How can I Prove Evolution?

[silverpig]

Well, if evolutionists can get away with creating things out of wild imagination, then I can sit here and ask you to prove it. I haven't read one single bit of evolutionary theory that doesn't contradict itself, require things impossible without some sort of preordered, controlled structure, etc.

Isaac Newton said the same thing about planetary orbits and gravity until Kepler came along...

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: silverpig

Well, if evolutionists can get away with creating things out of wild imagination, then I can sit here and ask you to prove it. I haven't read one single bit of evolutionary theory that doesn't contradict itself, require things impossible without some sort of preordered, controlled structure, etc.

Isaac Newton said the same thing about planetary orbits and gravity until Kepler came along...

In such an advanced civilization

 

[silverpig]

Yeah, but you see that's the thing. If everyone had just settled for Newton's "divine influence" hypothesis regarding planetary orbits, we'd still be in that "advanced civilization." It's only because someone else thought that idea was crap that we now have Kepler's laws and the advancements we have gained since.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: silverpig
Yeah, but you see that's the thing. If everyone had just settled for Newton's "divine influence" hypothesis regarding planetary orbits, we'd still be in that "advanced civilization." It's only because someone else thought that idea was crap that we now have Kepler's laws and the advancements we have gained since.

They didn't have the ability to scientifically analyze the data that we have today. I don't see how you can relate the stone age to today.

nik

 

[silverpig]

And I'm sure that in the future we'll have more advancements that will allow us to discover the true nature of genetics and evolution.

Okay, let me spell it out if you can't see it then:

Newton was faced with a complex problem. He was at the end of his career and basically said "Fsck it. This is too hard. I can't figure this out, god must have done it." Kepler picked up his work, and with a little analysis, showed planetary motion to be dependent on gravity, and further showed it to be relatively simple.

Today we are faced with the complex problem of the nature of life. Creationists say "Life is too complex to arise naturally. There must be some kind of divine intervention."

Enter a modern day Kepler...

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: Athlon4all

Originally posted by: bGIveNs33
Do any of you creationist leave room for theistic evolution?? Do you really think that everything in the Bible was meant to be taken literally? Jesus told stories all the time, "Good Samaritan", "Prodigal Son" ect. those never happened! I repect you'll(i'm from the south) for standing up for what you believe in, but don't close your mind to other possibilities. The moment you stop trying to learn and ponder, you become ignorant.

No. Exodus 20:11 "For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth" Not to mention the fact that the Bible teaches that there was no death or suffering until man sinned and Evolution inheriantly in nature says that Man has come to be by organisms dieing, including those before man was even alive to sin.

Guys, why do you reject what the Bible teaches? God is offering you a better life!!!! If you would call on the name of the LORD and give you life to him, life would be so much better!!!! Don't think your good works will get you to heaven, "There is none righteous, no not one." I beg you all to reject unrighteousness and accept Christ today!!!!

Uh... you're not really doing us any good. :frown: Nobody's asking for a some trite Sunday school babbling.

nik

well his belief is vaid as your own.

 

[0roo0roo]

require things impossible without some sort of preordered, controlled structure, etc.

are you trying to make a watch makers arguement again? just because you say somethings impossible without a prordered structure does not make it so

 

[Moonbeam]

And besides, a proof of evolution does not require a watchmaker on no watchmaker. All you have to show is that watches evolve. That has been done in spades. The argument as to where the watches came from is an entirely different subject. It is all very simple. In the beginning there were no watches and then all of a sudden simple watches and only simple watches start showing up in the fossile record by the ton. In the rocks above the fossils get more complex. Since we know that watches begat watches we know that the complex watches are the progeny of simple ones. Eureka, the proof that evolution took place. Looking at the genetic code reaffirms logical means by which this happened. Looking at who breeds, reveals a logical explanation for that. The latter two are part of the Theory of Evolution and are logical guesses that scientists have great confidence in. The record in the rock is a factual record. That watches evolved, changed over vast periods of time from simple to complex is a fact.

 

[silverpig]

I don't think anyone disputes evolution in the sense that creatures evolve into new creatures, but I think evolution in this thread refers to the creation of life from a primordial soup.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: silverpig
I don't think anyone disputes evolution in the sense that creatures evolve into new creatures, but I think evolution in this thread refers to the creation of life from a primordial soup.

Or the big bang. Or whatever the fsck else someone dreamed up while trippin on acid or something.

nik

 

[FrozenYak]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo

Originally posted by: FrozenYak

Originally posted by: FrustratedUser

Originally posted by: Tominator

Originally posted by: FrustratedUser
A new thread about Creationism is started.

I call all Creationists to present evidence.

But all your so-called evidence leads to a dead end where even scientist cannot agree.

I call all evolutionist to face the facts! There are none!

Hmmm, do I get this right?

Evolutionists have to prove their theory.
Creationistst just say God created everything and that's it. No discussion.

Ohh, come on! give me a break!

The only reason you say that is because youve never met all the creationists. There are entire books written by creationists that prove what the bible says to be true while disproving evolutionism.

oh, you mean intellectually dishonest books the scientific community finds no credibility in? oh yea, those its called pseudo science bubba, the same thing used to sell you magnets that heal you with ionizing energy.

No...im talking about books that primarily disprove the evolutionist theory. After all God's the only one who could convince those who dont believe in creationism. So actually any book that disproves evolutionistic points could be seen as a creasionist book.

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: silverpig
I don't think anyone disputes evolution in the sense that creatures evolve into new creatures, but I think evolution in this thread refers to the creation of life from a primordial soup.

Or the big bang. Or whatever the fsck else someone dreamed up while trippin on acid or something.

nik

maybe you apply the same thought to your bible

naw u couldn't do that, u'd break your mind.

No...im talking about books that primarily disprove the evolutionist theory. After all God's the only one who could convince those who dont believe in creationism. So actually any book that disproves evolutionistic points could be seen as a creasionist book.

and i wasn't talking about just books trying to prove creationism. trying to disprove evolution is a fundamental part of creationist books anyhow. the often repeated falsehoods lie in those. apparently they believe disproved and invalid arguements grow stronger the more you publish them. apparently it is true. they have done a poor job of disproving evolution, and a worse job at proving creationism.


and no, they don't believe that only god can convince you of creationism. in their intellectual dishonesty they try pushing creationism "science" as proof of their religious beliefs.

 

[FrozenYak]

Orooroo

You know what you said just made me realize something.

God IS the only one who can convince you of creationism.
After all, to believe in creationism means you would believe in God. Thats like saying you are a Christian and you 'believe in God' but at the same time believe evolutionism to be true, it would be saying that you did not believe what the Bible said to be true.


Maybe its just me, but I have trouble seeing how one could believe there is a God yet not believe Creationism to be true.

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: FrozenYak
Orooroo

You know what you said just made me realize something.

God IS the only one who can convince you of creationism.
After all, to believe in creationism means you would believe in God. Thats like saying you are a Christian and you 'believe in God' but at the same time believe evolutionism to be true, it would be saying that you did not believe what the Bible said to be true.


Maybe its just me, but I have trouble seeing how one could believe there is a God yet not believe Creationism to be true.

well actually, your god is the only one that can convince you of your version of the creation story yours is not the only one. many are from other religions, or even include the possibility of evolution

sorry, all christians don't view the bible the same way. you only discount other christians as infidels when you say that. not every christian believes the bible literally. the same way not every religion based on the bible is the same. according to you, only your view of the bible is true


believing in god does not automatically make you a christian, a muslim, or anything else. such logic is faulty.

 

[silverpig]

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: silverpig
I don't think anyone disputes evolution in the sense that creatures evolve into new creatures, but I think evolution in this thread refers to the creation of life from a primordial soup.

Or the big bang. Or whatever the fsck else someone dreamed up while trippin on acid or something.

nik

Most people who trip out on acid would more likely see what they believe to be god rather than the underlying principles of string theory floating in space in front of them...

 

[Athlon4all]

Uh... you're not really doing us any good. Nobody's asking for a some trite Sunday school babbling.

Actually I am. I'm telling you the truth so that you might repent and come to Christ. You will see him one day at the glorious appearing, but by then, it will be too late.

Religion is based on the faith that there is a god. Proof of a god would negate any need for faith in the existence of a god, which is really the problem most people have with religion.

I will say that Evolution is a religion as well based on faith, Science cannot prove evolution because it wasn't observed. Neither can science prove Creationism.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: Athlon4all

Uh... you're not really doing us any good. Nobody's asking for a some trite Sunday school babbling.

Actually I am. I'm telling you the truth so that you might repent and come to Christ. You will see him one day at the glorious appearing, but by then, it will be too late.

Religion is based on the faith that there is a god. Proof of a god would negate any need for faith in the existence of a god, which is really the problem most people have with religion.

I will say that Evolution is a religion as well based on faith, Science cannot prove evolution because it wasn't observed. Neither can science prove Creationism.

You forgot the not measurable and not repeatable part.

nik

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: silverpig

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: silverpig
I don't think anyone disputes evolution in the sense that creatures evolve into new creatures, but I think evolution in this thread refers to the creation of life from a primordial soup.

Or the big bang. Or whatever the fsck else someone dreamed up while trippin on acid or something.

nik

Most people who trip out on acid would more likely see what they believe to be god rather than the underlying principles of string theory floating in space in front of them...

Oh, so you're experienced with it, I see? That explains the content of your debates.

nik

 

[slaman]

Originally posted by: Harvey

Originally posted by: Tominator
There is zero evidence man had an 'ape-like'ancestor.

Isn't that your purpose on this planet?

Seriously, you may want to consider bacterial resistance to antibiotics as evidence that living organisms adapt and evolve. When attacked by antibiotics, the most resistant are the most likely to survive, and this resistance is passed to later generations of the bacteria.

Amen. This is exactly what I was going to type when I opened the thread. The fact that bacteria develop immunity is proof that organisms change and adapt. The reason why many species go extinct and no new ones are found is because evolution takes thousands and thousands of years. When an entire species is killed off by humans in 100 years, nature has no real way to cope. The animals simply aren't give the chance to evolve. So the next question is - how does nature handle the threat of humans - and I think it's fairly evident. Humans are able to destroy any animal and basically have no predators. Top of the food chain. Nature's answer: AIDS, cancer, ebola, etc... You cure one disease, and more will come - it's nature's way.

Either that or humans will just kill themselves off which is more plausible.

From Jurassic Park, "Nature finds a way"

 

[silent tone]

Originally posted by: Athlon4all

Uh... you're not really doing us any good. Nobody's asking for a some trite Sunday school babbling.

Actually I am. I'm telling you the truth so that you might repent and come to Christ. You will see him one day at the glorious appearing, but by then, it will be too late.

You are telling him what you BELIEVE to be the truth according to your religion. Calling it 'the truth' doesn't make it so. I have no problems with your belief. I have problems with it being paraded around as 'the one true belief'.

Religion is based on the faith that there is a god. Proof of a god would negate any need for faith in the existence of a god, which is really the problem most people have with religion.

I will say that Evolution is a religion as well based on faith, Science cannot prove evolution because it wasn't observed. Neither can science prove Creationism.

Faith, by definition is a belief that doesn't rest on logical proof or evidence. It seems to me that thousands of scientists from around the world in a variety of disciplines have found supporting evidence to the best theory so far. So believing in a theory based on evidence, is not 'faith'. If the 'evidence' put forth isn't legitimate, then people's belief in evolution is based on ignorance, but still not faith.

 

[ElFenix]

science involves healthy scepticism, religion involves faith.

 

[silent tone]

WTH kind of argument is calling Evolution a religion anyway? Doesn't discrediting evolution this way also discredit the poster's religion as well?

creationist: Har Har, infidel. Evolution is just a religion! You must be crazy.
evolutionist: But don't you believe in religion? Isn't that hypocritical?
creationist: No, because I'm not crazy silly.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: istallion
WTH kind of argument is calling Evolution a religion anyway? Doesn't discrediting evolution this way also discredit the poster's religion as well?

creationist: Har Har, infidel. Evolution is just a religion! You must be crazy.
evolutionist: But don't you believe in religion? Isn't that hypocritical?
creationist: No, because I'm not crazy silly.

Both evolution and creation are accepted by faith. Take it or leave it.

nik

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: istallion
WTH kind of argument is calling Evolution a religion anyway? Doesn't discrediting evolution this way also discredit the poster's religion as well?

creationist: Har Har, infidel. Evolution is just a religion! You must be crazy.
evolutionist: But don't you believe in religion? Isn't that hypocritical?
creationist: No, because I'm not crazy silly.

Both evolution and creation are accepted by faith. Take it or leave it.

nik

no, evolution is accepted after scepticism rules out other likely explanations, and leaves evolution standing as the mechanism by which the diversity of life on earth came about.

 

[slaman]

Originally posted by: FrozenYak
Orooroo

You know what you said just made me realize something.

God IS the only one who can convince you of creationism.
After all, to believe in creationism means you would believe in God. Thats like saying you are a Christian and you 'believe in God' but at the same time believe evolutionism to be true, it would be saying that you did not believe what the Bible said to be true.


Maybe its just me, but I have trouble seeing how one could believe there is a God yet not believe Creationism to be true.

Simple - it's called being agnositc. To me the concept of "God" is simply what humans attribute to the unknown. They use this divinity to answer things that they cannot explain. This is evident in the "evolution" of religion. The Ancient Greeks felt their gods interfered with their daily life, controlled the weather, harvest, etc... As humanity progressed and science began answering more of these "unknowns", the role of divinity diminished. As science can explain more and more in the future, God will simply be a spiritual and metaphysical ideology. Once science explains how the planet came into being, religion will no longer need to use God to explain it.

As it stands, I believe in evolution, I believe in the "Big Bang" or some other explanation on the creation of the universe, but what I personally attribute to God is the unknown. What WAS before the big bang - how did the transfer from non-life to life occur (at the micro-organism level) - what exactly constitutes "life"... Secondly, I think humans are arrogant - they need a purpose in life. Some people simply cant even grasp the thought of just being here as another piece of nature rather than something on a mission. Where does it stop? Do dogs go to hell when they die? What about birds? What about insects? Bacteria? Virii? It's hypocritical.

My outlook on life is - enjoy it. I live my CURRENT life - I refuse to base my entire life on what may or may not happen to me when I'm dead (except biodegration)