HOME THEATER: Component Search

[Muadib]

This won't work because it all pretty much comes down to your budget. I've heard a htib that was bought in a CVS drugstore for $90. I thought it sounded pretty good for something under $100, and told my mom that she should get one.

 

[JulesMaximus]

The trouble with this is that most people who have cheap equipment will likely not have the foundation to give you good advice. Think about it. If you ask 100 people and 50 of them have crappy Bose systems but they love Bose because they paid a lot of money for it and it sounded good in the store but you found that out of the other 50 people maybe 10 have actually done some research into the matter and found various other brands that when combined with the right receiver/amp will sound really really good, who are you going to believe? Unfortunately, majority rules. Bose counts on this and marketing.

BTW-I've done zero research into the HTIB systems because they were really just coming into vogue after I spent thousands on my setup. I'd be willing to bet that a $1k HTIB system can't compare to my setup and I'd bet good money that a comparably priced Bose system sounds like sh!t in a can compared to my setup.

 

[Sketcher]

Originally posted by: Muadib
This won't work because it all pretty much comes down to your budget.

What won't work? Discussing what people have done, would do differently or wish they hadn't done at all? Certainly it comes down to budget and that's why being informed is crucial here. Finding out what some of us have done and have experienced can go a long way toward helping those of us starting out make good initial decisions. There's excellent input in this thread and I appreciate everyone who takes the time to share their HT experience regardless of whether it comes from a low end or high-end perspective. As long as we discuss detail, it's all good.

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Unfortunately, majority rules.

Jules, this sentiment about the ignorant masses is true for the ignorant masses. If there's one thing AT is good at it's calling BS, and there's usually someone close by who can delineate the facts. In the above posts I don't find any market induced hype, no ignorance. I find good discussion derived from personal experience. THAT's exactly the goal here; equitable discussion on what each of us knows and would like to know.

My OP contains enough detail and information that if it's actually read, one can understand that this is a quest for experience and detail; directly addressing the lack of information or mis-information that is so abundant. It's gotta start somewhere.

So why don't we continue the excellent posts above with you posting your experience with the gear you've chosen? Other threads have beat the Bose issue to death. I'm interested in your gear and your experience. Sounds like you have a system worth listening to.

 

[Muadib]

Oh, you just want a list on what people have. It's been done before, many times in fact, but here's mine.

Rotel rmb1075
Rotel rsp1066
Directivo series2
Samsung sir-ts160
Panasonic dvd-97s
Panasonic ae700u projector
Five Paradigm Studio 20 speakers
HSU vtf-2 subwoofer

 

[Sketcher]

Originally posted by: amx
I have been in the HT market for quite some time now. I have 3 setups in my house and none of them have been HTIB. THough, there are quite a few good HTIB setups outthere.

amx, would you mind posting your gear and reasoning? Much interested in what you've done.

Originally posted by: Muadib
Oh, you just want a list on what people have.

Well, it's a start. but if you read my posts I'm asking for detail as to why you've chosen the gear you have and what you'd do differently knowing what you do now. You're right, it's been done many times... the difference is that I'm asking for actual experience and relevant discussion sans brand bashing and link lobbing. I want to know what AND why you've chosen the gear you have; which by your links (thanks for taking the time to link them btw) it'd be interesting to hear your story. Some killer stuff you've listed... got a total price tag you'd be willing to divulge?

 

[nsafreak]

Nice setup you have there Muadib, not very often that you see nice Rotel equipment posted here on the boards. Way out of my price range now but worth consideration some point in the future.

Sketcher, what would help us the most is some kind of price range. It is possible to put together a nice non HTIB system for most price points although there is a point below which the budget cannot drop and have a person expect a nice setup still. While a lot of us have more personal experience with our own equipment a lot of us know friends with different equipment and some people (like myself) frequently audition other pieces of equipment while we're buying. It would also help to know what you plan on using the setup for the most. Do you watch a lot of TV or is most of your viewing movies?

Since you asked for it in a previous post I'll let you know why I've bought some of what I've bought. The Harman Kardon was bought after reading a lot of different reviews and looking for various receivers in my price range. I listened to Onkyo, Yamaha, and Pioneer receivers in a nice sound enviroment that I could get as close to as possible to the enviroment I had to work with. While the other ones sounded nice I just liked the quality of sound that I got out of the Harman Kardon over the other brands that I listened to along with the nice thorough set of hookups on the back of the unit. Those things coupled along with H/K's great reputation in the industry and nice warranty sold me on that unit.

For the subwoofer it was pretty much the same process. I had listened to subwoofers from JL Audio, Sony, Velodyne and while I hadn't actually auditioned one I was considering Hsu Research subwoofers. I decided on the Paradigm PDR-10 that I got because I just liked the clean bass with a nice thump that came with it over the other subwoofers that I had listened to in similar enviroments.

The other speakers are just placeholders more than anything else that I got inexpensively and will tide me over until I get some Paradigm Cinema speakers.

 

[Sketcher]

Originally posted by: nsafreak
Sketcher, what would help us the most is some kind of price range.

Good points you've mentioned; thanks for asking - I'll quote just your first line as reference.

I'm comfortable in spending a total of $1,000 this year (total package sans tv). I have a smallish space 13'L x 10'W x 8'H and my family watches a lot of movies, plays a lot of music ( a little bit of everything). I'm patient and am interested in building my system piece by piece; but I'm not opposed to going HTIB if it's a good foundation with room to grow.

I started out just looking for the best $500.00 package deal and quickly realized that I'm really just starting at $800.00 if I want to begin with gear that I won't be replacing too quickly. Who knows. I might be tickled pink for years with a carefully chosen HTIB. I'm not an audiophile or discerning listener by any stretch of the imagination. I just don't like the idea of buying cheap stuff or regretting a hasty decision to just 'get by'.

But, for those with a $500.00 - $600.00 cap, if there's a solidly recommended system I'm sure it'd be of significant interest. And, I might find myself back in that range if I decide to plunk more dough into photography instead...

 

[bozack]

if you want cheap, easy, with no thought in the purchase I have heard the Onkyo is the best of the bunch for the money...the Sony's, Panasonics, Yamahas, KLH and many others all suck compared to the Onkyo and either cost only a little less or in some cases a good deal more....


general concensus is that building your own is your best route, however often times to compete with the price of the Onkyo "audiophiles" suggest building a stereo system first and then upgrading to 5.1 or by buying used/refurb parts for the system...imho kind of defeats trying to compete with the audio as your either not getting 5.1 or you are getting used/refurb stuff.

only bad I have heard about the Onkyo is that the center chanel sucks and voices aren't that clear.

 

[bozack]

Originally posted by: Sketcher
I personally like the satelite/sub configuration (space consideration) but I want to avoid the lack of dynamic range or 'missing' frequencies issues some complain about. Who knows, mabye I can't tell the difference. But on the satelite front, I've been looking at these: http://www.orbaudio.com/

Any opinions?

The orbs are reportedely a better alternative to Bose (also check out the Keff eggs) but still suffer from the same inadequacies that all small speakers suffer from...basically they cannot compete in terms of sound reproduction as larger bookshelfs can and many audiophiles dismiss small speakers because of this limitation....again anything that does not have at least a 5 1/4 driver is often looked down on by audiophiles. Personally I question just how much better the orbs sound than the Polk or even Bose systems given the speakers are just as small...the only difference is the true subwoofer which might make a difference in the amount of bass but you will still have a large frequency gap that the small speakers cannot fill, plus the price is on par with the Bose and I believe higher than the Polk, personally I feel audiophiles only enjoy this brand because they give polk and bose competition but I haven't talked to many who actually own or would own this system.

If you truly want a smaller system you should really check out the HSU research Ventriloquist system, the 5.1 setup is only $129.99 now at Compusa and the Sub I believe is about $400 supposedly sounds great.

 

[NTB]

I am building my own small HT system right now; At this point I've got everything *except* for all of the speakers. Right now I have:

Samsung 27" TV
Onkyo TX-SR501 reciever
Sony 300-disc CD changer
Toshiba single-disc DVD player (forget the model #)
a pair of cheapo Sony floorstanding speakers (3-way: 8" woofer, 3" midrange, 1" tweeter - what can I say? I needed some speakers in a hurry, and didn't have the money for the ones I wanted.)

So far everything works great. The only other *big* thing I plan on doing is replacing those sonys (and getting the rest of the surround speakers, eventually) with Athena Audition ASF-1s or ASF-2s; these seem to be the some of the best "bang-for-the-buck" speakers available. I'm open to suggestions in the same price-range, though.

Nate

 

[Apex]

It all comes out to budget, your woodworking skills (and spare time), and your own preference.

This being said, there still are HTIB's that are a waste of money, especially compared to other, better, cheaper, HTIB's (or even separates).

 

[Sketcher]

Originally posted by: Apex
It all comes out to budget, your woodworking skills (and spare time), and your own preference.

Heh heh..... Apex, not goin' the carpenter route - though I've enjoyed your pics . Room is finished. HT is an afterthought. Most I'll be doing is wall mounting speakers if I don't go w/stands and pulling up some carpet to lay some cabling. Receiver, Speakers, Stands and Cabling for about a grand would be the budget.

 

[bozack]

Originally posted by: Sketcher

It all comes out to budget, your woodworking skills (and spare time), and your own preference.

Heh heh..... Apex, not goin' the carpenter route - though I've enjoyed your pics . Room is finished. HT is an afterthought. Most I'll be doing is wall mounting speakers if I don't go w/stands and pulling up some carpet to lay some cabling. Receiver, Speakers, Stands and Cabling for about a grand would be the budget.

[/quote]

Well to be honest you are in the same boat as I am and unless you plan on getting refurb or used equipment then don't expect to get an "audiophile" grade system for that budget...

Again, for $600 or so the HSU system is supposedly really nice and has a fuller sound than most micro systems, but position is key. I myself am not a fan of speaker stands and or towers and prefer wall mount, but some of the bookshelves on stands look ok....for under a grand that Onkyo HTIB is definately doable with stands and everything...most everything else is going to cost you at least $600 for speakers alone, about $300 for the reciever and that is even a budget model, and then another $50-100 in various cables not to mention at least $100 for stands possibly even upwards of $300 depending on what you want.

 

[Sketcher]

Yeah bozack, adding up the list it gets up to 1k pretty quick. I set a budget cap and then just when I think I can squeek it all in I ask myself if I'll be happy with the equipment two years down the road... then I start all over. I have a much easier time of being comfortable with the options if I put it in the $1,500 - $2,000 range. I think I'm deciding to step just a little away from the 'micro' sats like the eggs and orbs and go with Paradigm Cinema 90 CT's or similar... (though reading up on the HSU Vents you mentioned... wow, good reviews).

EDIT of the EDIT - As good as some of the micro sats are, I think I'm solidly into 5.25" (not 4.5") driver territory. Whatever that means.

I don't so much like speaker stands either (at least not with limited space, and kids around) but I'm also not excited about cables running up walls and I'm not interested in chopping up our newly finished basement..

 

[bozack]

Originally posted by: Sketcher
Yeah bozack, adding up the list it gets up to 1k pretty quick. I set a budget cap and then just when I think I can squeek it all in I ask myself if I'll be happy with the equipment two years down the road... then I start all over. I have a much easier time of being comfortable with the options if I put it in the $1,500 - $2,000 range. I think I'm deciding to step just a little away from the 'micro' sats like the eggs and orbs and go with Paradigm Cinema 90 CT's or similar... (though reading up on the HSU Vents you mentioned... wow, good reviews).

EDIT - As good as some of the micro sats are, I think I'm solidly into 4.5" driver territory. Whatever that means.

I don't so much like speaker stands either (at least not with limited space, and kids around) but I'm also not excited about cables running up walls and I'm not interested in chopping up our newly finished basement..

you really need 5 1/4" drivers for accurate sound reproduction...with the cable issue it is fairly easy to conceal wires going up walls if you really want to, I know HomeDepot sells platic wire enclosures which you stick to your wall with double sided tape, they look like a long box and if you run it near a corner or what not then you put your wires into them...either way you go wires are a pita. Good luck.

 

[Goosemaster]

This is "the way it works"

Either you get a HTIB or or a setup that will provide you with a minimal version of what you need IMMEDIATELY, or you buy it by parts and get something better in the end.

1st step of the "good way"

-AMP or Receiver
-front two speakers

2nd step
-Amp or reciever (if you have one and the other is still required)
-subwoofer

3rd step
-surround speakers
-center channel speaker


Thats it...instead of buying a HTIB, I had to wait a considerably longer amount of time to get something better, but as time passed, I would pass each step, get "new" stuff on the way, and the system would get better and better.....it has been an enthusiasts paradise.....which still isn;t over....

<--needs to save u pto buy good durround speakers one day,

 

[Goosemaster]

DP

 

[Sketcher]

bozack, good mention on the cable runs. How the speakers are mounted and cables run will at this point be a 'Wife' decision. All I care about is getting the gear. She'll be the one who influences how it all looks.

Originally posted by: Goosemaster
This is "the way it works"

You're probably right Goosemaster , but I'm both patient and impatient at the same time ! I won't go the cheap route just to get by; I'm willing to wait and save the money to buy good stuff. On the other hand, once I start spending I'm going to want to have 80% of the kit up and running right off. I'm better off if I just save up the whole ball of wax and buy in when I get there. I'll be in the $1,500 ballpark in two months, which gives me plenty of time to learn up and iron out components. Of course 'Life' will probably happen and funds will go to something like a vehicle transmission, kids clothing, food, etc...

*Ugh.... just remembered I ordered a Dell 2100fp. Hmm, that would have bought me a pretty nice HT Receiver and a speaker or two... Gotta be careful about unnecessary expenditures for a while. Starbucks (X), Eating out (X), Eating in general (x).

BTW Goose, what have you purchased thus far?

 

[Sketcher]

So far, I?m considering:

1. Harman Kardon AVR 335 ($467)
I was originally considering the 235 but I want the EZSetup+ and it never hurts to have a little more wattage. I don?t know that I?ll use the Second Zone thingy but ya never know. Anyway, a $110 difference between the 235 and 335 at this point is moot if the setup function operates as advertised.

2. Paradigm Cinema Series 90CT ($650)
Many, solid reviews on the Paradigm Cinema series with a nod to edging into Audiophile territory. The only reconsideration is that I might opt for a different sub, but that?s based more on what experienced reviewers have noted rather than what I might be able to discern. nsafreak, I was considering the AVR 235 and Cinema 70 CT?s before you joined in, but comparing the specs ? I?m comfortable spending the money on the exact models you?ve linked. Neat stuff.

3. Cables

*So, everything from this point on uses the HK and Paradigm items as a performance and cost reference.

Any suggestions to consider other equipment?

 

[conjur]

I wouldn't mind having whatever BMW puts in their 745Li with the DVD system. WOW! A friend of mine just got a new 745Li and the sound on that thing is awesome!

Too bad the screen is so small, though.

 

[Stark]

i think we need a forum for HT/HTPCs. it seems to be a focus of the site and there's not really a forum to discuss it.

personally it bought a DTS yamaha reciever with jbl satellites/sub about 3-4 years ago. My latest project is hooking my PC up to the system and playing with MCE. From what I've seen of HTIB kits, I would have been screwed if I wanted to replace/upgrade the DVD player or wanted to hook up anything external with a spdif cable.

 

[Skiguy411]

For some excellent prices on JBL(my personal favorite) check out bestpriceaudiovideo I have ordered from the twice and had no problems. Also I believe they have some HK stuff there too

 

[Fandu]

If your looking for bang for your buck, than IMO Fluance is the best by far. Check out the reviews -
AV-HTB ($199) - Review
AV-STB ($260) - Review

 

[lancestorm]

H/K AVR630 (upgraded DSP and CPU last weekend)
5 Klipsch RF-3II speakers
Panasonic DVD-s97

If your budget is $700 on up, then do NOT go HTIB. Build slowly. $500 - 700 range think about it carefully. Under $500 fahgetaboutit and get a HTIB.

 

[Sketcher]

I appreciate the equipment references. Have me some more reading to do!

Thanks everyone.

Edited &amp; Updated OP with budget ranges. If anyone has a better 'range' to reference LMK. I just used my personal exodus in putting that one up.