You essentially could do absolutely nothing to it, except plug it in to charge. It covers everything.

 

[Kaido]

I couldn't wait though, so I ordered an S a few weeks ago. Right now I'm looking at a Dec 15 delivery. Merry Xmas!

Seriously?! What options did you go with? I demand pics & a review upon arrival! :awe:

 

[natto fire]

I'm just waiting to see what happens when it rains on these things. I'm no rocket scientist, but water and electricity don't mix....and it's hard to drive safely when you're actively being shocked.

I hope you are just stretching sarcasm, or you are really underselling your low intelligence. If you are serious they probably considered rain when designing it.

 

[bigi]

Tesla now the most-registered new car in eight of the nation’s 25 wealthiest neighborhoods tracked by zip code

 

[EagleKeeper]

In one or two more generations, people won't have any attachment to old combustion engines and they will seem like ridiculous ancient technology.

I love the sounds, feelings, vibrations, scents etc of normal cars but the Tesla is a flat screen TV emerging from a world of CRT's. A complete replacement once costs are down.

Look how long it took to remove the horse/buggy from the public (with the exception of certain communities)

 

[phucheneh]

I caught part of the Tesla 'review' on [American] Top Gear last night.

Am I the only one that's noticed that their [very occasional] car review segments are 1) always entirely positive and 2) always American cars?

Tesla kicking some money at those guys means they must really be trying to step it up.

 

[hanoverphist]

got one in my friends shop a while ago for a tint job. damn, they are sexy looking. and the tech features are amazing! the whole console is a huge monitor, full control of all the cars features from there. the owner even shared with us that he knew when the car was done since he saw it parked out front instead of in the back of the shop on the gps. good thing we didnt give in to the temptation of drag racing it in the back lot. if i had the cash, id get one. even if it did have a chance at exploding.

 

[Vetterin]

I hope you are just stretching sarcasm, or you are really underselling your low intelligence. If you are serious they probably considered rain when designing it.

I would image that flood damage....especially along the coast, would render that car useless.

 

[phucheneh]

If anything, the electronics of the Tesla are probably less complex than a modern ICE. Surely less complex than a newer BMW or Mercedes in the same pricerange.

The difference would obviously be in the high-voltage system, which is itself not all that complicated. It's a battery, some big cables, some motors, and hardware/software to manage it.

The reason most cars' electronics can survive floods surprisingly well is due to a) a relatively low-voltage electrical system and b) a lack of 'switched on' parts when the car is parked and shut down. Obviously, if the car is running, the engine is highly likely to get smoked, anyway, so the majority of your resold flood cars are just stuff that was sitting locked in parking lots when the water came.

[/pure speculation]

Just saying that depending on the design, an electric car might defy the 'obvious' initial thought that water is its worst enemy. I can't say I'd be sad about 100% of submersion victims being sent straight to the recycler, though. The resilience of most cars is nothing but a boon to the scam-artists that resell them.

 

[Kaido]

If anything, the electronics of the Tesla are probably less complex than a modern ICE. Surely less complex than a newer BMW or Mercedes in the same pricerange.

The difference would obviously be in the high-voltage system, which is itself not all that complicated. It's a battery, some big cables, some motors, and hardware/software to manage it.

The reason most cars' electronics can survive floods surprisingly well is due to a) a relatively low-voltage electrical system and b) a lack of 'switched on' parts when the car is parked and shut down. Obviously, if the car is running, the engine is highly likely to get smoked, anyway, so the majority of your resold flood cars are just stuff that was sitting locked in parking lots when the water came.

[/pure speculation]

Just saying that depending on the design, an electric car might defy the 'obvious' initial thought that water is its worst enemy. I can't say I'd be sad about 100% of submersion victims being sent straight to the recycler, though. The resilience of most cars is nothing but a boon to the scam-artists that resell them.

I'm curious as to why Tesla has all the crazy electronics but they don't have a lot of the newer advanced features, i.e. Around-View Camera, lane watch, pedestrian braking, automatic parallel parking, etc. You'd think that as the world's most advanced electric car, you'd want to pimp it out with some more tech goodies...I mean, they just barely added power folding mirrors as an option

 

[MagickMan]

Seriously?! What options did you go with? I demand pics & a review upon arrival! :awe:

Pics will be incoming when it arrives.

I'm curious as to why Tesla has all the crazy electronics but they don't have a lot of the newer advanced features, i.e. Around-View Camera, lane watch, pedestrian braking, automatic parallel parking, etc. You'd think that as the world's most advanced electric car, you'd want to pimp it out with some more tech goodies...I mean, they just barely added power folding mirrors as an option

They've been working hard just to perfect what they've got, for now (and doing a great job of it). But the relationships they're building with Mercedes and GM will be key for them down the road, when they start adding that type of technology.

----------------------

Tesla haters just crack me up, looking for any little thing to criticize and blame. Calm down, there's plenty of room them in the global car market.

 

[Kaido]

Pics will be incoming when it arrives.

Wow congrats!! A guy down the street from me has a white one - I've never been a huge fan of white, but it looks amazingly sharp on the Model S. I'd like to keep it low-key, so probably the dark grey for me, even though the pearl-coat red looks amazing :awe: Gotta wait for the AWD model though, haha!

 

[Leyawiin]

A few more charging stations and the areas of the state I travel will be covered. If they can come out with a model that is about two thirds the cost of the current ones I'd bite.

 

[vi edit]

I'm curious as to why Tesla has all the crazy electronics but they don't have a lot of the newer advanced features, i.e. Around-View Camera, lane watch, pedestrian braking, automatic parallel parking, etc. You'd think that as the world's most advanced electric car, you'd want to pimp it out with some more tech goodies...I mean, they just barely added power folding mirrors as an option

The coding, testing and legal work behind those has to be staggering. And for what gain? I really doubt they are losing sales because the car doesn't park itself. They have a uniqueness that BMW or Mercedes doesn't have and do not need to one up the competition with gadgets like that right now.

 

[jaedaliu]

Pics will be incoming when it arrives.

I'm impressed. I guess when you have money, it's easy to check all the boxes for options. (guess you didn't get 3rd row seats or a shelf)

 

[MagickMan]

I'm impressed. I guess when you have money, it's easy to check all the boxes for options. (guess you didn't get 3rd row seats or a shelf)

Well, it kind of snowballed into that. At first we were going for the regular 85kWh but were told it would add 2 months to the delivery because "they aren't building any right now due to demand for the Performance model". So we said okay, which secretly made me happy so I didn't fuss very much, and by then if you're spending that much, you reason that you might as well get all the options you want... it takes on a life of its own by that point. :\ We were going to get a BMW or Merc estate, maybe even a Cayenne, but the Model S has nearly as much storage space and looks 10x better.

Wow congrats!! A guy down the street from me has a white one - I've never been a huge fan of white, but it looks amazingly sharp on the Model S. I'd like to keep it low-key, so probably the dark grey for me, even though the pearl-coat red looks amazing :awe: Gotta wait for the AWD model though, haha!

The Mrs wanted the pearl white, and up close it really is stunning to see.

 

[jagec]

hm.. what happns if u get in a car accident and crack the battery panel?
game over? buy another Tesla S?

Probably. What happens when you get into a car accident in a normal car and crack the engine block/bend the frame?

Major accidents lead to totaled cars, gas or electric.

I don't really understand the FUD that surrounds electric. Mass-market hybrids have been on the road for over a decade, and they have all of the potential issues AND complexity of both gas and electric...but they have been safe and reliable so far. Why should an all-electric car be any different?

Well, it kind of snowballed into that. At first we were going for the regular 85kWh but were told it would add 2 months to the delivery because "they aren't building any right now due to demand for the Performance model". So we said okay, which secretly made me happy so I didn't fuss very much, and by then if you're spending that much, you reason that you might as well get all the options you want...

There is nothing more sad than buying a base-model luxury car.

 

[ballmode]

One of the safest cars ever too

 

[bigi]

I would image that flood damage....especially along the coast, would render that car useless.

Really? Do we have geniuses forum you can join?

Your statement would be ... 'as opposed to ICE cars' which do survive flooding perfectly fine?