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imported_vr6

Platinum Member
Jul 6, 2001
2,740
0
0
When it comes to supplements, DPS is the way to go. I have tried alot of EAS products though, probably too many to list...

Here are some of the memorable ones...

MuscleDrive HP...
Phosphagen Hp....
and some others
 

Codewiz

Diamond Member
Jan 23, 2002
5,758
0
76
Originally posted by: alchemize
Rather than have this thread spiral off into a endless and pointless discussion of weight-lifting and muscle building, I'll try and redirect some folks. I messed around with reading muscle mags, supplements, etc. for 2 years. Then I read this article and it changed everything for me:

Link

If you want natural (no steroids) muscle, this will enlighten you as well.

Then browse around the site, maybe join the forum.

But if you want it in a summary, it comes down to this:
1) Appropriate sleep (8+ hours per night)
2) Appropriate recovery between workouts
3) Compound (multiple muscle group) exercises using excellent form
4) Proper nutrition, excess calories with enough protein if you are gaining.

Note that the above do not include supplements. You *can* get plenty of protein with ever touching supplements. That being said, protein supplements are convienient and easy and relatively cheap. IMHO, everything else is junk. The supplement industry is a $20+ BILLION industry, yet they can't afford research scientists, double-blind studies, and published materials? It is unregulated snake oil, pure and simple. I dare anyone to prove me wrong, because it can't be done. Everything is testimonials and anecdotes.


There are a lot supplements that ARE bullsh*t but there are also some that are beneficial and work. I guess you are going to be the same person that says roids don't work. Or that you lose everything you gain on roids. Don't even try to go there because even though there aren't a lot of studies on roids and bodybuilding, I can show you the results and they aren't possible naturally.

There are supplements that are will enhance your workouts. Are they worth it? I don't think so. I don't want to pay $40 for 30 pills that aren't going to result in amazing results. I do however take Creatine. There have been TONS of blind testing of creatine and safety tests for it. It works. You can't deny it. Is it going to turn you into a massive piece of muscle a lot quicker? No but it will help with recovery so that you eventually will lift more faster. Where you run into trouble are the people that say 5 serving is good for you and helps a lot so if I take 30 servings it will help even more. That is the type of thinking that gets people in trouble quick.

EDIT: On the topic of protein. Whey is very helpful because it contains the importaint strains of protein you need to have for repairing muscle. It is very hard to eat enough protein to build lots of muscle mass without using protein supplements. I know I can't eat enough meals to have 300g of protein a day. Maybe if I didn't have a job but when I can only get 3 meals in a day, I can certainly have a protein shake between meals to make sure I get my needed protein.
 

Mangos

Senior member
Jun 13, 2001
536
0
0
Whey protein, for sure. I drink GNC Pro Performance whey protein. I was drinking 2-3 glasses a day during the summer...the stuff works.


If you eat meat/eggs (i'm lactovegetarian) - eggs are the most complete protein. Watch out for cholesterol, though.
 

Pothead

Platinum Member
Jan 8, 2001
2,522
0
0
Actually it'll be $20 after the EAS coupon. Can't beat that.

20% is only for orders of $100 or more.

Plenty of studies on creatine but they have no evidence or anything of any longterm effects or consequences of it though.
 

frankqfrank

Golden Member
Aug 29, 2001
1,040
0
0
Phosphagen HP for under $21 each, for the big 42 serving jugs. That is great, especially for everyone who can't afford Cell Tech (everyone.)
 

anton73

Member
Aug 21, 2002
63
0
0
First - On the deal I'd say it's warm. Decent prices, but same range as what Drugstore.com is offering right now with their 30% off EAS sale. Plus if you check the coupon sites you can find a $5 off 15 coupon out there

Second - Supplements work. I've been going on and off to the gym for many years. Usually with not much results. This time, I went in with a proper diet (which is the most important), a well educated workout parter and a few basic supplements and I've already noticed a difference. So far I've been using EAS Phoshagen HP (creatine) and Nature's Best Isopure (whey protein) along with EAS CLA (antioxidant and possible fat burner) and Flaxseed Oil (which has a laundry list of positive effects). Since starting with the supplements, I've noticed increased performance and most importantly a much faster recovery after a workout.

I really don't think anyone can argue the effectiveness of creatine. It has been well documented since the early 90's when it made big news at the Olympics and has been improved on over and over since. Yes, there is a lot of crap out there, but if you are smart and you do your research you shouldn't get burned. (Note- if you see a comercial for it at 2 am, it's probably crap)

 

billandopus

Platinum Member
Dec 29, 1999
2,082
0
0
No offense to everyone here who likes EAS products - but - I along with many others find EAS overpriced. It's the Plextor of supplements. ( I hate using that comparison since I have a Plextor burner) People with money who also want name-brand cachet go for the likes of Plextor. I still use a 8432. However, most now would pick up something like a LiteOn. It burns great and is much less expensive.

Same thing with EAS. Decent product for sure - nothing wrong with that. However, Phosphagen for example (Creatine) is very expensive when you can get great German (SKW) creatine and add your own favorite glycemic-index insulin response product. EAS spends huge money in advertising which reflects in their prices.

I admire Bill Philips business savvy for sure.

If you can afford EAS then more power to you. If it helps your motivation in getting into the gym then all the better. I would just hope that everyone takes a look around for other alternative sources of supplementation. Ya gotta stretch your dollar these days.
 

billandopus

Platinum Member
Dec 29, 1999
2,082
0
0
Originally posted by: alchemize
Rather than have this thread spiral off into a endless and pointless discussion of weight-lifting and muscle building, I'll try and redirect some folks. I messed around with reading muscle mags, supplements, etc. for 2 years. Then I read this article and it changed everything for me:

Link

If you want natural (no steroids) muscle, this will enlighten you as well.

Then browse around the site, maybe join the forum.

But if you want it in a summary, it comes down to this:
1) Appropriate sleep (8+ hours per night)
2) Appropriate recovery between workouts
3) Compound (multiple muscle group) exercises using excellent form
4) Proper nutrition, excess calories with enough protein if you are gaining.

Note that the above do not include supplements. You *can* get plenty of protein with ever touching supplements. That being said, protein supplements are convienient and easy and relatively cheap. IMHO, everything else is junk. The supplement industry is a $20+ BILLION industry, yet they can't afford research scientists, double-blind studies, and published materials? It is unregulated snake oil, pure and simple. I dare anyone to prove me wrong, because it can't be done. Everything is testimonials and anecdotes.


Well, I wouldn't go so far as say that everything else is junk. Maybe "lots". There are some products that have gone under heavy scrutiny with regards to it's efficacy versus human performance. Creatine comes to mind and the usual E/C/A combo is another.

Additionally, I agree with your commentary. However, I just want to point out to everyone that one of the major reasons for supplementation re: protein powders, MRPs is convenience. You can do all that you said but where does that leave you food-wise? It's enough to go to school, work, sleep and workout and get decent nutrition reflecting a rigorous weightlifting/bodybuilding routine. Unless you are really hardcore doing the chicken breast/tuna/potato/lentils etc thing ... you're going to eventually consider taking a "shortcut" with regards to calorie intake (protein/carbs/fats).

That's where protein powders/MRPs come into play.

I agree that starting off for the newb you should incorporate your abovementioned points ... but to maintain it for the long haul is sheer torture once your body's nutritional requirements increase. That's the appropriate time to investigate proper supplementation ... as a supplement not a replacement.

Not a flame/critique but a friendly reminder.

While we're on the this topic an interesting site to check out is
The BrinkZone Check out the article reerformance-enhancing supplements and the two-part "picking Brink's brain". Interesting reading.

for all those who've spent any quality time over at misc.fitness.weights on UseNet. Brink hangs out there all the time making for great conversation.
 

patrickj

Platinum Member
Dec 7, 2000
2,252
0
0
Different supplements work for different people. I have been through most of the brands (Weider, GNC, EAS, MetRx) and have found that to get consistantly good results requires the use of a few good supplements, a good work out program, proper diet and nutrition, plenty of water, and plenty of rest. I take a multi-vitamin/mineral, SAM-E, Glucosamine/MSM daily and Lutein every third day. I also take Creatine for a 3 month cycle in the spring. On my lifting days, I have a MetRx prior to my work out and another with a small bowl of cereal for breakfast the following morning. I also take branched chain aminos each morning after lifting. My recovery times are excellent (usually one to three days at most after a hard leg routine) and I am able to maintain solid muscle weight while keeping the fat away. On my days off from lifting, I do 45 minutes of cardio (eliptical trainer, rowing machine, stair stepper) and have 16oz. of Gatorade or some other fluid replacement drink that contains electrolytes. I have been lifting/working out since I was 13. I am now 37 and still in excellent health.

My point is that you won't figure out what works for you without some trial and error. You shouldn't expect instant results without hard work and spending some time. Be patient and find out what works for you.
 

Pothead

Platinum Member
Jan 8, 2001
2,522
0
0
I really don't think anyone can argue the effectiveness of creatine. It has been well documented since the early 90's when it made big news at the Olympics and has been improved on over and over since.

True, but no one actually knows how it will affect the body say 30 years down the line for the person that uses it. That's my concern.
 

Codewiz

Diamond Member
Jan 23, 2002
5,758
0
76
Originally posted by: Pothead
I really don't think anyone can argue the effectiveness of creatine. It has been well documented since the early 90's when it made big news at the Olympics and has been improved on over and over since.

True, but no one actually knows how it will affect the body say 30 years down the line for the person that uses it. That's my concern.

Umm we don't know how computer will affect us from 30 years of use. Yes computers have been around since the 40's but not in the homes of people in mass quatities until the 90's. Haven't you found out that everything gives you cancer? Everyone dies, it is just a matter of when. There is NO evidence that creatine is harmful at all. They have done tests of high doses on animals and it hasn't caused widespread cancer. Fear should not control your life
 

billandopus

Platinum Member
Dec 29, 1999
2,082
0
0
Originally posted by: Codewiz
Originally posted by: Pothead
I really don't think anyone can argue the effectiveness of creatine. It has been well documented since the early 90's when it made big news at the Olympics and has been improved on over and over since.

True, but no one actually knows how it will affect the body say 30 years down the line for the person that uses it. That's my concern.

Umm we don't know how computer will affect us from 30 years of use. Yes computers have been around since the 40's but not in the homes of people in mass quatities until the 90's. Haven't you found out that everything gives you cancer? Everyone dies, it is just a matter of when. There is NO evidence that creatine is harmful at all. They have done tests of high doses on animals and it hasn't caused widespread cancer. Fear should not control your life

Actually, Creatine has been shown reduce brain capacity and trigger-lock while playing your fave First-Person-Shooter game.

And your dinky shrinks to 1/3 of it's original size.

 

SirChadwick

Diamond Member
Jul 27, 2001
4,595
1
81
Originally posted by: bill_n_opus
Originally posted by: Codewiz
Originally posted by: Pothead
I really don't think anyone can argue the effectiveness of creatine. It has been well documented since the early 90's when it made big news at the Olympics and has been improved on over and over since.

True, but no one actually knows how it will affect the body say 30 years down the line for the person that uses it. That's my concern.

Umm we don't know how computer will affect us from 30 years of use. Yes computers have been around since the 40's but not in the homes of people in mass quatities until the 90's. Haven't you found out that everything gives you cancer? Everyone dies, it is just a matter of when. There is NO evidence that creatine is harmful at all. They have done tests of high doses on animals and it hasn't caused widespread cancer. Fear should not control your life

Actually, Creatine has been shown reduce brain capacity and trigger-lock while playing your fave First-Person-Shooter game.

And your dinky shrinks to 1/3 of it's original size.


And can you please provide a link that proves all of this.... :Q
 

Booyah

Senior member
Oct 22, 2000
676
0
0
Can anyone tell me what that EAS simple Protein tastes like. I have been using the 5lbs Prolab pure whey protein(choc flav) but cannot stomach it any more! I'm just worried that this EAS stuff is identical.
 

billandopus

Platinum Member
Dec 29, 1999
2,082
0
0
Originally posted by: Booyah
Can anyone tell me what that EAS simple Protein tastes like. I have been using the 5lbs Prolab pure whey protein(choc flav) but cannot stomach it any more! I'm just worried that this EAS stuff is identical.

The EAS stuff probably tastes pretty good although, in the general scheme of things, it won't be an overly superior product to the Prolab both in taste and efficiency. I'd stick with the Prolab since it's cheaper (I think) and just alter the way you intake your protein.

One good way to manipulate the taste of your Prolab protein powder is to add chocolate milk to it. If you aren't worried too much about calories then you can do all chocolate milk and it will taste fine. What I do (used to do) is add 70% water and 30% choco milk and it was fine. Use a blender beforehand if you can or use a good shaker cup so that you mix well. I hate lumps. If you know that you are going to work out the next day - like after work or after school - you can mix up a portion in the morning/night before, put it in something like a Nalgene bottle (the ones they sell at outdoor stores that are easy to use and relatively bacteria resistant) and put some ice cubes to keep it cool. It will be ready to rock right after you finish your workout for that window of opportunity for your body.

Besides, it's the protein you're after ... not the taste. Chug and hold your nose if you have to.

My brother is hard core, he'll take a serving/scoop DRY ... right in the mouth and washes the rest down with water. Now, that's impressive. Maybe stupid ...


 
Oct 16, 1999
10,490
4
0
Originally posted by: whazzzzzup
One quick question...kind of irrelevant but if someone can answer it'll be a lot of help...Being a muslim and having a whole bunch of restrictions on what to and not to eat, I found out whey is an ingredient that's not allowed. I've heard of some "Kosher" whey but can rarely find any supplements with whey protein that I can take. Any muslims out there taking supplements/etc that can help out?...What can I take that'll help build (specifically protein)?? Tia

You can get Soy protein powder. It has a lot of phytoestrogens though, so I'd take Chrysin or something along with it. Or you can convert.
 

hapahaole

Member
Jul 17, 2001
188
0
0
Boys and girls, a few things:

First, don't bother with EAS or Prolab, both cheap out on their formulas. One of the few places that still exercise truth in labeling is Proteinfactory.com. That's where you're going to find a better deal on a higher quality formula, customized to your preferences.....and heavily recommended by the hardcore scene. Proteinfactory is a blender, one of the companies that EAS, Weider, Ultimate, etc. contract to mix, label, and ship their formulas (none of those companies actually MAKE the powders they sell). They have some pretty good Deals of the Month also. The best part besides the ability to order the mix you want, and the flavor, are the sweetening options (you can also get Stevia, Sucralose, etc.).

As for the rest of my rant:

1. Most of the supplement industry is full of crap. Look at all the companies that sell "protein" bars filled with hydrolyzed collagen, which is a totally useless incomplete protein (digest of things like cow hooves, bones, connective tissue), glycerin (not very useful either, but is synthetic and allows you to claim "low carb" - but due to FDA fines they cant do that anymore), and so forth. Unless you know what you're looking at you have been ripped off by the supplement hype machine at one point or another. Oh and by the way ecdysterone products (EcdyMax for ex.) are crap also, clinically proven to be a waste of time unless you are an insect, and marketed based on bad decades-old russian studies that have long since been proven worthless.

2. Prohormones are a waste of money. Yes. Ignore what the guys at the gym say, and what the supplement companies say, and the fancy ads in the magazines. They do not work. Despite scores of clinical studies to the contrary, some people still hold on to their Andro and Norandro stacks with a death grip - face it, you have been scammed again by hype, just like back in the day with dibencozide, or FRAC, or beta-sitosterol, or plant sterols etc etc. No company has ANY need to verify ANY claim that they make - that is why they all have disclaimers.

3. Simple tips - if you're buying protein powders, look for ones where the primary proteins are high quality (e.g. ion-exchange, CFM, etc.) and NOT lower quality. Most co's wrap a "proprietary" label around their proteins so there's no way for you to tell how much of the good stuff vs crap you are paying for in your protein. Also when buying protein bars, stay away from any that use collagen (e.g. MetRX Pure Protein is a good example) since it is a useless protein used as a cost cutting measure.

*****If you want to make gains you must eat, rest, and train with equal amounts of dedication... with your eating MACRONUTRIENTS (e.g. carbs, proteins, fats) are the key, not "miracle" supplements like Andro or whatever the flavor of the month is. The most important thing is to fuel your body with enough quality real food. This means lean meats, vegetables, legumes, whole grains, etc. Macronutrient supplementation (carb, protein) should be used as a supplement to a good diet, not as a replacement.

ALSO: If you are any kind of real athlete, do not bother with hype-driven low/no-carb diets. Unfortunately they have no basis in sport science, and there is a reason why they are relegated to fad diet books from people with no background in nutrition (e.g. Robert Atkins is a cardiologist with zero accreditation or clinical coursework in nutrition) and not in the training diets of Olympic athletes.

Fact of the matter is that your body is designed around carbs as fuel. Carbs are not the enemy, total caloric intake is. If you cut out quality complex carb intake you will directly knock your athletic performance into the crapper when it comes to sustained peak output. You will crash sooner, hit the wall faster, and generally be able to sustain less intensity. They also have a protein-sparing effect that helps prevent catabolism (protein/muscle breakdown). At least half of your calories should be carbs, esp. in the form of quality complex carbs, whole grains, legumes, etc. There are NO "miracle" fad diets - they all work off of some form of caloric restriction and that is all. Low carb diets give an initial false positive because glycogen depletion also takes water with it, hence the rapid initial 10lb weight loss (water and glycogen but not fat). Regardless they are of little use to an athlete seeking to maximize his gains from his workouts, and wanting to be able to perform at his peak.
 

wolfnap

Member
Sep 7, 2001
86
0
0
In general, I agree with hapahole. The vast majority of supplements are a complete waste of money. The only thing I use -- and I recommend highly -- are the drink mixes like Myoplex. They're an easy and cheap way to get protein, nutrients and some carbs. Obviously, the best option is to prepare your own food ... but when you're in a hurry or are lazy or just don't feel like eating (such as immediately after a workout), they are excellent. I've used Met-Rx for this purpose for a few years, and I recently tried EAS's Myoplex. Both taste pretty good, but Myoplex is now cheaper.



 

sekser

Senior member
Jul 4, 2000
395
0
0
can anybody who ordered the EAS Simply protein give me the expiration dates that is written on the bottle? I want to buy some but a little worried that they are dumping old stock...
 

slycat

Diamond Member
Jul 18, 2001
5,656
0
0
i just got their 2 5lb DesignerWhey for $55...with free s/h...thats a great deal...
by the way... free shipping has increased to $50 !
 
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