Question hostapd + 6E = new M2 (WCN6856) $58

[Tech Junky]

So, having run hostapd in the past and using internal cards to do so this is a nice option to see finally. Taking this card and putting it into a PC or PI gives you 6E AP functionality for a fraction of the price of a 6E router / AP.

View attachment 40873

https://novotech.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/WMX7205-Datasheet_v0.1.5.pdf

Emwicon Modems

Novotech distributes leading lines of Emwicon cellular modems and gateways. Some of the more popular lines of Emwicon products we carry include: Wi-Fi 6 Modules mPCIe Wi-Fi 6 (2.4 GHz) Modules M.2 Wi-Fi 6 Modules with Bluetooth mPCIe Wi-Fi 6 Modules with Bluetooth WI-Fi 5 Modules mPCIe Wi-Fi 5...

novotech.com

The only issue is shipping costs being ~$42 for a single card or $50 for 2... shipping rates from CA based on cart total.

Sparklan WNFQ-268AXI(BT) 802.11ax/ac/a/b/g/n Industrial Capable Tri-band WiFi Combo, M.2 2230 (E KEY) Module (WiFi 6), Qualcomm, 2T2R

Sparklan WNFQ-268AXI(BT) 802.11ax/ac/a/b/g/n Industrial Capable Tri-band WiFi Combo, M.2 2230 (E KEY) Module (WiFi 6), Qualcomm, 2T2R

www.524wifi.com

Same card from a tech standpoint higher per unit @ $70/ea but, free shipping. (on backorder status)

$100/1
$166/2

or

$70/1
$140/2

There's also a 4x4 module in hmPCIE format for $99 that would work in an older laptop or with a PCI adapter in a desktop/server setup. QCN9074

Also, a 6 not 6E option for desktop / server use $70 using a MediaTek chipset - MT7915 - mPCIE

 

[Fallen Kell]

I have seen very little reason for WiFi 6E personally (or WiFi 6 for that matter). Mainly because the 6GHz bands penetrate walls and objects even worse than the 5GHz bands. You are lucky to get through one set of interior walls with 6GHz. Unless you are putting a AP in almost every other room in your home, you won't really see the performance benefits.

That said, this might be one of the few ways to get enough WiFi 6E AP's around the house without spending thousands of dollars....

 

[Tech Junky]

@Fallen Kell

Well, I'm using a NWA210AX AP currently and cover 1300 sq ft corner to corner w/ 5ghz just fine. 6ghz isn't that big of a leap when it comes to spectrum / penetration.

For construction I have drywall / steel studs in the walls. I could see it being more of an issue if you lined your walls with foil and blocked the signals but, even out on the patio w/ brick in between it still works fine.

 

[Fallen Kell]

The steel studs are probably part of why you have coverage. Not sure in your case but at least around here metal studs usually means 24" inch on center, so 25% fewer studs in the wall. Also the cross section of material that the signal is trying to penetrate is much lower with metal studs since they are usually only 2mm thick (that said metal usually presents a more difficult material for the signals to penetrate).

I am very surprised that you have coverage through brick. Are you sure your devices are not changing over to 2.4Ghz? Brick usually causes 15db or more of signal loss at 5GHz. Please remember that this is a log scale, so every 3db is a loss of 1/2 signal. So a -15db loss is effectively 1/32 the signal you had before the loss.

Also, I'm not making up these numbers off the top of my head. These have been studied by NIST to see the effects of different building materials on WiFi signals in the 5GHz bands.

 

[Tech Junky]

I'm not getting that bogged down by the technicalities of wall composition or measuring the db changes through the different materials. I'm fully covered and the signal in any given part of the area is 80%+ on the wifi meter on my phone.

The signal originates from the AP located approximately in the center of the space. Keeping in mind no 2 spaces match 100% it's possible what works for me won't work for you. Also, relying on automatic channels selections and not tuning to your specific environment is a good source of failure. Letting the device pick the channel results in a lot of channel hopping in contention with other broadcasts and lower speeds / coverage.

I use a wifi analyzer app to figure out what's around me and narrow down the channel options and test them for performance before locking down the best option on each band. For 2.4G the best channel for me is 8. For 6G it's 40 on a 160mhz bandwidth which yields ~1.3gbps with spikes higher occasionally.

From Laptop <> Speedtest


From DIY server <> Speedtest (wired directly)


My speeds vary depending on which VPN server I'm connected to as well as everything is routed through one 24/7 using Nord / Wire Guard.

 

[Tech Junky]

Dug into the options a little deeper this time and found some oddities and some other decent options

single bands	Wallys DR9074	4T4R	MMCX	4x4	QCN9074/9024	M.2 E	HE160	$95.00
not 6E	WPEQ-405AX	4T4R	MHF1	4x4	QCN9074/9024	MINI PCIE	HE160	$84.50
	WMX7203-1F	2T2R	MHF1	2x2	QCA2066-5		HE160	$67.50
2.4/5/6GHz	WMX7205-1	2T2R	MHF4	2x2	QCA2066-5		HE160	$67.50
	sam 7203/7205			2x2	WCN6856-5			$67.50
Tri-Band	WNFQ-268AXI	2T2R	MHF4	2x2	WCN6856	M.2 E	HE160	$72.00
5G or 6G + 2.4	WMX7205	2T2R	MHF4	2x2	WCN6856	M2	HE160	$61.70
not 6E	EmWicon WMX7402-3	3T3R	MHF1	3x3	QCN9074/9024		HE160	$79
no 2.4G	WMX7406	4T4R	MHF1	4x4	QCN9074-0	MINI PCIE	HE160	$96.90

Thinking the WMX7205 hits a happy medium between 6Ghz / price. Going with a 4x4 option would be nice just for the extra 2 lanes but, there really aren't any clients that do 4x4 unless it's a full size PC with a similar card in it to take advantage of the additional BW. I suppose getting a 2nd card and a USB adapter for the laptop would work too but, that's a bit inconvenient to drag around or deal with the risk of breaking it when moving the system around.

 

[Tech Junky]

Ordered a pair of the WMX7205's and we'll see what they can do.

 

[Tech Junky]

Ran into a snag on the order as they're out of stock and got a refund.

Looked into the MT7921 as an option and though it's 1/2 the theoretical speed of the AX210/WMX7205 it's also considerably cheaper at $15/M2 vs the ~$70/WM7205.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09MBMXNYB - M2 only $16
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B081ZKTFN2 - M2 / PCIE + antennas - $20

Plan is to use one for hosting an AP and the other as a client to the GW for a WIFI redundancy when moving the GW around for better throughput since the AX210 is being finicky about throughput in the server for some reason. I'm thinking the MT7921 should perform well enough at lower BW on the GW to not impact WWAN speeds. The internal LAN speeds might take a small hit though but that's yet to be seen with testing. I don't think it's going to make much of a significant difference though even though the AX210 is LR@2.4gbps and the MT's LR are 1.2gbps. If they will do concurrent 5G/6G that would put them at 2.4gbps though the BW is 80mhz vs 160mhz with the AX210. Then again if they do DC that effectively doubles to 160 again.

For 50% of the cost of the QCA's though it should suffice as long as they're stable. The alternative is ordering the WCN6856 @ $60/ea as they do have those in stock. I couldn't really spot any differences between the QCA vs WCN though other than the WCN seems to be more consumer common for it has some perks on the BT audio side. There's no real way to compare the two anywhere and there's not a data sheet that dives into the specs deep enough to tell the differences. We'll see how the MT's work out and go from there.

 

[Tech Junky]

Well, the Mt7921K's were unimpressive. I discovered also hostapd doesn't want to enable ieee80211ax even though it's an option in the config templates along with anything that enable HE. I'm fairly certain this is a program issue and not related to the MTK chipset. I was able to get the MTK's working but, the speeds capped at B/G/N under 100mbps. The AX210 at least as a client hits top end 866mbs but can't be used for an AP beyond 2.4ghz bands due to it being a disabled / hobbled feature by Intel.

Now, the debate is whether to push forward with getting Qualcomm based chips and continue down the path of an internal AP w/ AC speeds until hostapd unlocks the AX feature set and enable it at a later time or just forgo the whole idea and wait for WIFI7 to be released.

 

[Tech Junky]

AX411 - $18.75

https://mightygadget.co.uk/tag/ax411/ Picked up a couple of these to play with at 50% less than the Amazon listings for the same cards. https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Intel/AX411.NGWG.NV?qs=pBJMDPsKWf20x9LnYd7Bqw%3D%3D...

forums.anandtech.com

So, playing around a bit more with the AX411 card I've got it working in hostapd w/ 5GHZ which is kind of a trick since Intel disables this option normally. Well, I did some detective work and found some pieces of the puzzle that I had been playing with the MTK chips apply to unlocking the Intel cards.

lar_disable=1 - /etc/modprobe.d/iwlwifi.conf -- this makes the 5ghz band work in hostapd

I started off with a really basic config and got the card up in AP mode and then tinkered from there a bit to add more functionality to the "AP" such as getting higher speeds out of it by enabling further commands to the config file.

Initially the system brought up the card in AP mode but, wouldn't give me an IP which led to needing to add the br0 interface to the basic config and that was solved. I had this in my other AP files but, since I wanted to start over and figure out how to unlock the Intel card for 5Ghz I missed readding it.

I got beyond that and has basic connectivity on 5ghz and did a couple of speed tests which were dismal to say the least at ~40-50mbps DL / 20-30mbps UL
Made some tweaks based off the output from - "iw list | more" which gives you the options the card is capable of. Added those into the config and that unlocked 135/50 speed which is decent enough for the moment.

Now unlocking more speed is the focus I need to dig into the "HE" options and see what works / doesn't to unlock the AX benefits as sit seems like it's just using the AC options at this point. Having a connection rate of 400mbps isn't bad but, my actual AP connects to the phone @ 1200mbps and laptop @ 2400mbps.

Things are moving in the right direction though being that I haven't spent more money on adapters based on Qualcomm chips at this point though in the past they have provided full speeds in comparison but, this is still better than intel suck on 2.4 only and twice the speed so far. Goal being to get the link rate up as far as possible to get internal LAN speeds comparable to the AP which will be difficult due to the AX411 only supporting 80mhz

It won't take the "ieee80211ax=1" option in the config / errors...so... yeah it's going to get interesting trying to push it to higher bandwidth.

 

[Tech Junky]

Connectivity Solutions > Embedded Wireless > SX-PCEAX Radio Module

The Silex’s SX-PCEAX is one of the industry’s first Tri-band Wi-Fi 6E modules. This Wi-Fi 6E module extends the benefits that Wi-Fi 6 already provides in the 2.4 and 5 GHz bands to 6 GHz and helps

www.silextechnology.com

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/702-SX-PCEAX-M2-SP

$85 + shipping to make your own 6E AP out of a PC / PI / etc.

I've tried to get my hands on these QCA chips in the past and never could get them delivered. I tried the MTK option and it sucked but, mouser is reliable for shipping. Now, of course the dilemma is waiting on the BE chips to come out that are coming from Intel / QC / MTK and possible BCM. Hard to gauge when they will actually be released for sales as right now they're being dumped for production of "MAX" mobo refreshes for Intel. BE from Intel mouser has listed for Nov restock right now. The problem with Intel as shown above is the hoops you have to jump through to make them work in AP mode at a reduced speed.

Too bad it took over a year to circle back to this with an available card that will actually ship.